Heads Up on SQL92 Mode

If you're like me (a long-time Access developer who doesn't do
ADPs), you've basically ignored SQL92 Mode in Access. If you're
unaware of its existence, what it does is enable a certain level of
compatibility with SQL Server's SQL dialect. Chief among those are: 

1. use of % and _ as wildcards (instead of conventional Access * and
?) 

2. execution of certain kinds of SQL commands (chiefly generic DDL)
that can't be run directly in Access (i.e., in the QBE as opposed to
via ADO in code). 

If you don't do ADPs, you don't necessarily need to write SQL
Server-compatible SQL, so this is not much of an issue for you. And
if you use Access the way I do, you don't often have a need to
execute generic DDL statements (indeed, if you're like me, you
almost never do so at all!). 

Anyway, that's the background.

I'm posting this to warn others off trying to use it without
thinking it through very carefully. 

I accidentally released to users a version of their app that had
SQL92 mode turned on. I had been testing out some things that
required SQL92 mode, and I generally use my existing projects (since
I understand how they work better than if I used an old app or some
generic app). Normally, I immediately change any settings back to
the original when I'm done with testing, but for some reason, that
didn't happen in this case, and I ended up shipping an update with
SQL92 mode turned on. 

Most of it worked.

Indeed, one of the things it does is convert all LIKE comparisons in
stored SQL statements (stored QueryDefs, recordsources and
rowsources) that use traditional Access wildcards to use ALIKE
(which allows you to use the opposite mode's wildcards; e.g., if
you're in SQL 89, you can use ALIKE "this%", or if in SQL 92, you
can use ALIKE "this*"). 

Unfortunately, it causes many problems that that substitution does
not fix: 

1. greatly increased sensitivity to aliases and syntax. At first I
though I had used a reserved word with a field called "Current" but
that's not a reserved word in Access. I was only able to make the
SQL work by surrounding all occurrences of "Current" with square
brackets: 

  SELECT tluTaxRates.TaxRate, Format([TaxRate],"0.0000%") 
    & '-'+[TaxRateDescription] AS Rate, 
    Format([tluTaxRates].[Current],"Yes/No") AS [Current]
  FROM tluTaxRates
  ORDER BY tluTaxRates.[Current], tluTaxRates.TaxRate;

The original version of this lacked any brackets around "Current"
and works just fine in SQL 89 mode, but with SQL 92 turned on, the
brackets were the only way to make it work because "Current" is a
reserved word in the SQL 92 standard. 

Thus, switching to SQL 92 means you have a different set of reserved
words to contend with. 

2. it can cause AutoComplete in dropdown lists to stop working. I
had a terrible time with this one -- I had a dropdown list with 3
columns, the first and last not displayed, and AutoComplete wouldn't
work, so typing was completely ineffective in editing the dropdown
list. Now, I had another very similar dropdown on the same form, but
with only two columns (the second hidden). Both used ALIKE for a
comparison, so I puzzled for a long time over what the difference
was. As it turned out, it was that the first column was the bound
column and it wasn't hidden. 

So, I'm not certain on this, but it seems that switching to SQL 92
broke combo boxes where the first visible column was not the bound
column. 

There were also strange reports of other things that we never
figured out, and that have disappeared once SQL 92 mode was turned
off (so far as I can tell), but I didn't waste time on those trying
to figure out what was going on, so I won't discuss those in detail. 

The takeaway:

Don't use SQL 92 mode unless you have a compelling reason to do so
and are prepared to convert all your SQL to be fully compatible with
a non-Access SQL standard. 

Keep in mind that ADO uses SQL 92 by default (so I presume you'd
have reserved word problems in ADO, which is another reason to avoid
it, in my opinion -- a generic database interface should inherit the
foibles of each particular database it's connecting to, not
introduced a set of its own, independent of any db engine). 

Also keep in mind that DAO is SQL 89 no matter what -- there is no
way to get SQL 92 mode with it, even if your database is set to use
SQL 92 mode. 

Since there's very little reason to use ADO in Access MDBs/ACCDBs, I
think there's almost no justification to turn on SQL 92 mode. 

You've been warned!

-- 
David W. Fenton                  http://www.dfenton.com/ 
contact via website only     http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/
0
David
11/5/2010 9:35:46 PM
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On 5 Nov 2010 21:35:46 GMT, "David-W-Fenton"
<NoEmail@SeeSignature.invalid> wrote:
  
>Since there's very little reason to use ADO in Access MDBs/ACCDBs, I
>think there's almost no justification to turn on SQL 92 mode. 

A client likes ADO when connected to a SQL Server database.  There are
more "things" that you can do easier, or maybe even at all, compared
to DAO.  Trouble is I don't recall what they are right now.    

They do run a lot of stored procedures which return recordsets to the
bound forms.   Again not sure why.  

Tony
-- 
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
For a convenient utility to keep your users FEs and other files 
  updated see http://www.autofeupdater.com/
0
Tony
11/7/2010 9:04:23 PM
Tony Toews <ttoews@telusplanet.net> wrote in
news:fo4ed6h3blf7rbat4u22m0i084m2cvm6ej@4ax.com: 

> On 5 Nov 2010 21:35:46 GMT, "David-W-Fenton"
><NoEmail@SeeSignature.invalid> wrote:
>   
>>Since there's very little reason to use ADO in Access MDBs/ACCDBs,
>>I think there's almost no justification to turn on SQL 92 mode. 
> 
> A client likes ADO when connected to a SQL Server database.  There
> are more "things" that you can do easier, or maybe even at all,
> compared to DAO.  Trouble is I don't recall what they are right
> now.    
> 
> They do run a lot of stored procedures which return recordsets to
> the bound forms.   Again not sure why.  

Well, that oughtn't be an issue, since you're not connecting to
Jet/ACE. But who knows! 

-- 
David W. Fenton                  http://www.dfenton.com/ 
contact via website only     http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/
0
David
11/8/2010 1:00:02 AM
"David-W-Fenton" <NoEmail@SeeSignature.invalid> wrote in
news:Xns9E27B2FFFA473f99a49ed1d0c49c5bbb2@74.209.136.91: 

> Indeed, one of the things it does is convert all LIKE comparisons
> in stored SQL statements (stored QueryDefs, recordsources and
> rowsources) that use traditional Access wildcards to use ALIKE
> (which allows you to use the opposite mode's wildcards; e.g., if
> you're in SQL 89, you can use ALIKE "this%", or if in SQL 92, you
> can use ALIKE "this*"). 

This statement was in error as written. It actually changes your
LIKE "this*" to ALIKE "this%", not retaining the SQL 89 wildcards,
as is implied by the text above. 

-- 
David W. Fenton                  http://www.dfenton.com/ 
contact via website only     http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/
0
David
11/8/2010 1:01:09 AM
Tony Toews wrote:
> On 5 Nov 2010 21:35:46 GMT, "David-W-Fenton"
> <NoEmail@SeeSignature.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Since there's very little reason to use ADO in Access MDBs/ACCDBs, I
>> think there's almost no justification to turn on SQL 92 mode.
>
> A client likes ADO when connected to a SQL Server database.  There are
> more "things" that you can do easier, or maybe even at all, compared
> to DAO.  Trouble is I don't recall what they are right now.
>
Disconnected recordsets are the biggest benefit. Other than that, I see no 
reas on to prefer DAO when using Access as the front end/ 


0
Bob
11/8/2010 1:32:37 AM
On Sun, 7 Nov 2010 20:32:37 -0500, "Bob Barrows"
<reb01501@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote:

>>> Since there's very little reason to use ADO in Access MDBs/ACCDBs, I
>>> think there's almost no justification to turn on SQL 92 mode.
>>
>> A client likes ADO when connected to a SQL Server database.  There are
>> more "things" that you can do easier, or maybe even at all, compared
>> to DAO.  Trouble is I don't recall what they are right now.
>>
>Disconnected recordsets are the biggest benefit. Other than that, I see no 
>reas on to prefer DAO when using Access as the front end/ 

No, they're not using disconnected recordsets.   I think it was that
you could call a stored procedure and get a recordset returned.   

Tony

-- 
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
For a convenient utility to keep your users FEs and other files 
  updated see http://www.autofeupdater.com/
0
Tony
11/13/2010 10:35:55 PM
> No, they're not using disconnected recordsets. =A0 I think it was that
> you could call a stored procedure and get a recordset returned. =A0

But DAO also fully supports returning recordsets from stored
procedures.
0
TechVsLife
11/26/2010 12:41:55 AM
The only DAO limitation I've come across so far is lack of any support
for getting output parameters and the return code of stored
procedures.  Output by recordsets is preferable anyway I think (and
DAO can also get the resultsets from sql server table functions, as
well as multi-recordset returns from stored procedures).
0
TechVsLife
11/26/2010 2:18:59 AM
Correction: one can also get the output parameters and return code
back in DAO (with the right t-sql text in the pass through query), so
everything is covered.

0
TechVsLife
11/26/2010 6:12:00 AM
On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 16:41:55 -0800 (PST), TechVsLife
<techvslife@gmail.com> wrote:
  
>> No, they're not using disconnected recordsets. � I think it was that
>> you could call a stored procedure and get a recordset returned. �
>
>But DAO also fully supports returning recordsets from stored
>procedures.

Ah, I stand corrected.  I doubt that was why then.

Tony
-- 
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
For a convenient utility to keep your users FEs and other files 
  updated see http://www.autofeupdater.com/
0
Tony
11/27/2010 12:52:35 AM
Tony Toews <ttoews@telusplanet.net> wrote in
news:shl0f6hq3h5ei99efmclbpqd7oi6acdjvb@4ax.com: 

> On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 16:41:55 -0800 (PST), TechVsLife
><techvslife@gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>>> No, they're not using disconnected recordsets. � I think it was
>>> that you could call a stored procedure and get a recordset
>>> returned. � 
>>
>>But DAO also fully supports returning recordsets from stored
>>procedures.
> 
> Ah, I stand corrected.  I doubt that was why then.

Is it perhaps that with ADO, you can get an editable recordset? And
bind it to a form? 

-- 
David W. Fenton                  http://www.dfenton.com/ 
contact via website only     http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/
0
David
11/27/2010 3:47:52 AM
On 27 Nov 2010 03:47:52 GMT, "David-W-Fenton" <dfassoc@dfenton.com>
wrote:
  
>>>> No, they're not using disconnected recordsets. � I think it was
>>>> that you could call a stored procedure and get a recordset
>>>> returned. � 
>>>
>>>But DAO also fully supports returning recordsets from stored
>>>procedures.
>> 
>> Ah, I stand corrected.  I doubt that was why then.
>
>Is it perhaps that with ADO, you can get an editable recordset? And
>bind it to a form? 

Yes, he is using ADO in that fashion.  Which really surprised me when
I was viewing the code.

Tony
-- 
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
For a convenient utility to keep your users FEs and other files 
  updated see http://www.autofeupdater.com/
0
Tony
11/27/2010 11:53:51 PM
> >Is it perhaps that with ADO, you can get an editable recordset? And
> >bind it to a form?
> Yes, he is using ADO in that fashion.

Not sure what the advantage of ADO over DAO is, which can also bind
editable recordsets.  Is is that ADO can get editable recordsets from
certain types of stored procedures and table functions, and DAO
cannot, or something else.  (since DAO can bind editable sql server
tables via linking, and local queries on them, and call stored
procedures or pass through sql for write & other operations)  Too bad
DAO won't get further enhancements to support sql server; but ADO is
also dead.  (The windows development world is in a more confused
terrain than usual after winforms (wpf? silverlight? asp? javscript/
html5?).)
0
TechVsLife
11/28/2010 3:50:55 AM
TechVsLife <techvslife@gmail.com> wrote in
news:5894c7bd-05b9-4b68-81dc-a38558f7133b@39g2000yqa.googlegroups.com
: 

>> >Is it perhaps that with ADO, you can get an editable recordset?
>> >And bind it to a form?
>> Yes, he is using ADO in that fashion.
> 
> Not sure what the advantage of ADO over DAO is, which can also
> bind editable recordsets. 

But not from a stored procedure, right?

> Is is that ADO can get editable recordsets from
> certain types of stored procedures and table functions, and DAO
> cannot, or something else.  (since DAO can bind editable sql
> server tables via linking, and local queries on them, and call
> stored procedures or pass through sql for write & other
> operations)  Too bad DAO won't get further enhancements to support
> sql server; 

DAO never supported SQL Server directly. It always did it through
Jet/ACE via ODBC. But the new native ODBC driver for SQL Server is
quite fast in comparison to the old (in my experience) and so it's
clear that MS is investing effort in ODBC, which is actually quite
an old technology. 

> but ADO is
> also dead.  (The windows development world is in a more confused
> terrain than usual after winforms (wpf? silverlight? asp?
> javscript/ html5?).)

I wouldn't know. I'm confused enough on my own.

-- 
David W. Fenton                  http://www.dfenton.com/ 
contact via website only     http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/
0
David
11/30/2010 12:10:20 AM
wow dude.. it sounds to me like you're stuck in the past.. I mean.. 92.. I mean wow.. that's like 18 years ago!!

I'm just surprised that you're still using an obsolete database engine that hasn't received any improvements in the past 15 years!
0
1/3/2011 12:18:00 PM
On Monday, January 3, 2011 5:18:00 AM UTC-7, a a r o n _ k e m p f wrote:
> wow dude.. it sounds to me like you're stuck in the past.. I mean.. 92.. =
I mean wow.. that's like 18 years ago!!
>=20
> I'm just surprised that you're still using an obsolete database engine th=
at hasn't received any improvements in the past 15 years!

A a r o n,
That's what I would have thought too: "SQL 92... WAT???" However, it is now=
 15 Sep 2013, 2.5 years later. Guess why I'm reading this post at all? I wa=
s browsing through the speaker list at this year's High Performance Computi=
ng financial Show and Conference. You'd think that they would be the most u=
p-to-date, unlimited budget developers, right? Supercomputing AND financial=
 markets, including uber-lucrative high frequency trading.

So I was looking at the biographies of the speakers to see what they were w=
orking on. I noticed this one,=20
http://www.flaggmgmt.com/hpc/speakers.html#Birnbaum=20
developing a new robust and scalable messaging system for HPC users in fina=
ncial markets: =20
"...60East Technologies, LLC, the company that is developing =91AMPS' (Adva=
nced Message Processing System). AMPS is a modern, high performance messagi=
ng platform designed for the most demanding environments where latency, thr=
oughput and scale are critical. The platform offers topic and content based=
 pub/sub with integrated SQL-92 database and real-time aggregation capabili=
ties."

Yes, that's right. The modern AMPS platform's integrated SQL-92 database is=
 a feature!=20

Dave fenton dude has company, if he is stuck in the past. I have no idea wh=
y AMPS uses SQL 92. Maybe it's an ODBC thing? Microsot says =20
"The ODBC Desktop Database Drivers and the underlying Microsoft Jet engine =
are not SQL-92 compliant"=20
and =20
"SQL-92 features not supported by Microsoft Jet SQL: Security statements, s=
uch as GRANT and LOCK" =20
although the SQL used by Desktop Database Drivers seems better overall than=
 SQL-92 See SQL-92 Compliance=20
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms711756(v=3Dvs.85).aspx

P.S. Sorry phor typos, my eph key is broken.
0
9/15/2013 9:01:55 AM
On Sunday, November 7, 2010 6:32:37 PM UTC-7, Bob Barrows wrote:
> Tony Toews wrote: 
> > On 5 Nov 2010 21:35:46 GMT, "David-W-Fenton"

I am so sorry. I didn't realize that David W. Fenton had passed away, earlier this year, per https://groups.google.com/d/topic/comp.databases.ms-access/OPJKKwxdsUs/discussion

I was merely replying to someone who posted in 2011, saying that Mr. Fenton's use o SQL 92 was antiquated. I was trying to explain why that wasn't true, not at all. I meant no disrespect. 

May he rest in peace. His work and wisdom lives on here, guiding and helping us.
0
9/15/2013 9:40:20 AM
FYI, aaron kempf has never been qualified to scrape the mud off David 
Fenton's boots, much less to question which SQL standard David's clients 
used.

 -- 
 Larry Linson



"Ellie K" <myindigolife@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:e57c868b-8397-4234-8d1c-2186c9c44ed2@googlegroups.com...
> On Sunday, November 7, 2010 6:32:37 PM UTC-7, Bob Barrows wrote:
>> Tony Toews wrote:
>> > On 5 Nov 2010 21:35:46 GMT, "David-W-Fenton"
>
> I am so sorry. I didn't realize that David W. Fenton had passed away, 
> earlier this year, per 
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/comp.databases.ms-access/OPJKKwxdsUs/discussion
>
> I was merely replying to someone who posted in 2011, saying that Mr. 
> Fenton's use o SQL 92 was antiquated. I was trying to explain why that 
> wasn't true, not at all. I meant no disrespect.
>
> May he rest in peace. His work and wisdom lives on here, guiding and 
> helping us. 


0
accdevel (436)
9/15/2013 5:16:15 PM
On Sun, 15 Sep 2013 12:16:15 -0500, "Access Developer"
<accdevel@gmail.com> wrote:
  
>FYI, aaron kempf has never been qualified to scrape the mud off David 
>Fenton's boots, much less to question which SQL standard David's clients 
>used.

Hehehe.  Well said.

Tony
0
ttoews (2789)
9/15/2013 8:47:33 PM
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Win 7. I believe that my computer used to awake from the sleep mode by moving the mouse or touching the space bar on the keyboard. It doesn't do that anymore. I have to manually push the power button on my laptop. Did I change something in error? Thanks in advance... Bob On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 14:12:08 -0700 (PDT), Bob Newman <newmagator@gmail.com> wrote: >Win 7. >I believe that my computer used to awake from the sleep mode by moving the mouse or touching the space bar on the keyboard. It doesn't do that anymore. I have to manually push the power button on my l...

Heading Control
Hello I perform some Tests with an ROV VideoRay Pro III . I have some questions. Maybe you can help me, or you have some ideas. My aim is generating a Heading-Control Loop. Therefore i have made some Tests in a pool and look at the Heading-Behaviour. First- the Video Ray Pro 3 get out only TWO! information (about serial port): This is Depth and Heading. The Depth should be constant at all times of investigation. Remains only one information - Heading (0...359). I can influence the VideoRay about a SIMULINK-Model. Input signals are: Current for the left and right Thruster! (This is ...

Can I use DDR400 in DDR333 mode on a 533fsb processor?
Hi, Intel docs suggst that DDR400 memory requires a 800fsb processor, but I can't figure out if they mean you will only get DDR400 mode with a 800fsb processor or that DDR400 memory will NOT work with a 533fsb processor. So, my question is, can I buy DDR400 memory and run it in DDR333 mode with a 533fsb processor until I get a faster processor? I'm planning on getting a D865GRH motherboard... Thanks, SA Dev SA Development wrote: " So, my question is, can I buy DDR400 memory and run it in DDR333 mode with a 533fsb processor until I get a faster processor? " Y...

NTPv4 : findexistingpeer() considers mode.
Hi Experts, Could you please help me in understanding the difference between the findexistingpeer() in NTPv3 and NTPv4. In NTPv4 the findexistingpeer() additionally check the mode too. Why is this so ? This could allow two different associations for a same server with different mode, right ? Could you please explain the reason for this change, if any ? Thanks, Arul Kumar C -~- Arul, This was a deliberate choice to avoid interaction between misconfigured conditions. Consider what happens if some perp configures peer and client associations with the same server. Formerly, this was rea...

Does Simulink\RTWinTarget run in windows kernel-mode?
So if i look at the adresses of the variable that i create in c-s-function-block: 1)if simulink is running in normal mode then adress of variable is in the user-mode adress-space i.e. before 0x80000000h 2)if simulink is runing in RTW\RTWinTarget then the adress is after 0x80000000h - so it's in the system memory of WindowsNT family OS! the questions are subj and is there more information about this architecture ?(actually i want to write an I/O driver and i don't want to use I/O registers, so if there is some information about kernel_mode_Matlab_code it was very interesting for me) ...

Insert Text script step in find mode
In FM5 pro I'm attempting to locate all records where a date field is empty. To do so I... enter find mode insert text(select, "DateFld", "=") perform find I get all records, filter is not working. What am I doing wrong? Steve When you use the Insert steps, you must be on a layout that includes the specified field. gsp wrote: > In FM5 pro I'm attempting to locate all records where a date field is empty. > To do so I... > > enter find mode > insert text(select, "DateFld", "=") > perform find > > I get all reco...

Microsoft, Google May go Head-to-Head
By Jim Hu and Mike Ricciuti Staff Writers, CNET News.com Microsoft's path to expand the Windows empire is leading directly to search king Google. The software company this month quietly launched a new search program called MSNBot, which scours the Web to build an index of HTML links and documents. The homegrown system -- which performs robot functions previously left to Inktomi and other partners -- may pose a significant threat to Google if Microsoft fulfills its promise to make the program a cornerstone of its overall PC and services strategies. MSNBot is believed to be ...

problem with printing in landscape mode
Hi All, &nbsp; I have to print my graph in landscape mode. &nbsp; Its printing in landscape mode...but the graph resides only in a small portion of the paper. &nbsp; I want to print the graph in such a way that the graph consumes the entire paper area. &nbsp; ie,a full page graph in landscape mode.How do i program like that? &nbsp; &nbsp; I am attaching a sample vI that depicts the problem. &nbsp; Thanks in advance &nbsp; print-landscape.vi: http://forums.ni.com/attachments/ni/170/291646/1/print-landscape.vi Hi Thank u for the reply.I am using Labview version...

Left justify section headings ?
Hi I am trying to left justify all section headings in a document using RevTeX4. I have tried \begin{flushleft} ... \end{flushleft} but it does not work. How does one do it ? Thanks, MS Madhusudan Singh <spammers-go-here@nowhere.now> wrote: > Hi > I am trying to left justify all section headings in a document using > RevTeX4. I have tried \begin{flushleft} ... \end{flushleft} but it does > not work. How does one do it ? I know nothing about RevTeX in any version. But you probably need to change the commands which generate the section headings. What does the RevT...

head's up, those of you who like to live on the cutting edge...
the latest tcl 8.5 cvs head has a wrinkle to consider. Up until recently, the deprecated {expand} notation was still accepted, even though the final implemention of {*} was in place. That changed this week, and now {expand} returns to being a syntax error. This causes cvs heads of a few tcllib modules to fail. There may be code of your own that fails as well. The symptom to watch for is: srv29 (13933) $ tclsh % proc a {args} { puts {expand}$args } % a a b c extra characters after close-brace ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Developers were warned this day would come - it is he...

Jed 6502 mode?
Hi there, everybody. I'm wondering if there is a 6502 assembly mode for Jed. If there isn't, I wouldn't mind modifying an existing mode (the current assembly mode isn't too far off). If there isn't any such mode readily available, maybe you could give me a hint as to what the best way would be to create such a fork of an existing mode? (I'm not very Unix-savvy; I found a jed-extra folder with lots of modes that I could edit, but moving them to my /lib folder doesn't seem to add them to Jed's mode menu.) Many thanks for any help! On 16 Dec 2006 15:03:5...