Eudora; now there is a better option

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Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
I like it.
Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.

0
Reply Mr 2/25/2005 10:52:30 PM

See related articles to this posting


In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>I like it.
>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.

Does it do everything that Eudora does?
Is it as stable as Eudora?
Is it as "comfortable"?
Is it as configurable?

These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
(or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
switching.

Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?

Francis


0
Reply fburton 2/26/2005 11:12:38 AM

I'm sure it doesn't do everything Eudora does because each email client
is different. Also, Thunderbird is not a mature program like Eudora.
It's still in release 1.0, but it is stable, comfortable, and
configurable. It still has a few features missing, most of which can be
"fixed" with "extensions". Since it's free, you could install
Thunderbird and set it to leave messages on your mail server for Eudora
and use it in parallel with Eudora to compare them [just be sure to
check mail with Thunderbird first]. Since it is open source, it will
most likely be improved at a faster rate than Eudora. Some of my
friends installed Thunderbird as part of a suite which includes the
Firefox browser, which also gets very good reviews. Thuderbird includes
built in SPAM controls, which catch anything that my previously
installed SPAM solution, "Mailwasher", misses. Eventually, I may try
uninstalling mailwasher to train Thunderbird's built in SPAM filter
more completely. It also includes an RSS reader and a news reader.


Francis Burton wrote:
> In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
> Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> >I like it.
> >Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
> Does it do everything that Eudora does?
> Is it as stable as Eudora?
> Is it as "comfortable"?
> Is it as configurable?
>
> These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
> (or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
> switching.
>
> Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
> 
> Francis

0
Reply Mr 2/26/2005 2:58:23 PM

On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:


>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
>Is it as stable as Eudora?
>Is it as "comfortable"?
>Is it as configurable?
>
>These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
>(or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
>switching.
>
>Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?

Note the above questions refers to thunderbird (v. 1.0).  Why not run
a side-by-side comparison for a few weeks?  No review in the world is
going to tell you, for sure, if you will like a particular email
client or not.  

I use pegasus and eudora.  I've been running TB also for the last
month.  In my experience, it is nicely configurable (some
configuration items requre readily available extensions).  It is
stable.  Except for filtering (below) it does everything eudora does
that I make use of.  Doubtless there are a number of things it does
not do that eudora does.  The reverse is probably true also.  Comfort
is too personal a concept to comment on.  

Compared to options I like in pegasus and eudora, the only lack I've
seen so far is in the filtering capability.  In this respect pegasus
is far in the lead, eudora is also quite good.  TB only permits
filtering on specified headers, or body text.  And the filter function
is sometimes a bit annoying to me.

I use IMAP relatively rarely, so my comments are restricted to POP3
access. 

Give it a shot and see if you like it.

0
Reply BobT 2/26/2005 3:18:19 PM

You might also try PocoMail...
http://www.pocosystems.com/home/index.php?option=content&task=category&sectionid=2&id=7&Itemid=25

Highly configurable and does most everything that Eudora does,
including redirect (called bounce in PocoMail).

If you like the look and feel of Outlook 2003, it does that also.

Unlike some competing products, PocoMail doesn't use the Internet
Explorer component to preview your HTML messages. Instead it uses an
internal HTML viewer. 
PocoMail does not understand VBScript or JavaScript, which are used to
write email viruses. 
PocoMail will not run PocoScript, its own scripting language, from
messages you receive. While VBScript and JavaScript let a third-party
control your mailer, PocoScript was designed to let you better control
your mailer. You'll need to enable PocoScript on a message (to better
process it) before the script can run.

On 25 Feb 2005 14:52:30 -0800, "Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>I like it.
>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>


0
Reply Les 2/26/2005 7:19:51 PM

On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:
>
>Does it do everything that Eudora does?

One thing it does **not** do that is a curse with Eudora is play havoc
with CR/LF

I have had the Eudora gurus baffled in the newsgroup. 

I have to send copy received from various sources to club members. I
use copy and paste, sometimes via a text editor to remove formatting.

I use the non printing characters to ensure that I have paragraph
separation and the received email has no line space after a paragraph
where I saw two paragraph marks.  I have been sending with three
paragraph marks and then I get a line space.

There is an example of a prepared email here:

http://www.rotary9790.org.au/test/eudora1.htm

There is another example of the phenomenon here:

http://www.rotary9790.org.au/test/Eudora2.htm

Each of the web pages has a hyperlink to the other one.

Robin Chapple
0
Reply Robin 2/26/2005 11:59:31 PM

On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, Francis Burton wrote:

>In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>I like it.
>>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.

>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
For the *average* user - abslolutely ...yes. Much of the more recent
additions (emoticons etc.) seem [to me] to be just useless junk
(emoticons etc.).

I ran the two in parallel for a while, then switched to TB. There's
hardly a function that I find I miss from Eudora.

>Is it as stable as Eudora?
I don't think I've had a crash in TB yet. Mind you, my Eudora setup
always seemd pretty stable - at least compared to many of the troubled
posters here.

>Is it as "comfortable"?
>Is it as configurable?
As with changing from any well-used program to another, it takes a
little getting used to. It has the odd "quirk" but once set up, just
sits there and lets you get on with the job. I certainly don't think
it gives as many problems with, say, using multiple personalities as
does Eudora.

Eudora has served me well overs the years, and I tend to stay loyal to
a good product (that's why I keep poking my nose into this group).
However - Eudora has become expensive to maintain and I feel the
developers have lost the plot. So called "upgrades" (that take *years*
to arrive) have become just minor tweaks with additional fripperies,
whilst glaring bugs apper to remain unfixed (or introduced).

I really thought I wasn't going to stick with Eudora for much longer.
My brief flirtation with Thunderbird has developed into a full-blown
affair <g>.

There are probably just too many variations of useage to compare
directly - point by point. I'd do what someone else suggested - just
run the two in tandem for a while and see what suits *you*.

Adam.
0
Reply Adamski 2/27/2005 12:23:18 AM

On 25 Feb 2005 14:52:30 -0800, "Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>I like it.
>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.

What does it have for spam filtering? For Eudora, Spamnix is an
excellent plug-in spam filter that catches almost everything. Is there
anything similar for Thunderbird?
0
Reply Jim 2/27/2005 2:40:23 AM

fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:

>In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>I like it.
>>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
>Is it as stable as Eudora?
>Is it as "comfortable"?
>Is it as configurable?
>
>These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
>(or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
>switching.
>
>Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
>
>Francis
>
One thing it won't do is "redirect " an email rather than forward. .
Something I use quite allot with Eudora..
0
Reply Mutlley 2/27/2005 7:18:37 PM

No.

I started using Thunderbird in December.

It has several shortcomings.

For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size (don't
know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and read
messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.

It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.

When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the mailboxes
to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then search
for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.

There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to be
able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No built-in
way to do this.

Documentation is sparse and not well organized.

Does not provide an interface for VB/VBA programming.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
"Francis Burton" <fburton@nyx.net> wrote in message
news:1109416358.675015@irys.nyx.net...
> In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
> Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> >I like it.
> >Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
> Does it do everything that Eudora does?
> Is it as stable as Eudora?
> Is it as "comfortable"?
> Is it as configurable?
>
> These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
> (or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
> switching.
>
> Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
>
> Francis
>
>


0
Reply Howard 2/27/2005 8:45:26 PM

"Adamski" <anon@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:qo3221tnkbphpnipr82p3lk18ks2um5o5c@4ax.com...

> I don't think I've had a crash in TB yet. Mind you, my Eudora setup
> always seemd pretty stable - at least compared to many of the troubled
> posters here.

I've not yet had Thunderbird "crash", but I regularly get Application errors
when closing the program.


0
Reply Howard 2/27/2005 8:49:08 PM

Thunderbird made a complete mess of copying the address book from
Eudora and I am not prepared to reconstruct it.

On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:

>In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>I like it.
>>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
>Is it as stable as Eudora?
>Is it as "comfortable"?
>Is it as configurable?
>
>These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
>(or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
>switching.
>
>Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
>
>Francis
>

0
Reply Robin 2/27/2005 8:54:44 PM

Howard Kaikow wrote:
> No.
> 
> I started using Thunderbird in December.
> 
> It has several shortcomings.
> 
> For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size (don't
> know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
> reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and read
> messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.

Sounds more like an ISP-related imitation. I've successfully received 
attachments up to >10 megs with no problem

> 
> It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.

True - but some work is required for any program, including Eudora.

> 
> When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the mailboxes
> to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then search
> for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.

Why - I've never had difficulty finding newly received messages.

> 
> There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to be
> able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No built-in
> way to do this.

Can't do this in Eudora either I don't believe. If you can (without 
deleting) please say how.

> 
> Documentation is sparse and not well organized.

True.

> 
> Does not provide an interface for VB/VBA programming.
> 
0
Reply RWEmerson 2/27/2005 9:16:03 PM

Howard Kaikow wrote:
> No.
> I started using Thunderbird in December.
> It has several shortcomings.
> 
> For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size (don't
> know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
> reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and read
> messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.

It would be for me too.  Did you check all the option settings - maybe 
this is something you can control or turn off.

I just installed TB to try it last night.  There is an option setting 
for this.  If you right-click the mail account and choose properties (or 
get to the properties tabs in other ways) there's one group or tab for 
Disk Space.  That has a checkable/uncheckable option that says "To save 
disk space, do not download any emails larger than ____", and you can 
either make that a big number or just uncheck the option.

> It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.

Maybe be true, but I don't use any really fancy things in my filters - 
just basically have it check the From line and move the email message to 
a folder based on that.  To that extent, the filtering seems to work the 
same in both.  If you do fancier stuff, TB probably can't handle it yet.

> When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the mailboxes
> to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then search
> for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.

Not sure what you mean here.  I've set up a few filters, and when new 
mail comes, the mailboxes where it resides are bolded, just like in 
Eudora.  No problem finding the new ones, but maybe I'm not 
understanding you.


> There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to be
> able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No built-in
> way to do this.

I didn't know you could do this with Eudora.  I probably don't need it, 
but it's neat to know.

> Documentation is sparse and not well organized.

Guess that's partly the nature of open source projects (OS folks please 
don't yell at me... :)

> Does not provide an interface for VB/VBA programming.

Didn't know Eudora did that either, but I don't really need it.

Actually I'm so happy with and used to Eudora, that I'll probably stay 
with it for email (and I just paid $50 for it).  But I'll use TB for my 
newsgroup reading, since I don't like to use Outlook for anything if I 
can avoid it.  (Is there a newsgroup reader in Eudora that I'm just 
missing?)

But if I hadn't a just bought Eudora, I might go with TB.  It seems 
fine, and the price is right.  The only other issue for me is that I 
like my plain-text, insecure MBX files.  I thought TB would somehow 
automatically encrypt the messages, but I just realized that it doesn't 
so I'll still have plain text access to the mailboxes.  In that case I 
would definitely use TB happily (so far, anyway) if I didn't have Eudora.

-- garyZ
0
Reply Gary 2/27/2005 10:48:13 PM

Robin Chapple wrote:
> Thunderbird made a complete mess of copying the address book from
> Eudora and I am not prepared to reconstruct it.

It worked great for me.  My address book was in Eudora 6.2.1, recently 
upgraded from Eudora 5.1.  The addresses made all the transitions 
intact, and I like the address information display in TB better than Eudora.

Just another data point.

-- garyZ
0
Reply Gary 2/27/2005 10:51:35 PM

Gary Zimmerman kindly wrote on 27/02/2005 23:51:
> Robin Chapple wrote:
>> Thunderbird made a complete mess of copying the address book from
>> Eudora and I am not prepared to reconstruct it.
> 
> It worked great for me.  My address book was in Eudora 6.2.1,
> recently upgraded from Eudora 5.1.  The addresses made all the
> transitions intact, and I like the address information display in TB
> better than Eudora.

It may be okay if you've only got one email address per address book 
entry, but my address book with plenty of mailing lists and phone 
numbers in it was unusable after TBird was done with importing.

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 2/28/2005 12:12:33 AM

Jim Byrd kindly wrote on 27/02/2005 03:40:
> What does it have for spam filtering? For Eudora, Spamnix is an
> excellent plug-in spam filter that catches almost everything. Is there
> anything similar for Thunderbird?

It's got a built-in spam filter that works miraculously well. When 
Eudora's spam filter was new, I was amazed at how much stuff it caught. 
With TBird, though, I'm still stunned. It's really very good, right out 
of the box.

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 2/28/2005 12:14:44 AM

Francis Burton kindly wrote on 26/02/2005 12:12:
> Does it do everything that Eudora does?

No, but then it's a different program. It does a few things that Eudora 
doesn't, so what?

> Is it as stable as Eudora?

Absolutely.

> Is it as "comfortable"?

That surely lies in the eye of the beholder. You'll need a few 
extensions for all the functionality you've got used to with Eudora, but 
in the end it's really quite good.

> Is it as configurable?

I'd probably say yes. Eudora has quite a few strong points, as does 
TBird. With TBird, you've got lots of extensions, and you can tweak 
almost anything in the about:config dialog.

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 2/28/2005 12:20:20 AM

Adamski kindly wrote on 27/02/2005 01:23:
> I certainly don't think
> it gives as many problems with, say, using multiple personalities as
> does Eudora.

Now that is certainly something that Eudora does exceptionally well. 
Setting up different SMTP servers, for example, in TBird that use the 
same domain but different user logins is still a pain in the arse with 
TBird -- unless you've got the right extension. ;> (If you're curious: 
"Show SMTP username".)

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 2/28/2005 12:22:41 AM

Mutlley kindly wrote on 27/02/2005 20:18:
> One thing it won't do is "redirect " an email rather than forward.

It will. The extension is called "Mail Redirect".

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 2/28/2005 12:23:26 AM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:48:13 -0800, Gary Zimmerman wrote:

>Howard Kaikow wrote:

>> When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the mailboxes
>> to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then search
>> for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.
>
>Not sure what you mean here.  I've set up a few filters, and when new 
>mail comes, the mailboxes where it resides are bolded, just like in 
>Eudora.  No problem finding the new ones, but maybe I'm not 
>understanding you.

I think I know what Gary means here. TB unfortunately emoldens ALL
your profile names (if you have a multi-profile setup) - and "Local
Folders" - regardless of whether they've just recieved new mail.

There's no easy (visual) way of knowing which of the profiles just got
mail.

I'm a bit wary of discussing TB in a Eudora newsgroup, so to counter
that - this highlighting is one thing Eudora *does* get right!

Adam.
0
Reply Adam 2/28/2005 12:38:47 AM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:51:35 -0800, Gary Zimmerman
<garyzim@NOexciteSPAM.com> wrote:
>
>It worked great for me.  My address book was in Eudora 6.2.1, recently 
>upgraded from Eudora 5.1.  The addresses made all the transitions 
>intact, and I like the address information display in TB better than Eudora.
>
I have put my evidence on a web page. Unreliable is the only comment.

http://www.rotary9790.org.au/test/eudora4.htm

Robin Chapple

>Robin Chapple wrote:
>> Thunderbird made a complete mess of copying the address book from
>> Eudora and I am not prepared to reconstruct it.
0
Reply Robin 2/28/2005 6:29:39 AM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 01:22:41 +0100, Peter Beattie wrote:

>Adamski kindly wrote on 27/02/2005 01:23:
>> I certainly don't think
>> it gives as many problems with, say, using multiple personalities as
>> does Eudora.
>
>Now that is certainly something that Eudora does exceptionally well. 
>Setting up different SMTP servers, for example, in TBird that use the 
>same domain but different user logins is still a pain in the arse with 
>TBird -- unless you've got the right extension. ;> (If you're curious: 
>"Show SMTP username".)

I've no experience of setting up different *SMTP* servers with TB
(mine all use the same one) so I'm sure you're right.

On the other hand - I've seen many posts here that have complained
about messages going out with the wrong personality somewhere in the
header - seemed to have started with the later versions of Eudora.

Again - I personally haven't had such problems (lucky me!) but I was
under the impression that there were problems in that area.

Adam.

0
Reply Adam 2/28/2005 9:48:20 AM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:18:37 +1300, Mutlley <mutley2000@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>One thing it won't do is "redirect " an email rather than forward. .
>Something I use quite allot with Eudora..

There is an extension called Mail Redirect (see the TB extension pages
at Mozilla) that configures TB to do just this.

0
Reply BobT 2/28/2005 2:22:08 PM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:45:26 -0500, "Howard Kaikow"
<kaikow@standards.com> wrote:


>
>For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size (don't
>know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
>reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and read
>messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.

See if you can figure out the max size.  I've received attachments up
to around 5 MB (nothing bigger happens to have arrived so far in my
tests) with no problem.

>It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.

That surely is the truth.  The filter capability is nowhere near as
good as Eudora, which isn't very good either.

>When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the mailboxes
>to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then search
>for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.

I don't understand the problem.  Except for new messages moved to
particular folders by filter action, TB can be configured to place all
new messages in a single inbox.  If you want to, that is.  I don't,
but I've tested and it works.

>Documentation is sparse and not well organized.

Open source software often, maybe usually, starts off this way.
Things tend to improve, but slowly.

0
Reply BobT 2/28/2005 2:32:04 PM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:23:18 +1300, Adamski <anon@nowhere.com> wrote:

>On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, Francis Burton wrote:
>
>>In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>>I like it.
>>>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
>>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
>For the *average* user - abslolutely ...yes. Much of the more recent
>additions (emoticons etc.) seem [to me] to be just useless junk
>(emoticons etc.).
>
>I ran the two in parallel for a while, then switched to TB. There's
>hardly a function that I find I miss from Eudora.
>
>>Is it as stable as Eudora?
>I don't think I've had a crash in TB yet. Mind you, my Eudora setup
>always seemd pretty stable - at least compared to many of the troubled
>posters here.
>
>>Is it as "comfortable"?
>>Is it as configurable?
>As with changing from any well-used program to another, it takes a
>little getting used to. It has the odd "quirk" but once set up, just
>sits there and lets you get on with the job. I certainly don't think
>it gives as many problems with, say, using multiple personalities as
>does Eudora.
>
>Eudora has served me well overs the years, and I tend to stay loyal to
>a good product (that's why I keep poking my nose into this group).
>However - Eudora has become expensive to maintain and I feel the
>developers have lost the plot. So called "upgrades" (that take *years*
>to arrive) have become just minor tweaks with additional fripperies,
>whilst glaring bugs apper to remain unfixed (or introduced).
>
>I really thought I wasn't going to stick with Eudora for much longer.
>My brief flirtation with Thunderbird has developed into a full-blown
>affair <g>.
>
>There are probably just too many variations of useage to compare
>directly - point by point. I'd do what someone else suggested - just
>run the two in tandem for a while and see what suits *you*.
>
>Adam.


I just recently installed TB and so far I do not care much for it at
all.  I agree any new software takes getting used to, but I have
always been the person who likes or dislikes software in the first
hour of use.  If I like it, its rare I will dislike it later.  If I
dislike it in the first hour, I do not recall ever sticking with the
software.  So, I doubt I will continue with it.  I could not even
explain why, other than the fact I am finding it clumbsy and lacking
the things I want in email software.  Of course I have used Eudora for
10 years or so.  I started using it with Windows 3,1.
So, it's hard to change.  I have three 2 complaints with Eudora, and
it all boils down to the way Eudora hogs memory.  The 3.x versions
were quick and easy.  After that, Eudora turned into a memory hog.  If
Eudora is receiving or sneding email, I may as well leave the
computer, because I can not retrieve a website or newsgroups.  Eudora
3.x loaded fast, but once I got to the 4.x versions, it got real slow
to load. Eudora also tends to crash fiarly often when people put lots
of pictures in my email.  I have solved most of that by telling the
people to send me only plain text messages.  The other thing is the 
fact that Eudora does not allow eliminating html content in messages.

Yet, I still like Eudora much better than TB.  I just want to go back
to Eudora 3.x.  I never understood why people need all the nonsense
they send in email.  The key word is "mail".  Generally the mailbox
contains a white paper with black text.  Maybe a logo if it is
business related.  Why should email contain so much junk?  Emoticons
are one of the newest and most assenine additions that serve no
purpose at all, (except for those under the age of 16 who think a
computer is a toy).

For the person that was complaining that Eudora does not upgrade often
enough, I ask, what the hell more do you want? This is EMAIL.  What
more can you possibly do with it?  I personally would like to see
Eudora downgrade in order to make it faster and eliminate all the
useless toys.  But I answered my own question when I said I want to go
back to version 3,x.

With that said, I still prefer Eudora.  TB takes even longer than
Eudora to load, and I see no advantages whatsoever.  I would have
deleted it by now, if it were not for the fact that I love Firefox,
and rarely use IE anymore.  But TB just dont "trip my trigger" and I
am afraid it never will.


0
Reply myself 2/28/2005 5:46:52 PM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:45:26 -0500, "Howard Kaikow"
<kaikow@standards.com> wrote:

>No.
>
>I started using Thunderbird in December.
>
>It has several shortcomings.
>
>For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size (don't
>know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
>reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and read
>messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.
>
>It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.


If this is the case. I will be removing it immediately.  There's no
sense continuing to try to convince myself to like this software
(which I really do not like), if it has this limitation.  My email is
too valuable to lose because of bad software and some idiot that is
sending me huge attachments that I never wanted in the first place.
Unfortunately I got such a person (I guess we all do), that has to
send all sorts high graphic content GARBAGE.  I finally added them to
my kill filter, but the mail is still downloaded off my server before
it goes in the trash, so I got to wait as much as a half hour to get
the email I want.  I finally solved that by setting a limit filesize
to download, which means that when someone else sends an attachment, I
got to retrieve it a second time.  All because of one rude person who
thinks it's cute to annoy others with crap email that he forwards to
several hundred persons.  I just wish there was a way to filter such
messages from ever appearing on my server.

Anyhow, I was getting long winded, but if TB locks me out of further
email because some idiot sent me garbage, I am done with it now.
0
Reply myself 2/28/2005 6:05:38 PM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:38:47 +1300, Adam <anon@nowhere.com> wrote:

>I'm a bit wary of discussing TB in a Eudora newsgroup, so to counter
>that - this highlighting is one thing Eudora *does* get right!
>
>Adam.


WHY?
Sure this is an Eudora newsgroup, but if we dont discuss the
competition, how will we ever learn what they offer and what they
dont.  It's just like awhile back when someone had the audacity to
post something about another online auction in an Ebay discussion
group and someone got all bent out of shape about it.  In that case,
Ebay was the loser.  In this case, Eudora is still the winner in my
opinion, but others will surely disagree.

Now if you posted on here a discussion about cooking, you might upset
a few people, almost as much as if you had posted one of those
messages that say "Enlarge Your Pens"  Why would anyone want 14 inch
pens?  Their desk would be too small for pens that big......

0
Reply myself 2/28/2005 6:19:47 PM

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:16:03 -0700, RWEmerson
<foolish_consistency@hobgoblin.com> wrote:

>> There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to be
>> able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No built-in
>> way to do this.
>
>Can't do this in Eudora either I don't believe. 

You'd better believe it.

>If you can (without 
>deleting) please say how.

It's that way by default with every version of Eudora I've ever used.
Attachments are stored in a default attachment directory, never in a
mailbox.
0
Reply Andrew 2/28/2005 6:47:45 PM

Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> I like it.

Good for you. I recently tried Thunderbird as a newsreader.
Total crap: no threading (that i could figure out at least),
no binary support - don't even think of yEnc.
I'd even "recommend" OE over Thunderbird for news ...

It may be OK as a mail client - if you are used to OE.
Didn't try that part - I'm not interested. 
Been using Eudora for 15 years, and kind of like it :-)

-- 
I recommend Macs to my friends, and Intel machines 
to those whom I don't mind billing by the hour
0
Reply andekl_no 2/28/2005 6:56:42 PM

myself@no-email.com said the following on 2/28/05 12:46 PM:

>On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:23:18 +1300, Adamski <anon@nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>  
>
>>On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, Francis Burton wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>>>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>>>I like it.
>>>>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>Does it do everything that Eudora does?
>>>      
>>>
>>For the *average* user - abslolutely ...yes. Much of the more recent
>>additions (emoticons etc.) seem [to me] to be just useless junk
>>(emoticons etc.).
>>
>>I ran the two in parallel for a while, then switched to TB. There's
>>hardly a function that I find I miss from Eudora.
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Is it as stable as Eudora?
>>>      
>>>
>>I don't think I've had a crash in TB yet. Mind you, my Eudora setup
>>always seemd pretty stable - at least compared to many of the troubled
>>posters here.
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Is it as "comfortable"?
>>>Is it as configurable?
>>>      
>>>
>>As with changing from any well-used program to another, it takes a
>>little getting used to. It has the odd "quirk" but once set up, just
>>sits there and lets you get on with the job. I certainly don't think
>>it gives as many problems with, say, using multiple personalities as
>>does Eudora.
>>
>>Eudora has served me well overs the years, and I tend to stay loyal to
>>a good product (that's why I keep poking my nose into this group).
>>However - Eudora has become expensive to maintain and I feel the
>>developers have lost the plot. So called "upgrades" (that take *years*
>>to arrive) have become just minor tweaks with additional fripperies,
>>whilst glaring bugs apper to remain unfixed (or introduced).
>>
>>I really thought I wasn't going to stick with Eudora for much longer.
>>My brief flirtation with Thunderbird has developed into a full-blown
>>affair <g>.
>>
>>There are probably just too many variations of useage to compare
>>directly - point by point. I'd do what someone else suggested - just
>>run the two in tandem for a while and see what suits *you*.
>>
>>Adam.
>>    
>>
>
>
>I just recently installed TB and so far I do not care much for it at
>all.  I agree any new software takes getting used to, but I have
>always been the person who likes or dislikes software in the first
>hour of use.  If I like it, its rare I will dislike it later.  If I
>dislike it in the first hour, I do not recall ever sticking with the
>software.  So, I doubt I will continue with it.  I could not even
>explain why, other than the fact I am finding it clumbsy and lacking
>the things I want in email software.  Of course I have used Eudora for
>10 years or so.  I started using it with Windows 3,1.
>So, it's hard to change.  I have three 2 complaints with Eudora, and
>it all boils down to the way Eudora hogs memory.  The 3.x versions
>were quick and easy.  After that, Eudora turned into a memory hog.  If
>Eudora is receiving or sneding email, I may as well leave the
>computer, because I can not retrieve a website or newsgroups.  Eudora
>3.x loaded fast, but once I got to the 4.x versions, it got real slow
>to load. Eudora also tends to crash fiarly often when people put lots
>of pictures in my email.  I have solved most of that by telling the
>people to send me only plain text messages.  The other thing is the 
>fact that Eudora does not allow eliminating html content in messages.
>
>Yet, I still like Eudora much better than TB.  I just want to go back
>to Eudora 3.x.  I never understood why people need all the nonsense
>they send in email.  The key word is "mail".  Generally the mailbox
>contains a white paper with black text.  Maybe a logo if it is
>business related.  Why should email contain so much junk?  Emoticons
>are one of the newest and most assenine additions that serve no
>purpose at all, (except for those under the age of 16 who think a
>computer is a toy).
>
>For the person that was complaining that Eudora does not upgrade often
>enough, I ask, what the hell more do you want? This is EMAIL.  What
>more can you possibly do with it?  I personally would like to see
>Eudora downgrade in order to make it faster and eliminate all the
>useless toys.  But I answered my own question when I said I want to go
>back to version 3,x.
>
>With that said, I still prefer Eudora.  TB takes even longer than
>Eudora to load, and I see no advantages whatsoever.  I would have
>deleted it by now, if it were not for the fact that I love Firefox,
>and rarely use IE anymore.  But TB just dont "trip my trigger" and I
>am afraid it never will.
>
>
>  
>
Well, I agree with you, to a point. I use TB for newsgroups; Eudora for 
mail. I recently decided to drop back from 6.2.1.2 to 6.1.2 due to the 
constant crashing. I might go back to 3.0.5 if there was a junk filter 
in it. Oh, well.

Rick
0
Reply Rick 2/28/2005 8:24:12 PM

Anders Ekl�f said the following on 2/28/05 1:56 PM:

>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
>>I like it.
>>    
>>
>
>Good for you. I recently tried Thunderbird as a newsreader.
>Total crap: no threading (that i could figure out at least),
>no binary support - don't even think of yEnc.
>I'd even "recommend" OE over Thunderbird for news ...
>
>It may be OK as a mail client - if you are used to OE.
>Didn't try that part - I'm not interested. 
>Been using Eudora for 15 years, and kind of like it :-)
>
>  
>
Threads just fine, here. Post back with an email address I can figure 
out, if yours is munged, if you want more info, and I'll try to show you.

Rick
0
Reply Rick 2/28/2005 8:29:45 PM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:24:12 -0500, Rick wrote:

>Well, I agree with you, to a point. I use TB for newsgroups; Eudora for 
>mail. I recently decided to drop back from 6.2.1.2 to 6.1.2 due to the 
>constant crashing. I might go back to 3.0.5 if there was a junk filter 
>in it. Oh, well.

If you don't need SSL, K9 works as well as the junk filter 
provided with Eudora 6.  If you need SSL, then I guess 
3.0.5 won't work anyway.

http://www.keir.net/k9.html   <----- free

Eudora 5 & 6 used to crash or hang a couple of times a
week; then I re-installed all my software when I upgraded
my mainboard/cpu/video card, and not one crash or hang
since.  I guess I'll never know for sure if it was a video
driver incompatibility or a conflict with something left
behind by an incomplete uninstallation, but I suspect
the video driver.

Erik
0
Reply Erik 2/28/2005 8:50:13 PM

Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.
If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
your mail.
Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
messages or volumes of large attachments.
Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.

0
Reply Mr 2/28/2005 10:58:47 PM

"RWEmerson" <foolish_consistency@hobgoblin.com> wrote in message
news:1124e4m3vb50gd6@corp.supernews.com...
> > For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size
(don't
> > know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird
aborts
> > reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and
read
> > messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.
>
> Sounds more like an ISP-related imitation. I've successfully received
> attachments up to >10 megs with no problem

Not an ISP limitation. I can use Eudora to fetch the mail. But Thunderbird
has the problem I described.

> > It is not possible to map all Eudora filters to Thunderbird filters.
>
> True - but some work is required for any program, including Eudora.

Thunderbird is missing some filtering capability so no amount of work can
overcome this limitation.

> > When Thunderbird receives mail, you have to go searching thru the
mailboxes
> > to find the messages. The alternative is create an search and then
search
> > for the messages after the fact. This is very annoying.
>
> Why - I've never had difficulty finding newly received messages.

You must have a lot simpler mailbox heirarchy.
Thunderbird does have the problem I described.

> > There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to
be
> > able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No
built-in
> > way to do this.
>
> Can't do this in Eudora either I don't believe. If you can (without
> deleting) please say how.

Eudora does not store the attachment within the message, so you are free to
move the attachment where you wish.

In Thunderbird, the attachments are in the messahe and cannot be saved
separately, tho somebody claims to have an extension to do so,


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:20:09 AM

"Gary Zimmerman" <garyzim@NOexciteSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:1124jheq34lj1ae@corp.supernews.com...
> It would be for me too.  Did you check all the option settings - maybe
> this is something you can control or turn off.
>
> I just installed TB to try it last night.  There is an option setting
> for this.  If you right-click the mail account and choose properties (or
> get to the properties tabs in other ways) there's one group or tab for
> Disk Space.  That has a checkable/uncheckable option that says "To save
> disk space, do not download any emails larger than ____", and you can
> either make that a big number or just uncheck the option.

I know about that option.
I do not have that option checked, so I am not limiting the space.
And I have tried a large number to no avail,

There must be a built-in default that is getting used that I am unable to
override.
I looked thru the various options/preference files and did not see anything
that might apply.
I expect that there is an option that can be forced, but I do not know the
setting ang nobody has responded to my postings on this issue in the
Thunderbird forums.

There are other options that seem to have a mind of their own, but this one
is the killer.

> Maybe be true, but I don't use any really fancy things in my filters -
> just basically have it check the From line and move the email message to
> a folder based on that.  To that extent, the filtering seems to work the
> same in both.  If you do fancier stuff, TB probably can't handle it yet.

To proberly filter one has to check things such as AnyHeader and
AnyRecipient, Thunderbird lacks this.

Also, Thunderbird does not allow a combination of AND and OR, making it
impossible to do some types of filtering.

> Not sure what you mean here.  I've set up a few filters, and when new
> mail comes, the mailboxes where it resides are bolded, just like in
> Eudora.  No problem finding the new ones, but maybe I'm not
> understanding you.

I have found two problems.

1. The mailboxes are not always bolded.
2. I have a very complex mailbox hierarchy, so it's time consuming to look
thru the criters.

I just defined an Incoming Search mailbox and search for messages that way.
It builds a list of the messages just received.

A faster way is to use a filter log, but the log does not contain links to
the messages.

A good email program should be building a list of the messages just received
with a link to each message.

> > There is no built-in way to do some things. For example, it is useful to
be
> > able to save a message without its attachments in the mailbox, No
built-in
> > way to do this.
>
> I didn't know you could do this with Eudora.  I probably don't need it,
 but it's neat to know.

Eudora saves the attachments separately from the message, so you can
copy/move them anywhere.
Not so with Thunderbird.

> > Does not provide an interface for VB/VBA programming.
>
> Didn't know Eudora did that either, but I don't really need it.

Eudora does have VBA interface, but does not expose all of the Eudora
functionality in VB.


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:36:21 AM

"Adam" <anon@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:nnp421heeo6mf8i3al2u11cftuukmg8fft@4ax.com...

> I'm a bit wary of discussing TB in a Eudora newsgroup, so to counter
> that - this highlighting is one thing Eudora *does* get right!

Not always, but it does pop open the mailboxes.


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:37:55 AM

"BobT" <fake@invalid.net> wrote in message
news:4ha621h9l9n0ncm25fkcn36ded1qaovaeb@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:45:26 -0500, "Howard Kaikow"
> <kaikow@standards.com> wrote:
>
>
> >
> >For example, I cannot receive mail with an attachment over some size
(don't
> >know the size) and when such a message is encountered, Thunderbird aborts
> >reading the incoming mail queue, leaving remaining messages unread and
read
> >messages are left on the mail server. This is just about a show stopper.
>
> See if you can figure out the max size.  I've received attachments up
> to around 5 MB (nothing bigger happens to have arrived so far in my
> tests) with no problem.

So have I.

I expect that the installation has somehow gotten corrupted.
I'll re-install when the update is released, supposedly this week.

> I don't understand the problem.  Except for new messages moved to
> particular folders by filter action, TB can be configured to place all
> new messages in a single inbox.  If you want to, that is.  I don't,
> but I've tested and it works.

Yes, the problem is that messages are filtered upon receipt.
I could allow all the messages to go in one inbox and filter afterwards.
Not something that has to be done with Eudora.

> Open source software often, maybe usually, starts off this way.
> Things tend to improve, but slowly.

Firefox has improved its documentation.
Thunderbird is dragging its documentation.
>


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:43:58 AM

> If this is the case. I will be removing it immediately.  There's no
> sense continuing to try to convince myself to like this software
> (which I really do not like), if it has this limitation.  My email is
> too valuable to lose because of bad software and some idiot that is
> sending me huge attachments that I never wanted in the first place.
> Unfortunately I got such a person (I guess we all do), that has to
> send all sorts high graphic content GARBAGE.  I finally added them to
> my kill filter, but the mail is still downloaded off my server before
> it goes in the trash, so I got to wait as much as a half hour to get
> the email I want.  I finally solved that by setting a limit filesize
> to download, which means that when someone else sends an attachment, I
> got to retrieve it a second time.  All because of one rude person who
> thinks it's cute to annoy others with crap email that he forwards to
> several hundred persons.  I just wish there was a way to filter such
> messages from ever appearing on my server.
>
> Anyhow, I was getting long winded, but if TB locks me out of further
> email because some idiot sent me garbage, I am done with it now.

I do not lose the mail, but I have to download with Eudora.

I go to my ISP's webmail to delete the critters.

Currently, I use  Thunderbird as the defaul tmail program.
But I still have Eudora, modified to disable filters and put everything on a
single In mailbox, and leave mail on the server so Thunderbird can also
download.

I do most of the initial filtering at my ISP using an implementation of
Sieve (RFC 3028) provided by my ISP. Last I checked, it was killing hundreds
of messages per day before I even downloaded mail.


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:51:16 AM

I had no trouble with the address  book.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
"Robin Chapple" <robinski@ANTI_SPAMmelbpc.org.au> wrote in message
news:jpc421h0upiik327ko9ocsi2vf49bbe0u5@4ax.com...
> Thunderbird made a complete mess of copying the address book from
> Eudora and I am not prepared to reconstruct it.
>
> On 26 Feb 2005 11:12:38 GMT, fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:
>
> >In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
> >Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >>Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> >>I like it.
> >>Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
> >
> >Does it do everything that Eudora does?
> >Is it as stable as Eudora?
> >Is it as "comfortable"?
> >Is it as configurable?
> >
> >These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
> >(or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
> >switching.
> >
> >Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
> >
> >Francis
> >
>


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:52:10 AM

I've not tried Thunderbird for news, still use OE.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
"Anders Ekl�f" <andekl_no@saaf_spam.se> wrote in message
news:1gsplc0.1n6po024vh1e8N%andekl_no@saaf_spam.se...
> Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> > Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> > I like it.
>
> Good for you. I recently tried Thunderbird as a newsreader.
> Total crap: no threading (that i could figure out at least),
> no binary support - don't even think of yEnc.
> I'd even "recommend" OE over Thunderbird for news ...
>
> It may be OK as a mail client - if you are used to OE.
> Didn't try that part - I'm not interested.
> Been using Eudora for 15 years, and kind of like it :-)
>
> -- 
> I recommend Macs to my friends, and Intel machines
> to those whom I don't mind billing by the hour


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 2:54:22 AM

On 28 Feb 2005 14:58:47 -0800, "Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.
>If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
>your mail.
>Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
>messages or volumes of large attachments.
>Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
>messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.

Hmmmmmmmmm, TB sucked out ALL of my Eudora email.  I save ALL email,
(except spam and junk) and have about 10 years of saved emails.  They
are in folders for each year, ex: 2004 2003 2002 ----> all the way
back to 1994.  It took a half hour to install because of that.  I
really did NOT want that.  I only wanted it to retrieve my settings
from Eudora but it never said what it was gonna do. It just did it.

I do not want to delete the old email from my computer, and plan to
keep Eudora no matter what.  How can I remove all that old mail from
TB (only)?  I wanted it to start out fresh....

PS. Did it COPY all that old email?  It does bring up all my old
folders, but I can not see copies in the TB directory or sub-dirs.  I
assume it is reading right out of my Eudora dirs.  TB is taking about
2- 3  minuted to load.  Eudora is taking about half that time.

I did not think Eudora loaded all that old stuff, Except my Inbox and
Outbox (which the inbox is still relatively small since the year is
fairly new, but the outbox is huge).
0
Reply myself 3/1/2005 3:06:26 AM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:05:38 -0600, "myself@no-email.com" wrote in
message-id <4lm621l5o68cfhrj3rfgkp8vra3h3gr703@4ax.com>:

>My email is
>too valuable to lose because of bad software and some idiot that is
>sending me huge attachments that I never wanted in the first place.
>Unfortunately I got such a person (I guess we all do), that has to
>send all sorts high graphic content GARBAGE.  I finally added them to
>my kill filter, but the mail is still downloaded off my server before
>it goes in the trash, so I got to wait as much as a half hour to get
>the email I want.  I finally solved that by setting a limit filesize
>to download, which means that when someone else sends an attachment, I
>got to retrieve it a second time.  All because of one rude person who
>thinks it's cute to annoy others with crap email that he forwards to
>several hundred persons.  I just wish there was a way to filter such
>messages from ever appearing on my server.

I have some email accounts that receive unwanted email so I just check
those individual accounts first using MailWasher. MW doesn't download
bodies, just the headers and a little bit of text from the body.

Then you are able to choose to delete the email on the server or
download the email with your email program.
-- 

 -.'.-  Les
0
Reply Les 3/1/2005 6:22:26 AM

"Howard Kaikow" <kaikow@standards.com> wrote in news:d00lfm$95e$1
@pyrite.mv.net:

> I've not tried Thunderbird for news, still use OE.
> 

Try Xnews for USENET. 

-- 
matthew.carrick@myfingergmail.com

If you wish to send private email 
please pull my finger . . . thanks!
0
Reply Matthew 3/1/2005 7:04:02 AM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:19:47 -0600, myself@no-email.com wrote:

>On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:38:47 +1300, Adam <anon@nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>>I'm a bit wary of discussing TB in a Eudora newsgroup, so to counter
>>that - this highlighting is one thing Eudora *does* get right!
>>
>>Adam.
>
>
>WHY?
>Sure this is an Eudora newsgroup, but if we dont discuss the
>competition, how will we ever learn what they offer and what they
>dont.  It's just like awhile back when someone had the audacity to
>post something about another online auction in an Ebay discussion
>group and someone got all bent out of shape about it.  In that case,
>Ebay was the loser.  In this case, Eudora is still the winner in my
>opinion, but others will surely disagree.
>
>Now if you posted on here a discussion about cooking, you might upset
>a few people, almost as much as if you had posted one of those
>messages that say "Enlarge Your Pens"  Why would anyone want 14 inch
>pens?  Their desk would be too small for pens that big......

Hehe ... you're quite right - on all counts <g>. This NG is actually
quite good at staying on-topic.

Back to one of your other points - about "not liking" software for no
apparent reason. I actually feel the same way.

I've also useed Eudora for around 10yrs - and got to like the
interface quite a lot. The switch to TB left me somewhat
"underwhelmed". It *does* seem clunky by comparison. But, I stuck with
it, as I'm a great fan of Firebird - and that's turned out to be a
beaut of a browser.

I'm hoping this ugly duckling will turn into a swan <ggg>.

Adam.
0
Reply Adamski 3/1/2005 10:17:39 AM

In article <oql6215kjgnjeng8qs2kan1b4s86o5k162@4ax.com>,
 <myself@no-email.com> wrote:
>Yet, I still like Eudora much better than TB.  I just want to go back
>to Eudora 3.x.

So why don't you? (Serious question, btw.) Me - I never left 3.0(32).

>  I never understood why people need all the nonsense
>they send in email.

You mean, like html? In my experience, it is not worth all the trouble
it causes. Why would one want to mess with fonts or styles anyway? If 
appearance is =that= important, send a Word file. For me it's easier
to emphasize a word by typing a couple of extra characters than futzing
around with the mouse and toolbars.

>For the person that was complaining that Eudora does not upgrade often
>enough, I ask, what the hell more do you want? 

Bigger, brighter, =animated= emoticons! :-) :-( :-)

>This is EMAIL.  What
>more can you possibly do with it?  I personally would like to see
>Eudora downgrade in order to make it faster and eliminate all the
>useless toys.

I would pay good money for that.

>With that said, I still prefer Eudora.  TB takes even longer than
>Eudora to load, and I see no advantages whatsoever.

Uh oh. In this day and age, there is no excuse for any program to
take over a second to load. Why is it so slow?

Francis
0
Reply fburton 3/1/2005 10:34:46 AM

In article <1109631527.259751.280150@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.

Yet another case of "jack of all trades, master of none"? Bleah!

>If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
>your mail.
>Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
>messages or volumes of large attachments.

The trouble is the newest versions of Eudora have nice searching
facilities, specifically tailored to email. I want to be able to
search the last ten years' worth of email and have matching messages 
displayed in a meaningful way, preferably with threading.

A decent component-based system would be able to do that (e.g. a
search app could call on the services of an email client's display
module). Unfortunately no such system exists yet, as far as I know -
certainly not in the mainstream.

>Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
>messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.

While true, that limits its usefulness considerably for some users.

Francis
0
Reply fburton 3/1/2005 10:45:57 AM

My recollection is that Thunderbird gives you an option on what to import.

In any case, just delete the mailboxes you don't want, best done via the
Thunderbird interface.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
<myself@no-email.com> wrote in message
news:ucm721hfcvmr7ftu911agmqja2gvsfcfss@4ax.com...
> On 28 Feb 2005 14:58:47 -0800, "Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> >Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.
> >If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
> >your mail.
> >Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
> >messages or volumes of large attachments.
> >Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
> >messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.
>
> Hmmmmmmmmm, TB sucked out ALL of my Eudora email.  I save ALL email,
> (except spam and junk) and have about 10 years of saved emails.  They
> are in folders for each year, ex: 2004 2003 2002 ----> all the way
> back to 1994.  It took a half hour to install because of that.  I
> really did NOT want that.  I only wanted it to retrieve my settings
> from Eudora but it never said what it was gonna do. It just did it.
>
> I do not want to delete the old email from my computer, and plan to
> keep Eudora no matter what.  How can I remove all that old mail from
> TB (only)?  I wanted it to start out fresh....
>
> PS. Did it COPY all that old email?  It does bring up all my old
> folders, but I can not see copies in the TB directory or sub-dirs.  I
> assume it is reading right out of my Eudora dirs.  TB is taking about
> 2- 3  minuted to load.  Eudora is taking about half that time.
>
> I did not think Eudora loaded all that old stuff, Except my Inbox and
> Outbox (which the inbox is still relatively small since the year is
> fairly new, but the outbox is huge).


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 11:09:50 AM

I believe that Thunderbird has a search mechanism at least as powerful as
Eudora's.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
"Francis Burton" <fburton@nyx.net> wrote in message
news:1109673956.847872@irys.nyx.net...
> In article <1109631527.259751.280150@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.
>
> Yet another case of "jack of all trades, master of none"? Bleah!
>
> >If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
> >your mail.
> >Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
> >messages or volumes of large attachments.
>
> The trouble is the newest versions of Eudora have nice searching
> facilities, specifically tailored to email. I want to be able to
> search the last ten years' worth of email and have matching messages
> displayed in a meaningful way, preferably with threading.
>
> A decent component-based system would be able to do that (e.g. a
> search app could call on the services of an email client's display
> module). Unfortunately no such system exists yet, as far as I know -
> certainly not in the mainstream.
>
> >Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
> >messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.
>
> While true, that limits its usefulness considerably for some users.
>
> Francis


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 11:11:36 AM

OE is satisfactory for my newsreading needs.

-- 
http://www.standards.com/; See Howard Kaikow's web site.
"Matthew Carrick" <matthew.carrick@myfinger.gmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns960C150813194myfinger@216.196.97.142...
> "Howard Kaikow" <kaikow@standards.com> wrote in news:d00lfm$95e$1
> @pyrite.mv.net:
>
> > I've not tried Thunderbird for news, still use OE.
> >
>
> Try Xnews for USENET.
>
> -- 
> matthew.carrick@myfingergmail.com
>
> If you wish to send private email
> please pull my finger . . . thanks!


0
Reply Howard 3/1/2005 11:14:12 AM

BobT,

I've been looking for this extension but can't find it.
Can you post the link please?

0
Reply Mr 3/1/2005 1:51:31 PM

Salut/Hi myself@no-email.com, 

 le/on Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:06:26 -0600, tu disais/you said:-


>I did not think Eudora loaded all that old stuff, Except my Inbox and
>Outbox (which the inbox is still relatively small since the year is
>fairly new, but the outbox is huge).

It doesn't unless you have a window open. While my emails don't go back 10
years, they do go back quite a bit, and like you, I tend to keep everything.
However:-

1:- I store almost nothing in my inbox or outbox, automatically filtering
most mail into appropriate mbxs and the rest into "General Correspondence". 

2:- About once every six months or I archive the penultimate 6 months'
worth. So in January '05 I put Jan to June '04 into an archive, keeping July
to Dec in the mbx. All these mbxs and archives, compressed or not can be
searched via Global Search, and searched impressively fast, as it happens. 

When I download my mail, the mbx into which it is filtered becomes opened,
and its listing is in bold, so I always know where stuff has been put. Once
I've answered it, and sent the reply, I close the MBX again, so in general
Eudora only has the IN and OUT Mbxs open. I couldn't say exactly how long it
takes to load completely, but not long - perhaps 3-4 seconds. I wonder if
the difference couldn't be down to the size of your out mbx which _does_ get
loaded into memory.

I'd strongly recommend at the very least setting up a new MBX called "sent
mail" Then you could set up a filter so that mail once sent gets moved
there. 

I don't work that way at all. I set up reciprocal rules in my filter. If a
message "from" my brother gets moved into "Family" mbx, then at the same
time I set up the filter to work on "outward bound" messages and the rule
would be OR header TO hisname would move to Family.

In fact, for the family I do it quite differently. I have an address book
entry with the nickname "family". In the "expand to" window I have the email
addresses of all my family members with emails. That means that with one
click I can round robin the entire family. But better, I can filter as
follows.

Match (all three) IN OUT Manual all active.

Header from: 
intersects nickname   family

OR 

Header to:
intersects nickname   family

action 

Transfer to mbx family

skip rest.

Which will automatically filter all incoming and outgoing messages to the
same mbx, which is much easier to use to follow conversations. 

I have similar filters for my regular contacts, and for business
correpondence. 

A further advantage of all this is that I keep my OUT mbx small or virtually
empty.

-- 
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website
0
Reply Ian 3/1/2005 4:26:24 PM

On 01 Mar 2005 10:45:57 GMT, fburton@nyx.net (Francis Burton) wrote:

>In article <1109631527.259751.280150@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
>Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>Don't forget, TB has a built in newsreader and RSS reader.
>
>Yet another case of "jack of all trades, master of none"? Bleah!
>
I didnt even know that TB did newsgroups, nor am I willing to leave
Forte Agent.

>>If you find that it is loading slowly, you may need to archive some of
>>your mail.
>>Email clients are not designed as repositories for years worth of
>>messages or volumes of large attachments.
>
>The trouble is the newest versions of Eudora have nice searching
>facilities, specifically tailored to email. I want to be able to
>search the last ten years' worth of email and have matching messages 
>displayed in a meaningful way, preferably with threading.

The 3.x versions of Eudora have horrible searching features.  That was
one reason I upgraded. However, I will be downgrading today.  I just
had Eudora 4.3 crash my computer again today, and a whole hour of
preparing an important email went to hell.  It just happens far too
often.  The minute I prepare a long email, it crashes.  I have been
forced to prepare all emails in Notepad then cut and paste them into
Eudora.  I never had that problem in EU 3.x.

I am going to see if there is a way to keep EU 4.3 and still use EU
3,x.  I will save EU 4.3 strictly for searching, and the rare
occasions that I want to view html content.

I DO NOT want to archive my old email.  Besides personal email, I run
a non-profit business and I MUST have access to old email for the
business, and I refer back to it often, at least the past 3 years.  I
could probably archive the first 7 years, but I need the most recent 3
years plus the present email, and need it one button away.  If I have
to archive and restore all the time, I will not be happy at all.

>A decent component-based system would be able to do that (e.g. a
>search app could call on the services of an email client's display
>module). Unfortunately no such system exists yet, as far as I know -
>certainly not in the mainstream.
>
>>Almost any email client will become faster if you archive older
>>messages and limit what you keep active to a year or less.
>
>While true, that limits its usefulness considerably for some users.
>
>Francis

0
Reply myself 3/1/2005 4:34:43 PM

Mr. D kindly wrote on 01/03/2005 14:51:
> I've been looking for this extension but can't find it. Can you post
> the link please?

http://mailredirect.mozdev.org/

-- 
Peter
0
Reply Peter 3/1/2005 4:51:22 PM

In article <np5921pjvp46l62tc1dbun5g4bij5gs2j9@4ax.com>, myself@no-email.com says...

> I am going to see if there is a way to keep EU 4.3 and still use EU
> 3,x.  I will save EU 4.3 strictly for searching, and the rare
> occasions that I want to view html content.

  Try:
  Yes there is a way.
  Use Eudora 3.x as normal for all your sending / receiving E-Mail.
 
  Then Use Eudora 4.x or 5.x or 6.x just to do your searches.
  What you need to do is Install the Newer Version of Eudora into
  another Drive / Directory, then use Command Line Parameters
  on the higher version to point to your 3.x Mailboxes.  Make sure
  you also point to another Eudora.ini file or you will get all your 
  settings messed up.

  Example:
  Your Installation for Eudora 3.x is in: C:\Eudora31 and it was installed
  with the default parms so your mailboxes are also in this directory.
  (Your In, Out and Trash Mailboxes are in this Directory)
  (Your Eudora.ini file is in this Directory)

  Then . . .
  1. Install the Eudora 4.x Version into C:\Eudora42
  2. Make the Command Line Parameter for the Eudora 4 Icon
     C:\EUDORA42\Eudora.exe C:\Eudora31 C:\Eudora42\Eudora.ini
     and you are all set.
  3. Set the Attachment directory the same one as the 3.x Version
  4. Set this higher version to a Mail Interval Check of 0 so it will
     never check for Mail and mess things up.

  Remember, if you send anything in 4.x and highter, it shows as
  HTML in the Out Mailbox even if you choose plain text.  So if
  you look a sent message from 4.x+ with Eudora 3.x, you will see
  all the formatting tags.  I complained big time about this and
  it has never been fixed.  The message is Sent as Plain Text but
  the Saved Copy is still in HTML format.

  This method works very well as long as you do not need any form
  of Authentication to get you mail from your ISP.
  --
  Over and Out
  Daniel Jacobson

0
Reply daniel12 3/2/2005 3:43:42 AM

On 1 Mar 2005 05:51:31 -0800, "Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>BobT,
>
>I've been looking for this extension but can't find it.
>Can you post the link please?

http://mailredirect.mozdev.org/installation.html

0
Reply BobT 3/2/2005 3:24:54 PM

I did a "side by side" for a few weeks.

TB was missing Eudora's "Speak" function.  TB's filtering was also not as 
good.

I think TB shows promise.  But it's not yet ready to replace Eudora for me.

"Mr. D" <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote in message 
news:1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> I like it.
> Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
> 


0
Reply DG 3/2/2005 7:38:42 PM

Tried it. On my machine (win 98SE) dragging from any mailbox to the inbox
causes the message to disappear. I have emailed Thunderbird but I have also
removed the program. Eudora remains the best program for my personal use.

"Francis Burton" <fburton@nyx.net> wrote in message
news:1109416358.675015@irys.nyx.net...
> In article <1109371950.858480.206420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
> Mr. D <baum744@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Recently tried Thunderbird 1.0 by Mozilla.
> >I like it.
> >Attention Eudora and Outlook users; switch, you'll be glad you did.
>
> Does it do everything that Eudora does?
> Is it as stable as Eudora?
> Is it as "comfortable"?
> Is it as configurable?
>
> These are some of the questions to which I would like answers
> (or reliable indications, at least) before I would consider
> switching.
>
> Are the any comparative reviews of different email clients?
>
> Francis
>
>


0
Reply Charles 3/3/2005 6:23:12 AM

On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:34:43 -0600, myself@no-email.com wrote:

>The 3.x versions of Eudora have horrible searching features.  That was
>one reason I upgraded. However, I will be downgrading today.  I just
>had Eudora 4.3 crash my computer again today, and a whole hour of
>preparing an important email went to hell.  It just happens far too

All true! I upgraded from 3.x also because of search and spam filters
issues. And have had a lot of satbility problems with initial Eudora
6.0 and also with the latest 6.2.1. 

I've found that most stable is Eudora v. 6.0.1.1. No crashes as I can
remember - only I had to  exclude Eudora Spool directory from Symantec
Corporate AV scaning. That should not compromise security much, as
antivirus scans attachment when they are copied to Eudora Attachment
folder.

Tr

0
Reply tr11 3/3/2005 11:07:39 AM

If you want to stick with Eudora but need better searching, why not
install either Google or Copernicus desktop search?

0
Reply Mr 3/3/2005 12:43:23 PM

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:05:38 -0600, myself@no-email.com wrote:


>......All because of one rude person who
>thinks it's cute to annoy others with crap email that he forwards to
>several hundred persons.  I just wish there was a way to filter such
>messages from ever appearing on my server.
>

Mailwasher.pro (free for (1) acct)
gets on server but can be deleted at server.
don't go on without it.....
--=20
  Greg   using Agent 1.93/32.576  Opera 7.50 3778  news.individual.net & =
news.gmane.org
for sale: Apple//,Auto Parts/Equip/Manuals:    =
http://geardoc@geardoc36.hostingisfree.com
0
Reply GregChi 3/4/2005 9:59:48 PM
comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows 10364 articles. 4 followers. Post

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SHORT QUESTION: Is there such a thing as a plugin or alternate frontend that provides iCal with more/better print options? I don't want to abandon iCal because it has pretty good integration with the rest of the system, but if there is another application that can access iCal's database and offer more print options, that might be what I'm looking for. -- schram@webenet.net is a filtered spam magnet. Email replies may get lost. Try <http://public.xdi.org/=chris.schram> instead. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com Chris Schram <schram@webe...

Eudora Options settings file?
Does Eudora save a file that contains all the various settings made via Tools | Options? I've finally got Eudora working perfectly and I want to have a record of my settings should I need to do a reinstallation. On Wed, 04 Nov 2009 16:44:05 -0600, RW wrote: > Does Eudora save a file > that contains all the various settings > made via Tools | Options? Eudora.ini (in the mail "Data" folder, along with mailboxes *.mbx, etc.) > I've finally got Eudora working perfectly > and I want to have a record of my settings > should I need to do...

x-Eudora-option ... how to use?
Hi ... much of the documentation I read about Eudora refers to x-Eudora-options. How do I apply them? In Eudora.INI?? ... if so, where? Does anyone have an example of this?? On 30 Apr 2004 16:30:44 -0700, google@tpsoft.com (Barry Demchak) wrote: >Hi ... much of the documentation I read about Eudora refers to x-Eudora-options. > >How do I apply them? In Eudora.INI?? ... if so, where? > >Does anyone have an example of this?? It is explained in the release notes file in your program directory. There are several examples which will give you an idea how they work....

command line option for Eudora?
Does anyone know if it is possible to send email using command line instructions to Eudora? Thanks, Jim -- Remove the .spam in my E-Mail address should you want to reply by E-Mail. NorSea Odyssey Around The World by BMW Motorcycle http://www.norseaodyssey.com "Yeah, I have a hair stylist. His name's helmet." "If Bill Gates had a nickel for every time Windows crashed....Oh, wait, he does!" On 12 Jan 2005 15:35:21 GMT, Jim Seavey <jwseavey.spam@norseaodyssey.com> wrote: > Does anyone know if it is possible to send email using command ...

Eudora 8.0b9 is now out
https://wiki.mozilla.org/Eudora_Releases Based on Thunderbird 3.0.1 now. Must be getting closer to release... - Steve ...

Need an OPTION set for EUDORA
A while back one of the regulars mentioned a settable option that changed the number of messages processed at a time before classification began... I think the default was 20 or something close to that. What might that option name be..?? Thanks in advance! ---<ribbit> On Wed, 29 Dec 2004 10:03:27 -0500, Froggie the Gremlin <Froggie@see.sig.for.details> wrote: > A while back one of the regulars mentioned a settable option >that changed the number of messages processed at a time before >classification began... I think the default was 20 or something ...

Seriously: ALL CAPS was the only option until NOW??
'But the big upgrade, the one that developers will rush to download the new update for, isn't any of this. It's the menu bars. With Update 3, Visual Studio now has an option to make the menu bar text use Title Case instead of its previous ALL CAPS, with the setting roaming to any machine signed in with the same Microsoft Account.' <http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/08/all-caps-begone-visual-studio-2013-update-adds-mixed-case-menu-option/> BWHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> wrote: > 'But ...

better idiom for title on an optional list?
I'm still learning Ruby, and most of the time I can find a beautiful Ruby idiom that collapses two or more statements into one easy-to-read (or learn) idiom, like h[key] ||= 0. My current project has a lot of places where it emits lists if they contain any items, much like this: unless items.empty? puts "items\n-----" items.each { |item| puts item } end My header code and list code is more complicated, and sometimes there are lists within lists, and it all just starts to look ugly, even split out into smaller methods. It would seem more Ruby-like if I could fold the head...

VIM7 now has (optional) Tabbed Windows
Hi, Open 2 Tabs vim -p file1 file2 Opening buffers into a TAB :help CTRL-W_gf :help :tabe You can Map the following to make tabbing default :nnoremap gf <C-W>gf :cab e tabe -- Best of VimTips http://www.vim.org/tips/tip.php?tip_id=305 ...

Eudora Usenet News Server Options
My ISP (rogers.com - a major Canadian ISP, close to monopoly) has announced that it is discontinuing Usenet. The service was a clone of Giganews. I am looking for alternative providers that do not charge $$ per month. Giganews, for example, is Cdn$120 annually - too much. I do not use binaries. Recommendations? -- Murray Try groups.google.com On Fri, 2 Dec 2005 19:32:14 -0500, M. Treloar <noname@gravity.com> wrotd: >My ISP (rogers.com - a major Canadian ISP, close to >monopoly) has announced that it is discontinuing Usenet. >The service was a clone o...

An editor with better search/replace options...
I want to convert large files of prose to xhtml and so I need a way to remove unwanted line wraps. So, I'm looking for a freebee editor that has the capability of searching for a single "carriage return/line feed" or "line feed/carriage return" and removing them. I quess what I need is an editor that allows non-printable characters in it's search strings. Does anyone know of on that will allow this? Thank you... Rich In article <1114788162.bb3a5b381a3b298cf70ea6acc336deb1@teranews>, SeaPlusPlus@hotmail.com enlightened us with... > I wa...