I don’t use Ubuntu, but once I tried it and seemed really easy to manage 
and install software to it.

Personal Experience... A client I have, from the USA, which came to live 
in Chile. I switched his Windows XP laptop (Acer Aspire) to Fedora, 
saved all his documents and with a single yum install line, installed 
everything he needed.

He is the kind of clients that confuses browser or “Mozilla” with 
Operating System. zero idea about computers. anyway, he can pretty well 
surf on the Internet and do his things. (He is Realtor and works in 
thing about finances which I have no damn idea about)

The experience has been pretty satisfactory, the only issue was 
installing the adobe flash player, which I totally forgot when I set up 
his os.
Surprisingly he was about to install it. D: lol
I then received a call from him asking me what the heck was that root 
password the system was asking him to install the plugin. lol

I gave it to him, and he installed it.
Also he has kept his system up to date thanks to the packagekit 
automatic updated.

Time has passed and everything cool, I installed Fedora 11 in his Laptop 
and nothing has ever failed, the system is pretty fast and with 
compiz-fusion enabled. He learned to install new software using 
PackageKit by himself, and as a good client, he called me to be sure if 
what he was doing was ok.

When his system was Windows XP the same always, not many programs open 
at the same time was possible. and I had to reinstall his Windows like 
every four months, because of the normal degradation of the system 
(increasingly more slow) and it was totally infected by spyware and 
those annoying things, even using Antivirus software.

Now I think that I will upgrade his system to Fedora 13. that is the 
only annoying part lol.
It would be nice if there existed (maybe it does) a distribution, easy 
to use and manage like Fedora, which is rolling release like the 
ArchLinux distro I am using now. I really love this feature.

I was thinking about LinuxMint just because its repositories, which are 
the ones of Ubuntu, kind of seems to have more software available. 
Perhaps because of its popularity... but I kind of think that Fedora has 
more stable packages.

Any tips? Comments?
I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one 
seems really happy so far. (More than one year)

On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 15:19:21 -0400, Marious Barrier
<marious.barrier@gmail.com> wrote:


>Any tips? Comments?
>I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one 
>seems really happy so far. (More than one year)

Ubuntu may be easier and has better support, if you can manage to make
it work for you.
That's the key part.

LinuxMint is Ubuntu with the proprietary stuff already added in and a
good clean up of the menus and so forth.
Again if it works for you it's a much better choice IMHO than pure
Ubuntu.

Overall though, I would choose Fedora.
Fedora has come a long way since it split with/from Redhat and has
gone from bleeding edge unstable to close to bleeding edge but very
stable.

The support while not as huge in quantity, is far better in quality

I prefer it to Ubuntu because of that.

As an example the ICE1712 cards had a major problem (ie:no sound) with
the last 2 versions of Ubuntu due to a missing line or two in the
configuration scripts.

This was brought up on the Ubuntu forums, but put on the back burner
because the instructions were posted on how to edit and what to put
into the file to make it work.

Fedora had a fix the day after someone reported it.
-- 
Moshe Goldfarb
Collector of soaps from around the globe.
Linux...Disappointing users for 19 years.
Linux::It's free when your time has no value.
See Liarmutt in action http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SazBzvQ0ZAM

Marious Barrier <marious.barrier@gmail.com> writes:

> I don’t use Ubuntu, but once I tried it and seemed really easy to manage 
> and install software to it.

In what way compared to what you currently use?

I smell an "advocate nym" story coming along ....

>
> Personal Experience... A client I have, from the USA, which came to live 
> in Chile. I switched his Windows XP laptop (Acer Aspire) to Fedora, 
> saved all his documents and with a single yum install line, installed 
> everything he needed.

Sure you did. Yup. I was right.

>
> He is the kind of clients that confuses browser or “Mozilla” with 
> Operating System. zero idea about computers. anyway, he can pretty
> well 

I bet he was well happy with you removing his Windows.

> surf on the Internet and do his things. (He is Realtor and works in 
> thing about finances which I have no damn idea about)
>
> The experience has been pretty satisfactory, the only issue was 
> installing the adobe flash player, which I totally forgot when I set up 
> his os.
> Surprisingly he was about to install it. D: lol
> I then received a call from him asking me what the heck was that root 
> password the system was asking him to install the plugin. lol
>
> I gave it to him, and he installed it.
> Also he has kept his system up to date thanks to the packagekit 
> automatic updated.
>
> Time has passed and everything cool, I installed Fedora 11 in his Laptop 
> and nothing has ever failed, the system is pretty fast and with 
> compiz-fusion enabled. He learned to install new software using 
> PackageKit by himself, and as a good client, he called me to be sure if 
> what he was doing was ok.
>
> When his system was Windows XP the same always, not many programs open 
> at the same time was possible. and I had to reinstall his Windows like 

Oh please. Not even Creepy Chris will back you up on that.

> every four months, because of the normal degradation of the system 
> (increasingly more slow) and it was totally infected by spyware and 
> those annoying things, even using Antivirus software.

Bullshit.

>
> Now I think that I will upgrade his system to Fedora 13. that is the 
> only annoying part lol.
> It would be nice if there existed (maybe it does) a distribution, easy 
> to use and manage like Fedora, which is rolling release like the 
> ArchLinux distro I am using now. I really love this feature.
>
> I was thinking about LinuxMint just because its repositories, which are 
> the ones of Ubuntu, kind of seems to have more software available. 

Huh?

> Perhaps because of its popularity... but I kind of think that Fedora has 
> more stable packages.

So you think Ubuntu is not stable?

>
> Any tips? Comments?
> I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one 
> seems really happy so far. (More than one year)

What do your "clients" do? 

Why would you trust anything in this cesspit against your own experience
where you have flawlessly migrated your "client" to Fedora? Do you
really want them all using different distros??

On 09/03/2010 03:37 PM, Hadron wrote:
> Marious Barrier<marious.barrier@gmail.com>  writes:
>
>> I don’t use Ubuntu, but once I tried it and seemed really easy to manage
>> and install software to it.
>
> In what way compared to what you currently use?
>
> I smell an "advocate nym" story coming along ....
>
>>
>> Personal Experience... A client I have, from the USA, which came to live
>> in Chile. I switched his Windows XP laptop (Acer Aspire) to Fedora,
>> saved all his documents and with a single yum install line, installed
>> everything he needed.
>
> Sure you did. Yup. I was right.
>
>>
>> He is the kind of clients that confuses browser or “Mozilla” with
>> Operating System. zero idea about computers. anyway, he can pretty
>> well
>
> I bet he was well happy with you removing his Windows.
>
>> surf on the Internet and do his things. (He is Realtor and works in
>> thing about finances which I have no damn idea about)
>>
>> The experience has been pretty satisfactory, the only issue was
>> installing the adobe flash player, which I totally forgot when I set up
>> his os.
>> Surprisingly he was about to install it. D: lol
>> I then received a call from him asking me what the heck was that root
>> password the system was asking him to install the plugin. lol
>>
>> I gave it to him, and he installed it.
>> Also he has kept his system up to date thanks to the packagekit
>> automatic updated.
>>
>> Time has passed and everything cool, I installed Fedora 11 in his Laptop
>> and nothing has ever failed, the system is pretty fast and with
>> compiz-fusion enabled. He learned to install new software using
>> PackageKit by himself, and as a good client, he called me to be sure if
>> what he was doing was ok.
>>
>> When his system was Windows XP the same always, not many programs open
>> at the same time was possible. and I had to reinstall his Windows like
>
> Oh please. Not even Creepy Chris will back you up on that.
>
>> every four months, because of the normal degradation of the system
>> (increasingly more slow) and it was totally infected by spyware and
>> those annoying things, even using Antivirus software.
>
> Bullshit.
>
>>
>> Now I think that I will upgrade his system to Fedora 13. that is the
>> only annoying part lol.
>> It would be nice if there existed (maybe it does) a distribution, easy
>> to use and manage like Fedora, which is rolling release like the
>> ArchLinux distro I am using now. I really love this feature.
>>
>> I was thinking about LinuxMint just because its repositories, which are
>> the ones of Ubuntu, kind of seems to have more software available.
>
> Huh?
>
>> Perhaps because of its popularity... but I kind of think that Fedora has
>> more stable packages.
>
> So you think Ubuntu is not stable?
>
>>
>> Any tips? Comments?
>> I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one
>> seems really happy so far. (More than one year)
>
> What do your "clients" do?
>
> Why would you trust anything in this cesspit against your own experience
> where you have flawlessly migrated your "client" to Fedora? Do you
> really want them all using different distros??
>
>

Please limit yourself to answer with I am asking for and shut up unless 
you will comment with something useful and not stupid.
Thanks.

Verily I say unto thee, that Marious Barrier spake thusly:
> On 09/03/2010 03:37 PM, Hadron wrote:

[snip ad hominem attack in defence of Windows]

> Please limit yourself to answer with I am asking for and shut up
> unless you will comment with something useful and not stupid.

Just plonk the slavering Windows fanboi.

-- 
K.
http://slated.org

..----
|    "Ibland är jag själva hindret. Oftare länken."
|("Sometimes I am the obstacle. More often the link.")
|    ~ Ibi "Kopimi" Botani, Piratbyrån co-founder.
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.31.5
 22:25:19 up 29 days, 23:35,  1 user,  load average: 0.08, 0.04, 0.01

On 2010-09-03, Marious Barrier <marious.barrier@gmail.com> claimed:
> On 09/03/2010 03:37 PM, Hadron wrote:
>> Marious Barrier<marious.barrier@gmail.com>  writes:
>>
>>> I don’t use Ubuntu, but once I tried it and seemed really easy to manage
>>> and install software to it.
>>
>> In what way compared to what you currently use?

> Please limit yourself to answer with I am asking for and shut up unless 
> you will comment with something useful and not stupid.
> Thanks.

Believe me, we /ALL/ wish for that. Queef would never be a bother again
if he was only answering questions, as none would be asked. As well,
Quirk wouldn't be the pestilence he is if he confined himself to only
useful content.

The main problem with most live distros is they don't do rolling
upgrades well usually. That said, I once did one with Ubuntu. I
installed it on a PPC Mac. The latest I could find a donwload for was
at least 3 versions older than on x86. I decided to settle for that
reluctantly. While I was adding software after the reboot, I was
informed of a newer release and asked if I wanted to upgrade. I let it
go. It came up and seemed A-OK after that reboot. Again, I was adding
software when I was notified of a newer release, and asked again if I
wanted to upgrade. I did it again. This continued until I was at the
latest version (I can't recall, but I'm thinking something like 8.04 or
8.10 at that time). And nothing failed. Everything was smooth. I added
all of the software and used it that way for several months, right up
until I had to put OS X back on it to be a test platform for software
before I put it on the machine of the lovely and gracious Mrs. Midget.

-- 
Come any closer and I'll use my magnet!
Aspire One, Linux Mint 9 (LXDE)
Friends don't let friends use Windows

On 09/04/2010 04:16 AM, Sinister Midget III wrote:
> The main problem with most live distros is they don't do rolling
> upgrades well usually. That said, I once did one with Ubuntu. I
> installed it on a PPC Mac. The latest I could find a donwload for was
> at least 3 versions older than on x86. I decided to settle for that
> reluctantly. While I was adding software after the reboot, I was
> informed of a newer release and asked if I wanted to upgrade. I let it
> go. It came up and seemed A-OK after that reboot. Again, I was adding
> software when I was notified of a newer release, and asked again if I
> wanted to upgrade. I did it again. This continued until I was at the
> latest version (I can't recall, but I'm thinking something like 8.04 or
> 8.10 at that time). And nothing failed. Everything was smooth. I added
> all of the software and used it that way for several months, right up
> until I had to put OS X back on it to be a test platform for software
> before I put it on the machine of the lovely and gracious Mrs. Midget.

Nice, so everything was done just through the package manager? I 
remember that I once read about doing the same on Fedora, but actually 
never tried it. since I am on ArchLinux now.
Anyway I think that I am going to virtualize a Fedora system and try it,
Thanks for your comment.

On Sep 3, 3:33=A0pm, Moshe Goldfarb <moshe_golf...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 15:19:21 -0400, Marious Barrier

> <marious.barr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Any tips? Comments?
> >I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one
> >seems really happy so far. (More than one year)

> Ubuntu may be easier and has better support, if you can manage to make
> it work for you.
> That's the key part.

I've found that Fedora has very good support.  I haven't had many
problems with Ubuntu, but I've found that Red Hat provides better
support for Fedora, perhaps because the current version of Fedora will
eventually become a future version of Red Hat Enterprise Linux - which
does generate revenue.  At the same time, Fedora makes a nice desktop
platform that supports all of the newest software.

> LinuxMint is Ubuntu with the proprietary stuff already added in and a
> good clean up of the menus and so forth.
> Again if it works for you it's a much better choice IMHO than pure
> Ubuntu.

Linux Mint doesn't have corporate support of any kind.  It's strictly
non-profit organization.  Not that that is necessarily bad, but many
corporations prefer to have the backing of a corporation like Red Hat
or Novell, with public accounting and information about their
financial status.  This leaves them lest exposed as the "deep
pockets".

Individuals like Ubuntu and Linux Mint because they get lower price
and they are not likely to be sued by someone because the Linux Mint
they gave a friend was hacked and their savings accounts were
drained.  We know that their savings accounts are more likely to be
drained if they use Windows, and that Microsoft's EULA prevents them
from filing any kind of lawsuit for liability that extends beyond the
price THEY actually paid for the Windows license (usually zero since
the OEM paid for the license and the cost was included in the total
cost of the computer, which was sold at a loss).

> Overall though, I would choose Fedora.
> Fedora has come a long way since it split with/from Redhat and has
> gone from bleeding edge unstable to close to bleeding edge but very
> stable.

I second that - Fedora is LSB-3.1 compliant, it still has some Red Hat
support, and it still has community support.  It also give the user
the choice of Open Source or Proprietary drivers and video display
software.  So if you want the high speed 3D graphics you can get the
nvidia or ati drivers, but if you want rock solid stability, you can
go with the Open Source drivers.

> The support while not as huge in quantity, is far better in quality

Ubuntu support is primarily through an unmoderated bulletin board, and
there are lots of trolls who tell horror stories, while giving
absolutely no diagnostic information to help anyone identify the
problem.  In many cases, they won't even disclose the make and model
of the computer they are using.

> I prefer it to Ubuntu because of that.

> As an example the ICE1712 cards had a major problem (ie:no sound) with
> the last 2 versions of Ubuntu due to a missing line or two in the
> configuration scripts.
>
> This was brought up on the Ubuntu forums, but put on the back burner
> because the instructions were posted on how to edit and what to put
> into the file to make it work.
>
> Fedora had a fix the day after someone reported it.

That's one of the things that has always impressed me about Red Hat's
support, even for Fedora, when a problem is reported, the fix comes
quickly, and once the fix is tested, it's released almost
immediately.  It's unusual for a defect or problem to go unresolved
more than 48 hours.

> --
> Moshe Goldfarb

A bit scary, but Moshe and I agree completely on this matter.

Rex Ballard
http://www.open4success.org

On Sep 3, 3:19=A0pm, Marious Barrier <marious.barr...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Now I think that I will upgrade his system to Fedora 13. that is the
> only annoying part lol.

I've been using Fedora 13 for a while now, it's really great.

> It would be nice if there existed (maybe it does) a distribution, easy
> to use and manage like Fedora, which is rolling release like the
> ArchLinux distro I am using now. I really love this feature.

Red Hat is pretty good about keeping older versions as up to date as
possible.  I still have one machine on FC-12 and haven't upgraded it
yet, because the new version needs a larger boot partition, and I
don't feel like repartitioning my disk at the moment.  The logical
volume arrangement seems to work very well, but it's not so easy to
resize logical volumes from a running system.  It doesn't want to
resize itself.

> I was thinking about LinuxMint just because its repositories, which are
> the ones of Ubuntu, kind of seems to have more software available.
> Perhaps because of its popularity... but I kind of think that Fedora has
> more stable packages.

> Any tips? Comments?
> I think that I am going to switch to Linux more of my clients. this one
> seems really happy so far. (More than one year)

I'd go with Fedora 13, it still gives you a really nice performance
with a nice support network.

Rex

Verily I say unto thee, that Marious Barrier spake thusly:
> I remember that I once read about doing the same on Fedora, but
> actually never tried it.

There's two methods, one of which is a Debian-style "dist-upgrade", and
the other is a rolling release.

To perform a dist-upgrade on Fedora, you need to run a tool called
PreUpgrade:

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_use_PreUpgrade

The result will be a switch to the latest release, and may require that
you temporarily remove certain incompatible packages before proceeding.
Further version upgrades will require that you repeat the same process.

To run a rolling-release version of Fedora, just switch permanently to
Rawhide, which is the development version, and is always the "next"
version - so to speak.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/Rawhide

This will never require a dist-upgrade, but will occasionally result in
incompatibilities with your existing system, due to major changes
upstream, and may require reconfiguring packages (or uninstalling then
reinstalling them to satisfy dependencies) to get working properly. This
is not recommended for production use, but many Red Hat developers use
this as their permanent system without serious or irresolvable issues.
Certainly you'll have access to bleeding edge features long before most
other Fedora users, and even before most other distro users.

-- 
K.
http://slated.org

..----
|    "Ibland är jag själva hindret. Oftare länken."
|("Sometimes I am the obstacle. More often the link.")
|    ~ Ibi "Kopimi" Botani, Piratbyrån co-founder.
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.31.5
 19:23:01 up  2:41,  1 user,  load average: 1.22, 0.59, 0.35

On 09/04/2010 02:23 PM, Homer wrote:
> Verily I say unto thee, that Marious Barrier spake thusly:
>> I remember that I once read about doing the same on Fedora, but
>> actually never tried it.
>
> There's two methods, one of which is a Debian-style "dist-upgrade", and
> the other is a rolling release.
>
> To perform a dist-upgrade on Fedora, you need to run a tool called
> PreUpgrade:
>
> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_use_PreUpgrade
>
> The result will be a switch to the latest release, and may require that
> you temporarily remove certain incompatible packages before proceeding.
> Further version upgrades will require that you repeat the same process.
>
> To run a rolling-release version of Fedora, just switch permanently to
> Rawhide, which is the development version, and is always the "next"
> version - so to speak.
>
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/Rawhide
>
> This will never require a dist-upgrade, but will occasionally result in
> incompatibilities with your existing system, due to major changes
> upstream, and may require reconfiguring packages (or uninstalling then
> reinstalling them to satisfy dependencies) to get working properly. This
> is not recommended for production use, but many Red Hat developers use
> this as their permanent system without serious or irresolvable issues.
> Certainly you'll have access to bleeding edge features long before most
> other Fedora users, and even before most other distro users.
>

Good one, I will try it for my system. but the suggestion from you and 
Sinister Midget III are really good to try them in clients. (muahuahua)

Thanks a lot for this info.

Verily I say unto thee, that Rex Ballard spake thusly:
> The logical volume arrangement seems to work very well, but it's not 
> so easy to resize logical volumes from a running system.  It doesn't 
> want to resize itself.

If you're reducing the size, then you need to resize the filesystem
first using resize2fs, then use lvreduce to shrink the logical volume.

If you're increasing the size, then you need to do it the other way
round ... increase the size of the logical volume first, with lvextend,
then increase the size of the filesystem with resize2fs.

Ext4 (the default in Fedora 13) supports online resizing, as does LVM2.

Here's a guide:

http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=154625

-- 
K.
http://slated.org

..----
|    "Ibland är jag själva hindret. Oftare länken."
|("Sometimes I am the obstacle. More often the link.")
|    ~ Ibi "Kopimi" Botani, Piratbyrån co-founder.
`----

Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.31.5
 21:41:29 up  5:00,  1 user,  load average: 0.21, 0.10, 0.03