f



Mac

Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to use
while you're waiting.

Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
playing with the Mac.

Not the fairest test, of course.

But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.

-- 
Information Center, n.:
	A room staffed by professional computer people whose job it is to
	tell you why you cannot have the information you require.
0
Chris
6/13/2015 6:31:45 PM
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On 6/13/15, 11:31 AM, in article mlhssi$pap$1@dont-email.me, "Chris
Ahlstrom" <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:

> Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to use
> while you're waiting.
> 
> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,

What were you looking for?

> ass-backward caption bar,

Caption bar?

> crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
> just needs a mouse pad to work better),

Also there are settings... but I know I hate the Apple mouse. I use a third
party mouse with a third party driver.

> incredible lack of preferences options,

You already said this - but what options were you looking for? Just counting
them or was there something you wanted?

> new windows don't always get focus.

Huh? You open a window and it is in front.
 
> Safari was disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.

In what way? I have a list but what do you mean? :)

> And I didn't even get to the console terminal or compiler environment.

Please do.

> I lasted five minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
> 
> Not the fairest test, of course.
> 
> But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.

Would love to hear you go into detail.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Mavericks / Pages 5.1:            <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/13/2015 6:42:36 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to
> use while you're waiting.
> 
> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
> just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
> options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
> compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
> terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
> playing with the Mac.
> 
> Not the fairest test, of course.
> 
> But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.
> 

Just another fairy tale by one of the creepy five.

0
GreyCloud
6/13/2015 9:37:56 PM
On 6/13/15, 2:37 PM, in article
4PWdnX5bDrAoP-HInZ2dnUU7-XudnZ2d@bresnan.com, "GreyCloud" <mist@cumulus.com>
wrote:

> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> 
>> Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to
>> use while you're waiting.
>> 
>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
>> just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
>> options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
>> compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
>> terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
>> playing with the Mac.
>> 
>> Not the fairest test, of course.
>> 
>> But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.
>> 
> 
> Just another fairy tale by one of the creepy five.
> 
I am open to hearing details.

* Limited options: for what? What was he trying to do where an option was
lacking? I can easily name some items, and have... but he mentions none. Is
he just counting options and using that as some bragging point for Linux? If
so that is meaningless... but if there is an option he wanted to use and
could not that does mean something.

* Caption Bar: what the heck does he even mean by this?

* Apple mouse: the movement can be adjusted via settings, but I agree the
Apple mouse is horrid. I do not like the feel in my hand and the touch-pad
combo never works well for me (with my limited use of).

* New windows not getting focus: when? Can he give an example?

* Safari disappointing: in what way? He never says. I can (and have) given
some examples... but also can give places where I prefer it.

* Console: It has one. If you do not like it there are third party options.
Is he limiting himself to just what Apple ships? What issues is he even
having?

He really says nothing of value.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Mavericks / Pages 5.1:            <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/13/2015 9:49:55 PM
On 2015-06-13, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to use
> while you're waiting.
>
> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
> just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
> options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
> compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
> terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
> playing with the Mac.
>
> Not the fairest test, of course.
>
> But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.

I've never used a Mac but the iPhone drove me crazy after a week of
using it. I just don't like the way it operated. I prefer to have
programs end when I close them. Then there is the double tap of the
home button to display applications. So are these actually running?
Why didn't they end when I switched to another application?
It's all just weird to me. Common settings are buried deep in
the settings menus. Just adding a ring tone that was purchased outside
the Apple Store is an exercise in frustration. I will give the build
quality a thumbs up because the device really is built well and it
feels that way but for me the software, which is the Apple experience
if you will was just too restrictive. I switched to an Android and
never looked back. For me, it's just a better device.
0
Humberto
6/13/2015 10:26:23 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 2015-06-13, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Waiting at the car wash, they have three Windows PC and a Mac for you to use
>> while you're waiting.
>>
>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
>> just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
>> options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
>> compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
>> terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
>> playing with the Mac.
>>
>> Not the fairest test, of course.
>>
>> But give me Linux with Fluxbox any day.
>
> I've never used a Mac but the iPhone drove me crazy after a week of
> using it. I just don't like the way it operated. I prefer to have
> programs end when I close them. Then there is the double tap of the
> home button to display applications. So are these actually running?
> Why didn't they end when I switched to another application?
> It's all just weird to me. Common settings are buried deep in
> the settings menus. Just adding a ring tone that was purchased outside
> the Apple Store is an exercise in frustration. I will give the build
> quality a thumbs up because the device really is built well and it
> feels that way but for me the software, which is the Apple experience
> if you will was just too restrictive. I switched to an Android and
> never looked back. For me, it's just a better device.

Well, I agree with the conclusion, but Android does have some quirks similar
to the iPhone.

-- 
I'm having fun HITCHHIKING to CINCINNATI or FAR ROCKAWAY!!
0
Chris
6/13/2015 11:37:05 PM
On 2015-06-13, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:

> Well, I agree with the conclusion, but Android does have some quirks similar
> to the iPhone.

My 2 biggest complaints with my droid S5 is that I need to purge the
cache every once in a while to fix sluggishness and that on
occasion I will get mediaserver  as my biggest battery drainer.
I've narrowed that one down to a corrupt video or mp3 file.
Copying the files, reformatting the SD card and copying the same
files back seems to solve the problem. Have had this happen twice.
Other than that and an occasional program that sucks I haven't had any
problems.
I just feel out of place in the Apple world and quite frankly at least
for smartphones and with the exception of the build quality I
don't understand what the fuss is about? It's a phone and it cost about
the same, with a contract, as the others so pick your poison.
0
Humberto
6/14/2015 3:31:39 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

>Well, I agree with the conclusion, but Android does have some quirks similar
>to the iPhone.

I don't own a smartphone, but I have heard friends complaining about
their Android phones, on occasion.  They sure are not perfect.  Their
main advantage is they have chaos, they have choice, they have what
shit-brained wannabe dictators tell us is bad for us.

-- 
"The market is flooded with half arsed Android devices based on old
versions : this confuses people, makes it harder to get support and
will ultimately turn people away from Android."  -  "Hadron"
0
chrisv
6/15/2015 1:06:24 PM
On 15/06/2015 14:06, chrisv wrote:
> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>> Well, I agree with the conclusion, but Android does have some quirks similar
>> to the iPhone.
>
> I don't own a smartphone,

Good move. It's never a good idea to own technology that is smarter than 
you. I'm surprised rotary dial still works though.....

0
Desk
6/15/2015 2:50:12 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

>Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
>just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
>options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
>compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
>terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
>playing with the Mac.

That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
store.  

I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how
to reduce it or exit it.

Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an
'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to
not do that. 

 Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?  

'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.

-- 
"If it weren't for Windows, you wouldn't be posting anything right
now."  -  DumFSck
0
chrisv
6/15/2015 3:14:40 PM
On 15/06/2015 16:14, chrisv wrote:
> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the mouse
>> just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of preferences
>> options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was disappointing
>> compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to the console
>> terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and was tired of
>> playing with the Mac.
>
> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
> store.
>
> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how
> to reduce it or exit it.
>
> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an
> 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to
> not do that.
>
>   Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>
> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>

It didn't take most people long to figure out that Metro apps are closed 
down with a swipe down from the top. I know Linux users are used to 
older technology so you are forgiven for not being able to deal with a 
new way of working without step by step instructions written by a 5 year 
old in crayon.

Traditional apps on the desktop still have all the features of quiting 
that you would be used to.


0
Desk
6/15/2015 3:32:32 PM
On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:

> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> 
>>Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and
>>was tired of playing with the Mac.
> 
> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
> 
> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
> reduce it or exit it.
> 
> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
> do that.
> 
>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
> 
> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.

And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he 
slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his 
issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply to 
the OS he's froths about 24/7?

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/15/2015 5:48:23 PM
On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
> 
> > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> > 
> >>Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
> >>ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
> >>mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
> >>preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
> >>disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
> >>to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
> >>minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
> > 
> > That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
> > store.
> > 
> > I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
> > how to reduce it or exit it.
> > 
> > Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
> > an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
> > decided to not do that.
> > 
> >  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
> > 
> > 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
> 
> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he 
> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his 
> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
> 

Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p

0
Melzzzzz
6/15/2015 6:19:34 PM
Melzzzzz wrote:

>Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p

I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
transfers.

-- 
'It's fashionable for cola weenies here in la-la land to whine that MS
"does everything in its power to fight Linux and open source", but the
reality is the exact opposite, of course.'  -  DumFSck, lying
shamelessly
0
chrisv
6/15/2015 6:33:41 PM
On 6/15/15, 10:48 AM, in article mln357$lr0$1@dont-email.me, "ronb"
<ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
> 
>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>> 
>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>> the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and
>>> was tired of playing with the Mac.
>> 
>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
>> 
>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
>> reduce it or exit it.
>> 
>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
>> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
>> do that.
>> 
>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>> 
>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
> 
> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit.

I have talked about how I do not like the Windows 8 UI and suggest to people
they get Classic Shell. I have yet to find the person who does not
appreciate getting back so they have a desktop based, well, desktop.

> Is he slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him?

First: you have to understand what the value of consistency is. If there is
a different context it may make sense to have a different UI... so *if* MS
had, say, the tiles for mobile devices, including tablets, that might make
sense even if it is different than a desktop UI. Consistency is not just
about being the same but understanding when to be different and not doing so
just to do so. This adds to the usability.

And, yes, I think MS is getting this wrong.

> Or are his issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only
> apply to the OS he's froths about 24/7?

I do not speak much about Windows in here because this is not a Linux forum,
but I have talked about how messed up the UI is on Windows systems for
years. Here, multiple examples from years ago:
<http://csma.gallopinginsanity.com/interface>

The "Save and Print Dialogs revisited" link is the most "complete", but the
other ones show examples I noted back then, too. And there are more examples
I can find.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/15/2015 7:51:30 PM
On 6/15/15, 11:19 AM, in article 20150615201934.467c0442@maxa-pc, "Melzzzzz"
<mel@zzzzz.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>> 
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>> 
>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>> store.
>>> 
>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>> 
>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>> decided to not do that.
>>> 
>>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>> 
>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>> 
>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>> 
> 
> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
> 
RonB's comments about me are weird: show his obsession with me tied to his
ignorance of my views.

Just weird... how can he be so obsessed and yet so ignorant?


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/15/2015 7:52:09 PM
On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC), ronb wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
> 
>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>> 
>>>Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>>the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and
>>>was tired of playing with the Mac.
>> 
>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
>> 
>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
>> reduce it or exit it.
>> 
>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
>> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
>> do that.
>> 
>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>> 
>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
> 
> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he 
> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his 
> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply to 
> the OS he's froths about 24/7?

The Windows 8.x interface is very poor unless one is using a
tablet/smartphone or touch screen. I don't know what Microsoft was
thinking, or maybe they weren't thinking, when they released it. 
They claim they wanted consistency across devices but in truth they
broke the consistency of the interface itself.

First thing I did was replace it. BTW I was one of those who couldn't
figure out how to close programs or even shut down the system. I had
to Google it. I didn't even realize it was actually 2 different kinds
of programs involved, the old style and the metro style. I just
thought it was a different launcher so to speak.
Very poorly done in my opinion and hopefully Microsoft fixes it in
Windows 10. 
0
Tomas
6/15/2015 8:31:20 PM
chrisv wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
> transfers.

LOL

> -- 
> 'It's fashionable for cola weenies here in la-la land to whine that MS
> "does everything in its power to fight Linux and open source", but the
> reality is the exact opposite, of course.'  -  DumFSck, lying
> shamelessly

He sure is a dazed follower!  A fruitcake.

-- 
Marriage is based on the theory that when a man discovers a brand of beer
exactly to his taste he should at once throw up his job and go to work
in the brewery.
		-- George Jean Nathan
0
Chris
6/15/2015 8:32:03 PM
On 15 Jun 2015 16:31, Tomas wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC), ronb wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>
>>>>Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>>>the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes,
and
>>>>was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>
>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
>>>
>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
>>> reduce it or exit it.
>>>
>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
>>> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
>>> do that.
>>>
>>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>
>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>
>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply to
>> the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>
> The Windows 8.x interface is very poor unless one is using a
> tablet/smartphone or touch screen. I don't know what Microsoft was
> thinking, or maybe they weren't thinking, when they released it.
> They claim they wanted consistency across devices but in truth they
> broke the consistency of the interface itself.
>
I'm one what likes the 8/8.1 modern interface, especially on
tablets/laptops and phones.  It is just smooth as silk in operation and
Simple to use.  And launching desktop apps is no big deal either.

The differences are that the 'modern' apps are more simplistic in the way
Most tablet apps on all OS's are while the desktop apps are more powerful
And flexible.  Simple to figure out which is better for which situation.

> First thing I did was replace it. BTW I was one of those who couldn't
> figure out how to close programs or even shut down the system. I had
> to Google it. I didn't even realize it was actually 2 different kinds
> of programs involved, the old style and the metro style. I just
> thought it was a different launcher so to speak.
> Very poorly done in my opinion and hopefully Microsoft fixes it in
> Windows 10.
>
While the W10 Tech Preview is twitchy as hell at this point, the things
you don't like are fixed.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/15/2015 8:49:29 PM
On 6/15/15, 1:31 PM, in article 1co3lza3q6i7i.1xd31u5atf17z$.dlg@40tude.net,
"Tomas" <tgif9fri@numo.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC), ronb wrote:
> 
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>> 
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>>> the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes, and
>>>> was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>> 
>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
>>> 
>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
>>> reduce it or exit it.
>>> 
>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
>>> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
>>> do that.
>>> 
>>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>> 
>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>> 
>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply to
>> the OS he's froths about 24/7?
> 
> The Windows 8.x interface is very poor unless one is using a
> tablet/smartphone or touch screen. I don't know what Microsoft was
> thinking, or maybe they weren't thinking, when they released it.
> They claim they wanted consistency across devices but in truth they
> broke the consistency of the interface itself.

Agreed. And even the desktop UI is so-so with its super wide window borders.
At least they are better than the transparent ones of Windows 7 where to get
text to be readable they had to add a rather hideous outer glow.

Then again: Apple brought a lot of the transparency ideas to Yosemite. I had
most of it turned off and am trying it again to see if I can learn to like
it or at least not mind it.

I do not mind it as much as I did before but still too many places where
windows show "frosted" transparency from what is behind in ways I find
distracting, and for menus it can be even worse. This is off the topic of
consistency - Apple is at least "consistent" here, but they are consistently
bad with it. At least you can turn it off (though then the dock looks like
windows and creates visual challenges... and no way I know of to pick and
choose what to keep and what to turn off!)

> First thing I did was replace it. BTW I was one of those who couldn't
> figure out how to close programs or even shut down the system. I had
> to Google it. I didn't even realize it was actually 2 different kinds
> of programs involved, the old style and the metro style. I just
> thought it was a different launcher so to speak.
> Very poorly done in my opinion and hopefully Microsoft fixes it in
> Windows 10. 

Agreed.

But notice here we are talking about the UI weaknesses of OS X and Windows.
No herd-mentality to stop us... as we see with the "advocates" who cannot
honestly speak of the weaknesses of desktop Linux.

-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/15/2015 9:43:48 PM
On 6/15/15, 1:49 PM, in article cu8s2rFntbfU1@mid.individual.net, "Lloyd
Parsons" <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:

> On 15 Jun 2015 16:31, Tomas wrote:
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC), ronb wrote:
>> 
>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get to
>>>>> the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five minutes,
> and
>>>>> was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>> 
>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a store.
>>>> 
>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out how to
>>>> reduce it or exit it.
>>>> 
>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had an 'X'
>>>> or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$ decided to not
>>>> do that.
>>>> 
>>>>  Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>> 
>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>> 
>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply to
>>> the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>> 
>> The Windows 8.x interface is very poor unless one is using a
>> tablet/smartphone or touch screen. I don't know what Microsoft was
>> thinking, or maybe they weren't thinking, when they released it.
>> They claim they wanted consistency across devices but in truth they
>> broke the consistency of the interface itself.
>> 
> I'm one what likes the 8/8.1 modern interface, especially on
> tablets/laptops and phones.  It is just smooth as silk in operation and
> Simple to use.  And launching desktop apps is no big deal either.
> 
> The differences are that the 'modern' apps are more simplistic in the way
> Most tablet apps on all OS's are while the desktop apps are more powerful
> And flexible.  Simple to figure out which is better for which situation.

I can see its value on a smaller, touch screen... but I think the mixing of
touch and desktop is done poorly.

I also have not used it much... so maybe I would learn to use it better. It
is a paradigm shift and for that I have to give MS credit.

>> First thing I did was replace it. BTW I was one of those who couldn't
>> figure out how to close programs or even shut down the system. I had
>> to Google it. I didn't even realize it was actually 2 different kinds
>> of programs involved, the old style and the metro style. I just
>> thought it was a different launcher so to speak.
>> Very poorly done in my opinion and hopefully Microsoft fixes it in
>> Windows 10.
>> 
> While the W10 Tech Preview is twitchy as hell at this point, the things
> you don't like are fixed.
> 



-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/15/2015 9:45:09 PM
On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>
>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>
>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>> store.
>>>
>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>
>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>> decided to not do that.
>>>
>>>   Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>
>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>
>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>
>
> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>

It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment 
that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
0
Desk
6/16/2015 8:31:15 AM
On 15/06/2015 19:33, chrisv wrote:
> Melzzzzz wrote:
>
>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>
> I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
> transfers.
>

Stop listening to the voices in your head.
0
Desk
6/16/2015 8:31:42 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>
>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>
>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>> store.
>>>>
>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>
>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>
>>>>   Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>
>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>
>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>
>>
>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>
> 
> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.

It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea 
that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and 
user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and are 
used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI and the 
applications.

Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just 
the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.

I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows 3x) 
to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by far 
the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those are an 
insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
No wonder you like it
0
Peter
6/16/2015 9:25:53 AM
chrisv wrote:

> Melzzzzz wrote:
> 
>>Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
> 
> I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
> transfers.
> 

Wouldn't it be better if stupid looking dog would rip boxes of clippies 
apart, only to be hit by flying chairs?

Maybe Snit Michael Glasser could make a visit at MS and bring some of his 
"students" along, who whimper in terror at the thought of "files" and start 
crying when "difficult concepts" like "folders" are mentioned.
Would make a nice "useability test"
0
Peter
6/16/2015 9:31:06 AM
On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>> store.
>>>>>
>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>
>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>
>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>
>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>
>>
>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>
> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea

You clearly haven't used it.

> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and are
> used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI and the
> applications.

Even more evidence that you haven't used it. Hint: The touch screen mode 
is turned off on non-touch devices.

You really do like to spout "facts" from a position of complete and 
utter ignorance don't you? Cue your equally ill-informed herd to back 
you up on this nonsense.


>
> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.

Yeah, we get it, you haven't tried Windows 10 so you don't have a clue 
what you are talking about.

>
> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows 3x)
> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by far
> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those are an
> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
> No wonder you like it
>

I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.

However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number 
of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
0
Desk
6/16/2015 10:23:59 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>
>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>
>>>
>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>
>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea
> 
> You clearly haven't used it.

I did. And I hated evey moment
Windows from version 8 are way worse than OSX could ever be. And man, *that* 
is shitty!
Up to Win7 it was a shoddy, but otherwise useable OS. This his completely 
ceased to be from Win8 on. Only the shoddyness remains

>> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
>> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and
>> are used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI
>> and the applications.
> 
> Even more evidence that you haven't used it. Hint: The touch screen mode
> is turned off on non-touch devices.

And? Does that somehow change the fact that the clunky tiles are still 
present? It is just not as intrusive as it was with Win8

> You really do like to spout "facts" from a position of complete and
> utter ignorance don't you? Cue your equally ill-informed herd to back
> you up on this nonsense.

At least I have used that shoddy mess. On the other hand, you spout loads of 
nonsense about linux and you have never in your entire miserable life used 
it

> 
>>
>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
>> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
> 
> Yeah, we get it, you haven't tried Windows 10 so you don't have a clue
> what you are talking about.

You know absolutely nothing about my usage of windows. You just try to 
deflect from that heap of elephant dung which is called "Win10"
 
>>
>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
>> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>> by far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>> those are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>> No wonder you like it
>>
> 
> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.

That was really a stinking mess.
So much for "usage labs" at MS. Those dimbulbs they employ to conduct those 
tests should be put to better use. Sweeping parking lots is about all those 
idiots may do without causing more harm

> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.

Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice when 
buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
After all, morons like you could never hope to install *any* OS, no matter 
which one, by yourself. This comes with a mother who is also your sister


0
Peter
6/16/2015 10:54:18 AM
On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>
>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>
>>>
>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>
>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea
>
> You clearly haven't used it.
>
>> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
>> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and are
>> used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI and the
>> applications.
>
> Even more evidence that you haven't used it. Hint: The touch screen mode
> is turned off on non-touch devices.
>
> You really do like to spout "facts" from a position of complete and
> utter ignorance don't you? Cue your equally ill-informed herd to back
> you up on this nonsense.
>
>
>>
>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
>> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
>
> Yeah, we get it, you haven't tried Windows 10 so you don't have a clue
> what you are talking about.
>
>>
>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows 3x)
>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by far
>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those are an
>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>> No wonder you like it
>>
>
> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>
> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>
That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)

Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/16/2015 11:56:47 AM
On 16/06/2015 11:54, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>     Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>>
>>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea
>>
>> You clearly haven't used it.
>
> I did. And I hated evey moment
> Windows from version 8 are way worse than OSX could ever be. And man, *that*
> is shitty!
> Up to Win7 it was a shoddy, but otherwise useable OS. This his completely
> ceased to be from Win8 on. Only the shoddyness remains
>
>>> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
>>> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and
>>> are used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI
>>> and the applications.
>>
>> Even more evidence that you haven't used it. Hint: The touch screen mode
>> is turned off on non-touch devices.
>
> And? Does that somehow change the fact that the clunky tiles are still
> present? It is just not as intrusive as it was with Win8

Again you show that you haven't used it.

>
>> You really do like to spout "facts" from a position of complete and
>> utter ignorance don't you? Cue your equally ill-informed herd to back
>> you up on this nonsense.
>
> At least I have used that shoddy mess. On the other hand, you spout loads of
> nonsense about linux and you have never in your entire miserable life used
> it

I use it every day. I even gave you the opportunity of proof but you ran 
away so don't try that old nonsense again.

>
>>
>>>
>>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
>>> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
>>
>> Yeah, we get it, you haven't tried Windows 10 so you don't have a clue
>> what you are talking about.
>
> You know absolutely nothing about my usage of windows. You just try to
> deflect from that heap of elephant dung which is called "Win10"

I know enough from the incorrect facts you keep spouting to know that 
you haven't used Windows 10 beyond a few minutes and certainly not a 
current preview version.

>
>>>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
>>> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>> by far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>> those are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>>
>>
>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>
> That was really a stinking mess.
> So much for "usage labs" at MS. Those dimbulbs they employ to conduct those
> tests should be put to better use. Sweeping parking lots is about all those
> idiots may do without causing more harm
>
>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>
> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice when
> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then

The old, tired, it's come pre-installed nonsense.

Many, many organisations have tried to sell desktop computers with Linux 
preinstalled and failed miserably. Even Walmart couldn't sell a sub $200 
PC with Linux on it. 
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/12/AR2008031201220.html

> After all, morons like you could never hope to install *any* OS, no matter
> which one, by yourself. This comes with a mother who is also your sister

Ah the old "I've lost the argument so let's fire out some insults" 
tactic, how sad and pathetic.



0
Desk
6/16/2015 12:17:11 PM
Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K=F6hlmann wrote:
> >> [...]
> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*=20
> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
> > can be given away.
>=20
> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>=20
> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.

Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
(2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):

<http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=3D1=
0&qpcustomd=3D0>



-hh
0
hh
6/16/2015 1:37:18 PM
On 2015-06-16 8:17 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 16/06/2015 11:54, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

>> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice when
>> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
>
> The old, tired, it's come pre-installed nonsense.
>
> Many, many organisations have tried to sell desktop computers with Linux
> preinstalled and failed miserably. Even Walmart couldn't sell a sub $200
> PC with Linux on it.
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/12/AR2008031201220.html

My IBM PS/1 in 1991 came pre-installed with IBM PC-DOS 4.0 and some 
graphical menu system. Even though I knew absolutely nothing about PCs 
at the time, I managed to have it boot straight to DOS after a while and 
eventually made it boot straight into Windows 3.0. I didn't _replace_ 
the operating system (since it loaded from ROM and was impossible) but 
essentially did the same thing.

The point? If people really hated Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or 10, they would 
find a way to remove it and replace it by something better. That's what 
I did when I booted it straight to DOS and avoided the GUI and then had 
it boot to Windows 3.0. Even the least knowledgeable person can do 
something of the sort and since installing Linux is not that difficult, 
any determined person can install it as well.

To me, that destroys the whole "it comes pre-installed" argument.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/16/2015 1:58:37 PM
On 2015-06-16 9:37 AM, -hh wrote:
> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>> far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>> can be given away.
>>
>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>
>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>
> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>
> <http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0>

Vista was actually pretty good, regardless of what the Linux Loser 
Liar's Club says. 7 was better, but Vista is snappier than any 
distribution I've ever run.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/16/2015 2:00:11 PM
On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> >> [...]
>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* 
>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>> > can be given away.
>> 
>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>> 
>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>
> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):

....and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's decendants.

[deletia]

-- 
	"Music is everybody's possession. 
	It's only publishers who think that people own it."          |||
~  John Lennon                                                      / | \
0
JEDIDIAH
6/16/2015 2:35:16 PM
On 16 Jun 2015 09:35, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>> >> [...]
>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>> > can be given away.
>>>
>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>
>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>
>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>
> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's decendants.
>
And Linux on the desktop has been dwarfed by OSX.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/16/2015 3:04:49 PM
Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> JEDIDIAH wrote:
> > -hh wrote:
> >> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> >>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> >>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K=F6hlmann wrote:
> >>> >> [...]
> >>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
> >>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
> >>> > can be given away.
> >>>
> >>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
> >>>
> >>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux=
..
> >>
> >> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
> >> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
> >
> > ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share
> > of DOS and it's decendants.
>=20
> And Linux on the desktop has been dwarfed by OSX.

True! =20

Golly, poor JED just simply can't _ever_ catch=20
a break when he tries any of his put-downs.  ;-)



-hh
0
hh
6/16/2015 3:24:58 PM
On 6/16/15, 2:31 AM, in article mloqac$o5t$1@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

> chrisv wrote:
> 
>> Melzzzzz wrote:
>> 
>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>> 
>> I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
>> transfers.
>> 
> 
> Wouldn't it be better if stupid looking dog would rip boxes of clippies
> apart, only to be hit by flying chairs?
> 
> Maybe Snit Michael Glasser could make a visit at MS and bring some of his
> "students" along, who whimper in terror at the thought of "files" and start
> crying when "difficult concepts" like "folders" are mentioned.
> Would make a nice "useability test"

You might not get it, but many people *do* struggle with the idea of working
with the hierarchy of files and folders. This is similar to how others might
not understand your confusion between "Quit" and "Exit".

---------------------------------------------------------------

  Peter K�hlmann: 
    ----- 
    The apps with "Quit" do *not* exit, they continue to run
    in the background
    ----- 
Had he known how to use "top" he would know he was wrong:
<http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/top.mov>

Message-ID: gq8oo1$u4v$03$1@news.t-online.com
<http://goo.gl/CcTIAO>

---------------------------------------------------------------

-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/16/2015 3:43:36 PM
JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> >> [...]
>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* 
>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>> > can be given away.
>>> 
>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>> 
>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>
>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>
> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's decendants.
>
> [deletia]

Let them shill for the "market leader".

No one cares anymore.

-- 
In a gathering of two or more people, when a lighted cigarette is
placed in an ashtray, the smoke will waft into the face of the non-smoker.
0
Chris
6/16/2015 4:30:11 PM
On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 09:35:16 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:

> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> >> [...]
>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> 
>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>> 
>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>
>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux (2.01% vs 1.57%
>> per the below cite):
> 
> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's
> decendants.
> 
> [deletia]

And here we go again. The iCultists and WinDrones drooling 24/7 in COLA 
about how "insignificant" Linux is. If they believe this is true, why are 
they so "het up" about it? Why do they spend all their waking hours 
attacking an "insignificant" OS. Their actions speak louder than their 
lying words.

As for the Microsoft's monopoly -- they can thank IBM and the always 
slimy Bill Gates for that. Short version. IBM was going to launch the PC, 
they needed an OS, Digital Research wouldn't give them the control they 
wanted, Bill Gates talks to IBM about MS BASIC, IBM mentions they want an 
OS ... Bill Gates gets his friend to sell a ripoff clone of DRI's newest 
OS, without telling him about the contract with IBM (what a scumball) and 
then the PC became much popular than anyone dreamed it would be. 
Microsoft rode on IBM's coattails. Of course they kept themselves there 
with dirty dealing, FUD, forcing OEMs to drop their competitor's OS -- 
more lies and bankrolling people like SCO, who tried to make a fortune on 
someone else's work by suing IBM. Microsoft NEVER wins in a fair fight. 
Only when the odds are skewed in their favor. Remember the Zune? Have you 
looked at market share of their search engine (Bing)? or Windows Phone or 
their tablets? They're a joke. 

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/16/2015 4:37:02 PM
Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> Desk Rabbit wrote:
> 
>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>> store.
>>>>>
>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>
>>>>>   Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>
>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>
>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>
>> 
>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
> 
> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea
> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and are
> used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI and
> the applications.
> 
> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
> 
> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
> far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
> are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
> No wonder you like it


Guffaw!!!  Koldturd, Linux sucks really bad.

0
GreyCloud
6/16/2015 4:48:29 PM
Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> Desk Rabbit wrote:
> 
>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably
>>>>>>>> the mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari
>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>>
>>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the
>>> idea
>> 
>> You clearly haven't used it.
> 
> I did. And I hated evey moment
> Windows from version 8 are way worse than OSX could ever be. And man,
> *that* is shitty!
> Up to Win7 it was a shoddy, but otherwise useable OS. This his completely
> ceased to be from Win8 on. Only the shoddyness remains
> 
>>> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
>>> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and
>>> are used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI
>>> and the applications.
>> 
>> Even more evidence that you haven't used it. Hint: The touch screen mode
>> is turned off on non-touch devices.
> 
> And? Does that somehow change the fact that the clunky tiles are still
> present? It is just not as intrusive as it was with Win8
> 
>> You really do like to spout "facts" from a position of complete and
>> utter ignorance don't you? Cue your equally ill-informed herd to back
>> you up on this nonsense.
> 
> At least I have used that shoddy mess. On the other hand, you spout loads
> of nonsense about linux and you have never in your entire miserable life
> used it
> 
>> 
>>>
>>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same.
>>> Just the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
>> 
>> Yeah, we get it, you haven't tried Windows 10 so you don't have a clue
>> what you are talking about.
> 
> You know absolutely nothing about my usage of windows. You just try to
> deflect from that heap of elephant dung which is called "Win10"
>  
>>>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
>>> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>> by far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>> those are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>>
>> 
>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
> 
> That was really a stinking mess.
> So much for "usage labs" at MS. Those dimbulbs they employ to conduct
> those tests should be put to better use. Sweeping parking lots is about
> all those idiots may do without causing more harm
> 
>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
> 
> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice when
> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
> After all, morons like you could never hope to install *any* OS, no matter
> which one, by yourself. This comes with a mother who is also your sister

Yeah, big deal... you're a blowhard, koldturd.

GUFFAW!!!

0
GreyCloud
6/16/2015 4:50:32 PM
Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> chrisv wrote:
> 
>> Melzzzzz wrote:
>> 
>>>Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>> 
>> I hear that an animated Sweaty Balmer will throw chairs during file
>> transfers.
>> 
> 
> Wouldn't it be better if stupid looking dog would rip boxes of clippies
> apart, only to be hit by flying chairs?
> 
> Maybe Snit Michael Glasser could make a visit at MS and bring some of his
> "students" along, who whimper in terror at the thought of "files" and
> start crying when "difficult concepts" like "folders" are mentioned.
> Would make a nice "useability test"

So, did you get hit in the head by a chair then?  Most likely what your 
problem is... brain damage.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

0
GreyCloud
6/16/2015 4:51:25 PM
On 2015-06-16 12:48 PM, GreyCloud wrote:
> Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably the
>>>>>>> mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack of
>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari was
>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>
>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>
>>>
>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>
>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the idea
>> that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same haptic and
>> user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use cases and are
>> used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected in the GUI and
>> the applications.
>>
>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same. Just
>> the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
>>
>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
>> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>> far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>> are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>> No wonder you like it
>
>
> Guffaw!!!  Koldturd, Linux sucks really bad.

Peter der Klown is just bitter that he wasn't able to successfully 
install Windows 8, 8.1 and 10.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/16/2015 4:52:11 PM
On Tuesday, June 16, 2015 at 12:38:23 PM UTC-4, ronb wrote:
> 
> And here we go again. The iCultists and WinDrones drooling 24/7 in COLA 
> about how "insignificant" Linux is. If they believe this is true, why are 
> they so "het up" about it? Why do they spend all their waking hours 
> attacking an "insignificant" OS. Their actions speak louder than their 
> lying words.

Golly, once again RonB misses the point entirely:  the
so-called "attacks" aren't criticsims being directed
against an inanimate object (Linux OS).


> As for the Microsoft's monopoly -- ...

Ancient history and an obsolete crybaby whine. 

(FYI, this is also not an "attack" on an 
inanimate object (Linux OS))


-hh
0
hh
6/16/2015 5:20:49 PM
On 6/16/15, 9:37 AM, in article mlpjbd$p8i$1@dont-email.me, "ronb"
<ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 09:35:16 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> 
>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>> far more than the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>> 
>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>> 
>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>> 
>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux (2.01% vs 1.57%
>>> per the below cite):
>> 
>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's
>> decendants.
>> 
>> [deletia]
> 
> And here we go again. The iCultists and WinDrones drooling 24/7 in COLA
> about how "insignificant" Linux is.

Your imaginary friends are not a good topic.

> If they believe this is true, why are they so "het up" about it? Why do they
> spend all their waking hours attacking an "insignificant" OS. Their actions
> speak louder than their lying words.

What your imaginary friends do is your issue.

Why not give up on them and speak about (and even show) how Linux helps you
in ways the competition does not?


> As for the Microsoft's monopoly -- they can thank IBM and the always
> slimy Bill Gates for that. Short version. IBM was going to launch the PC,
> they needed an OS, Digital Research wouldn't give them the control they
> wanted, Bill Gates talks to IBM about MS BASIC, IBM mentions they want an
> OS ... Bill Gates gets his friend to sell a ripoff clone of DRI's newest
> OS, without telling him about the contract with IBM (what a scumball) and
> then the PC became much popular than anyone dreamed it would be.
> Microsoft rode on IBM's coattails. Of course they kept themselves there
> with dirty dealing, FUD, forcing OEMs to drop their competitor's OS --
> more lies and bankrolling people like SCO, who tried to make a fortune on
> someone else's work by suing IBM. Microsoft NEVER wins in a fair fight.
> Only when the odds are skewed in their favor. Remember the Zune? Have you
> looked at market share of their search engine (Bing)? or Windows Phone or
> their tablets? They're a joke.



-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/16/2015 5:27:44 PM
On Tuesday, June 16, 2015 at 9:04:58 AM UTC-6, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> On 16 Jun 2015 09:35, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> > On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
> >> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> >>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> >>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K=F6hlmann wrote:
> >>> >> [...]
> >>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
> >>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
> >>> > can be given away.
> >>>
> >>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
> >>>
> >>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux=
..
> >>
> >> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
> >> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
> >
> > ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it'=
s decendants.
> >
> And Linux on the desktop has been dwarfed by OSX.

Regarding market share, the desktop is the only place one can claim this (a=
 thing that is true even for Windows). Even so, the term "dwarfed" may not =
be appropriate when the leading OS has ~90%  market share and OS X splits t=
he remainder with desktop Linux (even it if has 3-4 times the share). It's =
possible that Linux could be twice as good as the competition and, due to l=
ack of software (and not being preloaded on enough machines in the public e=
ye), it'd still have a low share. For all the focusing on OSes that go on i=
n OS advocacy newsgroups, it's easy to forget the average user doesn't care=
 about them much at all, they all have tons of features the average user wi=
ll never use. In a very real sense the browser has become the OS for many d=
esktop users. Worse, for Linux, the average user doesn't change their OS ve=
ry often, a thing that works to MS' benefit. Couple the above with hardware=
 compatibility and a legacy of doing what MS did and you've got the recipe =
for 'entrenched'. In any event, it's way past time to get realistic about:

http://searchengineland.com/its-official-google-says-more-searches-now-on-m=
obile-than-on-desktop-220369

If this isn't 100% accurate today... it's only a matter of time until it is=
.. MS knows this, which is why they are doing the things they are. They're a=
lso well aware they spent too many resources attempting to hold on to their=
 desktop share, only to discover that the desktop arena isn't what it once =
was (and their market cap bears that out).
0
Steve
6/16/2015 5:48:19 PM
On Tuesday, June 16, 2015 at 11:27:49 AM UTC-6, Snit wrote:
> On 6/16/15, 9:37 AM, in article mlpjbd$p8i$1@dont-email.me, "ronb"
> <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> > On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 09:35:16 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> >=20
> >> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
> >>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> >>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> >>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K=F6hlmann wrote:
> >>>>>> [...]
> >>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
> >>>>> far more than the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
> >>>>=20
> >>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
> >>>>=20
> >>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linu=
x.
> >>>=20
> >>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux (2.01% vs 1.57=
%
> >>> per the below cite):
> >>=20
> >> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it=
's
> >> decendants.
> >>=20
> >> [deletia]
> >=20
> > And here we go again. The iCultists and WinDrones drooling 24/7 in COLA
> > about how "insignificant" Linux is.
>=20
> Your imaginary friends are not a good topic.

As opposed to your "real" friends?

"Either Snatch the Clown is oblivious to what's going on in the real world =
or he truly wants to trick us into thinking he represents/owns Prescott Com=
puter." - Slimer

Wait a minute... Snatch the Clown? That's you, isn't it, Snit? LOL!
0
Steve
6/16/2015 6:12:21 PM
On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:

>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>> Windows 3x)
>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>> far
>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>> are an
>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>> No wonder you like it
>>
> 
> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
> 
> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.

SO
FUCKING
WHAT?

-- 
 -v

0
vallor
6/16/2015 9:12:58 PM
Slimer wrote:

> On 2015-06-16 12:48 PM, GreyCloud wrote:
>> Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 15/06/2015 19:19, Melzzzzz wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:48:23 +0000 (UTC)
>>>>> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 10:14:40 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tried the Mac.  Not impressed, at all.  Clumsy, limited options,
>>>>>>>> ass-backward caption bar, crappy mouse response (though probably
>>>>>>>> the mouse just needs a mouse pad to work better), incredible lack
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> preferences options, new windows don't always get focus.  Safari
>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>> disappointing compared to Chrome or Firefox.  And I didn't even get
>>>>>>>> to the console terminal or compiler environment. I lasted five
>>>>>>>> minutes, and was tired of playing with the Mac.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That sounds like a joy, compared to when I tried Windwoes 8, in a
>>>>>>> store.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I started an app, it went full-screen, and I could not figure-out
>>>>>>> how to reduce it or exit it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sheesh, every GUI application on every OS that I've ever seen had
>>>>>>> an 'X' or something in the corner, to exit an application.  M$
>>>>>>> decided to not do that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    Where are the Consistency Police, when you need them?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 'Quit' or 'Exit', I can easily deal-with.  Nothing at all, I can't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yet not a single rant or video on the subject by Snit. Is he
>>>>>> slipping? Is a "consistent UI" no longer important to him? Or are his
>>>>>> issues with "inconsistent UIs" a "selective" problem that only apply
>>>>>> to the OS he's froths about 24/7?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Win 8 is cell phone OS, which was once desktop OS ...
>>>>> Let's see what Win 10 will be ;p
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's a great fusion of both. Some innovation on the desktop environment
>>>> that gives a consistent look and feel across devices.
>>>
>>> It is a bullshit OS. It is very slightly "better" than Win8. But the
>>> idea that a desktop, laptop, tablet and phone should have the same
>>> haptic and user-interface is way beyond stupid. They have different use
>>> cases and are used in very different ways. And this *must* be reflected
>>> in the GUI and the applications.
>>>
>>> Even apple is not that stupid and makes OSX and iOS behave the same.
>>> Just the GUIs are made optical somewhat akin, but not at all the usage.
>>>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to Windows
>>> 3x) to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>> by far the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>> those are an insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>
>>
>> Guffaw!!!  Koldturd, Linux sucks really bad.
> 
> Peter der Klown is just bitter that he wasn't able to successfully
> install Windows 8, 8.1 and 10.
> 

He's just some old fart living in Germany somewhere.  I hear they never 
launder their leather shorts over there.
Must be a prime area for linux... no bathing required.


0
GreyCloud
6/16/2015 10:04:07 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
> 
>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> >> [...]
>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>> > can be given away.
>>>> 
>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>> 
>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>>
>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>
>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's
>> decendants.
>>
>> [deletia]
> 
> Let them shill for the "market leader".
> 
> No one cares anymore.
> 
Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.

LOL!!!

0
GreyCloud
6/16/2015 10:05:14 PM
On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>> Windows 3x)
>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>> far
>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>> are an
>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>>
>> 
>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>> 
>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>
> SO
> FUCKING
> WHAT?

Think about it this way.
Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.

0
Humberto
6/16/2015 10:36:29 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>> far
>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>> are an
>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>
>>> 
>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>> 
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>
>> SO
>> FUCKING
>> WHAT?
> 
> Think about it this way.
> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.

Idiot

It would not change anything from the current situation.

Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install 
linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch. The 
majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will 
stay with windows
0
Peter
6/16/2015 10:41:58 PM
On 2015-06-16, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>> 
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>> 
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Idiot

Why are you so angry and bitter?

> It would not change anything from the current situation.

The current situation is dismal and what we have now
is not working.
You just refuse to admit it.

> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install 
> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch. The 
> majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will 
> stay with windows

So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
ones who are correct.
That's asinine.

0
Humberto
6/16/2015 10:52:07 PM
On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>> 
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>> 
>> Idiot
> 
> Why are you so angry and bitter?
> 
>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
> 
> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
> is not working.
> You just refuse to admit it.
> 
>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install
>> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch. The
>> majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will
>> stay with windows
> 
> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
> ones who are correct.
> That's asinine.

It is. The reality is people have choice... and those who choose Linux are
not by default wrong... but neither are people who choose Windows or OS X.

They each have pros and cons.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/16/2015 11:08:46 PM
On 6/16/15, 3:41 PM, in article mlq8l7$kua$1@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>> 
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> 
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>> 
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
> 
> Idiot
> 
> It would not change anything from the current situation.
> 
> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install
> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch. The
> majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will
> stay with windows

Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have needs
which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is refreshing to
see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/16/2015 11:11:08 PM
On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 16:11:08 -0700
Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> On 6/16/15, 3:41 PM, in article mlq8l7$kua$1@dont-email.me, "Peter
> K=C3=B6hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>=20
> >>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
> >>>>=20
> >>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
> >>>> the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
> >>>=20
> >>> SO
> >>> FUCKING
> >>> WHAT?
> >>=20
> >> Think about it this way.
> >> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
> >=20
> > Idiot
> >=20
> > It would not change anything from the current situation.
> >=20
> > Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows
> > anymore install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent
> > enough will switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to
> > not shit into the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>=20
> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have
> needs which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is
> refreshing to see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.
>=20
>=20

Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
how to use computer and that's all.
Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
Windows or OS X.


0
Melzzzzz
6/16/2015 11:18:37 PM
On 6/16/15, 4:18 PM, in article 20150617011837.6b8451f7@maxa-pc, "Melzzzzz"
<mel@zzzzz.com> wrote:

>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>> 
>>> Idiot
>>> 
>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>> 
>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows
>>> anymore install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent
>>> enough will switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to
>>> not shit into the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>> 
>> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have
>> needs which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is
>> refreshing to see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.
> 
> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
> was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
> how to use computer and that's all.

I have no problem with that. Curious: what distro do they use and what type
tasks do they work with?

> Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
> Windows or OS X.

Huh?


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/16/2015 11:24:45 PM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 00:41:58 +0200, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
> 
> Idiot

Glad I killfiled him. Again, if Linux is so insignificant, why do 
WinDrones and iCultists drone on about it 24/7 in COLA? Again, their 
actions speak louder than their lying words.

As for Linux "needing sales," obviously "Humberto" hasn't watching Linux 
very closely? Linux is proliferating all over the world WITHOUT corporate 
sales. Hence the rants from the iCultists and WinDrones about "too much 
choice." And, BTW, "Humberto" many corporations make a lot of money on 
Linux. Ever hear of Google? 

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/16/2015 11:52:46 PM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 01:18:37 +0200, Melzzzzz wrote:

> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
> was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
> how to use computer and that's all.
> Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
> Windows or OS X.

The Linux Mint "flavor" of Ubuntu is fine by my 80+ year-old father also. 
Windows was a disaster for him -- and for me, because I had to try to 
support the crappy Microsoft "hobbyware" from 600 miles away. Much, much 
easier support with Linux Mint. He's been using it now for about four 
years.

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/16/2015 11:55:28 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>> far
>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>> are an
>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>
>>> 
>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>> 
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>
>> SO
>> FUCKING
>> WHAT?
>
> Think about it this way.
> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.

Nah.  Most people buy what is presented to them.  That is all.

-- 
The sendmail configuration file is one of those files that looks like someone
beat their head on the keyboard.  After working with it... I can see why!
		-- Harry Skelton
0
Chris
6/17/2015 12:14:47 AM
On 6/16/15, 4:52 PM, in article mlqcse$vfv$4@dont-email.me, "ronb"
<ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 00:41:58 +0200, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> 
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>> 
>> Idiot
> 
> Glad I killfiled him. Again, if Linux is so insignificant, why do
> WinDrones and iCultists drone on about it 24/7 in COLA? Again, their
> actions speak louder than their lying words.

What your imaginary friends do is your own issue... why don't you stop
talking about them and instead talk about Linux?

> As for Linux "needing sales," obviously "Humberto" hasn't watching Linux
> very closely? Linux is proliferating all over the world WITHOUT corporate
> sales.

The context is desktop Linux.

> Hence the rants from the iCultists and WinDrones about "too much
> choice." 

Again: what your imaginary friends do is not on topic.

As for me: one of the problems I have with desktop Linux is the lack of
choice. Far, far too little for my tastes. I would love to see it gain
more... but not just choice for the sake of choice, choice that benefits
productivity, efficiency, and error reduction.

> And, BTW, "Humberto" many corporations make a lot of money on
> Linux. Ever hear of Google?

They did not use standard desktop Linux and instead made their own ChromeOS.
Same thing with Android. They did not go with the poorly designed UIs and
experiences offered by the open source community.

Very wise of them.

-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 12:18:59 AM
On 6/16/15, 5:14 PM, in article mlqe3q$4ah$4@dont-email.me, "Chris Ahlstrom"
<OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:

>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>> 
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> 
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>> 
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
> 
> Nah.  Most people buy what is presented to them.  That is all.

Dell, HP, Walmart, and others have presented Linux to them, too.

It did not go well. Do any of them even do it any more?


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 12:33:56 AM
Snit wrote:

> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
> 
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>> 
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>> 
>>> Idiot
>> 
>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>> 
>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>> 
>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>> is not working.
>> You just refuse to admit it.
>> 
>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>> 
>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>> ones who are correct.

It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%

>> That's asinine.

Your welcome, lying imbecile
0
Peter
6/17/2015 12:37:07 AM
On 6/16/15, 5:37 PM, in article mlqfd4$87g$2@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

> Snit wrote:
> 
>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>> 
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>> 
>>>> Idiot
>>> 
>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>> 
>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>> 
>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>> is not working.
>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>> 
>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>> 
>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>> ones who are correct.
> 
> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
> 
>>> That's asinine.
> 
> Your welcome, lying imbecile

Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 12:45:04 AM
On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>> far
>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>> are an
>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>
>>>
>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>
>> SO
>> FUCKING
>> WHAT?
> 
> Think about it this way.
> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.

Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.

Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
measured in terms of retail usage, right?


-- 
 -v

He is a man capable of turning any colour into grey.
		-- John LeCarre

0
vallor
6/17/2015 12:46:09 AM
On 17 Jun 2015 16:28, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>
>>>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>     then
>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>>>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>> trollish rant.
>>>
>>> More baseless accusations.
>
>    No. An obvious contradiction.
>
>    If "Redhat equals Linux" back in the stone age when he allegedly started
> using Linux then the whole issue of RMS being embarassing and smelly is
> clearly irrelevant. A commercial brand was already the "face of Linux" instead
> of RMS.
>
I'll add the inability to read for comprehension to the list of things you
Can't do.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 1:01:01 AM
On 6/16/15, 5:46 PM, in article
5580c352$0$44089$b1db1813$46decd27@news.astraweb.com, "vallor"
<vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:

>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>> 
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> 
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>> 
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
> 
> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
> 
> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
> measured in terms of retail usage, right?

To me the true level of success / failure is how well a tool works. In the
case of a desktop system, in general, this means how well it handles the
many tasks a desktop is "expected" to do and how well it supports
productivity, efficiency, and error-reduction.

Of course, not everyone will have the same needs nor find the same things to
benefit those items I list. But we can see from the lack of use of desktop
Linux (tied to it being free, easy to get, and having had the backing of
Dell and HP and Walmart and others) that it is not competing well.

I would love for it to grow to the point of being good competition.

-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 1:10:09 AM
Snit wrote:

> On 6/16/15, 5:37 PM, in article mlqfd4$87g$2@dont-email.me, "Peter
> Köhlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> 
>> Snit wrote:
>> 
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Idiot
>>>> 
>>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>>> 
>>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>>> 
>>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>>> is not working.
>>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>>> 
>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>> 
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
>> 
>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>> 
>>>> That's asinine.
>> 
>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
> 
> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
> 

Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?

0
Peter
6/17/2015 7:07:19 AM
On 16/06/2015 14:58, Slimer wrote:
> On 2015-06-16 8:17 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 11:54, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>>> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice
>>> when
>>> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
>>
>> The old, tired, it's come pre-installed nonsense.
>>
>> Many, many organisations have tried to sell desktop computers with Linux
>> preinstalled and failed miserably. Even Walmart couldn't sell a sub $200
>> PC with Linux on it.
>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/12/AR2008031201220.html
>>
>
> My IBM PS/1 in 1991 came pre-installed with IBM PC-DOS 4.0 and some
> graphical menu system. Even though I knew absolutely nothing about PCs
> at the time, I managed to have it boot straight to DOS after a while and
> eventually made it boot straight into Windows 3.0. I didn't _replace_
> the operating system (since it loaded from ROM and was impossible) but
> essentially did the same thing.
>
> The point? If people really hated Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or 10, they would
> find a way to remove it and replace it by something better. That's what
> I did when I booted it straight to DOS and avoided the GUI and then had
> it boot to Windows 3.0. Even the least knowledgeable person can do
> something of the sort and since installing Linux is not that difficult,
> any determined person can install it as well.
>
> To me, that destroys the whole "it comes pre-installed" argument.
>

Every single server we buy in comes without an operating system. Our 
clients mostly choose Windows even though they know Linux is free and 
will therefore reduce the cost.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 10:58:45 AM
On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>> Windows 3x)
>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>> far
>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>> are an
>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>>
>>
>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>
>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>
> SO
> FUCKING
> WHAT?
>

The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying 
for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a 
free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't 
really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue 
to pay for their OS.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:02:17 AM
On 16/06/2015 23:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-16, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>
>> Idiot
>
> Why are you so angry and bitter?

That's his default mode, it just goes down from there.

>
>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>
> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
> is not working.
> You just refuse to admit it.
>
>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install
>> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch. The
>> majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will
>> stay with windows
>
> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
> ones who are correct.
> That's asinine.
>

That's Peter for you.....
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:03:34 AM
On 17/06/2015 01:14, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Nah.  Most people buy what is presented to them.  That is all.
>

And when several large vendors try to present them Linux pre-installed 
it failed miserably.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:06:03 AM
On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>
> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>
>

So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:07:07 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>> far
>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>> are an
>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>
>>>
>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>
>> SO
>> FUCKING
>> WHAT?
>>
> 
> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
> to pay for their OS.

Idiot

They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy. 

You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael 
Glasser
0
Peter
6/17/2015 11:29:04 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>> by far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>
>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>
>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>
>>
> 
> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?

How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a 
machine?
Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit
0
Peter
6/17/2015 11:30:31 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 16/06/2015 14:58, Slimer wrote:
>> On 2015-06-16 8:17 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 11:54, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice
>>>> when
>>>> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
>>>
>>> The old, tired, it's come pre-installed nonsense.
>>>
>>> Many, many organisations have tried to sell desktop computers with Linux
>>> preinstalled and failed miserably. Even Walmart couldn't sell a sub $200
>>> PC with Linux on it.
>>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/12/AR2008031201220.html
>>>
>>
>> My IBM PS/1 in 1991 came pre-installed with IBM PC-DOS 4.0 and some
>> graphical menu system. Even though I knew absolutely nothing about PCs
>> at the time, I managed to have it boot straight to DOS after a while and
>> eventually made it boot straight into Windows 3.0. I didn't _replace_
>> the operating system (since it loaded from ROM and was impossible) but
>> essentially did the same thing.
>>
>> The point? If people really hated Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or 10, they would
>> find a way to remove it and replace it by something better. That's what
>> I did when I booted it straight to DOS and avoided the GUI and then had
>> it boot to Windows 3.0. Even the least knowledgeable person can do
>> something of the sort and since installing Linux is not that difficult,
>> any determined person can install it as well.
>>
>> To me, that destroys the whole "it comes pre-installed" argument.
>>
> 
> Every single server we buy in comes without an operating system. Our
> clients mostly choose Windows even though they know Linux is free and
> will therefore reduce the cost.

I believe that. If they are really "clients" of you, they are dumb as bread 
anyway
0
Peter
6/17/2015 11:32:49 AM
On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>> 
>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>> 
>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>
>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and it's
>>> decendants.
>>>
>>> [deletia]
>> 
>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>> 
>> No one cares anymore.
>> 
> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>
> LOL!!!

Who is shilling for Windows?
I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.



0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:32:53 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>
>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>> 
>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>
>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>
>>>> [deletia]
>>> 
>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>> 
>>> No one cares anymore.
>>> 
>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>
>> LOL!!!
> 
> Who is shilling for Windows?
> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.

This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat
0
Peter
6/17/2015 11:39:05 AM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Snit wrote:
>
>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>> 
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>> 
>>>> Idiot
>>> 
>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>> 
>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>> 
>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>> is not working.
>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>> 
>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>> 
>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>> ones who are correct.
>
> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%

I never said it was.
You have a reading comprehension problem.
It seems to be common in this froup.


>>> That's asinine.
>
> Your welcome, lying imbecile

Fact: 98 percent of computer users are using something other than Linux.
So if Windows users comprise even 85 percent of that number your 
statement that the vast majority of users aren't intelligent is
ludicrous.

The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
advocating Linux.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:40:56 AM
On 17/06/2015 12:30, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
>
> How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a
> machine?
> Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit
>

So putting your usual potty mouthed, low IQ, childish and unnecessary 
comments to one side, how about answering the question? Or is it too 
hard for you? Perhaps you can draw us a picture of a duck instead?
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:42:24 AM
On 17/06/2015 12:29, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.
>
> Idiot
>
> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.

Obviously, but they can choose to buy a machine without an OS or replace 
it with the allegedly superior Linux Desktop. Evidence seems to suggest 
that they don't, could it be that Linux Desktop isn't up to the everyday 
job?


0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:44:39 AM
On 17/06/2015 12:32, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 16/06/2015 14:58, Slimer wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-16 8:17 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 11:54, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Big deal. It gets shuffled to the people. They simply have no choice
>>>>> when
>>>>> buying a new machine. It is preinstalled then
>>>>
>>>> The old, tired, it's come pre-installed nonsense.
>>>>
>>>> Many, many organisations have tried to sell desktop computers with Linux
>>>> preinstalled and failed miserably. Even Walmart couldn't sell a sub $200
>>>> PC with Linux on it.
>>>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/12/AR2008031201220.html
>>>>
>>>
>>> My IBM PS/1 in 1991 came pre-installed with IBM PC-DOS 4.0 and some
>>> graphical menu system. Even though I knew absolutely nothing about PCs
>>> at the time, I managed to have it boot straight to DOS after a while and
>>> eventually made it boot straight into Windows 3.0. I didn't _replace_
>>> the operating system (since it loaded from ROM and was impossible) but
>>> essentially did the same thing.
>>>
>>> The point? If people really hated Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or 10, they would
>>> find a way to remove it and replace it by something better. That's what
>>> I did when I booted it straight to DOS and avoided the GUI and then had
>>> it boot to Windows 3.0. Even the least knowledgeable person can do
>>> something of the sort and since installing Linux is not that difficult,
>>> any determined person can install it as well.
>>>
>>> To me, that destroys the whole "it comes pre-installed" argument.
>>>
>>
>> Every single server we buy in comes without an operating system. Our
>> clients mostly choose Windows even though they know Linux is free and
>> will therefore reduce the cost.
>
> I believe that. If they are really "clients" of you, they are dumb as bread
> anyway
>

Yeah so dumb they run companies with turnovers measured in the millions 
and win industry specific awards for their use of Information Technology.

You must be doing exceptionally well then by your standards but still 
you work alone from home ;-)
0
Desk
6/17/2015 11:47:07 AM
It was reported that Peter K�hlmann posted:

> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>
>> 
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.

What a stupid, inane statement from DimRabbit.

> Idiot
>
> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy. 

And secondly, the vast majority of windows users couldn't even install  
*any* OS on their computers, which is why they take it to a shop.

Also, it's *quite* likely they have NO idea that there *are* other OSs they
 could use.

> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael 
> Glasser

-- 
openSUSE 13.2 64-bit
KDE 4.14.6 
Kernel: 4.0.5-2.1.g0899eb-desktop  #1 SMP PREEMPT
Mon Jun 8 09:07:57 UTC 2015 (f4cd21b) x86_64 x86_64 x86_64
  
This message is virus free, as absolutely 
NO Micro$oft products were used in its preparation. 

0
William
6/17/2015 11:47:12 AM
On 2015-06-16, ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 00:41:58 +0200, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>> 
>> Idiot
>
> Glad I killfiled him. Again, if Linux is so insignificant, why do 
> WinDrones and iCultists drone on about it 24/7 in COLA? Again, their 
> actions speak louder than their lying words.

My actions?
You mean actually advocating Linux?
One of my first posts was a response to the challenge to advocate Linux.
And that's what I did do. I posted a list of why I feel Linux is a superior
alternative to Windows for me.

> As for Linux "needing sales," obviously "Humberto" hasn't watching Linux 
> very closely? Linux is proliferating all over the world WITHOUT corporate 
> sales. Hence the rants from the iCultists and WinDrones about "too much 
> choice." And, BTW, "Humberto" many corporations make a lot of money on 
> Linux. Ever hear of Google? 

The context is desktop.
And you have a very severe case of lack of reading comprehension.
I never said corporations weren't making money from Linux.

As for sales, your poor reading skills are once again on display.
I said nothing of Linux sales. I said *LOST OPPORTUNITY* meaning
one less potential Linux user.

Your extreme hate and bitterness is getting in the way of your ability
to comprehend what you are attempting to read.

BTW you *do* realize using terms like "iCultist" and "Windrones" make
you appear like a petulant child in need of attention?
I suppose you aren't intelligent enough to realize that.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:50:13 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> Who is shilling for Windows?
> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.

Hello, "Hadron".

-- 
The real man's Bloody Mary:
	Ingredients: vodka, tomato juice, Tobasco, Worcestershire
	sauce, A-1 steak sauce, ice, salt, pepper, celery.
 
	Fill a large tumbler with vodka.
	Throw all the other ingredients away.
0
Chris
6/17/2015 11:51:05 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
> advocating Linux.

Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the desktop
market.

Thanks for playing.  

-- 
Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people.
		-- W. C. Fields
0
Chris
6/17/2015 11:53:43 AM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>> 
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Nah.  Most people buy what is presented to them.  That is all.

That they do and it's a clear advantage Microsoft has with pre-loaded
systems. Linux could do better though if the movement had the right
leadership.
Look how much Shuttleworth has done to bring Linux to the average folks.


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:53:57 AM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>> 
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>
> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
> measured in terms of retail usage, right?

Another person who can't read.
Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.

The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
the lack of leadership and focus.

Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
been at it since 2006 I believe?

And the group jumped all over him for posting it.

That's where your problem is. If something as simple as that can't
be remedied in 9 years, convincing big companies or municipalities
to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 12:00:59 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>
>>>
>> 
>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
>
> How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a 
> machine?
> Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit

It doesn't matter if it's being downloaded by the billions. The fact is
just about every web counter has Linux at somewhere around 2 percent.
So either this is some huge conspiracy or it's "Houston, we have a problem"
time.
My opinion is, it's the latter and the lack of leadership, focus and
the attitude of the Linux community in general is to blame.
And this group is the poster child for that statement.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 12:03:57 PM
> Desk Retard wrote:
>> 
>> So how would you measure success,

Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
and companies, dipshit.

It's only extremely stupid assholes, like you, who seem to think that
a product isn't "successful" if it doesn't have a massive share of the
market.

-- 
"for a time Apple had a greater domination of the Mac hardware market
then Microsoft had of the PC hardware market."  -  John "mono means
one" Slade
0
chrisv
6/17/2015 12:06:12 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>>
>> 
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.
>
> Idiot
>
> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy. 
>
> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael 
> Glasser

But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
Most, by far, don't.
Why is that?

The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.

The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
people like you. 


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 12:06:59 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 11:40, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Snit wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Idiot
>>>>
>>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>>>
>>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>>>
>>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>>> is not working.
>>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>>>
>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>>
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
>>
>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>
> I never said it was.
> You have a reading comprehension problem.
> It seems to be common in this froup.
>
>
>>>> That's asinine.
>>
>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>
> Fact: 98 percent of computer users are using something other than Linux.
> So if Windows users comprise even 85 percent of that number your
> statement that the vast majority of users aren't intelligent is
> ludicrous.
>
> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
> advocating Linux.
>
>
Old Petey has never advocated anything.  Post after post of very
negative comments and insults.  He sometimes throws in some asinine
opinion that he tries to pass off as fact which is usually followed
soon by someone handing him his ass as he is proven wrong.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 12:12:40 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 07:06, chrisv wrote:
>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>
>>> So how would you measure success,
>
> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
> and companies, dipshit.
>
> It's only extremely stupid assholes, like you, who seem to think that
> a product isn't "successful" if it doesn't have a massive share of the
> market.
>
It is also those mfgs that found that putting Linux on desktops/laptops
was a very big no sale.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 12:16:21 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 12:06, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>
>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>> to pay for their OS.
>>
>> Idiot
>>
>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
>>
>> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael
>> Glasser
>
> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
> Most, by far, don't.
> Why is that?
>
> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>
> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
> people like you.
>
And unfortunately, even in the supposed Linux support forums, bitter
and vile postings similar to what you see here are all too common.
That doesn't make someone feel warm and fuzzy about switching.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 12:19:47 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

>But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>Most, by far, don't.
>Why is that?
>
>The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>
>The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>people like you. 

*plonk* goes the troll

As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
the desktop.

As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
"obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.

As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
the circumstances.

The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.

-- 
"There are too many distros"  -  "Hadron"
0
chrisv
6/17/2015 12:56:55 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Snit wrote:
>
>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>> 

[deletia]

>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>> 
>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>> ones who are correct.

   Americans will happily eat dirt. That's why Detroit is still in business
and McDonalds is the fast food juggernaut it is.

   Fortunately, in a genuinely free market it is quite possible for the 2%
option to not merely survive but to thrive. 

>
> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>
>>> That's asinine.
>
> Your welcome, lying imbecile


-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 1:07:05 PM
On 2015-06-16, Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 16:11:08 -0700
> Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
>
>> On 6/16/15, 3:41 PM, in article mlq8l7$kua$1@dont-email.me, "Peter
>> Köhlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> 
>> >>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>> >>>> 
>> >>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
>> >>>> the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>> >>> 
>> >>> SO
>> >>> FUCKING
>> >>> WHAT?
>> >> 
>> >> Think about it this way.
>> >> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>> > 
>> > Idiot
>> > 
>> > It would not change anything from the current situation.
>> > 
>> > Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows
>> > anymore install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent
>> > enough will switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to
>> > not shit into the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>> 
>> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have
>> needs which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is
>> refreshing to see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.

   Nope. People just think they need the monopoly because they have 
predominantly thought that they need the monopoly. This goes all the
way back to MS-DOS when things were much more proprietary and being
part of the "right ecosystem" mattered much more.

   Windows is not the "better option" for pretty much nearly nobody.
Everyone is just so used to the Windows monopoly that they think they
can't get along without it.

   Fortunately, tablets and phones are undermining that idea.

   Whatever success Apple has had has been a net benefit for the entire
market in this regard.

>
> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
> was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
> how to use computer and that's all.
> Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
> Windows or OS X.
>
>

    If you are a pedestrian home user, then there is probably no need to
be fixated with any particualar brand of desktop OS. They are in truth
probably all equally interchangeable.

    Now I "use it harder" so MacOS is out. Windows it out just because it's
a festering pile and I know too much about technology to tolerate it.

-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 1:11:40 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 07:56, chrisv wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>>But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>Most, by far, don't.
>>Why is that?
>>
>>The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>
>>The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>people like you.
>
> *plonk* goes the troll
>
> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
> the desktop.
>
Yep, it is obvious.  They have a consistent product with excellent
marketing skills.

> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
>
That's a fair assessment, it is difficult to expand and grow in an
established market unless the market leader fumbles the ball.  So far,
MS hasn't done that enough.

> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
> the circumstances.
>
The "FOSS community" is the problem.  I have no doubt that overall they
feel that they are doing all they can, but the problem is they lack
business sense and how to package and market a product in order to
expand.

They feel that the many distros is a plus for a marketable product,
when it actually is a big detriment.  To the market at large, the
various distros represent confusion and lack of a consistent marketing
effort.  To the geek market Linux on the desktop is a viable product
because it allows them to enjoy playing with the OS, and that isn't
something that the business or consumer markets are interested in at
all.  And unfortunately for them, the geeks represent a miniscule part
of the market and not even a very profitable one at that.

You just have to look at where Linux has been successful to see if you
are not blind.
1.  Chromebooks - hiding Linux behind a browser has worked commercially
though not gaining a huge marketshare, but producing some profits for
the producers.
2.  Android - presenting a consistent front end while hiding the Linux
underpinning has proven very successful.
3.  Embedded systems - you don't see the OS, you don't directly
interact with it and it works and sells.
4.  Servers - the big strength of Linux and it has been successful,
both commercially and for the hobbyists.

The kiss of death for Linux desktop isn't that MS owns the market, it
is that there is no consistency in appearance or operation and doesn't
have a good marketing message.  As long as the geeks and hobbyists are
in charge of getting Linux on the desktop, it will fail time and again,
just as it has these many years.

> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>
And that right there tells you all you need to know about the business
sense of FOSS and GNU/Linux in a nutshell.  Total amateur hour if there
ever was one.  The 'free' market isn't a market at all.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 1:12:41 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 08:07, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Snit wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>>
>
> [deletia]
>
>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>>
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
>
>    Americans will happily eat dirt. That's why Detroit is still in business
> and McDonalds is the fast food juggernaut it is.
>
Which excuse number is that one?  And since Linux is available
worldwide, yet doesn't penetrate the desktop market enough to be more
than a polling error, which excuse will you blame that on?

>    Fortunately, in a genuinely free market it is quite possible for the 2%
> option to not merely survive but to thrive.
>
Thrive at what?  Certainly not profits on the desktop, not marketshare
on the desktop, and outside of the geek/hobbyist bunch, virtually
invisible.

-- 
Lloyd



0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 1:15:32 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>
>>>
>> 
>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?

    Merely continuing to exist puts it ahead of 99.9% of all of the alternatives
that ever existed.

    MS-DOS wiped everything else out. It nearly wiped out MacOS.

[deletia]

-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 1:16:43 PM
On 17/06/2015 12:47, William Poaster wrote:
> It was reported that Peter K�hlmann posted:
>
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>>
>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>> to pay for their OS.
>
> What a stupid, inane statement from DimRabbit.
>
>> Idiot
>>
>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
>
> And secondly, the vast majority of windows users couldn't even install
> *any* OS on their computers, which is why they take it to a shop.
>
> Also, it's *quite* likely they have NO idea that there *are* other OSs they
>   could use.

Yet when offered lower price PCs with Linux Desktop installed by major 
manufacturers and outlets they still failed to sell.

0
Desk
6/17/2015 1:27:36 PM
On 17/06/2015 13:56, chrisv wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>> Most, by far, don't.
>> Why is that?
>>
>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>> people like you.
>
> *plonk* goes the troll
>
> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
> the desktop.
>
> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.

So why is it that whenever large retail outlets have tried to sell low 
price Linux systems they have failed and had to remove them from the 
shelves?

0
Desk
6/17/2015 1:29:29 PM
On 17/06/2015 14:12, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 07:56, chrisv wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>> Most, by far, don't.
>>> Why is that?
>>>
>>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>>
>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>> people like you.
>>
>> *plonk* goes the troll
>>
>> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
>> the desktop.
>>
> Yep, it is obvious.  They have a consistent product with excellent
> marketing skills.
>
>> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
>> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
>>
> That's a fair assessment, it is difficult to expand and grow in an
> established market unless the market leader fumbles the ball.  So far,
> MS hasn't done that enough.
>
>> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
>> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
>> the circumstances.
>>
> The "FOSS community" is the problem.  I have no doubt that overall they
> feel that they are doing all they can, but the problem is they lack
> business sense and how to package and market a product in order to
> expand.
>
> They feel that the many distros is a plus for a marketable product,
> when it actually is a big detriment.  To the market at large, the
> various distros represent confusion and lack of a consistent marketing
> effort.  To the geek market Linux on the desktop is a viable product
> because it allows them to enjoy playing with the OS, and that isn't
> something that the business or consumer markets are interested in at
> all.  And unfortunately for them, the geeks represent a miniscule part
> of the market and not even a very profitable one at that.
>
> You just have to look at where Linux has been successful to see if you
> are not blind.
> 1.  Chromebooks - hiding Linux behind a browser has worked commercially
> though not gaining a huge marketshare, but producing some profits for
> the producers.
> 2.  Android - presenting a consistent front end while hiding the Linux
> underpinning has proven very successful.
> 3.  Embedded systems - you don't see the OS, you don't directly
> interact with it and it works and sells.
> 4.  Servers - the big strength of Linux and it has been successful,
> both commercially and for the hobbyists.
>
> The kiss of death for Linux desktop isn't that MS owns the market, it
> is that there is no consistency in appearance or operation and doesn't
> have a good marketing message.  As long as the geeks and hobbyists are
> in charge of getting Linux on the desktop, it will fail time and again,
> just as it has these many years.
>
>> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
>> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
>> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>>
> And that right there tells you all you need to know about the business
> sense of FOSS and GNU/Linux in a nutshell.  Total amateur hour if there
> ever was one.  The 'free' market isn't a market at all.
>
>

You've taken a hammer and hit the nail firmly and squarely on the head.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 1:30:54 PM
On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>
>>> So how would you measure success,
>
> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
> and companies, dipshit.

If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????


> It's only extremely stupid assholes, like you, who seem to think that
> a product isn't "successful" if it doesn't have a massive share of the
> market.

So if a restaurant opened selling fresh shit on a plate you'd describe 
that as a success then?

0
Desk
6/17/2015 1:33:04 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 08:11, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-16, Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 16:11:08 -0700
>> Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:41 PM, in article mlq8l7$kua$1@dont-email.me, "Peter
>>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
>>> >>>> the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> SO
>>> >>> FUCKING
>>> >>> WHAT?
>>> >>
>>> >> Think about it this way.
>>> >> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>> >
>>> > Idiot
>>> >
>>> > It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>> >
>>> > Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows
>>> > anymore install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent
>>> > enough will switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to
>>> > not shit into the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>
>>> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have
>>> needs which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is
>>> refreshing to see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.
>
>    Nope. People just think they need the monopoly because they have
> predominantly thought that they need the monopoly. This goes all the
> way back to MS-DOS when things were much more proprietary and being
> part of the "right ecosystem" mattered much more.
>
>    Windows is not the "better option" for pretty much nearly nobody.
> Everyone is just so used to the Windows monopoly that they think they
> can't get along without it.
>
Can you number your excuses?  Makes it easier to follow along with your
bullshit.

>    Fortunately, tablets and phones are undermining that idea.
>
Not enough to change things on the desktop though.

>    Whatever success Apple has had has been a net benefit for the entire
> market in this regard.
>
>>
>> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
>> was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
>> how to use computer and that's all.
>> Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
>> Windows or OS X.
>>
>>
>
>     If you are a pedestrian home user, then there is probably no need to
> be fixated with any particualar brand of desktop OS. They are in truth
> probably all equally interchangeable.
>
In many ways that is true.  And because of that you would think that
FOSS/Gnu/Linux would quit shooting themselves in the foot and gain some
marketshare.

>     Now I "use it harder" so MacOS is out. Windows it out just because it's
> a festering pile and I know too much about technology to tolerate it.
>
There's no evidence to support your knowledge about tech, and certainly
not business.



-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 1:41:15 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 08:11, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-16, Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Jun 2015 16:11:08 -0700
>> Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:41 PM, in article mlq8l7$kua$1@dont-email.me, "Peter
>>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
>>> >>>> the number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> SO
>>> >>> FUCKING
>>> >>> WHAT?
>>> >>
>>> >> Think about it this way.
>>> >> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>> >
>>> > Idiot
>>> >
>>> > It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>> >
>>> > Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows
>>> > anymore install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent
>>> > enough will switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to
>>> > not shit into the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>
>>> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have
>>> needs which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is
>>> refreshing to see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.
>
>    Nope. People just think they need the monopoly because they have
> predominantly thought that they need the monopoly. This goes all the
> way back to MS-DOS when things were much more proprietary and being
> part of the "right ecosystem" mattered much more.
>
>    Windows is not the "better option" for pretty much nearly nobody.
> Everyone is just so used to the Windows monopoly that they think they
> can't get along without it.
>
Can you number your excuses?  Makes it easier to follow along with your
bullshit.

>    Fortunately, tablets and phones are undermining that idea.
>
Not enough to change things on the desktop though.

>    Whatever success Apple has had has been a net benefit for the entire
> market in this regard.
>
>>
>> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop
>> was more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them
>> how to use computer and that's all.
>> Problems are dummies which want more but don't know how, therefore
>> Windows or OS X.
>>
>>
>
>     If you are a pedestrian home user, then there is probably no need to
> be fixated with any particualar brand of desktop OS. They are in truth
> probably all equally interchangeable.
>
In many ways that is true.  And because of that you would think that
FOSS/Gnu/Linux would quit shooting themselves in the foot and gain some
marketshare.

>     Now I "use it harder" so MacOS is out. Windows it out just because it's
> a festering pile and I know too much about technology to tolerate it.
>
There's no evidence to support your knowledge about tech, and certainly
not business.



-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 1:41:15 PM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>
> Hello, "Hadron".

So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
You people are crazy.

Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 1:52:01 PM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>> advocating Linux.
>
> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the desktop
> market.

It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
was associated with Redhat.
These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.

Name another person who has done more to bring Linux to the average
folk than Mark Shuttleworth.
RMS certainly doesn't qualify. If anything he scares people away from
Linux.

> Thanks for playing.  

I'm serious.
0
Humberto
6/17/2015 1:56:04 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>> advocating Linux.
>>
>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>> desktop market.
> 
> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
> was associated with Redhat.

Bullshit. There were several distros around then

> These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.

It is not just Ubuntu.
 
> Name another person who has done more to bring Linux to the average
> folk than Mark Shuttleworth.
> RMS certainly doesn't qualify. If anything he scares people away from
> Linux.

Again bullshit. Most linux users have never heard of him.
They just use linux. 
 
>> Thanks for playing.
> 
> I'm serious.

You do not even know what "serious" means
0
Peter
6/17/2015 2:01:08 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>
>> Hello, "Hadron".
> 
> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
> You people are crazy.

No, flatfish. You are stupid like Hadron Msg-ID Larry

> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?

And again an attempt to help that lying swine Snit Michael Glasser install 
yet another Snit circus
0
Peter
6/17/2015 2:02:27 PM
On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>
>> Hello, "Hadron".
>
> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
> You people are crazy.
>
> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>

They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive 
at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to 
the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so 
therefore we are all one or maybe two people.

0
Desk
6/17/2015 2:09:54 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 11:40, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Snit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Idiot
>>>>>
>>>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>>>>
>>>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>>>>
>>>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>>>> is not working.
>>>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>>>
>>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>>> ones who are correct.
>>>
>>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>>
>> I never said it was.
>> You have a reading comprehension problem.
>> It seems to be common in this froup.
>>
>>
>>>>> That's asinine.
>>>
>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>
>> Fact: 98 percent of computer users are using something other than Linux.
>> So if Windows users comprise even 85 percent of that number your
>> statement that the vast majority of users aren't intelligent is
>> ludicrous.
>>
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>> advocating Linux.
>>
>>
> Old Petey has never advocated anything.  Post after post of very
> negative comments and insults.  He sometimes throws in some asinine
> opinion that he tries to pass off as fact which is usually followed
> soon by someone handing him his ass as he is proven wrong.

I beginning to think I have stumbled upon the community room at the local
mental institution because some of these people appear to have
some serious issues when it comes to reality.

The anger and bitterness and petty word-smithing like iCultist and such
is rampant in this group. 

When I read that Linus Torvalds had made a statement that Linux zealots
are mentally ill, or something like that, it angered and upset me because
while not really a zealot, I have been a Linux user since 1997.

After spending a few days in this group I fully understand what type of
people Linus was referring to and he is spot on.

And what is really tragic is that the premise of GNU/Linux/Open Source
is built upon is freedom, sharing, low cost/free software along with
a community that supports that model.

The people in this group are none of those.
Not even close.
And the people who have different ideas, do try to discuss Linux vs
other operating systems, in line with the charter of this group, are
immediately attacked and branded as trolls.

Snit is 100 percent correct. I don't think any of you are capable of
honestly and truthfully discussing Linux.

I've seen exactly 2 posts advocating Linux, aside from my own, and both
came from vallor. His listing his known to work with Linux hardware
was a great post and I actually did learn from it in that I looked
up that AMD processor and surprisingly discovered it compares extremely
well to the higher priced Intel competitors, for gaming. That came as a surprise
to me.

Anyhow, the hate, bitterness and paranoia have clouded your judgment to the level
where you have actually become an embarrassment to those who are
interested in seeing Linux improve.

Like I've already stated, the problem isn't Linux it's the community
and not the entire community but enough bad apples like COLA seems to
have to spoil the rest of the good apples.

 


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:11:48 PM
On 2015-06-17, William Poaster <wp@dev.null> wrote:

> And secondly, the vast majority of windows users couldn't even install  
> *any* OS on their computers, which is why they take it to a shop.

That's no longer a true statement and in particular Linux is easier
to install than Windows is especially when considering having
to install applications and updates as well.
It's certainly less time consuming.


> Also, it's *quite* likely they have NO idea that there *are* other OSs they
>  could use.

You might be surprised how many average people have heard of Linux.
It's more than you think.
This is especially true for younger people.


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:16:48 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 12:06, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>>> to pay for their OS.
>>>
>>> Idiot
>>>
>>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
>>>
>>> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael
>>> Glasser
>>
>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>> Most, by far, don't.
>> Why is that?
>>
>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>> people like you.
>>
> And unfortunately, even in the supposed Linux support forums, bitter
> and vile postings similar to what you see here are all too common.
> That doesn't make someone feel warm and fuzzy about switching.

No it doesn't.
One other fact, COLA has the most traffic of any of the Linux groups
I am aware of so it's most likely to appear at the top of typical
what's Linux about Google searches.

Is there anything positive that a new or potential Linux user can read
here?

COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
than COLA does.



0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:22:04 PM
On 17/06/2015 15:01, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>
>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>> desktop market.
>>
>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>> was associated with Redhat.
>
> Bullshit. There were several distros around then

Well of course there were, that's not what was said and your reading 
comprehension failure has made you look a twat again.

>
>> These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.
>
> It is not just Ubuntu.

Comprehension failure again.


0
Desk
6/17/2015 2:25:43 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 07:56, chrisv wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>>But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>>Most, by far, don't.
>>>Why is that?
>>>
>>>The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>>to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>>
>>>The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>>people like you.
>>
>> *plonk* goes the troll
>>
>> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
>> the desktop.
>>
> Yep, it is obvious.  They have a consistent product with excellent
> marketing skills.

They also have a community that is helpful to users and doesn't talk
down to them or act like little children throwing temper tantrums.

Take a look at the Windows 10 groups.
See anything like COLA?
Of course not.
One group has a couple of Linux users in it and they try, tactfully I
will say, to convert people to Linux. The regulars engage in dialog with
them and very little mud slinging happens.

Completely unlike this cesspit.

>> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
>> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
>>
> That's a fair assessment, it is difficult to expand and grow in an
> established market unless the market leader fumbles the ball.  So far,
> MS hasn't done that enough.

I disagree.
Windows XP, prior to SP2, Windows ME, Windows Vista, Windows 8 all were
fumbles. Yes they recovered, eventually, but these were golden opportunities
where the Linux community could have capitalize and didn't.

And that goes right back to a lack of leadership and a focused direction.

>> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
>> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
>> the circumstances.
>>
> The "FOSS community" is the problem.  I have no doubt that overall they
> feel that they are doing all they can, but the problem is they lack
> business sense and how to package and market a product in order to
> expand.

You get it Lloyd.
They need a leader with a vision willing to lead instead someone who
looks like he is homeless and wanders the globe preaching to the choir.
Add in his extremist views, which even much of the hardcore Linux
community do not agree with, and it's already set up to fail.


> They feel that the many distros is a plus for a marketable product,
> when it actually is a big detriment.

Read up on the paradox of choice.

>  To the market at large, the
> various distros represent confusion and lack of a consistent marketing
> effort.  To the geek market Linux on the desktop is a viable product
> because it allows them to enjoy playing with the OS, and that isn't
> something that the business or consumer markets are interested in at
> all.  And unfortunately for them, the geeks represent a miniscule part
> of the market and not even a very profitable one at that.

I believe choice is good but at the commercial level Linux needs to
present a consistent model instead of a hodgepodge of different
versions.
I am against limiting choice, but it can't work both ways.
The Linux community needs to unite behind a single product at some point
and that requires leadership.

Or things can continue to remain as they are and Microsoft with Windows 10
will continue to gain users while Linux remains stagnant.


> You just have to look at where Linux has been successful to see if you
> are not blind.
> 1.  Chromebooks - hiding Linux behind a browser has worked commercially
> though not gaining a huge marketshare, but producing some profits for
> the producers.

Yep.

> 2.  Android - presenting a consistent front end while hiding the Linux
> underpinning has proven very successful.
> 3.  Embedded systems - you don't see the OS, you don't directly
> interact with it and it works and sells.
> 4.  Servers - the big strength of Linux and it has been successful,
> both commercially and for the hobbyists.
>
> The kiss of death for Linux desktop isn't that MS owns the market, it
> is that there is no consistency in appearance or operation and doesn't
> have a good marketing message.  As long as the geeks and hobbyists are
> in charge of getting Linux on the desktop, it will fail time and again,
> just as it has these many years.

That is a truth.

>> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
>> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
>> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>>
> And that right there tells you all you need to know about the business
> sense of FOSS and GNU/Linux in a nutshell.  Total amateur hour if there
> ever was one.  The 'free' market isn't a market at all.

Funny how in one thread where I mention market I get attacked by the
very same people who use the term to describe what really doesn't
exist at all.
There is no free' market.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:34:21 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 14:12, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>> On 17 Jun 2015 07:56, chrisv wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>>> Most, by far, don't.
>>>> Why is that?
>>>>
>>>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>>>
>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>>> people like you.
>>>
>>> *plonk* goes the troll
>>>
>>> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
>>> the desktop.
>>>
>> Yep, it is obvious.  They have a consistent product with excellent
>> marketing skills.
>>
>>> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
>>> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
>>>
>> That's a fair assessment, it is difficult to expand and grow in an
>> established market unless the market leader fumbles the ball.  So far,
>> MS hasn't done that enough.
>>
>>> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
>>> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
>>> the circumstances.
>>>
>> The "FOSS community" is the problem.  I have no doubt that overall they
>> feel that they are doing all they can, but the problem is they lack
>> business sense and how to package and market a product in order to
>> expand.
>>
>> They feel that the many distros is a plus for a marketable product,
>> when it actually is a big detriment.  To the market at large, the
>> various distros represent confusion and lack of a consistent marketing
>> effort.  To the geek market Linux on the desktop is a viable product
>> because it allows them to enjoy playing with the OS, and that isn't
>> something that the business or consumer markets are interested in at
>> all.  And unfortunately for them, the geeks represent a miniscule part
>> of the market and not even a very profitable one at that.
>>
>> You just have to look at where Linux has been successful to see if you
>> are not blind.
>> 1.  Chromebooks - hiding Linux behind a browser has worked commercially
>> though not gaining a huge marketshare, but producing some profits for
>> the producers.
>> 2.  Android - presenting a consistent front end while hiding the Linux
>> underpinning has proven very successful.
>> 3.  Embedded systems - you don't see the OS, you don't directly
>> interact with it and it works and sells.
>> 4.  Servers - the big strength of Linux and it has been successful,
>> both commercially and for the hobbyists.
>>
>> The kiss of death for Linux desktop isn't that MS owns the market, it
>> is that there is no consistency in appearance or operation and doesn't
>> have a good marketing message.  As long as the geeks and hobbyists are
>> in charge of getting Linux on the desktop, it will fail time and again,
>> just as it has these many years.
>>
>>> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
>>> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
>>> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>>>
>> And that right there tells you all you need to know about the business
>> sense of FOSS and GNU/Linux in a nutshell.  Total amateur hour if there
>> ever was one.  The 'free' market isn't a market at all.
>>
>>
>
> You've taken a hammer and hit the nail firmly and squarely on the head.

Yes he has.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:35:00 PM
On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Snit wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>> 
>
> [deletia]
>
>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>> 
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
>
>    Americans will happily eat dirt. That's why Detroit is still in business
> and McDonalds is the fast food juggernaut it is.
>
>    Fortunately, in a genuinely free market it is quite possible for the 2%
> option to not merely survive but to thrive. 

There you go again making assumptions.
I said nothing about America.
Linux is a worldwide product.

This is why when I read your posts I am confused.
You seem to be reading and replying to completely different
posts than the rest of us.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 2:37:44 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>
>> Hello, "Hadron".
>
> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
> You people are crazy.
>
> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?

Kiss off, troll.

-- 
The Least Successful Police Dogs
	America has a very strong candidate in "La Dur", a fearsome looking
schnauzer hound, who was retired from the Orlando police force in Florida
in 1978.  He consistently refused to do anything which might ruffle or
offend the criminal classes.
	His handling officer, Rick Grim, had to admit: "He just won't go up
and bite them.  I got sick and tired of doing that dog's work for him."
	The British contenders in this category, however, took things a
stage further.  "Laddie" and "Boy" were trained as detector dogs for drug
raids.  Their employment was terminated following a raid in the Midlands in
1967.
	While the investigating officer questioned two suspects, they
patted and stroked the dogs who eventually fell asleep in front of the
fire.  When the officer moved to arrest the suspects, one dog growled at
him while the other leapt up and bit his thigh.
		-- Stephen Pile, "The Book of Heroic Failures"
0
Chris
6/17/2015 2:41:02 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
> than COLA does.

Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
"Humberto"?

-- 
Substance
 
Too much colour blinds the eye,
Too much music deafens the ear,
Too much taste dulls the palate,
Too much play maddens the mind,
Too much desire tears the heart.
In this manner the sage cares for people:
He provides for the belly, not for the senses;
He ignores abstraction and holds fast to substance.
		-- Lao Tse, "Tao Te Ching"
0
Chris
6/17/2015 2:43:35 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

>

Idiot.

-- 
MARTA SAYS THE INTERESTING thing about fly-fishing is that it's two lives
connected by a thin strand.
 
Come on, Marta, grow up.
		-- Jack Handey, The New Mexican, 1988.
0
Chris
6/17/2015 2:44:26 PM
chrisv wrote:

>The result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.

Obviously, some regulation is required, to discourage things like
excessive pollution, fraud, anti-competitive behavior, etc.

-- 
"As Snit said, it's astonishing how little the COLA freetards actually
know and understand about the GPL."  -  "True Linux advocate" Hadron
Quark
0
chrisv
6/17/2015 3:09:24 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>
>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>
>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>> You people are crazy.
>>
>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>
>
> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive 
> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to 
> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so 
> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.

It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
to be about free choice, openness and freedom. 

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:12:31 PM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>
>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>
>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>> You people are crazy.
>>
>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>
> Kiss off, troll.

And another sheep has been born.
I've never heard of the Linux community being referred to as a herd
before but at least in this news froup the description really fits.

I would say they are more like lemmings but herd is a good one.
0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:15:15 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>
>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>> desktop market.
>> 
>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>> was associated with Redhat.
>
> Bullshit. There were several distros around then

I never said there wasn't.
Pay attention.
The WORD LINUX was associated with Redhat because they had a big
presence in the Linux world back then.


>> These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.
>
> It is not just Ubuntu.

Of course not.
Ask an average person what they know about Linux and I will 
almost guarantee that they will mention Ubuntu.


>> Name another person who has done more to bring Linux to the average
>> folk than Mark Shuttleworth.
>> RMS certainly doesn't qualify. If anything he scares people away from
>> Linux.
>
> Again bullshit. Most linux users have never heard of him.
> They just use linux. 

Better that they haven't. 
lol.

Anyway, that just goes to prove my point that he is in ineffective
leader.

  
>>> Thanks for playing.
>> 
>> I'm serious.
>
> You do not even know what "serious" means

And you have a reading comprehension problem.


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:18:45 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 15:01, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>> desktop market.
>>>
>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>
>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>
> Well of course there were, that's not what was said and your reading 
> comprehension failure has made you look a twat again.

I'm convinced I have stumbled into the community room at the local
insane asylum.

These people can't be this ignorant.
They have to be trolling.

>>> These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.
>>
>> It is not just Ubuntu.
>
> Comprehension failure again.

Yep.
Peter Kohlmann fails again.

Sooner or later he's bound to be right about something.
Just by the law of averages it has to happen.
I'll keep my eye out for when it happens.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:21:11 PM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>>
>
> Idiot.

Buh bye?
What does that mean?
Are you going somewhere?
Hopefully it's sunny and warm.
0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:22:40 PM
On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>> than COLA does.
>
> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
> "Humberto"?

Pitch invaders?
WTF is that?

I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
Why are you here?

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:24:35 PM
On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>
>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>
>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>> You people are crazy.
>>>
>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>
>>
>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>
> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>

Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and 
important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat 
other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 3:32:00 PM
On 17/06/2015 15:44, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>>
>
> Idiot.
>

Translation: I've lost the argument, I cannot advocate Linux and my 
insults have had no effect.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 3:34:23 PM
On 17/06/2015 16:24, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>> than COLA does.
>>
>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>> "Humberto"?
>
> Pitch invaders?
> WTF is that?
>
> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
> Why are you here?
>

He's here because he failed the village idiot entrance exam.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 3:35:35 PM
On 6/17/15, 8:15 AM, in article mls2u2$cip$2@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>> 
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>> 
>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>> 
>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>> 
>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>> You people are crazy.
>>> 
>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>> 
>> Kiss off, troll.
> 
> And another sheep has been born.
> I've never heard of the Linux community being referred to as a herd
> before but at least in this news froup the description really fits.
> 
> I would say they are more like lemmings but herd is a good one.

To be clear: I do not refer to the Linux community as a herd. I refer to the
cult-like group in COLA as a herd... and it has nothing to do with different
people coming to the same conclusions, it is about them irrationally backing
each other and sharing unsupported and even demonstrably wrong claims. I
have been very clear on some of these views. From a previous post:

---------------------------------------------------------------
I have been very specific as to what I mean by the "advocate" herd. It is a
group of people who, with little exception, believe or at least refuse to
question these unsupported or even clearly incorrect claims:

* MS has secret deals to stop OEMs from selling Linux pre-installed.
* Apple claims to have invented the "rounded rectangle".
* Desktop Linux serves people as well as the competition.
* Apple never innovated anything.
* Samsung has not been copying Apple's products.
* Apple and MS are struggling / dying companies.
* MS has a monopoly on the desktop.
* Snit is anti-choice (as are others they accuse).
* Snit is anti-Linux (as are others they accuse).
* Snit uses sock puppets (as do others they accuse).
* Stallman's views on kids and sexuality are fine.
* Stallman's doubletalk about "Freedom" is coherent and makes sense.
* MS is evil to have blocked Linux years ago, but Google is fine to
  block Aliyun OS *now*.
* When an organization moves to a Linux based product it is always a
  good move. When they move away from one it is always a bad move.
* Even though some herd members post membership lists of who is in
  the herd, all herd members deny the herd even exists.
* If you recognize there are downsides to massive amounts of distros,
  then you must want to be told how to use it and believe everyone
  feels the same way.
* You must deny that Android has joined Windows as an OS where user
  are at a significant risk of getting malware. Often tied to a
  baseless claim that iOS and OS X users are at equal risk to
  Android users.

While there have been some of those points which have been questions by some
of the COLA "advocates", the level of agreement on these irrational and
unsupportable claims is very high. Group consensus is not what determines
truth or who is right or wrong... people's own actions show if they can back
their claims. And when a whole group make the *same* fairly large set of
irrational claims they are showing themselves to be herd-like or
cult-like... or at best just completely irrational and followers of each
other (some, of course, being more prone to following than others).

Now if you choose to align yourself with such a cult-like group and then
find it "insulting" that others merely note you do, that is your issue.

Meanwhile we have RonB babbling about his "iCultists", a group of imaginary
friends he has but he sometimes tries to imply *I* am one of his imaginary
friends (he really should seek mental health care). He refuses, though, to
say what these "iCultists" do other than somehow work to make Linux be like
OS X (though he never really says how... maybe by joining the Linux
Foundation and wanting more consistent dialogs and the like?) and his
obsession with worshipping a logo.

Just weird. Maybe he does it just to try to obfuscate his own herd
affiliation.
---------------------------------------------------------------


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 3:40:04 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>> than COLA does.
>>
>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>> "Humberto"?
> 
> Pitch invaders?
> WTF is that?

Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing

> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.

How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that 
come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?

> Why are you here?

Advocating linux might be one reason
0
Peter
6/17/2015 3:40:16 PM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 15:44, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>>
>>
>> Idiot.
>>
> 
> Translation: I've lost the argument, I cannot advocate Linux and my
> insults have had no effect.

Much too wordy.
If one wants to describe you lunatic lying dimbulbs with a short word which 
exactly describes what you really are one would use a perfectly fitting one:

Idiot
0
Peter
6/17/2015 3:41:33 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:

>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>
>
> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and 
> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat 
> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.

There must be something in the water.
People this insane don't just "find" each other.
Or maybe they do?

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:41:50 PM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>
>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>
>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>
>>>
>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>
>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>
> 
> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.

Now, now.
I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy 
scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
0
Peter
6/17/2015 3:43:03 PM
On 2015-06-17, Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> On 6/17/15, 8:15 AM, in article mls2u2$cip$2@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
><hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>> 
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>> 
>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>> 
>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>> 
>>> Kiss off, troll.
>> 
>> And another sheep has been born.
>> I've never heard of the Linux community being referred to as a herd
>> before but at least in this news froup the description really fits.
>> 
>> I would say they are more like lemmings but herd is a good one.
>
> To be clear: I do not refer to the Linux community as a herd. I refer to the
> cult-like group in COLA as a herd... and it has nothing to do with different
> people coming to the same conclusions, it is about them irrationally backing
> each other and sharing unsupported and even demonstrably wrong claims. I
> have been very clear on some of these views. From a previous post:

Aye.
That's what I mean.
COLA. Not the Linux community as a whole although there are of course
some nasty people there as well.

>
>
0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:43:34 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:24, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>> than COLA does.
>>>
>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>> "Humberto"?
>>
>> Pitch invaders?
>> WTF is that?
>>
>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>> Why are you here?
>>
>
> He's here because he failed the village idiot entrance exam.

Could get the square peg in the round hole now could he?

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:44:55 PM
Peter Köhlmann wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>> than COLA does.
>>>
>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>> "Humberto"?
>> 
>> Pitch invaders?
>> WTF is that?
>
> Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
> Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing
>
>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>
> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that 
> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?
>
>> Why are you here?
>
> Advocating linux might be one reason

It's the same old gambit over and over and over again.
"Humberto" is just another in the long line of trolls here.

-- 
"I got a question for ya.  Ya got a minute?"
		-- two programmers passing in the hall
0
Chris
6/17/2015 3:47:34 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>> than COLA does.
>>>
>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>> "Humberto"?
>> 
>> Pitch invaders?
>> WTF is that?
>
> Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
> Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing

I'm not invading anything and I'm not a troll.
Last time I checked, this is an open group.
I also post in Google + groups but the Linux ones are mostly
cemeteries. No traffic.


>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>
> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that 
> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?

Jeremy at Walmart?
Ok, I'll bite. What's the story behind this one?


>> Why are you here?
>
> Advocating linux might be one reason

Hs/she fooled me. I don't see any Linux advocacy from him/her.
All I see is agreeing with others who aren't advocating Linux either.


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 3:48:29 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>
>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>> desktop market.
>> 
>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>> was associated with Redhat.
>
> Bullshit. There were several distros around then

    Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long then
he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is his
own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire trollish rant.

>
>> These days it's Ubuntu and a lot of people have heard of Ubuntu.
>
> It is not just Ubuntu.
>  
>> Name another person who has done more to bring Linux to the average
>> folk than Mark Shuttleworth.

    Everyone that works on the upstream projects that Mark takes advantage of.

    Also, Canonical is not the beginning and end of efforts to create a version
of Linux that conforms to some fantasy of how well Windows works. Attempts to 
creat such a thing go back to Redhat and have continued with intervening projects
and successors to Ubuntu. Mark has tried to create a "Linux desktop brand". Beyond
that, he hasn't done much real work.

    My first true PnP experience in Linux was with Mandrake taking advantage of a 
Redhat authored subsystem. Even that was mostly enabled by the advent of true PnP
hardware for the PC.

-- 
	Nothing quite gives you an understanding of Oracle's         |||
	continued popularity as does an attempt to do some          / | \ 
	simple date manipulations in postgres.
0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 4:13:33 PM
On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>
>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>
>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>
>>
>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
>
> Now, now.
> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy
> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>

You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy, 
no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 4:14:18 PM
On 17/06/2015 16:41, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 15:44, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Idiot.
>>>
>>
>> Translation: I've lost the argument, I cannot advocate Linux and my
>> insults have had no effect.
>
> Much too wordy.
> If one wants to describe you lunatic lying dimbulbs with a short word which
> exactly describes what you really are one would use a perfectly fitting one:
>
> Idiot
>

Reading/comprehension failure again.

I'm beginning to see why you are wrong all the time and make such 
asinine comments.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 4:16:04 PM
On 2015-06-17, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> chrisv wrote:
>
>>The result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>
> Obviously, some regulation is required, to discourage things like
> excessive pollution, fraud, anti-competitive behavior, etc.
>

    It's like what the GPL enforces, a sort of "rule of law" and a level
playing field where the small fry can keep what they catch because the
system isn't totally corrupted in favor of oligarchs.

    Business needs the rule of law to function so that there is some degree
of trust and predictability. People need to be confident that they can make
a buck and keep it and not have it stolen from them. Total anarchy won't do
for this.

-- 
	Nothing quite gives you an understanding of Oracle's         |||
	continued popularity as does an attempt to do some          / | \ 
	simple date manipulations in postgres.
0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 4:16:32 PM
On 17/06/2015 16:44, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 16:24, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>>> than COLA does.
>>>>
>>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>>> "Humberto"?
>>>
>>> Pitch invaders?
>>> WTF is that?
>>>
>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>>> Why are you here?
>>>
>>
>> He's here because he failed the village idiot entrance exam.
>
> Could get the square peg in the round hole now could he?
>

No, the exam was in the village he lives in but he got lost getting out 
the front door.
0
Desk
6/17/2015 4:17:02 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
..com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>
>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
>>
>> Now, now.
>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy
>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>
>
> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy, 
> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.

They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations than
they do advocating Linux.
Insane.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 4:19:14 PM
On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:41, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 15:44, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Idiot.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Translation: I've lost the argument, I cannot advocate Linux and my
>>> insults have had no effect.
>>
>> Much too wordy.
>> If one wants to describe you lunatic lying dimbulbs with a short word which
>> exactly describes what you really are one would use a perfectly fitting one:
>>
>> Idiot
>>
>
> Reading/comprehension failure again.
>
> I'm beginning to see why you are wrong all the time and make such 
> asinine comments.

It must be rough being wrong all the time.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 4:33:37 PM
On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>> desktop market.
>>> 
>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>
>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>
>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long then
> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is his
> own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire trollish rant.

More baseless accusations.

Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
with Redhat.

I see you have reading comprehension problems as well.
Seems to be going around this group these days.
Kind of like the flu.





0
Humberto
6/17/2015 4:37:47 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
> .com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
>>>
>>> Now, now.
>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy
>>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>
>>
>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy,
>> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>
> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations than
> they do advocating Linux.
> Insane.
>
>
Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will be
The last they look at Linux.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 4:47:31 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
>>>>
>>>> Now, now.
>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy
>>>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>
>>>
>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy,
>>> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>
>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations than
>> they do advocating Linux.
>> Insane.
>>
>>
> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will be
> The last they look at Linux.

This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on USENET.
I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from Linux
help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of them.



0
Humberto
6/17/2015 4:58:17 PM
On 6/17/15, 8:09 AM, in article hj23oa13ubl3rnlnbdghgvae28hv8oclru@4ax.com,
"chrisv" <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> chrisv wrote:
> 
>> The result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
> 
> Obviously, some regulation is required, to discourage things like
> excessive pollution, fraud, anti-competitive behavior, etc.

Agreed.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 5:48:21 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>> desktop market.
>>>> 
>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>
>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>
>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>     then
>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>> trollish rant.
> 
> More baseless accusations.
> 
> Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
> with Redhat.

Idiot. I started before that, and I did it with Slackware. Then Debian. Then 
Suse.
RedHat in any form did I use only much later as "Fedora".

Many linux users had similar experiences. And RedHat was *not* selected most 
of the time because it was always behind the current development. Especially 
at that time it was mostly an advantage if you selected a bleeding edge 
distro. That is much less true now

By simply claiming and repeating nonsense you will not make it true
0
Peter
6/17/2015 5:54:28 PM
On 6/17/15, 7:22 AM, in article mlrvqc$tav$3@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>> On 17 Jun 2015 12:06, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>>>> to pay for their OS.
>>>> 
>>>> Idiot
>>>> 
>>>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
>>>> 
>>>> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit
>>>> Michael
>>>> Glasser
>>> 
>>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>> Most, by far, don't.
>>> Why is that?
>>> 
>>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>> 
>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>> people like you.
>>> 
>> And unfortunately, even in the supposed Linux support forums, bitter
>> and vile postings similar to what you see here are all too common.
>> That doesn't make someone feel warm and fuzzy about switching.
> 
> No it doesn't.
> One other fact, COLA has the most traffic of any of the Linux groups
> I am aware of so it's most likely to appear at the top of typical
> what's Linux about Google searches.
> 
> Is there anything positive that a new or potential Linux user can read
> here?
> 
> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
> than COLA does.
> 
> 
> 
I would *love* to see an actual focus on Linux and how it compares to the
competition. My personal focus (and Torvald's) is the desktop... but of
course others may have different views. That is fine.

But, heck, who in COLA has done even half as much as I have to help the open
source ecosystem? <https://goo.gl/4GKaP9>


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 7:12:24 PM
chrisv wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>>But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>Most, by far, don't.
>>Why is that?
>>
>>The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>
>>The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>people like you.
> 
> *plonk* goes the troll
> 
> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
> the desktop.
> 
> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
> 
> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
> the circumstances.
> 
> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
> 

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:12:28 PM
chrisv wrote:

> chrisv wrote:
> 
>>The result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
> 
> Obviously, some regulation is required, to discourage things like
> excessive pollution, fraud, anti-competitive behavior, etc.
> 

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:12:52 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>>> than COLA does.
>>>>
>>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>>> "Humberto"?
>>> 
>>> Pitch invaders?
>>> WTF is that?
>>
>> Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
>> Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing
> 
> I'm not invading anything and I'm not a troll.
> Last time I checked, this is an open group.
> I also post in Google + groups but the Linux ones are mostly
> cemeteries. No traffic.
> 

I wonder why?  LOL!!!

> 
>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>>
>> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that
>> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?
> 
> Jeremy at Walmart?
> Ok, I'll bite. What's the story behind this one?
> 
> 
>>> Why are you here?
>>
>> Advocating linux might be one reason
> 
> Hs/she fooled me. I don't see any Linux advocacy from him/her.
> All I see is agreeing with others who aren't advocating Linux either.

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:15:32 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> Peter Köhlmann wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
> 
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>>> than COLA does.
>>>>
>>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>>> "Humberto"?
>>> 
>>> Pitch invaders?
>>> WTF is that?
>>
>> Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
>> Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing
>>
>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>>
>> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that
>> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?
>>
>>> Why are you here?
>>
>> Advocating linux might be one reason
> 
> It's the same old gambit over and over and over again.
> "Humberto" is just another in the long line of trolls here.
> 

Well, you sure have been here for way over a decade now, eh LinTroll.


0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:16:08 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>
>>>>
>>> 
>>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one
>>> PC?
>>
>> How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a
>> machine?
>> Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit
> 
> It doesn't matter if it's being downloaded by the billions. The fact is
> just about every web counter has Linux at somewhere around 2 percent.
> So either this is some huge conspiracy or it's "Houston, we have a
> problem" time.
> My opinion is, it's the latter and the lack of leadership, focus and
> the attitude of the Linux community in general is to blame.
> And this group is the poster child for that statement.

I think the best thing to do is for all of us to leave these so-called 
advocates here to talk to themselves.  Watch them get bored and start eating 
on each other after a week or so.  It's also not worth talking to low IQ 
morons like these advocates.  Some are so low IQed that they don't know how 
to answer a simple question, let alone reading correctly.

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:20:42 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
> 
>>
> 
> Idiot.
> 

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:23:28 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>
>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>> 
>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>
>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>
>>>> [deletia]
>>> 
>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>> 
>>> No one cares anymore.
>>> 
>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>
>> LOL!!!
> 
> Who is shilling for Windows?
> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.

I don't need to shill anything.  What the adovocates fail to see are 
suggestions and recommendations.  I still say to boycott cola and then stand 
back and watch them eat their own.

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:25:34 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
> 
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>
>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>
>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>
>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>> You people are crazy.
>>
>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
> 
> Kiss off, troll.
> 

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:26:15 PM
On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>
>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>> far
>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>> are an
>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>
>>>
>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>
>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>
>> SO
>> FUCKING
>> WHAT?
>>
> 
> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
> to pay for their OS.

Okay, so go on -- what about it?

-- 
 -v

Pardon this fortune.  Database under reconstruction.

0
vallor
6/17/2015 7:28:11 PM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects
>>>>>>>>>> royalties:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien
>>>>>>>> concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it is not
>>>>>>>> possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is
>>>>>>> supposed to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior
>>>>>> and important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to
>>>>>> treat other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on
>>>>>> your shoe.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, now.
>>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>>> filthy scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux
>>>> advocacy, no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>>
>>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations
>>> than they do advocating Linux.
>>> Insane.
>>>
>>>
>> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
>> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will
>> be The last they look at Linux.
> 
> This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on
> USENET. I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from Linux
> help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of them.

These nuts also infest some of the linux help forums.  Even there they spew 
their insults and their vitriol.

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:28:17 PM
Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>
>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>
>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>
>>>>> [deletia]
>>>> 
>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>> 
>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>> 
>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>
>>> LOL!!!
>> 
>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
> 
> This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
> You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat

You don't even know who is posting.  Put the booze back in the cabinet.
LOL!!!

0
GreyCloud
6/17/2015 7:29:13 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 13:28, GreyCloud wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>>> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>>>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects
>>>>>>>>>>> royalties:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien
>>>>>>>>> concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it is not
>>>>>>>>> possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is
>>>>>>>> supposed to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior
>>>>>>> and important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to
>>>>>>> treat other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on
>>>>>>> your shoe.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now, now.
>>>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>>>> filthy scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux
>>>>> advocacy, no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>>>
>>>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations
>>>> than they do advocating Linux.
>>>> Insane.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
>>> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will
>>> be The last they look at Linux.
>>
>> This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on
>> USENET. I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from Linux
>> help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of them.
>
> These nuts also infest some of the linux help forums.  Even there they spew
> their insults and their vitriol.
>
>
That's also not much different from the support forums at the various
distro sites unfortunately.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 7:29:57 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 12:28, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.
>
> Okay, so go on -- what about it?
>
And that's a proper question for one who must want Linux desktop to remain
A hobbyist tool.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 7:30:55 PM
On 06/17/2015 08:44 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 16:24, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>>> than COLA does.
>>>>
>>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>>> "Humberto"?
>>>
>>> Pitch invaders?
>>> WTF is that?
>>>
>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>>> Why are you here?
>>>
>>
>> He's here because he failed the village idiot entrance exam.
> 
> Could get the square peg in the round hole now could he?
> 

Another showing of the hand.

According to "Humberto":  If someone pro-Linux responds to an insult
with an insult, that's "dragging [us] down into the cesspool".

But if a Linux-hater makes an insult out of the blue, that's all just
fine and dandy by Humbug, and he'll just pile on.

This is the same guy that said he wanted to see the FSF "disbanded".

It's not hard to see what the guy is up to.

-- 
 -v

The best way to preserve a right is to exercise it, and the right to
smoke is a right worth dying for.

0
vallor
6/17/2015 7:35:28 PM
On 06/17/2015 05:56 AM, chrisv wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>> Most, by far, don't.
>> Why is that?
>>
>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>> people like you. 
> 
> *plonk* goes the troll
> 
> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
> the desktop.
> 
> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
> 
> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
> the circumstances.
> 
> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
> 

As usual, your sense of how capitalism works (or is supposed to work) is
spot-on, and I always appreciate reading your views.

During the 19th and 20th centuries, we learned that a purely
laissez-faire market can get lopsided, ending up with trusts and
companies with monopoly power, which is often abused.  In other words: a
_free_ market is not necessarily a _fair_ market.

The solution was regulation, including anti-trust regulation, which now
often suffers from the problem of "regulatory capture".

This isn't new or controversial, but for some reason, people get amnesia
about it when we start talking about one company having a large chunk of
the OS and software market on commodity hardware.  (It's also the case
for telecomm companies in a lot of markets, and I'll fill your ear with
how screwed up that is, if you want to hear it.)

Meanwhile, you'll find people who (apparently) just can't see computing
as anything else but a retail, desktop, enterprise.  (Or at least, they
pretend that is the case -- who knows if that is sincere?)  They are the
ones who say Linux is a quote "dismal failure" unquote, despite the vast
amounts of evidence to the contrary.

-- 
 -v

The large majority of the computers at our company run Linux.

0
vallor
6/17/2015 7:49:15 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 12:49, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 05:56 AM, chrisv wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>> Most, by far, don't.
>>> Why is that?
>>>
>>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>>
>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>> people like you.
>>
>> *plonk* goes the troll
>>
>> As if everyone here doesn't know how and why M$ continues to dominate
>> the desktop.
>>
>> As if everyone doesn't understand the "chicken and egg" problem that
>> "obscure alternatives" face in these kinds of markets.
>>
>> As if everyone here (with a brain) doesn't know that the FOSS
>> community is doing the best it can, doing everything it should, under
>> the circumstances.
>>
>> The GNU/Linux subset of the market is free and healthy.  It does not
>> require bickering committees and dictators to implement "plans".  The
>> result of a healthy free market cannot be improved-upon.
>>
>
> As usual, your sense of how capitalism works (or is supposed to work) is
> spot-on, and I always appreciate reading your views.
>
Utter horseshit!  He has no clue and if you agree with his view on how
Capitalism works, you don't either.

There is and has been a place for Linux desktop for many years.  The lack
Of any real business acumen by the Linux crowd with their multitude of
Destroys is a huge reason that Linux desktop languishes.  It can't beat MS
At its own game, and they aren't smart enough to compete in a smaller
niche profitably as Apple has done.

> During the 19th and 20th centuries, we learned that a purely
> laissez-faire market can get lopsided, ending up with trusts and
> companies with monopoly power, which is often abused.  In other words: a
> _free_ market is not necessarily a _fair_ market.
>
> The solution was regulation, including anti-trust regulation, which now
> often suffers from the problem of "regulatory capture".
>
> This isn't new or controversial, but for some reason, people get amnesia
> about it when we start talking about one company having a large chunk of
> the OS and software market on commodity hardware.  (It's also the case
> for telecomm companies in a lot of markets, and I'll fill your ear with
> how screwed up that is, if you want to hear it.)
>
> Meanwhile, you'll find people who (apparently) just can't see computing
> as anything else but a retail, desktop, enterprise.  (Or at least, they
> pretend that is the case -- who knows if that is sincere?)  They are the
> ones who say Linux is a quote "dismal failure" unquote, despite the vast
> amounts of evidence to the contrary.
>
You fail to understand that the server, desktop, embedded and other
markets are distinct markets with different forces at play.  In all but
the desktop, Linux has done very well.

It is only on the desktop that Linux is an abject failure.  No market
share, little or no profits and no reason for any mfg to offer a
desktop/laptop with it preloaded.  And until that becomes viable from a
Business perspective, Linux desktop will remain a hobby.  And those things
Will never happen with the current leaders in the Linux world.



-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 8:15:07 PM
On 06/17/2015 08:32 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>
>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>
>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>
>>>
>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>
>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>
> 
> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.

You mean like you responding to Chris' comment about pitched battles
with your "village idiot" nonsense?

-- 
 -v

	One day it was announced that the young monk Kyogen had reached
an enlightened state.  Much impressed by this news, several of his peers
went to speak with him.
	"We have heard that you are enlightened.  Is this true?" his fellow
students inquired.
	"It is", Kyogen answered.
	"Tell us", said a friend, "how do you feel?"
	"As miserable as ever", replied the enlightened Kyogen.

0
vallor
6/17/2015 8:15:41 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>
>>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>     then
>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>> trollish rant.
>> 
>> More baseless accusations.
>> 
>> Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
>> with Redhat.
>
> Idiot. I started before that, and I did it with Slackware. Then Debian. Then 
> Suse.
> RedHat in any form did I use only much later as "Fedora".

Good for you.
I'm talking full time.
I haven't used Windows for my own PC since 1997.

> Many linux users had similar experiences. And RedHat was *not* selected most 
> of the time because it was always behind the current development. Especially 
> at that time it was mostly an advantage if you selected a bleeding edge 
> distro. That is much less true now

Again your lack of reading comprehension skills get the best of you.
I never claimed Redhat was selected most of the time.

Is every Linux advocate in this group retarded?
This is a serious question because it seems none of you are able to
read at an 8th grade level which is approximately the level at which
I am dumbing down my posts to.


> By simply claiming and repeating nonsense you will not make it true

It is true.

Think of it this way, when someone mentions fast food what resteraunt
is probably going to be mentioned?
McDonald's.

When someone mentions a French car what brand is likeley to be mentioned?
Renault.

When someone mentions a high quality car what car is likely to be mentioned?
Rolls Royce.

Are you getting this yet?

It has *nothing* to do with other versions of Linux being around.
It has everything to do with the fact that at that time the Linux "brand"
was associated with Redhat. And that's a fact because I lived it too.

Maybe this is a US thing, but that's the way I recall it.

And today, if you walk into a big box store like Sams or Costco and
pick people shopping in the computer department at random and ask them
about Linux, the ones who know a little about what Linux is will almost always mention
Ubuntu.

They won't Gentoo or Slackware or Debian but they might know Ubuntu.

Ubuntu is today's version of Redhat.

Do you finally get it or are you going to dig your grave even deeper?

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:17:22 PM
> desk retard wrote:
>>
>> the general consensus seems to be that 

.... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.

-- 
'The point is this : MS have not overcharged or abused their
"monopoly" (if you insist we use this word).'  -  "True Linux
advocate" Hadron Quark
0
chrisv
6/17/2015 8:23:50 PM
On 2015-06-17, Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> On 6/17/15, 7:22 AM, in article mlrvqc$tav$3@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
><hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>>> On 17 Jun 2015 12:06, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>>>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>>>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>>>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>>>>> to pay for their OS.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Idiot
>>>>> 
>>>>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
>>>>> 
>>>>> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit
>>>>> Michael
>>>>> Glasser
>>>> 
>>>> But they can switch to Linux if they so desire.
>>>> Most, by far, don't.
>>>> Why is that?
>>>> 
>>>> The Linux community needs to stop making excuses and start moving
>>>> to "plan b" because "plan a" has been a dismal failure.
>>>> 
>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's the Linux community and in particular
>>>> people like you.
>>>> 
>>> And unfortunately, even in the supposed Linux support forums, bitter
>>> and vile postings similar to what you see here are all too common.
>>> That doesn't make someone feel warm and fuzzy about switching.
>> 
>> No it doesn't.
>> One other fact, COLA has the most traffic of any of the Linux groups
>> I am aware of so it's most likely to appear at the top of typical
>> what's Linux about Google searches.
>> 
>> Is there anything positive that a new or potential Linux user can read
>> here?
>> 
>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>> than COLA does.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> I would *love* to see an actual focus on Linux and how it compares to the
> competition. My personal focus (and Torvald's) is the desktop... but of
> course others may have different views. That is fine.


I find it interesting how they refuse to talk of desktop Linux and
somehow manage to turn the tables to include server Linux or embedded
Linux or super computers running Linux. All areas where few would
disagree that Linux is an excellent choice.

The literally run from demonstrating how THEIR CHOSEN os, Linux is 
a superior desktop system. 
And I say desktop because I doubt any of these people have a super computer
cluster in their basement.
Although I think the idiot 7 from alt.sci.physics might have made that claim.
That's how I found this group BTW.
I had forgotten it even existed until he cross posted a bunch of messages.

Someone mentioned he was the appointed king of COLA so I figured that
any group of people knowingly appointing that complete idiot King, has
got to include some massive idiots so I took a look.

I have not been disappointed.

Let's just say "School's Out For Summer" and I intend to have a blast
challenging this group of massive idiots to advocate Linux instead of
dragging it down into the cesspit like they are currently doing.




> But, heck, who in COLA has done even half as much as I have to help the open
> source ecosystem? <https://goo.gl/4GKaP9>

I see you have submitted bug reports.
That is a good thing.
I have been doing it for years.
It's how things get improved.


>
0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:26:32 PM
On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>
>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>
>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>
>>>>> [deletia]
>>>> 
>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>> 
>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>> 
>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>
>>> LOL!!!
>> 
>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>
> I don't need to shill anything.  What the adovocates fail to see are 
> suggestions and recommendations.  I still say to boycott cola and then stand 
> back and watch them eat their own.

This group would die of boredom if the opposing side wasn't posting.
See Google + for details.
The Linux groups are a ghost town.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:29:26 PM
On 06/17/2015 06:33 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> So how would you measure success,
>>
>> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
>> and companies, dipshit.
> 
> If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????

Once again, we have an apparent wintroll trying to frame the discussion
in terms of desktop retail adoption as a measure of "Linux success".

I guess all we can do is point it out repeatedly, until they get it.

"why does [Linux] score so low in all the stats????"

It doesn't "score so low in all the stats", no matter how many question
marks you end the sentence with.

(Lovely illustration of "begging the question" though.)

-- 
 -v

"If we solve the fuse problem and you can use the CD player we are sort
of done, but the disorderly behavior of your disks are worrying"

Husse Aug 5 2007

0
vallor
6/17/2015 8:31:44 PM
On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
> Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> 
>>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [deletia]
>>>>> 
>>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>>> 
>>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>>> 
>>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>>
>>>> LOL!!!
>>> 
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>> 
>> This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
>> You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat
>
> You don't even know who is posting.  Put the booze back in the cabinet.
> LOL!!!
 
So far I have been accused of being at least 3 different people.
It's a good thing these clowns aren't taking their LSAT exam.
You only get one try at each question.

They would rather attack the messenger, bury their head in the sand
and deny that as far as Linux, or Windows for that matter, can be
improved.

People wandering into this group will assume they have fallen into some
sort of insane asylum.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:33:31 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 13:31, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 06:33 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>>>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> So how would you measure success,
>>>
>>> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
>>> and companies, dipshit.
>>
>> If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????
>
> Once again, we have an apparent wintroll trying to frame the discussion
> in terms of desktop retail adoption as a measure of "Linux success".
>
> I guess all we can do is point it out repeatedly, until they get it.
>
> "why does [Linux] score so low in all the stats????"
>
> It doesn't "score so low in all the stats", no matter how many question
> marks you end the sentence with.
>
> (Lovely illustration of "begging the question" though.)
>
And once again you dodge and weave around the fact that on the desktop,
Linux is a complete failure outside of the hobbyist or geek realm.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 8:34:02 PM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 08:44 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:24, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> COLA drags down Linux advocacy to the lowest level possible.
>>>>>> There isn't a single group that does a worse job of advocating Linux
>>>>>> than COLA does.
>>>>>
>>>>> Agreed.  So why don't you get rid of the "pitch invaders", then,
>>>>> "Humberto"?
>>>>
>>>> Pitch invaders?
>>>> WTF is that?
>>>>
>>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>>>> Why are you here?
>>>>
>>>
>>> He's here because he failed the village idiot entrance exam.
>> 
>> Could get the square peg in the round hole now could he?
>> 
>
> Another showing of the hand.

Have we met?
I don't seem to recall but at my age my memory is the second thing
to go.
You don't want to know the first.


> According to "Humberto":  If someone pro-Linux responds to an insult
> with an insult, that's "dragging [us] down into the cesspool".

No.
I was completely civil until attacked.
I refuse to ignore direct attacks on my credibility so I return the fire.
Which of course plays right into your hand and you come up with the
well worn out claim "see you have shown your true colors".

It's a no win situation, but I don't care because I'm not trying to win
anything.
I'm simply stating my case, my opinions and backing them up with data.

Why?

Because apparently unlike most of the Linux users in this group, I actually
want to see Linux take market share from Microsoft.

> But if a Linux-hater makes an insult out of the blue, that's all just
> fine and dandy by Humbug, and he'll just pile on.

You guys started this war.
Deal with it.
It's impossible to post here unless one pretends to be a lemming and agree
100 percent with everything the core group has adopted as their platform.

Some of you are so wussy I wonder if you are really men at all.

> This is the same guy that said he wanted to see the FSF "disbanded".

I've clarified that statment like 48 times already but like a true troll
you continue to misinterpret it.
Why?
Because you have nothing else to use against me.

You certainly can't argue the point that the leaders of the FSF are doing
a good job and are legitimate representitivies for the movement.

That would be ludicrous even in the most die-hard Linux user's mind.


> It's not hard to see what the guy is up to.

It's even easier to see what lame attempt at discrediting me you are
currently propagating.


0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:41:33 PM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>
> Meanwhile, you'll find people who (apparently) just can't see computing
> as anything else but a retail, desktop, enterprise.  (Or at least, they
> pretend that is the case -- who knows if that is sincere?)  They are the
> ones who say Linux is a quote "dismal failure" unquote, despite the vast
> amounts of evidence to the contrary.

Linux is a dismal failure on the desktop and every single figure
you can find will back up that claim.
If you consider that Linux is free it becomes an even bigger failure.

As a Linux user, I would like to see this change and as I have said
before, this is not a Linux problem it's a community problem and that
goes directly to the leaders of the Linux community: RMS and Linus.
Neither of which are a good choice as a spokesman for/to the masses.
Linus is better than RMS but he has a thin skin and acts arrogant like
a child when confronted.

As for RMS, all the baggage he carries by virtue of his bizarre beliefs
would provide a field day for the MSM should he decide to begin preaching
to those who aren't part of the Linux community.
Maybe that is why he earns his money traveling the globe preaching to the
already converted.

Could you imagine RMS on CNN talking about how Linux is superior?
It wouldn't take 30 seconds before someone from Microsoft was contacting
CNN suggesting that they research some of RMS's opinions on under age sex.

They would have a field day.

Maybe that's why RMS has done literally nothing positive for the FSF.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 8:49:05 PM
On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>
>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>
>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
> 
> Another person who can't read.

I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
interested in the response.

> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.

FOR WHAT?

Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
is useful for -- and successful at.

(For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
still go unheeded.)

> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
> the lack of leadership and focus.

WHAT PROBLEM?

You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
 You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
successful."

Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!


> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
> been at it since 2006 I believe?
> 
> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.

No I didn't.

I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.

Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".


> That's where your problem is.

Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".


> If something as simple as that can't
> be remedied in 9 years,

As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was wrong.

> convincing big companies or municipalities
> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.

Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?

-- 
 -v

Religions revolve madly around sexual questions.

0
vallor
6/17/2015 8:50:12 PM
On 6/17/15, 7:02 AM, in article mlruj4$pds$2@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>> 
>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>> 
>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>> 
>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>> You people are crazy.
> 
> No, flatfish. You are stupid like Hadron Msg-ID Larry
> 
>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
> 
> And again an attempt to help that lying swine Snit Michael Glasser install
> yet another Snit circus

Insults. Attacks.

No comments about Linux.

The "advocates" fear speaking of Linux.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 9:07:43 PM
On 2015-06-17 7:07 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>> but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>> number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>
>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>
>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>
>>
>
> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?

I believe their measurement is based on the number of places where Linux 
appears. The fact that it is used in insignificant things like toasters 
and is hidden underneath Google's proprietary code is success for them.
-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/17/2015 9:12:47 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 13:50, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>
>> Another person who can't read.
>
> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
> interested in the response.
>
>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>
> FOR WHAT?
>
> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
> is useful for -- and successful at.
>
> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
> still go unheeded.)
>
>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>> the lack of leadership and focus.
>
> WHAT PROBLEM?
>
> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>  You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
> successful."
>
> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!
>
>
>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>
>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>
> No I didn't.
>
> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>
> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>
>
>> That's where your problem is.
>
> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".
>
>
>> If something as simple as that can't
>> be remedied in 9 years,
>
> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was wrong.
>
>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>
> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>
On the desktop?  Nope, damned few use it there.  Servers and embedded
Devices for sure.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 9:21:36 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>
>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>
>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>
>> 
>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.

   When someone comes into your house and commences to shit all over your
living room carpet, people are bound to treat you accordingly.

   Whining about RMS is straight from the Lemming Troll FUD playbook. He has
long been a somewhat marginalized voice in the community even among those of
us that care to be informed. Nevermind the world at large.

>
> Now, now.
> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you filthy 
> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think


-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 9:24:23 PM
On 2015-06-17 9:16 AM, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 01:46, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
>
>      Merely continuing to exist puts it ahead of 99.9% of all of the alternatives
> that ever existed.
>
>      MS-DOS wiped everything else out. It nearly wiped out MacOS.
>
> [deletia]

Cockroaches continue to exist. That is proof that they've succeeded.

Speaking of cockroaches, I find it interesting how they live in the same 
conditions as Linux users do.


-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/17/2015 9:25:29 PM
On 2015-06-17 9:52 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>
>> Hello, "Hadron".
>
> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
> You people are crazy.
>
> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?

You probably shouldn't give Chris Ass Storm too much attention or he'll 
be lusting for the opportunity to wipe your penis.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/17/2015 9:26:31 PM
On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>
>>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>     then
>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>> trollish rant.
>> 
>> More baseless accusations.

   No. An obvious contradiction.

   If "Redhat equals Linux" back in the stone age when he allegedly started
using Linux then the whole issue of RMS being embarassing and smelly is
clearly irrelevant. A commercial brand was already the "face of Linux" instead
of RMS.

>> 
>> Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
>> with Redhat.
>
> Idiot. I started before that, and I did it with Slackware. Then Debian. Then 
> Suse.

   I also started with something ELSE. Namely Slackware.

> RedHat in any form did I use only much later as "Fedora".
>
> Many linux users had similar experiences. And RedHat was *not* selected most 
> of the time because it was always behind the current development. Especially 
> at that time it was mostly an advantage if you selected a bleeding edge 
> distro. That is much less true now
>
> By simply claiming and repeating nonsense you will not make it true


-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 9:28:41 PM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>>
>> 
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.

   Idiocy. No one "pays" for their OS. It's bundled in. It is seen by the
normal consumer as something that is zero cost. Nearly NO ONE buys it as
a separate non-force-bundled product.

   So Linux can't manage to take over the world with an entry point into
the market that nearly no one uses? And that's supposed to be some fault 
of Linux?

   Also, nearly NO ONE installs their own OS. This is a considerable barrier
to ANY 3rd party alternative. 

   Microsoft committed violations of the Sherman Anti-Trust act (for which it
accepted punishment) eliminating competition from the OEM channel. Microsoft
has specifically sabotaged this option. Even BeOS couldn't escape from that.

   So Linux has trouble making inroads into a market it's been effectively
locked out of? Apple tries to bypass that and even they have trouble.

>
> Okay, so go on -- what about it?
>

   The troll's argument is pretty much a post factum claim that Windows is not 
crap just because it has a commanding market share. Plenty of crap options have 
large (or dominant) market share.

-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 9:38:40 PM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

[deletia]

>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>
> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>

   ...yes, another fine example of where the troll simply ignores reality.

   "There's no OSI or Linux Foundation"

   "There's no Oracle or IBM."

   "The local megabank doesn't have a VP of Linux."

-- 

   cat /dev/video0 > tivo-sucks.mpg &                                 |||
   mplayer tivo-sucks.mpg                                            / | \

0
JEDIDIAH
6/17/2015 9:42:04 PM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:

>> desk retard wrote:
>>>
>>> the general consensus seems to be that
> 
> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.

Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up 
with Windows because they think they have to.

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/17/2015 9:45:42 PM
On 2015-06-17 11:21 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 15:01, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>
>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>
>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>
>> Well of course there were, that's not what was said and your reading
>> comprehension failure has made you look a twat again.
>
> I'm convinced I have stumbled into the community room at the local
> insane asylum.

+1.

> These people can't be this ignorant.
> They have to be trolling.

No, they really are this idiotic.

< snip >

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/17/2015 9:48:12 PM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 21:45:42 +0000 (UTC)
ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
> 
> >> desk retard wrote:
> >>>
> >>> the general consensus seems to be that
> > 
> > ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
> > and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
> > motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
> 
> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up 
> with Windows because they think they have to.
> 

It is fuss to install new OS, especially dual boot. You have to move
data around and all. Few people know how to install OS and rest doesn't
bother.


0
Melzzzzz
6/17/2015 9:58:32 PM
On 2015-06-17 12:14 PM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>> arrive
>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>
>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>> shoe.
>>
>> Now, now.
>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>> filthy
>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>
>
> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy,
> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.

Anything Peter der Kl�wn types is pointless drivel, worth less than a 
steaming pile of poop.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/17/2015 9:58:58 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 21:45, ronb wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>
>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>
>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
>> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
>> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>
> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
> with Windows because they think they have to.
>
Most people don't care at all what OS they use as long as they can buy it
Preloaded with some apps and then use it with few problems.  Linux on the
Desktop COULD do that if they could come up with a single commercial
Version.  Then let the plethora of distros stick around for geeks and
Hobbyists.

Of course, that won't happen.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 9:59:04 PM
On 17 Jun 2015 23:58, Melzzzzz wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 21:45:42 +0000 (UTC)
> ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>
>> >> desk retard wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> the general consensus seems to be that
>> >
>> > ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
>> > and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
>> > motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>
>> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
>> with Windows because they think they have to.
>>
>
> It is fuss to install new OS, especially dual boot. You have to move
> data around and all. Few people know how to install OS and rest doesn't
> bother.
>
Because there is no need to.  Windows or OSX do just fine without the
Baggage that Linux desktop brings along.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/17/2015 10:00:09 PM
It was reported that JEDIDIAH posted:

> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>> 
>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>> to pay for their OS.
>
>    Idiocy. No one "pays" for their OS. It's bundled in. It is seen by the
> normal consumer as something that is zero cost. Nearly NO ONE buys it as
> a separate non-force-bundled product.
>
>    So Linux can't manage to take over the world with an entry point into
> the market that nearly no one uses? And that's supposed to be some fault 
> of Linux?
>
>    Also, nearly NO ONE installs their own OS. This is a considerable barrier
> to ANY 3rd party alternative. 
>
>    Microsoft committed violations of the Sherman Anti-Trust act (for which it
> accepted punishment) eliminating competition from the OEM channel. Microsoft
> has specifically sabotaged this option. Even BeOS couldn't escape from that.
>
>    So Linux has trouble making inroads into a market it's been effectively
> locked out of? Apple tries to bypass that and even they have trouble.
>
>>
>> Okay, so go on -- what about it?
>>
>
>    The troll's argument is pretty much a post factum claim that Windows is not 
> crap just because it has a commanding market share. 

Which IMO is a strawman argument.

>Plenty of crap options have large (or dominant) market share.

Like MacDonalds, as opposed to Maxim's.

-- 
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0
William
6/17/2015 10:31:44 PM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 23:58:32 +0200, Melzzzzz wrote:

> It is fuss to install new OS, especially dual boot. You have to move
> data around and all. Few people know how to install OS and rest doesn't
> bother.

I quit dual-booting six or seven years ago. I found I never needed to go 
to the Windows side. (I also quit running Windows in VM or -- now -- even 
installing Wine.) But I understand your point. Most people still have to 
use (or think they have to use) something from the Windows world.

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/17/2015 10:34:31 PM
On 6/17/15, 12:07 AM, in article mlr68p$vrj$2@dont-email.me, "Peter
K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

> Snit wrote:
> 
>> On 6/16/15, 5:37 PM, in article mlqfd4$87g$2@dont-email.me, "Peter
>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> 
>>> Snit wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Idiot
>>>>> 
>>>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>>>> 
>>>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>>>> 
>>>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>>>> is not working.
>>>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>>> 
>>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>>> ones who are correct.
>>> 
>>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>>> 
>>>>> That's asinine.
>>> 
>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>> 
>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>> 
> 
> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
> 
More insults from you.

No talk of Linux. You fear speaking of Linux.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:16:06 PM
On 6/17/15, 4:30 AM, in article mlrlm8$l07$2@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>> 
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
> 
> How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a
> machine?
> Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit

You obsession with me is weird.

Please, less talk about your fantasizes of me, more talk of Linux.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:16:59 PM
On 6/17/15, 4:42 AM, in article mlrmci$noi$1@deskrabbit.motzarella.org,
"Desk Rabbit" <me@example.com> wrote:

>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>> 
>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> So how would you measure success, one downloaded distro running on one PC?
>> 
>> How would you know how often a download of linux is used to install a
>> machine?
>> Answer is: You don't, and can't. You are a dishonest lying twat. A Snit
>> 
> 
> So putting your usual potty mouthed, low IQ, childish and unnecessary
> comments to one side, how about answering the question? Or is it too
> hard for you? Perhaps you can draw us a picture of a duck instead?

I am sincere when I note Peter truly fears speaking of Linux.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:17:21 PM
On 6/17/15, 4:40 AM, in article mlrmc8$m98$2@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>> 
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
>> 
>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
> 
> I never said it was.
> You have a reading comprehension problem.
> It seems to be common in this froup.
> 
> 
>>>> That's asinine.
>> 
>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
> 
> Fact: 98 percent of computer users are using something other than Linux.

Likely more than that, even accepting a rounding of 2% Linux usage. Many of
those who use Linux use multiple OSs... so the number who use Linux
exclusively is very, very small.

> So if Windows users comprise even 85 percent of that number your
> statement that the vast majority of users aren't intelligent is
> ludicrous.
> 
> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
> advocating Linux.



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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:18:40 PM
On 6/17/15, 4:47 AM, in article
0b385c-jid.ln1@user-1842.linux.individual.net, "William Poaster"
<wp@dev.null> wrote:

>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>> to pay for their OS.
> 
> What a stupid, inane statement from DimRabbit.
> 
>> Idiot
>> 
>> They can't deduct the price of windows from the machines they buy.
> 
> And secondly, the vast majority of windows users couldn't even install
> *any* OS on their computers, which is why they take it to a shop.

Keep in mind Dell, HP, Walmart, and others have worked to market and sell
systems with desktop Linux.

Heck, some companies have that as their full business.

They stay small businesses. Desktop Linux competes poorly.

> Also, it's *quite* likely they have NO idea that there *are* other OSs they
>  could use.

Some do not. Some do. But even of those that do, few use it... and of those
who do most do not stick with it. They go back to Windows or OS X.

>> You are nearly as dishonest / and / or stupid as your ass-buddy Snit Michael
>> Glasser



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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:20:14 PM
On 6/17/15, 5:00 AM, in article mlrnhr$m98$5@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>> 
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>> 
>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>> 
>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
> 
> Another person who can't read.
> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
> 
> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
> the lack of leadership and focus.
> 
> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
> been at it since 2006 I believe?
> 
> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.

And deems me anti-Linux for backing the stance of the Linux Foundation, the
KDE and GNOME teams, those who make OpenOffice, etc.

Yeah, I and they are all so very, very anti-Linux. Just insane.

> That's where your problem is. If something as simple as that can't
> be remedied in 9 years, convincing big companies or municipalities
> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.

And it is not like all distros would even have to move to better usability
and consistency. If for some reason a distro preferred to make things harder
to use they could.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:22:03 PM
On 6/17/15, 5:12 AM, in article cud6hoFqjdqU1@mid.individual.net, "Lloyd
Parsons" <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:

>> Fact: 98 percent of computer users are using something other than Linux.
>> So if Windows users comprise even 85 percent of that number your
>> statement that the vast majority of users aren't intelligent is
>> ludicrous.
>> 
>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>> advocating Linux.
>> 
>> 
> Old Petey has never advocated anything.  Post after post of very
> negative comments and insults.  He sometimes throws in some asinine
> opinion that he tries to pass off as fact which is usually followed
> soon by someone handing him his ass as he is proven wrong.

He is clearly fearful of speaking of Linux and technology in general. And it
makes sense: when he ties he generally makes a fool of himself.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:22:56 PM
On 6/17/15, 6:07 AM, in article slrnmo2s7p.9e9.jedi@nomad.mishnet,
"JEDIDIAH" <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:

>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the
>>>>> kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>> 
>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>> ones who are correct.
> 
>    Americans will happily eat dirt. That's why Detroit is still in business
> and McDonalds is the fast food juggernaut it is.
> 
>    Fortunately, in a genuinely free market it is quite possible for the 2%
> option to not merely survive but to thrive.

At 2% for a free product that has been marketed by Dell, HP, Walmart and
others that is not a good sign.

I would love to see the ecosystem grow to offer more and better choices ...
to see it truly compete with OS X and Windows.

Somehow in COLA this gets twisted to me being anti-Linux and anti-choice...
because I am rooting for each.

Weird.

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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:24:33 PM
On 6/17/15, 6:11 AM, in article slrnmo2sgc.9e9.jedi@nomad.mishnet,
"JEDIDIAH" <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:

.... 
>>> Thank you for admitting you cannot understand how people can have needs
>>> which are met by Windows better than by desktop Linux. It is refreshing to
>>> see you acknowledge your ignorance so clearly.
>>> 
> Nope. People just think they need the monopoly because they have predominantly
> thought that they need the monopoly. This goes all the way back to MS-DOS when
> things were much more proprietary and being part of the "right ecosystem"
> mattered much more.
> 
> Windows is not the "better option" for pretty much nearly nobody. Everyone is
> just so used to the Windows monopoly that they think they can't get along
> without it.

Not at all true. Many people move to OS X... and that is when it comes from
one vender and only at a high price tag.

Linux is free, comes from many venders, and can be installed on existing
hardware. It also has been pushed by Dell, HP, Walmart, and others.

The fact is the ecosystem simply does not allow distros to be made that
compete well.

> Fortunately, tablets and phones are undermining that idea.

In that are you have Google who has taken on making a more unified
experience. 
 
> Whatever success Apple has had has been a net benefit for the entire market in
> this regard.

Apple helped to redefine those markets... and Google has largely copied.

>> Ubuntu Linux is fine by my parents. My last intervention on their laptop was
>> more than year ago. Windows, Linux same to them- I just show them how to use
>> computer and that's all. Problems are dummies which want more but don't know
>> how, therefore Windows or OS X.
> 
> If you are a pedestrian home user, then there is probably no need to be
> fixated with any particualar brand of desktop OS. They are in truth probably
> all equally interchangeable.

For someone who does little more than web surfing, perhaps. This is why
ChromeOS has a chance. For people who want more, though, desktop Linux does
not compete well. 

> Now I "use it harder" so MacOS is out.

Not sure what you mean here.

> Windows it out just because it's a
> festering pile and I know too much about technology to tolerate it.

What tasks do you think desktop Linux allows you to do in a better way?
Would love to see it.


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0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:28:11 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 21:45, ronb wrote:
>> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>
>>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>>
>>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
>>> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
>>> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>
>> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
>> with Windows because they think they have to.
>>
> Most people don't care at all what OS they use as long as they can buy it
> Preloaded with some apps and then use it with few problems.  Linux on the
> Desktop COULD do that if they could come up with a single commercial
> Version.  Then let the plethora of distros stick around for geeks and
> Hobbyists.
>
> Of course, that won't happen.

The truth is Linux does not offer a superier computing experience for
the masses and that is why they refuse to downgrade.

Let's say for a moment that Linux somehow offered full, 100 percent
accurate speech and thought controlled computing.
Now how many people do you think Linux would have running the OS?

The figures would be overwhelming.
Microsoft would be out of business in a month.

But Linux can't offer that.
And on a smaller scale, Linux for most people, is a step backwards in 
their expectations for computers.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:29:49 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 13:31, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 06:33 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>>>>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So how would you measure success,
>>>>
>>>> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
>>>> and companies, dipshit.
>>>
>>> If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????
>>
>> Once again, we have an apparent wintroll trying to frame the discussion
>> in terms of desktop retail adoption as a measure of "Linux success".
>>
>> I guess all we can do is point it out repeatedly, until they get it.
>>
>> "why does [Linux] score so low in all the stats????"
>>
>> It doesn't "score so low in all the stats", no matter how many question
>> marks you end the sentence with.
>>
>> (Lovely illustration of "begging the question" though.)
>>
> And once again you dodge and weave around the fact that on the desktop,
> Linux is a complete failure outside of the hobbyist or geek realm.
>

I'm getting a hearty laugh out of how this clown keeps missing the point.
It has to be on purpose because nobody is this ignorant.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:32:19 PM
On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>> 
>> Another person who can't read.
>
> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
> interested in the response.


I don't either.
You keep digging your grave deeper and deeper.

>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>
> FOR WHAT?

The context is desktop.

> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
> is useful for -- and successful at.


It's a fact.
You deny it but it's a fact.

Someone else asked you why you don't run Linux on the desktop at your company which is
apparently Sonic.net.

So why don't you?

Answer that question or continue to attempt to cloud the issue.
The choice is yours.



0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:35:32 PM
On 6/17/15, 1:50 PM, in article
5581dd85$0$65109$b1db1813$65575428@news.astraweb.com, "vallor"
<vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:

....
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>> 
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>> 
>> Another person who can't read.
> 
> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
> interested in the response.
> 
>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
> 
> FOR WHAT?
> 
> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
> is useful for -- and successful at.
> 
> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
> still go unheeded.)

He is speaking of his comments... and since this is a thread about a
comparison with a desktop system, the Mac, yes, the context is desktop
systems.

Does not in any way diminish the value of Linux in the server room (and
elsewhere).

>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>> the lack of leadership and focus.
> 
> WHAT PROBLEM?

Look at COLA. Look at how the "advocates" act. The irrational, hate-filled,
cult-like behavior.

That is a good place to start... but we can also look at how the Linux
Foundation has not been able to get something as simple as an idea of print
dialogs to be accepted enough for it even to be a reasonable choice for any
distro.

This lack of choice in the Linux ecosystem is indicative of the problems
with the community.

> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.

Again, speaking of the desktop: it is not. It is a free product and has been
marketed by many companies. It has many groups with many distros. And
together they have less than 2% usage.

That is not "wildly successful".

But also look at their own standards: look at the goals of KDE and GNOME...
their own stated goals of building consistent SYSTEMS which benefit
usability. Now look for distros where this goal has been reached.

Any? 

Esp. if you include the software in their repositories they fail. With that
said, they *ARE* improving, even if much slower than I would like.

> You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few people can
> even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't successful."
> 
> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!

The metric is one that is backed by the Linux Foundation, the KDE team, the
GNOME team, the OpenOffice team, and more.

>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>> 
>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
> 
> No I didn't.

While you generally back the herd, you are not "the group". Yes, multiple
people attacked me for posting information from the Linux Foundation... as
if it was somehow anti-Linux.

> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
> Chrome.

I asked in what distro and, as far as I know, got no reply. Would love to
know... and see examples from your system.

> In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all over him", then
> kindly go back to my post and follow up to it, explaining exactly my error?
> Looked pretty civil to me.

I think it is civil to say you disagree. Fine. But what distro? Why no
examples? Would love to see it.

> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
> 
> 
>> That's where your problem is.
> 
> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".

Were you accused of doing so?

>> If something as simple as that can't
>> be remedied in 9 years,
> 
> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was wrong.

No, I was not... or if I was then the Linux Foundation is, too.

>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
> 
> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?



-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:36:38 PM
On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 13:50, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>
>>> Another person who can't read.
>>
>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>> interested in the response.
>>
>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>
>> FOR WHAT?
>>
>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
>> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
>> is useful for -- and successful at.
>>
>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>> still go unheeded.)
>>
>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>>> the lack of leadership and focus.
>>
>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>
>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>>  You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
>> successful."
>>
>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!
>>
>>
>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>
>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>
>> No I didn't.
>>
>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>
>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>
>>
>>> That's where your problem is.
>>
>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".
>>
>>
>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>
>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was wrong.
>>
>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>
>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>
> On the desktop?  Nope, damned few use it there.  Servers and embedded
> Devices for sure.
>

This particular zealot is extremely thick headed.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:36:42 PM
On 6/17/15, 1:26 PM, in article mlsl5o$san$4@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

>> I would *love* to see an actual focus on Linux and how it compares to the
>> competition. My personal focus (and Torvald's) is the desktop... but of
>> course others may have different views. That is fine.
> 
> I find it interesting how they refuse to talk of desktop Linux and
> somehow manage to turn the tables to include server Linux or embedded
> Linux or super computers running Linux. All areas where few would
> disagree that Linux is an excellent choice.

Right... it is not as if there are people in COLA insisting one should stick
to Windows (or OS X) servers. Even when Apple had a bigger focus on the
server world I do not think anyone pushed OS X in here. I know my web server
needs were handled by Linux (though I did run OS X Server at one school).

> The literally run from demonstrating how THEIR CHOSEN os, Linux is
> a superior desktop system.

They run to the concept of "choice"... even though desktop Linux lacks the
types of choices I speak about (and the types the Linux Foundation, KDE
team, GNOME team, and others speak about and state as their goals).

> And I say desktop because I doubt any of these people have a super computer
> cluster in their basement.

:)

> Although I think the idiot 7 from alt.sci.physics might have made that claim.
> That's how I found this group BTW.
> I had forgotten it even existed until he cross posted a bunch of messages.
> 
> Someone mentioned he was the appointed king of COLA so I figured that
> any group of people knowingly appointing that complete idiot King, has
> got to include some massive idiots so I took a look.
> 
> I have not been disappointed.

Even for COLA he is ... different. But the herd refuses to call him out on
his nonsense.

> Let's just say "School's Out For Summer" and I intend to have a blast
> challenging this group of massive idiots to advocate Linux instead of
> dragging it down into the cesspit like they are currently doing.

I have been having fun for a few days... but really have (again) spent too
much time here. I *am* in the middle of a big project... took a week
(mostly) off but need to get back to it. Does not mean I will not post some,
but my count will drop again soon.

Fun to run the herd's collective nose in their mess from time to time and
challenge them to speak of Linux. The results are very predictable: a couple
of posts where people do that (thanks vallor) but mostly just hate-filled,
fear-filled attacks and insults demonstrating their ignorance and lack of
confidence. And accusations of me lying (in ways that cannot be quoted,
however that works) and of me using socks (in ways that can never be
shown... but you have not called me many names so you must be my sock...
everyone is).
 
>> But, heck, who in COLA has done even half as much as I have to help the open
>> source ecosystem? <https://goo.gl/4GKaP9>
> 
> I see you have submitted bug reports.
> That is a good thing.
> I have been doing it for years.
> It's how things get improved.

Exactly. I made the videos first, just tinkering... then submitted the bug
reports.

I sincerely think that is more work to help the Linux community than all of
the "advocates" have done, combined.

-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:51:14 PM
On 6/17/15, 8:48 AM, in article mls4sd$cip$13@dont-email.me, "Humberto
Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>> 
>> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that
>> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?
> 
> Jeremy at Walmart?
> Ok, I'll bite. What's the story behind this one?

I, too, would love to hear Peter's explanation of this.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:51:45 PM
On 6/17/15, 8:47 AM, in article mls4oo$l48$1@dont-email.me, "Chris Ahlstrom"
<OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:

>> 
>> Rushing the field or storming the field, by individuals or groups.
>> Which is exactly what you trolling filthy scum are doing
>> 
>>> I'm here to talk about Linux and how to improve it.
>> 
>> How "surprising". And just like Snit Michael Glasser. Now how might that
>> come to be? Are you somehow related to Jeremy at Walmart?
>> 
>>> Why are you here?
>> 
>> Advocating linux might be one reason
> 
> It's the same old gambit over and over and over again.
> "Humberto" is just another in the long line of trolls here.

He is asking people to speak about Linux. To your herd, that is a form of
trolling.

Speaks volumes about you and your herd.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/17/2015 11:52:15 PM
On 2015-06-17, Slimer <slvrslmr@lv.c> wrote:
> On 2015-06-17 11:21 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 15:01, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>
>>> Well of course there were, that's not what was said and your reading
>>> comprehension failure has made you look a twat again.
>>
>> I'm convinced I have stumbled into the community room at the local
>> insane asylum.
>
> +1.
>
>> These people can't be this ignorant.
>> They have to be trolling.
>
> No, they really are this idiotic.
>
>< snip >
Sad.
Very sad.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:58:22 PM
On 2015-06-17, Slimer <slvrslmr@lv.c> wrote:
> On 2015-06-17 12:14 PM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>> arrive
>>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>>> shoe.
>>>
>>> Now, now.
>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>> filthy
>>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>
>>
>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy,
>> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>
> Anything Peter der Klöwn types is pointless drivel, worth less than a 
> steaming pile of poop.
I concur.
He is worthless.

What is the worth of someone who is wrong most of the time?
He's as useless as a toilet that refuses to flush.

0
Humberto
6/17/2015 11:59:44 PM
On 6/17/15, 4:29 PM, in article mlsvtd$cci$5@dont-email.me, "Humberto Lopez"
<hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>> On 17 Jun 2015 21:45, ronb wrote:
>>> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>> 
>>>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>>> 
>>>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
>>>> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
>>>> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>> 
>>> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
>>> with Windows because they think they have to.
>>> 
>> Most people don't care at all what OS they use as long as they can buy it
>> Preloaded with some apps and then use it with few problems.  Linux on the
>> Desktop COULD do that if they could come up with a single commercial
>> Version.  Then let the plethora of distros stick around for geeks and
>> Hobbyists.
>> 
>> Of course, that won't happen.
> 
> The truth is Linux does not offer a superier computing experience for
> the masses and that is why they refuse to downgrade.
> 
> Let's say for a moment that Linux somehow offered full, 100 percent
> accurate speech and thought controlled computing.
> Now how many people do you think Linux would have running the OS?
> 
> The figures would be overwhelming.
> Microsoft would be out of business in a month.
> 
> But Linux can't offer that.
> And on a smaller scale, Linux for most people, is a step backwards in
> their expectations for computers.
> 
Absolutely correct. But even with this, there have to be places where it
handles tasks better than the competition. I think you already have seen my
use of images in word processor video:

* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

This is a very clear example of where Linux is simple behind (or maybe there
are things I am missing). Would be great for "advocates" to show places
where Linux is ahead (or to show what I am missing and how such tasks can be
done on Linux).

I have made similar comparisons with high end image editing, screencasting,
file management (or at least aspects of it), etc.

There are *some* places Linux is ahead: windows snapping to each other is
one. Sure, this is not a deal breaker for a user experience, but it is a
benefit. I wish Apple would "innovate" this for OS X.

But the "advocates" seem incapable of finding much, if anything.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 12:03:14 AM
On 2015-06-17 7:59 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Slimer <slvrslmr@lv.c> wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17 12:14 PM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>> arrive
>>>>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>>>> shoe.
>>>>
>>>> Now, now.
>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>> filthy
>>>> scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>
>>>
>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux advocacy,
>>> no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>
>> Anything Peter der Klöwn types is pointless drivel, worth less than a
>> steaming pile of poop.
> I concur.
> He is worthless.
>
> What is the worth of someone who is wrong most of the time?
> He's as useless as a toilet that refuses to flush.

Nah, a broken toilet is still useful to sit on and do some quality 
thinking.

Peter der Klöwn is not worth even that much. He's closer to the sticky 
stuff you find in your garbage can if you haven't cleaned it in months.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/18/2015 12:43:18 AM
On 17/06/2015 21:31, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 06:33 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>>>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> So how would you measure success,
>>>
>>> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
>>> and companies, dipshit.
>>
>> If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????
>
> Once again, we have an apparent wintroll trying to frame the discussion
> in terms of desktop retail adoption as a measure of "Linux success".
>
> I guess all we can do is point it out repeatedly, until they get it.

Go on then, what standard are you using to measure the success of 
Linux......

>
> "why does [Linux] score so low in all the stats????"
>
> It doesn't "score so low in all the stats", no matter how many question
> marks you end the sentence with.

Show some stats where it scores high then or middle, or something. You 
are not actually saying anything.

0
Desk
6/18/2015 1:01:01 AM
vallor wrote:

> On 06/17/2015 06:33 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 13:06, chrisv wrote:
>>>> Desk Retard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> So how would you measure success,
>>>
>>> Being a viable product in the market, the best choice for many people
>>> and companies, dipshit.
>> 
>> If it's the best choice why does it score so low in all the stats????
> 
> Once again, we have an apparent wintroll trying to frame the discussion
> in terms of desktop retail adoption as a measure of "Linux success".
> 
> I guess all we can do is point it out repeatedly, until they get it.
> 
> "why does [Linux] score so low in all the stats????"
> 
> It doesn't "score so low in all the stats", no matter how many question
> marks you end the sentence with.
> 
> (Lovely illustration of "begging the question" though.)
> 

Why isn't then found on the desktops for sale at BestBuy, Staples, Office 
Depot, etc.?

You won't because the branding of a PC "Runs Linux" is the kiss of death to 
the vendor.

Guffaw!!!

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 1:51:42 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>
>>>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>     then
>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there
>>>> is his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>> trollish rant.
>>> 
>>> More baseless accusations.
>>> 
>>> Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
>>> with Redhat.
>>
>> Idiot. I started before that, and I did it with Slackware. Then Debian.
>> Then Suse.
>> RedHat in any form did I use only much later as "Fedora".
> 
> Good for you.
> I'm talking full time.
> I haven't used Windows for my own PC since 1997.
> 
>> Many linux users had similar experiences. And RedHat was *not* selected
>> most of the time because it was always behind the current development.
>> Especially at that time it was mostly an advantage if you selected a
>> bleeding edge distro. That is much less true now
> 
> Again your lack of reading comprehension skills get the best of you.
> I never claimed Redhat was selected most of the time.
> 
> Is every Linux advocate in this group retarded?

I believe they are.

> This is a serious question because it seems none of you are able to
> read at an 8th grade level which is approximately the level at which
> I am dumbing down my posts to.
> 
> 

That explains why they don't have jobs.

>> By simply claiming and repeating nonsense you will not make it true
> 
> It is true.
> 
> Think of it this way, when someone mentions fast food what resteraunt
> is probably going to be mentioned?
> McDonald's.
> 
> When someone mentions a French car what brand is likeley to be mentioned?
> Renault.
> 
> When someone mentions a high quality car what car is likely to be
> mentioned? Rolls Royce.
> 
> Are you getting this yet?
> 
> It has *nothing* to do with other versions of Linux being around.
> It has everything to do with the fact that at that time the Linux "brand"
> was associated with Redhat. And that's a fact because I lived it too.
> 
> Maybe this is a US thing, but that's the way I recall it.
> 
> And today, if you walk into a big box store like Sams or Costco and
> pick people shopping in the computer department at random and ask them
> about Linux, the ones who know a little about what Linux is will almost
> always mention Ubuntu.
> 

Not our local Costco.  They'll say "What's that?"

> They won't Gentoo or Slackware or Debian but they might know Ubuntu.
> 
> Ubuntu is today's version of Redhat.

I'm using RedHat now.  Everything is working to their specs.

> 
> Do you finally get it or are you going to dig your grave even deeper?

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 1:56:14 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [deletia]
>>>>> 
>>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>>> 
>>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>>> 
>>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>>
>>>> LOL!!!
>>> 
>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>
>> I don't need to shill anything.  What the adovocates fail to see are
>> suggestions and recommendations.  I still say to boycott cola and then
>> stand back and watch them eat their own.
> 
> This group would die of boredom if the opposing side wasn't posting.
> See Google + for details.
> The Linux groups are a ghost town.

It was done once in here a few years ago.  We should've kept away and then 
Google would have shut this ghost town down.

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 1:57:48 AM
JEDIDIAH wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien
>>>>> concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it is not
>>>>> possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>
>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>
>>> 
>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>> shoe.
> 
>    When someone comes into your house and commences to shit all over your
> living room carpet, people are bound to treat you accordingly.
> 

This isn't your living room.  This is a public forum.
But your point is taken.  So when are you guys going to quit shitting on our 
carpet?  Eh?

>    Whining about RMS is straight from the Lemming Troll FUD playbook. He
>    has
> long been a somewhat marginalized voice in the community even among those
> of us that care to be informed. Nevermind the world at large.
> 

RMS is a real odd ball.

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 1:59:43 AM
Lloyd Parsons wrote:

> On 17 Jun 2015 13:28, GreyCloud wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>>>> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>>>>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects
>>>>>>>>>>>> royalties:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely
>>>>>>>>>> alien concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it
>>>>>>>>>> is not possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is
>>>>>>>>> supposed to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be
>>>>>>>> superior and important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free
>>>>>>>> license to treat other people like a bit of dog shit that has been
>>>>>>>> discovered on your shoe.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now, now.
>>>>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>>>>> filthy scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux
>>>>>> advocacy, no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>>>>
>>>>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations
>>>>> than they do advocating Linux.
>>>>> Insane.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
>>>> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will
>>>> be The last they look at Linux.
>>>
>>> This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on
>>> USENET. I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from
>>> Linux help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of
>>> them.
>>
>> These nuts also infest some of the linux help forums.  Even there they
>> spew their insults and their vitriol.
>>
>>
> That's also not much different from the support forums at the various
> distro sites unfortunately.
> 
I know, and now they are creeping into the windows 10 preview newsgroup.
One clown keeps calling windows 10 as Son of Frankenstein.
Slimer knows all about this dude.

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 2:01:08 AM
Humberto Lopez wrote:

> On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>> Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [deletia]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>>>> 
>>>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> LOL!!!
>>>> 
>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>> 
>>> This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
>>> You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat
>>
>> You don't even know who is posting.  Put the booze back in the cabinet.
>> LOL!!!
>  
> So far I have been accused of being at least 3 different people.
> It's a good thing these clowns aren't taking their LSAT exam.
> You only get one try at each question.
> 
> They would rather attack the messenger, bury their head in the sand
> and deny that as far as Linux, or Windows for that matter, can be
> improved.
> 
> People wandering into this group will assume they have fallen into some
> sort of insane asylum.

Or at the least a moshpit.

Win10 has Cortana, so I'm interested to look into it and see how well it 
works.  I don't need it, but there will certainly be people that will want 
it.
As it is, it looks like this PC will be my last one.  Getting too old to 
deal with these nut cases in here as it is, and once my contract runs out, I 
may as well sell it.  There is now no reason to waste time trying to get 
these guys to see reason, let alone their ability to read reason.

0
GreyCloud
6/18/2015 2:05:24 AM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 19:56:14 -0600, GreyCloud wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter K�hlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>>
>>>>>     Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>>     then
>>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there
>>>>> is his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>>> trollish rant.
>>>> 
>>>> More baseless accusations.
>>>> 
>>>> Back then it was a fact. Mention Linux and most people would equate it
>>>> with Redhat.
>>>
>>> Idiot. I started before that, and I did it with Slackware. Then Debian.
>>> Then Suse.
>>> RedHat in any form did I use only much later as "Fedora".
>> 
>> Good for you.
>> I'm talking full time.
>> I haven't used Windows for my own PC since 1997.
>> 
>>> Many linux users had similar experiences. And RedHat was *not* selected
>>> most of the time because it was always behind the current development.
>>> Especially at that time it was mostly an advantage if you selected a
>>> bleeding edge distro. That is much less true now
>> 
>> Again your lack of reading comprehension skills get the best of you.
>> I never claimed Redhat was selected most of the time.
>> 
>> Is every Linux advocate in this group retarded?
> 
> I believe they are.

They are indeed mentally retarded.
It's obvious.

>> This is a serious question because it seems none of you are able to
>> read at an 8th grade level which is approximately the level at which
>> I am dumbing down my posts to.
>> 
>> 
> 
> That explains why they don't have jobs.

Most of them have jobs using Windows.
 
>>> By simply claiming and repeating nonsense you will not make it true
>> 
>> It is true.
>> 
>> Think of it this way, when someone mentions fast food what resteraunt
>> is probably going to be mentioned?
>> McDonald's.
>> 
>> When someone mentions a French car what brand is likeley to be mentioned?
>> Renault.
>> 
>> When someone mentions a high quality car what car is likely to be
>> mentioned? Rolls Royce.
>> 
>> Are you getting this yet?
>> 
>> It has *nothing* to do with other versions of Linux being around.
>> It has everything to do with the fact that at that time the Linux "brand"
>> was associated with Redhat. And that's a fact because I lived it too.
>> 
>> Maybe this is a US thing, but that's the way I recall it.
>> 
>> And today, if you walk into a big box store like Sams or Costco and
>> pick people shopping in the computer department at random and ask them
>> about Linux, the ones who know a little about what Linux is will almost
>> always mention Ubuntu.
>> 
> 
> Not our local Costco.  They'll say "What's that?"

Same here.
Mention Linux and people start running for the exits.

 
>> They won't Gentoo or Slackware or Debian but they might know Ubuntu.
>> 
>> Ubuntu is today's version of Redhat.
> 
> I'm using RedHat now.  Everything is working to their specs.

As predicted.
They sell it to corporate companies.
 
Redhat isn't the Linux amateur hour.

0
Tomas
6/18/2015 2:08:10 AM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 20:01:08 -0600, GreyCloud wrote:

> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> 
>> On 17 Jun 2015 13:28, GreyCloud wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>>>>>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects
>>>>>>>>>>>>> royalties:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely
>>>>>>>>>>> alien concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it
>>>>>>>>>>> is not possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is
>>>>>>>>>> supposed to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be
>>>>>>>>> superior and important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free
>>>>>>>>> license to treat other people like a bit of dog shit that has been
>>>>>>>>> discovered on your shoe.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Now, now.
>>>>>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>>>>>> filthy scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux
>>>>>>> advocacy, no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations
>>>>>> than they do advocating Linux.
>>>>>> Insane.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
>>>>> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will
>>>>> be The last they look at Linux.
>>>>
>>>> This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on
>>>> USENET. I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from
>>>> Linux help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of
>>>> them.
>>>
>>> These nuts also infest some of the linux help forums.  Even there they
>>> spew their insults and their vitriol.
>>>
>>>
>> That's also not much different from the support forums at the various
>> distro sites unfortunately.
>> 
> I know, and now they are creeping into the windows 10 preview newsgroup.
> One clown keeps calling windows 10 as Son of Frankenstein.
> Slimer knows all about this dude.

Seen that idiot.
A Linux freak.
0
Tomas
6/18/2015 2:09:35 AM
On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 20:05:24 -0600, GreyCloud wrote:

> Humberto Lopez wrote:
> 
>> On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>> Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> > On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> >> [...]
>>>>>>>>>> > However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>>>>> > far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>>>>> > can be given away.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> [deletia]
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> LOL!!!
>>>>> 
>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>> 
>>>> This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
>>>> You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat
>>>
>>> You don't even know who is posting.  Put the booze back in the cabinet.
>>> LOL!!!
>>  
>> So far I have been accused of being at least 3 different people.
>> It's a good thing these clowns aren't taking their LSAT exam.
>> You only get one try at each question.
>> 
>> They would rather attack the messenger, bury their head in the sand
>> and deny that as far as Linux, or Windows for that matter, can be
>> improved.
>> 
>> People wandering into this group will assume they have fallen into some
>> sort of insane asylum.
> 
> Or at the least a moshpit.
> 
> Win10 has Cortana, so I'm interested to look into it and see how well it 
> works.  I don't need it, but there will certainly be people that will want 
> it.
> As it is, it looks like this PC will be my last one.  Getting too old to 
> deal with these nut cases in here as it is, and once my contract runs out, I 
> may as well sell it.  There is now no reason to waste time trying to get 
> these guys to see reason, let alone their ability to read reason.

Windows 10 is going to steamroll Linux.
The Linux idiots know it.
They are just trying to deny and deflect.
Their usual operation.
0
Tomas
6/18/2015 2:10:48 AM
Snit wrote:

> On 6/17/15, 12:07 AM, in article mlr68p$vrj$2@dont-email.me, "Peter
> Köhlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> 
>> Snit wrote:
>> 
>>> On 6/16/15, 5:37 PM, in article mlqfd4$87g$2@dont-email.me, "Peter
>>> Köhlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Snit wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On 6/16/15, 3:52 PM, in article mlq9am$nfp$1@dont-email.me, "Humberto
>>>>> Lopez" <hlopez88@linuxmail.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Idiot
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Why are you so angry and bitter?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The current situation is dismal and what we have now
>>>>>> is not working.
>>>>>> You just refuse to admit it.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>>>>>>> install linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will
>>>>>>> switch. The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into
>>>>>>> the kitchen sink will stay with windows
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> So 98 percent is wrong and the 2 percent that use Linux are the only
>>>>>> ones who are correct.
>>>> 
>>>> It is not 98% who use windows. It is not even 90%
>>>> 
>>>>>> That's asinine.
>>>> 
>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>> 
>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>> 
>> 
>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>> 
> More insults from you.

Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is 
declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying imbecile 
here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.
0
Peter
6/18/2015 7:12:05 AM
On 17/06/2015 21:15, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 08:32 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>
>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could arrive
>>>> at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien concept to
>>>> the point that they have convinced themselves it is not possible so
>>>> therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>
>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>
>>
>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your shoe.
>
> You mean like you responding to Chris' comment about pitched battles
> with your "village idiot" nonsense?
>

Calling someone the village idiot is extremely mild compared to what 
some of your herd call people.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 8:06:53 AM
On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>
>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>> desktop market.
>>>
>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>
>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>
>      Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long then
> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is his
> own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire trollish rant.

I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter 
suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!

0
Desk
6/18/2015 8:11:03 AM
On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>>> are an
>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>
>>>>> SO
>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>
>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>
>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>
>> Another person who can't read.
>
> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
> interested in the response.
>
>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>
> FOR WHAT?
>
> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
> is useful for -- and successful at.
>
> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
> still go unheeded.)
>
>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>> the lack of leadership and focus.
>
> WHAT PROBLEM?
>
> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>   You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
> successful."
>
> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!
>
>
>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>
>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>
> No I didn't.
>
> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>
> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>
>
>> That's where your problem is.
>
> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".
>
>
>> If something as simple as that can't
>> be remedied in 9 years,
>
> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was wrong.
>
>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>
> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>


OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves 
around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is 
Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
0
Desk
6/18/2015 8:17:13 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> SO
>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>
>>> Another person who can't read.
>>
>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>> interested in the response.
>>
>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>
>> FOR WHAT?
>>
>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
>> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
>> is useful for -- and successful at.
>>
>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>> still go unheeded.)
>>
>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>>> the lack of leadership and focus.
>>
>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>
>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>>   You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
>> successful."
>>
>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!
>>
>>
>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>
>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>
>> No I didn't.
>>
>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>
>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>
>>
>>> That's where your problem is.
>>
>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".
>>
>>
>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>
>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>> wrong.
>>
>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>
>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>
> 
> 
> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is
> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?

Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that 
direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are an 
abject failure outside of the desktop
Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not 
even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard

0
Peter
6/18/2015 8:40:49 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>
>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>
>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>
>>      Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>      then
>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>> trollish rant.
> 
> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!

So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic 
bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?

It has *never* been that way. RedHat has always been strong in the server 
market, as well as SuSE. RedHat never played any significant role on the 
desktop

0
Peter
6/18/2015 8:43:20 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 17/06/2015 21:15, vallor wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 08:32 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien
>>>>> concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it is not
>>>>> possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>
>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>> shoe.
>>
>> You mean like you responding to Chris' comment about pitched battles
>> with your "village idiot" nonsense?
>>
> 
> Calling someone the village idiot is extremely mild compared to what
> some of your herd call people.

Well, it is a good thing then that you have not even reached "people" 
status. You are a "thing". Contaminated dirt is worth a lot more than you 
are
0
Peter
6/18/2015 8:44:27 AM
On 18/06/2015 09:44, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 21:15, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/17/2015 08:32 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely alien
>>>>>> concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it is not
>>>>>> possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is supposed
>>>>> to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be superior and
>>>> important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free license to treat
>>>> other people like a bit of dog shit that has been discovered on your
>>>> shoe.
>>>
>>> You mean like you responding to Chris' comment about pitched battles
>>> with your "village idiot" nonsense?
>>>
>>
>> Calling someone the village idiot is extremely mild compared to what
>> some of your herd call people.
>
> Well, it is a good thing then that you have not even reached "people"
> status. You are a "thing". Contaminated dirt is worth a lot more than you
> are
>

Well done Peter, I knew we could rely on you to provide a current 
example of the depths your herd sinks to on a daily basis.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:05:10 AM
chrisv wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

>> desk retard wrote:
>>>
>>> the general consensus seems to be that 
>
> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
> and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
> motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.

And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their desktop system,
in spite of all these barriers.

It's just that good a system!

-- 
One is often kept in the right road by a rut.
		-- Gustave Droz
0
Chris
6/18/2015 10:06:40 AM
On 18/06/2015 09:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>
>>>       Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>       then
>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>> trollish rant.
>>
>> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
>> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!
>
> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic
> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?

No, because I read and understood what was being written.

You clearly do not and for some bizarre reason seem to be determined to 
repeatedly display your error.


0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:07:30 AM
On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but
>>>>>>>>> by far
>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that up.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>
>>>> Another person who can't read.
>>>
>>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>>> interested in the response.
>>>
>>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>>
>>> FOR WHAT?
>>>
>>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is a
>>> never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what Linux
>>> is useful for -- and successful at.
>>>
>>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>>> still go unheeded.)
>>>
>>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in particular
>>>> the lack of leadership and focus.
>>>
>>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>>
>>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>>>    You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
>>> successful."
>>>
>>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy, dude!
>>>
>>>
>>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print system
>>>> to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and have
>>>> been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>>
>>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>>
>>> No I didn't.
>>>
>>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
>>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>>
>>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>>
>>>
>>>> That's where your problem is.
>>>
>>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over them".
>>>
>>>
>>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>>
>>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>>> wrong.
>>>
>>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>>
>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>>
>>
>>
>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is
>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
>
> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are an
> abject failure outside of the desktop
> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>

Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system 
per se so if you are going to compare Linux and OSX you HAVE to compare 
it with Linux Desktop otherwise you are not comparing apples with 
apples. That's a fairly simple concept.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:11:54 AM
On 17/06/2015 20:28, vallor wrote:
> On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>
>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>> to pay for their OS.
>
> Okay, so go on -- what about it?
>

Which bit are you having trouble understanding?
0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:16:08 AM
On 17/06/2015 22:59, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
> On 17 Jun 2015 21:45, ronb wrote:
>> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>
>>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>>
>>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
>>> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
>>> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>
>> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
>> with Windows because they think they have to.
>>
> Most people don't care at all what OS they use as long as they can buy it
> Preloaded with some apps and then use it with few problems.  Linux on the
> Desktop COULD do that if they could come up with a single commercial
> Version.  Then let the plethora of distros stick around for geeks and
> Hobbyists.
>
> Of course, that won't happen.
>
>

Many large retailers have tried selling PCs with Linux pre-installed, 
every single case has been a complete and utter failure.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:17:50 AM
On 17/06/2015 22:38, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>> On 06/17/2015 04:02 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>> On 16/06/2015 22:12, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>>
>>>
>>> The point is that given the choice of a free operating system and paying
>>> for one or removing the paid for operating system and replacing with a
>>> free one, the general consensus seems to be that Linux Desktop doesn't
>>> really cut it for the majority of computer users becuase they continue
>>> to pay for their OS.
>
>     Idiocy. No one "pays" for their OS. It's bundled in. It is seen by the
> normal consumer as something that is zero cost. Nearly NO ONE buys it as
> a separate non-force-bundled product.
>
>     So Linux can't manage to take over the world with an entry point into
> the market that nearly no one uses? And that's supposed to be some fault
> of Linux?

Many large retailers have tried to sell cheap PCs with Linux 
pre-installed and have failed completely yet the smaller and higher 
price point Apple market flourishes.

It's to do with quality and Linux Desktop doesn't have the quality yet.

>
>     Also, nearly NO ONE installs their own OS. This is a considerable barrier
> to ANY 3rd party alternative.
>
>     Microsoft committed violations of the Sherman Anti-Trust act (for which it
> accepted punishment) eliminating competition from the OEM channel. Microsoft
> has specifically sabotaged this option. Even BeOS couldn't escape from that.
>
>     So Linux has trouble making inroads into a market it's been effectively
> locked out of? Apple tries to bypass that and even they have trouble.
>
>>
>> Okay, so go on -- what about it?
>>
>
>     The troll's argument is pretty much a post factum claim that Windows is not
> crap just because it has a commanding market share. Plenty of crap options have
> large (or dominant) market share.
>

List some crap options.


0
Desk
6/18/2015 10:21:55 AM
On 2015-06-17 10:01 PM, GreyCloud wrote:
> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>
>> On 17 Jun 2015 13:28, GreyCloud wrote:
>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Lloyd Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 17 Jun 2015 16:19, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 16:12, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Desk Rabbit <me@example
>>>>>> .com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 14:52, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects
>>>>>>>>>>>>> royalties:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> users.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello, "Hadron".
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> So now I'm someone named 'Hadron' ?
>>>>>>>>>>>> You people are crazy.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you so afraid to advocate Linux?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> They are a herd so the concept that individuals such as us could
>>>>>>>>>>> arrive at a similar conclusion independently is a completely
>>>>>>>>>>> alien concept to the point that they have convinced themselves it
>>>>>>>>>>> is not possible so therefore we are all one or maybe two people.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It seems that way which is odd since Linux and Open Source is
>>>>>>>>>> supposed to be about free choice, openness and freedom.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Unfortunately for some it's an opportunity to pretend to be
>>>>>>>>> superior and important & L33T geeks. Seems to also come with a free
>>>>>>>>> license to treat other people like a bit of dog shit that has been
>>>>>>>>> discovered on your shoe.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Now, now.
>>>>>>>> I would treat dog shit on my shoes much gentler. Because unlike you
>>>>>>>> filthy scum it is not responsible for its total inability to think
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are a perfect example of the problem there Peter. No Linux
>>>>>>> advocacy, no intelligent retort just more low IQ insults.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They spend more time hurling insults and making baseless accusations
>>>>>> than they do advocating Linux.
>>>>>> Insane.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Yep, if someone new was starting to look at Linux, this would be a very
>>>>> Possible first place to look.  And of course, if they do then that will
>>>>> be The last they look at Linux.
>>>>
>>>> This is certainly one of the higher if not the highest traffic group on
>>>> USENET. I suppose it does serve to keep these malcontents away from
>>>> Linux help groups although I see a few familiar names in a couple of
>>>> them.
>>>
>>> These nuts also infest some of the linux help forums.  Even there they
>>> spew their insults and their vitriol.
>>>
>>>
>> That's also not much different from the support forums at the various
>> distro sites unfortunately.
>>
> I know, and now they are creeping into the windows 10 preview newsgroup.
> One clown keeps calling windows 10 as Son of Frankenstein.
> Slimer knows all about this dude.

He's a disgusting piece of shit who says negative things about Windows 
without any kind of evidence in the hope of promoting toiletware. He's 
the same kind of troll that the Linux Loser Liar's Club says that we are 
except that none of what he says is ever supported by any kind of 
articles or screenshots. This is a guy who claims that people at his 
"job" overwhelmingly rejected Windows 8 and 8.1 "just because."


-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/18/2015 10:42:18 AM
On 2015-06-17 10:10 PM, Tomas wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 20:05:24 -0600, GreyCloud wrote:
>
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-17, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>> Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> JEDIDIAH wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, -hh <recscuba_google@huntzinger.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 16 Jun 2015 11:23, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell*
>>>>>>>>>>>> far more than the number of Linux Desktops that
>>>>>>>>>>>> can be given away.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> That's a sucker bet if there ever was one!!  :)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Even the hated Windows 8.0 was/is on more desktops/laptops than
>>>>>>>>>>> Linux.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Even Vista still has more marketshare today than Linux
>>>>>>>>>> (2.01% vs 1.57% per the below cite):
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ...and MacOS has always been dwarfed by the market share of DOS and
>>>>>>>>> it's decendants.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> [deletia]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Let them shill for the "market leader".
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No one cares anymore.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Only a handfull of linux loons like you would shill for linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LOL!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Who is shilling for Windows?
>>>>>> I see Windows mentioned more often by Linux users than Windows users.
>>>>>
>>>>> This was fast. Your true colors appear just after several dozen posts.
>>>>> You did better in the past, flatfish Gary Stewrat
>>>>
>>>> You don't even know who is posting.  Put the booze back in the cabinet.
>>>> LOL!!!
>>>
>>> So far I have been accused of being at least 3 different people.
>>> It's a good thing these clowns aren't taking their LSAT exam.
>>> You only get one try at each question.
>>>
>>> They would rather attack the messenger, bury their head in the sand
>>> and deny that as far as Linux, or Windows for that matter, can be
>>> improved.
>>>
>>> People wandering into this group will assume they have fallen into some
>>> sort of insane asylum.
>>
>> Or at the least a moshpit.
>>
>> Win10 has Cortana, so I'm interested to look into it and see how well it
>> works.  I don't need it, but there will certainly be people that will want
>> it.
>> As it is, it looks like this PC will be my last one.  Getting too old to
>> deal with these nut cases in here as it is, and once my contract runs out, I
>> may as well sell it.  There is now no reason to waste time trying to get
>> these guys to see reason, let alone their ability to read reason.
>
> Windows 10 is going to steamroll Linux.
> The Linux idiots know it.
> They are just trying to deny and deflect.
> Their usual operation.

A free modern operating system or a free "operating system" which works 
about as well as Windows 98 did known as Linux...

I don't know, it's hard to decide.


-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/18/2015 10:45:08 AM
On 2015-06-18 6:17 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 17/06/2015 22:59, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
>> On 17 Jun 2015 21:45, ronb wrote:
>>> On Wed, 17 Jun 2015 15:23:50 -0500, chrisv wrote:
>>>
>>>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>>>
>>>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows and
>>>> installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and motivated
>>>> will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>>
>>> Most people don't even know they CAN leave the herd. They just put up
>>> with Windows because they think they have to.
>>>
>> Most people don't care at all what OS they use as long as they can buy it
>> Preloaded with some apps and then use it with few problems.  Linux on the
>> Desktop COULD do that if they could come up with a single commercial
>> Version.  Then let the plethora of distros stick around for geeks and
>> Hobbyists.
>>
>> Of course, that won't happen.
>>
>>
>
> Many large retailers have tried selling PCs with Linux pre-installed,
> every single case has been a complete and utter failure.

I still remember how "successful" Lindows was.

-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/18/2015 10:53:03 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>>>>>> but by far
>>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that
>>>>>> up.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>>
>>>>> Another person who can't read.
>>>>
>>>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>>>> interested in the response.
>>>>
>>>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>>>
>>>> FOR WHAT?
>>>>
>>>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is
>>>> a never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what
>>>> Linux is useful for -- and successful at.
>>>>
>>>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>>>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>>>> still go unheeded.)
>>>>
>>>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in
>>>>> particular the lack of leadership and focus.
>>>>
>>>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>>>
>>>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>>>>    You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>>>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
>>>> successful."
>>>>
>>>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy,
>>>> dude!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print
>>>>> system to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and
>>>>> have been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>>>
>>>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>>>
>>>> No I didn't.
>>>>
>>>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>>>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
>>>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>>>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>>>
>>>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> That's where your problem is.
>>>>
>>>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over
>>>> them".
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>>>
>>>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>>>> wrong.
>>>>
>>>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>>>
>>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is
>>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
>>
>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>
> 
> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
> per se 

Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of server 
blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the 
(bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because it 
was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more powerful in 
any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings around that crap


Idiot

0
Peter
6/18/2015 11:02:18 AM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 18/06/2015 09:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>
>>>>       Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>       then
>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there
>>>> is his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>> trollish rant.
>>>
>>> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
>>> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!
>>
>> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic
>> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?
> 
> No, because I read and understood what was being written.

Translation: Heavy backpedaling is occuring right now
0
Peter
6/18/2015 11:02:59 AM
On 6/16/2015 5:12 PM, vallor wrote:
> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>
>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>> Windows 3x)
>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>> far
>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>> are an
>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>> No wonder you like it
>>>
>>
>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>
>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>
> SO
> FUCKING
> WHAT?


So your hobbyist crapware can't even be given away.




0
DFS
6/18/2015 12:18:03 PM
On 6/16/2015 6:41 PM, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>
>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available), but by
>>>>> far
>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>> are an
>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>
>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the number
>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>
>>> SO
>>> FUCKING
>>> WHAT?
>>
>> Think about it this way.
>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>
> Idiot
>
> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>
> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore install
> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch.


huh?  Look at the low-grade morons here who use Linux: 7, Dumb Willie, 
John Gohde, Nobody, RonG, Tattoo Vampire.

You have to be less intelligent - almost to the point of retarded - to 
run an unstable platform which reduces your choices in software and 
hardware.

Right now, I can only watch YouTube videos for 15 minutes or so before 
the Mint 17.1 hobbyware goes crazy, then locks up.  MS is doomed.



> The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen sink will
> stay with windows

Windows and Macs are the systems of choice for virtually all of the 
smartest people in the world: executives, academics, scientists, engineers.

Watch TV and you won't EVER see a Linux desktop in a science or academia 
show.  eg CERN puts Windows 7 on all new computers.


0
DFS
6/18/2015 12:19:06 PM
On 6/18/2015 6:06 AM, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> chrisv wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> the general consensus seems to be that
>>
>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
>> and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
>> motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>
> And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their desktop system,
> in spite of all these barriers.


Where "*millions*" is approx. 1%, and where the barriers to obtaining 
and installing Linux are practically nil.

What a success!




> It's just that good a system!


Says the Windows developer/QA weenie.





0
DFS
6/18/2015 12:19:57 PM
On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 09:43, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>>
>>>>>        Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>>        then
>>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there
>>>>> is his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>>> trollish rant.
>>>>
>>>> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
>>>> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!
>>>
>>> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic
>>> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?
>>
>> No, because I read and understood what was being written.
>
> Translation: Heavy backpedaling is occuring right now
>

In which strange 4th dimension other world, is my repeatedly saying that 
I read and understood what was being said back-pedalling????
0
Desk
6/18/2015 12:38:56 PM
On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>>>>>>> but by far
>>>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that
>>>>>>> up.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Another person who can't read.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>>>>> interested in the response.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>>>>
>>>>> FOR WHAT?
>>>>>
>>>>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.  It is
>>>>> a never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what
>>>>> Linux is useful for -- and successful at.
>>>>>
>>>>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>>>>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>>>>> still go unheeded.)
>>>>>
>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in
>>>>>> particular the lack of leadership and focus.
>>>>>
>>>>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>>>>
>>>>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly successful.
>>>>>     You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>>>>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux "isn't
>>>>> successful."
>>>>>
>>>>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy,
>>>>> dude!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print
>>>>>> system to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and
>>>>>> have been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>>>>
>>>>> No I didn't.
>>>>>
>>>>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>>>>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping all
>>>>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>>>>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> That's where your problem is.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over
>>>>> them".
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>>>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>>>>
>>>>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>>>>> wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>>>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>>>>
>>>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>>>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>>>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is
>>>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
>>>
>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>
>>
>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>> per se
>
> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of server

The operative words there are "used to"

> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the
> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because it
> was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more powerful in
> any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings around that crap

Now who's moving the discussion? Why are you talking about OSX servers??

Try advocating Linux. Hint: Running down other OS's just by saying "They 
suck" is not advocating Linux. It's just being silly.

>
>
> Idiot
>

Like the new sig. It suits you.

0
Desk
6/18/2015 12:42:30 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
> 
> And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their 
> desktop system, in spite of all these barriers.
> 
> It's just that good a system!

Until you actually look beyond the worldwide
top line stats into just what segments that 
desktop Linux has been "successful" in:  you
immediately find that the OS stats are in
essence skewed to per capita GDP...with the
poorest nations/regions favoring the free
(and also illegally pirated) stuff. 

> It's just that good a system!

Nope, you can't make that claim:  because there
is a price variance versus the competition, your
data is conflated with that variable and you can't
legitimately claim that it is "good", because the
driving favor very well may instead be "cheap".

And given how loudly the COLA boys squeal like pigs
about the "threat" of having to spend all of $20, 
it is indisputable that otherwise trivial costs are
actually a huge influence on your demographic segment.  

The reality is that if someone were to pay you
$20/year to use MS-Windows & MS-Office (and provided
the same), many of you would do so...

....everyone has their price, and what many of the
COLA 'Advocates' have repeatedly demonstrated, their's
is surprisingly low.  


-hh
0
hh
6/18/2015 1:03:07 PM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>

Here: Your idiotic claim

>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>> per se


See? You lying imbecile can't get youir story straight from one post to the 
next

>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>> server
> 
> The operative words there are "used to"

They still sell "OSX Server" 

>> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the
>> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because
>> it was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more
>> powerful in any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings
>> around that crap
> 
> Now who's moving the discussion? Why are you talking about OSX servers??

You try to move it franttically away from your own blunder

0
Peter
6/18/2015 1:31:42 PM
On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>

[deletia]

>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>
>> 
>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>> per se 

    Really? It's a "certified Unix" but it isn't a "server operating system
per se"? It's that a BLATANT contradiction?

    Never mind the fact that the whole distinction between "desktop OS" and
"server OS" is entirely arbitrary. If MacOS is truly a Unix then any variant
should be up to the task of doing server duty.

    Take the training wheels off the iOS on a phone and even THAT should be
a perfectly capable server.

    My first production Sun box had less horsepower, memory, or storage.

>
> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of server 
> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the 
> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because it 
> was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more powerful in 
> any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings around that crap
>
>
> Idiot
>


-- 
     What's the difference between reactionary right-wing authoritarian thought police 
     and progressive 3rd wave feminists?                                                   |||
                                                                                          / | \
     One reads the bible.

0
JEDIDIAH
6/18/2015 1:35:15 PM
On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>
>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>
>>>      Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>      then
>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there is
>>> his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>> trollish rant.
>> 
>> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
>> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!
>
> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic 
> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?
>
> It has *never* been that way. RedHat has always been strong in the server 
> market, as well as SuSE. RedHat never played any significant role on the 
> desktop
>

   I disagree. They were quite effective in the early days as an "ease of use"
distribution. RPM was especially useful. However, they eventually were eclipsed
by others (like Mandrake) and decided to just give up entirely.

   They also at least tried to have a retail presence (unlike canonical).

-- 
     What's the difference between reactionary right-wing authoritarian thought police 
     and progressive 3rd wave feminists?                                                   |||
                                                                                          / | \
     One reads the bible.

0
JEDIDIAH
6/18/2015 1:37:01 PM
On Thu, 18 Jun 2015 06:03:07 -0700 (PDT), -hh wrote:

> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>> 
>> And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their 
>> desktop system, in spite of all these barriers.
>> 
>> It's just that good a system!
> 
> Until you actually look beyond the worldwide
> top line stats into just what segments that 
> desktop Linux has been "successful" in:  you
> immediately find that the OS stats are in
> essence skewed to per capita GDP...with the
> poorest nations/regions favoring the free
> (and also illegally pirated) stuff. 
> 
>> It's just that good a system!
> 
> Nope, you can't make that claim:  because there
> is a price variance versus the competition, your
> data is conflated with that variable and you can't
> legitimately claim that it is "good", because the
> driving favor very well may instead be "cheap".
> 
> And given how loudly the COLA boys squeal like pigs
> about the "threat" of having to spend all of $20, 
> it is indisputable that otherwise trivial costs are
> actually a huge influence on your demographic segment.  
> 
> The reality is that if someone were to pay you
> $20/year to use MS-Windows & MS-Office (and provided
> the same), many of you would do so...
> 
> ...everyone has their price, and what many of the
> COLA 'Advocates' have repeatedly demonstrated, their's
> is surprisingly low.  
> 
> 
> -hh

And apparently so are their requirements.
Using Linux is like building a 5000 sq ft house with hand tools
rather than power tools.
Yes it can be done, but why?

The problem with Linux as a desktop system is that it looks great in
theory. It's only when you actually start to use it that you realize
how much it sucks.
That's the reason why many have tried Linux but so very few stick
with Linux for any reasonable length of time.

At some point the honeymoon phase wears off, the user stops trying to
convince himself and usually all of his friends, family, co-workers
as well, how great Linux is and ultimately dumps Linux. It happens
all the time.

New Linux users love to talk about how "great" Linux is.
What's really fun is to narrow them down to specifics instead of
hyperbole.
That's where they fall apart.
Much like we see here in COLA.

They don't advocate Linux as a superior alternative operating system
because they know it's not so they can't.

And it's entertaining watching them get all huffed up trying to
deflect the questions away from actually demonstrating how Linux is
superior.
0
Tomas
6/18/2015 1:38:50 PM
On 2015-06-18, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
> chrisv wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>>> desk retard wrote:
>>>>
>>>> the general consensus seems to be that 
>>
>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
>> and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
>> motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>
> And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their desktop system,
> in spite of all these barriers.
>
> It's just that good a system!
>

    I suspect that Linux accounts for a much larger portion of the "enthusiast"
market as opposed to just the mindless consumers. You see this with HTPCs which
are a relatively small enthusiast niche.

-- 
     What's the difference between reactionary right-wing authoritarian thought police 
     and progressive 3rd wave feminists?                                                   |||
                                                                                          / | \
     One reads the bible.

0
JEDIDIAH
6/18/2015 1:38:55 PM
JEDIDIAH wrote:

> On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 17/06/2015 17:13, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>>> On 2015-06-17, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote:
>>>>>>> Humberto Lopez wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux: It's people like you doing a poor job of
>>>>>>>> advocating Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nope.  Ask Mark Shuttleworth what it's like trying to penetrate the
>>>>>>> desktop market.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's very difficult but his results have been excellent.
>>>>>> Back in 1997 or so when I started running Linux the word Linux
>>>>>> was associated with Redhat.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bullshit. There were several distros around then
>>>>
>>>>      Plus there was the OSI. If he's really been using Linux that long
>>>>      then
>>>> he really has no excuse for acting as ignorant as he does. Then there
>>>> is his own "Linux == Redhat" remark which kind of self nukes his entire
>>>> trollish rant.
>>> 
>>> I see you are also suffering from the same comprehension failure Peter
>>> suffers from. Hang on, you must be Peter or he is one of your socks!
>>
>> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic
>> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?
>>
>> It has *never* been that way. RedHat has always been strong in the server
>> market, as well as SuSE. RedHat never played any significant role on the
>> desktop
>>
> 
>    I disagree. They were quite effective in the early days as an "ease of
>    use" distribution. RPM was especially useful. 

Yes, it was. But around the same time (1995) the DEB package format appeared 
too. 

> However, they eventually were
> eclipsed by others (like Mandrake) and decided to just give up entirely.

Also Suse, which also adopted RPM as its pakage management system

>    They also at least tried to have a retail presence (unlike canonical).
> 

Well, they actually made the smart move to have 2 distros. RedHat for the 
(generally) commercial use, and Fedora as test-bed for the bleeding edge 
features.
Much the same as Suse does. 
0
Peter
6/18/2015 2:27:34 PM
On 18/06/2015 14:31, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>
> Here: Your idiotic claim
>
>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>>> per se

What's wrong with that? OSX to most people is a desktop OS.

>
>
> See? You lying imbecile can't get youir story straight from one post to the
> next

It was you that brought up the subject of OSx with "Because otherwise 
you have to admit that windows and OSX are an abject failure outside of 
the desktop"

Reading and following a thread are not your strengths are they?


>
>>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>>> server
>>
>> The operative words there are "used to"
>
> They still sell "OSX Server"

Which is software, not hardware. You wrote "They used to have even their 
own line of server blades" and then separately "They still have 'OSX 
Server'"

>
>>> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the
>>> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because
>>> it was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more
>>> powerful in any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings
>>> around that crap
>>
>> Now who's moving the discussion? Why are you talking about OSX servers??
>
> You try to move it franttically away from your own blunder
>

Please feel free to move it back, you seem to be the one in the driving 
seat.

0
Desk
6/18/2015 3:07:39 PM
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

> chrisv wrote:
>>
>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
>> and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
>> motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>
>And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their desktop system,
>in spite of all these barriers.

Indeed.  

Imagine how many would be using Linux if it had name recognition, a
good selection of name-brand systems with Linux pre-installed and
visible in the stores, and the few key commercial apps that people
think that they need.

*Lots* more than what are using it now, obviously!

>It's just that good a system!

Or is that Windows is that bad a system?   8)

-- 
"In this case they don't want a choice. They already chose. They want
a Windows PC."  -  "True Linux advocate" Hadron Quark
0
chrisv
6/18/2015 3:09:25 PM
On 18/06/2015 14:35, JEDIDIAH wrote:
> On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>
> [deletia]
>
>>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>> per se
>
>      Really? It's a "certified Unix" but it isn't a "server operating system
> per se"? It's that a BLATANT contradiction?

No.

>
>      Never mind the fact that the whole distinction between "desktop OS" and
> "server OS" is entirely arbitrary. If MacOS is truly a Unix then any variant
> should be up to the task of doing server duty.

Except that the two perform entirely different functions and require 
completely different configurations both of software and hardware.

>
>      Take the training wheels off the iOS on a phone and even THAT should be
> a perfectly capable server.

ROFL!


0
Desk
6/18/2015 3:10:04 PM
On 18 Jun 2015 10:09, chrisv wrote:
> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>> chrisv wrote:
>>>
>>> ... most people don't want to install their own OS.  Wiping Windows
>>> and installing Linux saves no money.  Only the most informed and
>>> motivated will do it.  Most people are afraid of leaving the herd.
>>
>>And yet *millions* of people use Linux as their desktop system,
>>in spite of all these barriers.
>
> Indeed.
>
> Imagine how many would be using Linux if it had name recognition, a
> good selection of name-brand systems with Linux pre-installed and
> visible in the stores, and the few key commercial apps that people
> think that they need.
>
None of which look to be in the offing!  The lack of a single commercial
Version of Linux for the desktop, with a consistent marketing message will
Keep it relegated to those places it is in now, and that is mostly
Hobbyists and geeks desktops/laptops.

> *Lots* more than what are using it now, obviously!
>
Pure conjecture on your part with no way to ever prove it is a
possibility, it sure isn't a probability!

>>It's just that good a system!
>
> Or is that Windows is that bad a system?   8)
>
Yeah, Windows sucks so bad that hardly anyone uses it every day!

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/18/2015 3:16:24 PM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 18/06/2015 14:35, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>> On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>
>> [deletia]
>>
>>>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX
>>>>> are an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did
>>>>> not even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>>> per se
>>
>>      Really? It's a "certified Unix" but it isn't a "server operating
>>      system
>> per se"? It's that a BLATANT contradiction?
> 
> No.
> 
>>
>>      Never mind the fact that the whole distinction between "desktop OS"
>>      and
>> "server OS" is entirely arbitrary. If MacOS is truly a Unix then any
>> variant should be up to the task of doing server duty.
> 
> Except that the two perform entirely different functions and require
> completely different configurations both of software and hardware.

Idiot

Why not admit that you don't have the tiniest of clues about the difference 
of server / desktop systems?

With windows it is basically a registry entry plus some additional software 
packages, with linux the distinction is totally arbitrary (non-existant) and 
depends mainly on the packages installed, and with OSX it is a additional 
software package

In short: You don't know shit what you are talking about. 
Now go tell your myriad of "clients" how good you are as "server admin"

0
Peter
6/18/2015 3:17:48 PM
Desk Rabbit wrote:

> On 18/06/2015 14:31, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>
>> Here: Your idiotic claim
>>
>>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating
>>>>> system per se
> 
> What's wrong with that? OSX to most people is a desktop OS.

What OSX is to idiots like you is totally irrelevant.
What counts is the facts. And those contradict all your claims

>>
>>
>> See? You lying imbecile can't get youir story straight from one post to
>> the next
> 
> It was you that brought up the subject of OSx with "Because otherwise
> you have to admit that windows and OSX are an abject failure outside of
> the desktop"
> 
> Reading and following a thread are not your strengths are they?

Since when are you allowed to restrict the discussion to the "facts" you 
like?

Windows is a total failure outside the desktop and parts of the server 
market. Emebedded windows is dead (for good reasons), windows on mobile 
devices is next to non-existant

OSX is only present (in low single digit market share) on the desktop.
Apples entries in the server market have failed totally
iOS is derived from OSX, but it is a different code-base for their mobile 
devices

So outside of the desktop (where linux does not look bad compared to OSX) 
linux dwarves the other OS

> 
>>
>>>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>>>> server
>>>
>>> The operative words there are "used to"
>>
>> They still sell "OSX Server"
> 
> Which is software, not hardware. You wrote "They used to have even their
> own line of server blades" and then separately "They still have 'OSX
> Server'"

Which is true. You don't know shit, and it shows with every cretinous post 
you make

0
Peter
6/18/2015 3:25:21 PM
On 18 Jun 2015 17:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 14:31, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>
>>>
>>> Here: Your idiotic claim
>>>
>>>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating
>>>>>> system per se
>>
>> What's wrong with that? OSX to most people is a desktop OS.
>
> What OSX is to idiots like you is totally irrelevant.
> What counts is the facts. And those contradict all your claims
>
>>>
>>>
>>> See? You lying imbecile can't get youir story straight from one post to
>>> the next
>>
>> It was you that brought up the subject of OSx with "Because otherwise
>> you have to admit that windows and OSX are an abject failure outside of
>> the desktop"
>>
>> Reading and following a thread are not your strengths are they?
>
> Since when are you allowed to restrict the discussion to the "facts" you
> like?
>
> Windows is a total failure outside the desktop and parts of the server
> market. Emebedded windows is dead (for good reasons), windows on mobile
> devices is next to non-existant
>
> OSX is only present (in low single digit market share) on the desktop.
> Apples entries in the server market have failed totally
> iOS is derived from OSX, but it is a different code-base for their mobile
> devices
>
> So outside of the desktop (where linux does not look bad compared to OSX)
> linux dwarves the other OS
>
But yet only embedded and server Linux makes money in significant amounts.
 Android might be more prevalent, but it is a sweet way to enjoy low or no
Profits for those mfgs that take that route.

On the desktop and portable devices, the money is in Apple's hands while
The others battle over pennies.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/18/2015 3:35:38 PM
On 6/18/2015 11:25 AM, Peter Köhlmann wrote:


> Windows is a total failure outside the desktop and parts of the server
> market. Emebedded windows is dead (for good reasons), windows on mobile
> devices is next to non-existant


Lying idiot.



0
DFS
6/18/2015 3:45:48 PM
On 18/06/2015 16:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 14:31, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>
>>>
>>> Here: Your idiotic claim
>>>
>>>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating
>>>>>> system per se
>>
>> What's wrong with that? OSX to most people is a desktop OS.
>
> What OSX is to idiots like you is totally irrelevant.

So why did you bring it up?

> What counts is the facts. And those contradict all your claims

Care to list one of these 'facts'?

>
>>>
>>>
>>> See? You lying imbecile can't get youir story straight from one post to
>>> the next

Well you haven't actually shown where I have deviated, you've just 
shouted and sworn a lot.

>>
>> It was you that brought up the subject of OSx with "Because otherwise
>> you have to admit that windows and OSX are an abject failure outside of
>> the desktop"
>>
>> Reading and following a thread are not your strengths are they?
>
> Since when are you allowed to restrict the discussion to the "facts" you
> like?

I'm not, you are driving the conversation by drifting into the subject 
of OSX which you brought up originally. Do keep up.

>
> Windows is a total failure outside the desktop and parts of the server
> market. Emebedded windows is dead (for good reasons), windows on mobile
> devices is next to non-existant
>
> OSX is only present (in low single digit market share) on the desktop.
> Apples entries in the server market have failed totally

A low single digit market share that despite being on dedicated hardware 
at a premium price still outstrips Linux Desktop's market share.

> iOS is derived from OSX, but it is a different code-base for their mobile
> devices

I doubt that is the case but to be honest I don;t really know or care 
what iOS is based on. It's not a Desktop OS so is not relevant when 
talking about Desktop OSes.


>
> So outside of the desktop (where linux does not look bad compared to OSX)
> linux dwarves the other OS

If you mean in being a simple web server server, I'd not argue against 
that. Linux pretty much has the Web server market place sewn up.

>
>>
>>>
>>>>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>>>>> server
>>>>
>>>> The operative words there are "used to"
>>>
>>> They still sell "OSX Server"
>>
>> Which is software, not hardware. You wrote "They used to have even their
>> own line of server blades" and then separately "They still have 'OSX
>> Server'"
>
> Which is true. You don't know shit, and it shows with every cretinous post
> you make
>

You might to read what you just wrote there. First you agree that I've 
stated correctly then you say I don't know anything.

You just can't help yourself with the insults, it's like an electronic 
form of tourettes with you. ;-)
0
Desk
6/18/2015 3:48:53 PM
On 18/06/2015 16:17, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>
>> On 18/06/2015 14:35, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>>> On 2015-06-18, Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>> [deletia]
>>>
>>>>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>>>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX
>>>>>> are an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>>>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did
>>>>>> not even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>>>> per se
>>>
>>>       Really? It's a "certified Unix" but it isn't a "server operating
>>>       system
>>> per se"? It's that a BLATANT contradiction?
>>
>> No.
>>
>>>
>>>       Never mind the fact that the whole distinction between "desktop OS"
>>>       and
>>> "server OS" is entirely arbitrary. If MacOS is truly a Unix then any
>>> variant should be up to the task of doing server duty.
>>
>> Except that the two perform entirely different functions and require
>> completely different configurations both of software and hardware.
>
> Idiot

You put your sig at the top!

>
> Why not admit that you don't have the tiniest of clues about the difference
> of server / desktop systems?

You can't have it both ways, either there is or there isn't a 
difference. Which side of the fence would you like to be on?

>
> With windows it is basically a registry entry plus some additional software
> packages, with linux the distinction is totally arbitrary (non-existant) and
> depends mainly on the packages installed, and with OSX it is a additional
> software package

So we agree agree, they are different things. If they were the same they 
would require no changes or additions.

>
> In short: You don't know shit what you are talking about.
> Now go tell your myriad of "clients" how good you are as "server admin"
>

Well they are very happy that we don't install server operating systems 
on desktop hardware. That's because as you have shown, Servers and 
Desktops are two different things.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 3:52:34 PM
On 18/06/2015 16:45, DFS wrote:
> On 6/18/2015 11:25 AM, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>
>
>> Windows is a total failure outside the desktop and parts of the server
>> market. Emebedded windows is dead (for good reasons), windows on mobile
>> devices is next to non-existant
>
>
> Lying idiot.
>
>
>

That's his default mode. It just goes downhill from there and gets more 
and more bizarre.
0
Desk
6/18/2015 3:54:17 PM
On 6/18/15, 12:12 AM, in article mltqtm$mrk$3@dont-email.me, "Peter
K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

>>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>>> 
>>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>>> 
>> More insults from you.
> 
> Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is
> declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
> I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying imbecile
> here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.

See: more insults from you - you fear speaking of Linux.

And, no, I am not interested in your fantasizes of my unquotable lies,
whatever that even means.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 4:07:18 PM
On 6/18/15, 1:40 AM, in article mlu043$bej$2@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it is now
>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how successful is
>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
> 
> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are an
> abject failure outside of the desktop

I do not think anyone says that OS X, at least, really is a great solution
off the desktop and, perhaps, small server needs. I know I do not. Heck, for
servers and super computers and the like Linux tends to be the best
solution.

> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard



-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 4:08:33 PM
On 6/18/15, 3:11 AM, in article mlu5es$tsf$3@deskrabbit.motzarella.org,
"Desk Rabbit" <me@example.com> wrote:

>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are an
>> abject failure outside of the desktop
>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>> 
> 
> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
> per se so if you are going to compare Linux and OSX you HAVE to compare
> it with Linux Desktop otherwise you are not comparing apples with
> apples. That's a fairly simple concept.

Right. In looking at embedded devices or big servers or super computers OS X
is a non-starter. Linux "wins". OK.

I do not think anyone denies this. We can harp on it on every post but I do
not see the value.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 4:09:36 PM
On 6/18/15, 4:02 AM, in article mlu8db$aef$1@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did not
>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>> 
>> 
>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>> per se 
> 
> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of server
> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the
> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because it
> was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more powerful in
> any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings around that crap
> 
> 
> Idiot

OS X can work well for small server needs... at one time Apple tried to push
into larger uses and they failed. Yup. They made no real inroads in that
market and OS X was not a good fit.

Now, without the hardware and with a change of focus of OS X Server, it is
even less of a fit for big server needs.

Is anyone saying otherwise? You act like people are pushing for OS X for
large server needs. Weird.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 4:11:11 PM
On 6/18/15, 5:42 AM, in article mlue98$upk$2@deskrabbit.motzarella.org,
"Desk Rabbit" <me@example.com> wrote:

>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>> per se
>> 
>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of server
> 
> The operative words there are "used to"

Right... they tried to get into that market and when they did not do well
they pulled out. OK.

>> blades. They still have "OSX Server". Yet their server OS, despite the
>> (bullshit) claims of it "easy to administer" was a total failure. Because it
>> was neither "easier" to admin as a linux server nor was it more powerful in
>> any way. A linux server on comparable hardware ran rings around that crap
> 
> Now who's moving the discussion? Why are you talking about OSX servers??

Peter works to move away from talking about the desktop because that is the
area he and his herd likes to lie about.

> Try advocating Linux. Hint: Running down other OS's just by saying "They
> suck" is not advocating Linux. It's just being silly.

That is why I ask for examples of where desktop Linux serves people better
than the competition. The herd has a very hard time coming up with examples
other than price and running on old hardware.
 
>> Idiot
>> 
> 
> Like the new sig. It suits you.



-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 4:12:58 PM
The lying imbecile Snit Michel Glasser snotted:

> On 6/18/15, 12:12 AM, in article mltqtm$mrk$3@dont-email.me, "Peter
> Köhlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
> 
>>>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>>>> 
>>>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>>>> 
>>> More insults from you.
>> 
>> Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is
>> declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
>> I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying
>> imbecile here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.
> 
> See: more insults from you - you fear speaking of Linux.

It would only be insults if it weren't true
And no, I will not discuss linux with you. You are not worth anything


So pray tell: Why did you assume that you are the only lying imbecile in 
COLA? After all it is well known that Slimer, Desk Rabbit and your latest 
incarnation "Humberto Lopez" strive very hardly to be as lunatic as you are
0
Peter
6/18/2015 4:32:56 PM
On 6/18/15, 9:32 AM, in article mlurp9$npv$1@dont-email.me, "Peter K�hlmann"
<peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:

> The lying imbecile Snit Michel Glasser snotted:
> 
>> On 6/18/15, 12:12 AM, in article mltqtm$mrk$3@dont-email.me, "Peter
>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>> 
>>>>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>>>>> 
>>>> More insults from you.
>>> 
>>> Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is
>>> declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
>>> I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying
>>> imbecile here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.
>> 
>> See: more insults from you - you fear speaking of Linux.
> 
> It would only be insults if it weren't true
> And no, I will not discuss linux with you. You are not worth anything
> 
> 
> So pray tell: Why did you assume that you are the only lying imbecile in
> COLA? After all it is well known that Slimer, Desk Rabbit and your latest
> incarnation "Humberto Lopez" strive very hardly to be as lunatic as you are

Again: not a word about Linux from you... just mindless, herd-pleasing
insults.

It is all you have.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 5:23:58 PM
On 18 Jun 2015 18:32, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
> The lying imbecile Snit Michel Glasser snotted:
>
>> On 6/18/15, 12:12 AM, in article mltqtm$mrk$3@dont-email.me, "Peter
>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>>>>>
>>>> More insults from you.
>>>
>>> Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is
>>> declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
>>> I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying
>>> imbecile here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.
>>
>> See: more insults from you - you fear speaking of Linux.
>
> It would only be insults if it weren't true
> And no, I will not discuss linux with you. You are not worth anything
>
>
> So pray tell: Why did you assume that you are the only lying imbecile in
> COLA? After all it is well known that Slimer, Desk Rabbit and your latest
> incarnation "Humberto Lopez" strive very hardly to be as lunatic as you are
>
So now in addition to the snide and nasty remarks, we can add dodging and
Weaving to your skills.
Too bad that you don't know much else by all indications.

-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/18/2015 5:29:56 PM
On 6/18/15, 10:29 AM, in article cugdgnFlfk8U1@mid.individual.net, "Lloyd
Parsons" <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:

> On 18 Jun 2015 18:32, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>> The lying imbecile Snit Michel Glasser snotted:
>> 
>>> On 6/18/15, 12:12 AM, in article mltqtm$mrk$3@dont-email.me, "Peter
>>> K�hlmann" <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> wrote:
>>> 
>>>>>>>> Your welcome, lying imbecile
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Why piggy back in a way that makes it seem you are responding to me?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Do you really think that you are the only lying imbecile in COLA?
>>>>>> 
>>>>> More insults from you.
>>>> 
>>>> Nope. It was you yourself who wrongly assumed that whenever someone is
>>>> declared to be a "lying imbecile" that it is talk about you.
>>>> I only corrected your wrong assumption that you are the only lying
>>>> imbecile here. You are not. You are just simply the worst of the lot.
>>> 
>>> See: more insults from you - you fear speaking of Linux.
>> 
>> It would only be insults if it weren't true
>> And no, I will not discuss linux with you. You are not worth anything
>> 
>> 
>> So pray tell: Why did you assume that you are the only lying imbecile in
>> COLA? After all it is well known that Slimer, Desk Rabbit and your latest
>> incarnation "Humberto Lopez" strive very hardly to be as lunatic as you are
>> 
> So now in addition to the snide and nasty remarks, we can add dodging and
> Weaving to your skills.
> Too bad that you don't know much else by all indications.

He is obsessed with my unquotable lies.

I still do not even know what the concept means - how can someone lie in a
text medium in ways that cannot be quoted and shown? It is just his way of
avoiding speaking of Linux. He fears doing so.


-- 
* Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu:     <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE>
* Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs?     <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA>
* Mint KDE working with folders:    <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0>
* Mint KDE creating files:          <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8>
* Mint KDE help:                    <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8>
* Mint KDE general navigation:      <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI>
* Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux:     <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk>
* OS / Word Processor Comparison:   <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>

0
Snit
6/18/2015 5:36:49 PM
On Thu, 18 Jun 2015 10:43:20 +0200, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> So you too are that abjectly stupid that you really believe that idiotic
> bullshit about "RedHat == linux in 1997"?
> 
> It has *never* been that way. RedHat has always been strong in the
> server market, as well as SuSE. RedHat never played any significant role
> on the desktop

So has "Desk Rabbit" taken up "Humberto's" stupidity? Obviously neither 
has ever heard of Debian, Turbolinux, Slackware, Vector Linux, Mandrake, 
Connectiva, Caldera, Corel/Xandros, Yellow Dog, Red Flag, Libranet, 
Lindows, S.u.S.E. and a score of others that existed at the time. Or, if 
they do know, they keep repeating the same lie in hopes that we'll adopt 
their stupidity.

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/18/2015 9:19:29 PM
On Thu, 18 Jun 2015 08:38:55 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:

>    I suspect that Linux accounts for a much larger portion of the
>     "enthusiast"
> market as opposed to just the mindless consumers. You see this with
> HTPCs which are a relatively small enthusiast niche.

Nothing to be enthusiastic about with Windows ... and Mac users (at least 
the iCultists within the Mac user base) are too busy thralling to how 
much Apple gouge$ them for to worry about the quality of the OS. 

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/18/2015 9:22:56 PM
On 2015-06-18 8:19 AM, DFS wrote:
> On 6/16/2015 6:41 PM, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>
>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>> but by
>>>>>> far
>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically those
>>>>>> are an
>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>
>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than the
>>>>> number
>>>>> of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>
>>>> SO
>>>> FUCKING
>>>> WHAT?
>>>
>>> Think about it this way.
>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>
>> Idiot
>>
>> It would not change anything from the current situation.
>>
>> Which is that people who just won't take that shoddy windows anymore
>> install
>> linux instead. In short: The ones intelligent enough will switch.
>
>
> huh?  Look at the low-grade morons here who use Linux: 7, Dumb Willie,
> John Gohde, Nobody, RonG, Tattoo Vampire.
>
> You have to be less intelligent - almost to the point of retarded - to
> run an unstable platform which reduces your choices in software and
> hardware.
>
> Right now, I can only watch YouTube videos for 15 minutes or so before
> the Mint 17.1 hobbyware goes crazy, then locks up.  MS is doomed.

I'm sure you appreciate the Youtube videos a lot more as a result of 
knowing that it can be taken away from you at any time, sort of like a 
Jew who had starved for years before being liberated and fed by the 
Allies. Thank Linux!

>> The majority which is barely smart enough to not shit into the kitchen
>> sink will
>> stay with windows
>
> Windows and Macs are the systems of choice for virtually all of the
> smartest people in the world: executives, academics, scientists, engineers.
>
> Watch TV and you won't EVER see a Linux desktop in a science or academia
> show.  eg CERN puts Windows 7 on all new computers.

All of the people I've ever met who used Linux were fat, had stains on 
their shirts, wore short until the first snowfall and emitted an 
unidentifiable odour.


-- 
Slimer
Proud "wintroll"
Encrypt.
0
Slimer
6/18/2015 9:25:51 PM
On 06/18/2015 05:42 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>
>>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter Köhlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>>>>>>>> but by far
>>>>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that
>>>>>>>> up.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>>>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Another person who can't read.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>>>>>> interested in the response.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> FOR WHAT?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense. 
>>>>>> It is
>>>>>> a never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what
>>>>>> Linux is useful for -- and successful at.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>>>>>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>>>>>> still go unheeded.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in
>>>>>>> particular the lack of leadership and focus.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly
>>>>>> successful.
>>>>>>     You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>>>>>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux
>>>>>> "isn't
>>>>>> successful."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy,
>>>>>> dude!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print
>>>>>>> system to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and
>>>>>>> have been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No I didn't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>>>>>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping
>>>>>> all
>>>>>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>>>>>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That's where your problem is.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over
>>>>>> them".
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>>>>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>>>>>> wrong.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>>>>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it
>>>>>> is now
>>>>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>>>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>>>>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how
>>>>> successful is
>>>>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
>>>>
>>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did
>>>> not
>>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>> per se
>>
>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>> server
> 
> The operative words there are "used to"

There are still OS X servers deployed, and Apple still supports the
server version of OS X.

But this "used to" is very telling -- because it is tacit admission that
Apple has thrown in the towel.  _That_ is failure.

So, by your standards, *OS X* is a complete and utter *failure*.

Oh, I'm sorry -- is that not a fair assessment?  NO SHIT.

-- 
 -v

An ounce of clear truth is worth a pound of obfuscation.

0
vallor
6/18/2015 9:27:08 PM
On Thu, 18 Jun 2015 17:17:48 +0200, Peter Köhlmann wrote:

> Idiot
> 
> Why not admit that you don't have the tiniest of clues about the
> difference of server / desktop systems?
> 
> With windows it is basically a registry entry plus some additional
> software packages, with linux the distinction is totally arbitrary
> (non-existant) and depends mainly on the packages installed, and with
> OSX it is a additional software package
> 
> In short: You don't know shit what you are talking about.
> Now go tell your myriad of "clients" how good you are as "server admin"

I remember when O'Reilly's published the hack that allowed Windows users 
to change their desktop Windows into Windows server. And you're right, it 
amounted to some Registry changes. I guess "Desk Rabbit" has forgotten 
that.

-- 
To WinDrones and iCultists obsessed with Linux. Get a life.
0
ronb
6/18/2015 9:27:56 PM
On 18 Jun 2015 14:27, vallor wrote:
> On 06/18/2015 05:42 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>> On 18/06/2015 12:02, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 18/06/2015 09:40, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>> Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 17/06/2015 21:50, vallor wrote:
>>>>>>> On 06/17/2015 05:00 AM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-17, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:36 PM, Humberto Lopez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2015-06-16, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 06/16/2015 03:23 AM, Desk Rabbit wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 16/06/2015 10:25, Peter K�hlmann wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have used all windows versions from win-386 (the precursor to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Windows 3x)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to Win10 (although the latter one only in the betas available),
>>>>>>>>>>>>> but by far
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the worst of all of them are win8, win8.1 and win10. Basically
>>>>>>>>>>>>> those are an
>>>>>>>>>>>>> insult to users with an IQ higher than room temperature.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> No wonder you like it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with you on Windows 8 and 8.1.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I'll wager that Windows 10 will *sell* far more than
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> number of Linux Desktops that can be given away.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> SO
>>>>>>>>>>> FUCKING
>>>>>>>>>>> WHAT?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Think about it this way.
>>>>>>>>>> Every one of those sales is a lost opportunity for Linux.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Interesting claim.  Will be interesting to see if you can back that
>>>>>>>>> up.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Of course, you _do_ realize that Linux success doesn't have to be
>>>>>>>>> measured in terms of retail usage, right?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Another person who can't read.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know why I'm bothering at this point, but readers might be
>>>>>>> interested in the response.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lost opportunity means a person running Windows instead of Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> FOR WHAT?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Seriously, please stop with this "context is desktop" nonsense.
>>>>>>> It is
>>>>>>> a never-ending fallacy, and an attempt to limit discussion of what
>>>>>>> Linux is useful for -- and successful at.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (For the reader:  this gentleman has also been corrected on this
>>>>>>> numerous times, but I'm posting this so that you can see that it will
>>>>>>> still go unheeded.)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The problem isn't Linux, the problem is the community and in
>>>>>>>> particular the lack of leadership and focus.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> WHAT PROBLEM?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You keep saying there is a "problem", while Linux is wildly
>>>>>>> successful.
>>>>>>>     You have simply picked pretty much the only metric by which a few
>>>>>>> people can even hope to say -- if you squint right -- that Linux
>>>>>>> "isn't
>>>>>>> successful."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Narrowing down the discussion "just so" is some kick-ass advocacy,
>>>>>>> dude!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Snit posted about how the fsf has been trying to unify the print
>>>>>>>> system to present the user with common, consistent dialog boxes and
>>>>>>>> have been at it since 2006 I believe?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the group jumped all over him for posting it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No I didn't.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I posted about how my print dialog boxes are consistent, except for
>>>>>>> Chrome.  In other words, I corrected the guy.  If that is "jumping
>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>> over him", then kindly go back to my post and follow up to it,
>>>>>>> explaining exactly my error?  Looked pretty civil to me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Clearly, _you_ are the one "who can't read".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That's where your problem is.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Not my problem.  Disagreeing with someone isn't "jumping all over
>>>>>>> them".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If something as simple as that can't
>>>>>>>> be remedied in 9 years,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As I already said (and I tire of repeating myself with you), Snit was
>>>>>>> wrong.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> convincing big companies or municipalities
>>>>>>>> to switch to Linux is a virtual impossibility.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Big companies have "switched to Linux" for two decades, where it
>>>>>>> is now
>>>>>>> a dominant force in computing.  You just continue to try to misdirect
>>>>>>> from that simple fact -- gee, why would you do _that_, hmmm?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> OK, let's make it easier. Most times in here the discussion revolves
>>>>>> around Windows and primevally the Desktop version so, how
>>>>>> successful is
>>>>>> Desktop Linux compared to Windows Desktop?
>>>>>
>>>>> Most of the time you lying ilk want to move the discussion in that
>>>>> direction. Because otherwise you have to admit that windows and OSX are
>>>>> an abject failure outside of the desktop
>>>>> Apple was smart enough to build iOS for their mobile divices. MS did
>>>>> not
>>>>> even have the smarts to see the errors of their way in that regard
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>>> per se
>>>
>>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>>> server
>>
>> The operative words there are "used to"
>
> There are still OS X servers deployed, and Apple still supports the
> server version of OS X.
>
> But this "used to" is very telling -- because it is tacit admission that
> Apple has thrown in the towel.  _That_ is failure.
>
> So, by your standards, *OS X* is a complete and utter *failure*.
>
> Oh, I'm sorry -- is that not a fair assessment?  NO SHIT.
>
You linuxloons are so full of shit, and it seems to get worse every day.

Apple got out of the server business because it wasn't selling in the kind
Of numbers and at the profit level they wanted.


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/18/2015 9:37:15 PM
On 18 Jun 2015 21:22, ronb wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Jun 2015 08:38:55 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:
>
>>    I suspect that Linux accounts for a much larger portion of the
>>     "enthusiast"
>> market as opposed to just the mindless consumers. You see this with
>> HTPCs which are a relatively small enthusiast niche.
>
> Nothing to be enthusiastic about with Windows ... and Mac users (at least
> the iCultists within the Mac user base) are too busy thralling to how
> much Apple gouge$ them for to worry about the quality of the OS.
>
Some more utter crap from the hobby lobby!


-- 
Lloyd

0
Lloyd
6/18/2015 9:38:00 PM
On 6/18/15, 2:27 PM, in article
558337ac$0$24427$c3e8da3$f6268168@news.astraweb.com, "vallor"
<vallor@cultnix.org> wrote:

>>>> Not trying to move the discussion. OSX is not a server operating system
>>>> per se
>>> 
>>> Tell that "fact" to apple. They used to have even their own line of
>>> server
>> 
>> The operative words there are "used to"
> 
> There are still OS X servers deployed, and Apple still supports the
> server version of OS X.

Right... but they have moved out of the market to a large extent and to the
extent they are in it they focus only on smaller servers. This makes sense
given how their GUI expertise is not as big of an issue for large servers as
it is desktops and even small servers.

> But this "used to" is very telling -- because it is tacit admission that
> Apple has thrown in the towel.  _That_ is failure.

Right: they tried to get into that market and failed.

> So, by your standards, *OS X* is a complete and utter *failure*.

That is a bizarre twisting of his words. Why?
 
> Oh, I'm sorry -- is that not a fair assessment?  NO SHIT.

But it is the one *you* made. Not him.

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