f



Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share

<quote>
Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share

Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP has 
dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that Windows XP 
has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
</quote>

http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/




0
zeke947 (1328)
4/9/2011 2:12:26 PM
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Ezekiel wrote:

> 
> <quote>
> Windows 7


Troll!!!!


This is a Linux newsgroup. 

0
4/9/2011 3:10:52 PM
"7" <email_at_www_at_enemygadgets_dot_com@enemygadgets.com> wrote in message 
news:8G_np.13723$o81.9536@newsfe28.ams2...
> Ezekiel wrote:
>
>
> This is a Linux newsgroup.
>

And you're a liar and a fraud.

Nanobot European Inventor of the Year scumbag.



0
zeke947 (1328)
4/9/2011 3:33:11 PM
"7" <email_at_www_at_enemygadgets_dot_com@enemygadgets.com> schreef in 
bericht news:8G_np.13723$o81.9536@newsfe28.ams2...
> Ezekiel wrote:
>
>>
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7
>
>
> Troll!!!!
>
>
> This is a Linux *TROLL* newsgroup.
>

Thanks, you fit into this group excellently!!!!!!
Description of comp.os.linux.advocacy (C.O.L.A.), it serves no *useful* 
purpose.
* The purpose of comp.os.linux.advocacy is to serve as a forum for 
*Microsoft* *bashers* .
* comp.os.linux.advocacy is not an advocacy group.
* Linux advocacy is off-topic in COLA.
* comp.os.linux.advocacy is a *troll* *group*.
* *Cola* *loons* ** ensure that their posts are littered with lots of swear 
words.

** meet the Cola loons: http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
--
ChuckIT, moderator 

0
ChuckIT (30)
4/9/2011 3:44:35 PM
On Sat, 9 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

> <quote>
> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
> 
> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP has 
> dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that Windows XP 
> has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
> </quote>
> 
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/

Where is desktop Linux?
You know, the free operating system that is ignored by just about
everyone.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 3:50:25 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 16:10:52 +0100, 7 wrote:

> Ezekiel wrote:
> 
>> 
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7
> 
> 
> Troll!!!!
> 
> 
> This is a Linux newsgroup.

No it's not.
COLA is a Microsoft hate group.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 3:53:50 PM
On 4/9/2011 10:12 AM, Ezekiel wrote:
> <quote>
> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>
> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP has
> dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that Windows XP
> has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
> </quote>
>
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>
>
>
>

It was bound to happen sooner or later, as one could see it happening in 
various corporations in the US  -- Win 7 and Vista replacing XP.
0
Big
4/9/2011 5:46:06 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 13:46:06 -0400, Big Steel wrote:

> On 4/9/2011 10:12 AM, Ezekiel wrote:
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP has
>> dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that Windows XP
>> has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> It was bound to happen sooner or later, as one could see it happening in 
> various corporations in the US  -- Win 7 and Vista replacing XP.

As the warranties expire on systems, corporations buy new, with a new
warranty rather than extend the older hardware which gets located to
less mission critical situations or sold/donated.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 6:09:04 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

> <quote>
> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
> 
> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now. </quote>
> 
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
desktop-os-market-share/

Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy new 
computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is that, 
technically, a Windows 7 machine?

-- 
RonB
Registered Linux User #498581 
CentOS 5.5 or VectorLinux Deluxe 6.0
& Linux Mint 10 (for now)
0
ronb02noSPAM (7426)
4/9/2011 6:48:27 PM
On Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:48:27 +0000 (UTC), RonB wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
> 
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>> 
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now. </quote>
>> 
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
> desktop-os-market-share/
> 
> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy new 
> computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is that, 
> technically, a Windows 7 machine?

Well you Linux loons were counting Linux netbooks sold with Linux but
wiped for Windows, which was most of them, so yes, in that case it
counts.

It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though.
Windows 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is
nothing you Linux weirdos can do about it.

You had many opportunities, like Vista, Bob, Windows ME and other MS
screw ups, but people just don't want Linux.
They don't want it for free and they certainly aren't interested in
paying for it.

Information in my sig.

Desktop Linux is dead for all but a niche crowd.



-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 6:54:53 PM
On 4/9/2011 2:48 PM, RonB wrote:
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
>
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.</quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
> desktop-os-market-share/
>
> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy new
> computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is that,
> technically, a Windows 7 machine?
>

Corporations are no more doing that then there is a man in the Moon. I 
have seen a lot of Windows 7 and Vista machines replacing XP in 
corporations.

Typical Linux Advocacy BS they have always always got excuses. They got 
an excuse that Win 7 is not replacing XP. :)

It's like the Civil War in the US. The North was the reality check on 
the South's dream. There is the MS and Windows O/S realilty check and 
the splintered Linux grass hope dreams. :)
0
Big
4/9/2011 6:58:31 PM
Ezekiel wrote:
> <quote>
> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
> 
> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
> </quote>
> 
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
> desktop-os-market-share/

From the same page:

<quote>
According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US for 
April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally 
leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
</quote>

StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter 
statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now have 
a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from 
those numbers.

Regards.

0
nomail6807 (1699)
4/9/2011 7:20:14 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:20:14 +0100, Lusotec wrote:

> Ezekiel wrote:
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>> 
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>> 
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>> desktop-os-market-share/
> 
> From the same page:
> 
> <quote>
> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US for 
> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally 
> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
> </quote>
> 
> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter 
> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now have 
> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from 
> those numbers.
> 
> Regards.

Except when Linux shows up favorable in these type of counters.
Then all of a sudden it's a legitimate method of measurement.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 7:27:50 PM
On 4/9/2011 3:20 PM, Lusotec wrote:
> Ezekiel wrote:
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>> desktop-os-market-share/
>
>  From the same page:
>
> <quote>
> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US for
> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
> </quote>
>
> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now have
> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from
> those numbers.

You are no expert on anything. What makes you right and the stats wrong?
0
Big
4/9/2011 7:29:57 PM
"flatfish+++" <flatfish@marianatrench.com> schreef in bericht 
news:19m05zebzlpom$.16ixpv4mlq4zr.dlg@40tude.net...
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 13:46:06 -0400, Big Steel wrote:
>
>> On 4/9/2011 10:12 AM, Ezekiel wrote:
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP 
>>> has
>>> dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that 
>>> Windows XP
>>> has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> It was bound to happen sooner or later, as one could see it happening in
>> various corporations in the US  -- Win 7 and Vista replacing XP.
>
> As the warranties expire on systems, corporations buy new, with a new
> warranty rather than extend the older hardware which gets located to
> less mission critical situations or sold/donated.

Of course and I see the development of a nice Goobler selfnuke!
Message-ID: <Ag2op.9453$Dj5.2145@newsfe10.ams2>

>
> -- 
> flatfish+++
> Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
> http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
>
> Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
> "By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta
> in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
> http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html


0
clog_-_wog (697)
4/9/2011 7:30:25 PM
"Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message 
news:inqbhh$c5g$1@dont-email.me...
> Ezekiel wrote:
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>> desktop-os-market-share/
>
> From the same page:
>
> <quote>
> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US 
> for
> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
> </quote>
>
> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now 
> have
> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from
> those numbers.
>

Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number of 
people who use Win7 vs WinXP?



0
zeke947 (1328)
4/9/2011 7:34:02 PM
On Sat, 9 Apr 2011 15:34:02 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

> "Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message 
> news:inqbhh$c5g$1@dont-email.me...
>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>>> desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>> From the same page:
>>
>> <quote>
>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US 
>> for
>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>> </quote>
>>
>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now 
>> have
>> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from
>> those numbers.
>>
> 
> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number of 
> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?

They don't have a suggestion.
They try not to think about it because it's just too painful for them to
bear.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/9/2011 7:36:00 PM
On Saturday 09 April 2011 19:48 RonB wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
> 
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>> 
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now. </quote>
>> 
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
> desktop-os-market-share/
> 
> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy new 
> computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is that, 
> technically, a Windows 7 machine?
> 

What's being talked about there is "Usage".  That is:-

(Number of web hits using Windows 7 as a % of all web hits), compared with 
(Number of web hits using Windows XP as a percentage of all web hits).

It's what I've taken to calling "WebClient Statistics" - the only metric 
that we seem to have, and one which I'm quite happy to use - as long as 
people understand what it is :-)

0
bbgruff (6628)
4/9/2011 7:42:29 PM
"flatfish+++" <flatfish@marianatrench.com> schreef in bericht 
news:1uelabojn8f33$.bt73bs6lpi7u.dlg@40tude.net...
> On Sat, 9 Apr 2011 15:34:02 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
>
>> "Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message
>> news:inqbhh$c5g$1@dont-email.me...
>>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>>> <quote>
>>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>>
>>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>>>> desktop-os-market-share/
>>>
>>> From the same page:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US
>>> for
>>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>>> have
>>> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from
>>> those numbers.
>>>
>>
>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number 
>> of
>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>
> They don't have a suggestion.
> They try not to think about it because it's just too painful for them to
> bear.
>
However it is still a bit early:
When the Windows 8 RC versions are coming, they surpass Linux market share 
within 1 week! 

0
clog_-_wog (697)
4/9/2011 8:19:31 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:42:29 +0100, bbgruff wrote:

> On Saturday 09 April 2011 19:48 RonB wrote:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
>> 
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>> 
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now. </quote>
>>> 
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
xps-
>> desktop-os-market-share/
>> 
>> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy
>> new computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is
>> that, technically, a Windows 7 machine?
>> 
>> 
> What's being talked about there is "Usage".  That is:-
> 
> (Number of web hits using Windows 7 as a % of all web hits), compared
> with (Number of web hits using Windows XP as a percentage of all web
> hits).
> 
> It's what I've taken to calling "WebClient Statistics" - the only metric
> that we seem to have, and one which I'm quite happy to use - as long as
> people understand what it is :-)

Okay, thanks. So, at the very least, it shows trends.

-- 
RonB
Registered Linux User #498581 
CentOS 5.5 or VectorLinux Deluxe 6.0
& Linux Mint 10 (for now)
0
ronb02noSPAM (7426)
4/9/2011 8:54:02 PM
Ezekiel wrote:
> "Lusotec" wrote:
>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
>>> xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>> From the same page:
>>
>> <quote>
>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US
>> for
>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>> </quote>
>>
>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken 
>> from those numbers.
> 
> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number of
> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?

I don't know how to estimate the "number of people". As for the number of 
*systems* connected to the internet with a public IP, I would randomly 
select a sample of IPs and using port scanning would determine the OS. This 
method has several practical problems (e.g. legal, technical, cost).

Some of the problems of this method are:
- port scanning may be illegal;
- distributed port scanning would be required to prevent triggering port 
scanning counter measures;
- desktops systems running servers like services may be mistaken as server 
systems;
- systems private IPs will not be scanned;
- systems not connected to the internet will not be counted.

Some of the advantages over web traffic statistics:
- less affected by dynamic IPs. IP ranges/networks can be scanned in a 
relatively short ammount of time compared to IP dynamic changes;
- not affected by the tracker being blocked (e.g. HTTP blocked, javascript 
disabled, cookies blocked);
- not affected by "User-Agent" settings;
- not affected by the user behavior (e.g. what sites and how many times the 
user visits);
- statistical hypothesis tests can be done on the data.

One more comment on the StatCounter numbers. "31.71%" and "31.56%" numbers 
have 4 significant digits. Either StatCounter has a incredibly precise way 
to make these measurements (they don't) or they have no clue about 
statistics, and measurement errors, or they don't really care.

Regards.

0
nomail6807 (1699)
4/9/2011 9:21:33 PM
On Saturday 09 April 2011 21:54 RonB wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:42:29 +0100, bbgruff wrote:
> 
>> On Saturday 09 April 2011 19:48 RonB wrote:
>> 
>>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
>>> 
>>>> <quote>
>>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>> 
>>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>>>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>>>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now. </quote>
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
> xps-
>>> desktop-os-market-share/
>>> 
>>> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy
>>> new computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is
>>> that, technically, a Windows 7 machine?
>>> 
>>> 
>> What's being talked about there is "Usage".  That is:-
>> 
>> (Number of web hits using Windows 7 as a % of all web hits), compared
>> with (Number of web hits using Windows XP as a percentage of all web
>> hits).
>> 
>> It's what I've taken to calling "WebClient Statistics" - the only metric
>> that we seem to have, and one which I'm quite happy to use - as long as
>> people understand what it is :-)
> 
> Okay, thanks. So, at the very least, it shows trends.

Indeed :-)
Various sources of statistics show very different figures.
The median of the 8-or-so usually-quoted sources shows (for example) Linux 
to be at about 1.77% of NetClient accesses in March worldwide.
That may or may not be accurate.  The more-interesting fact is that that 
median was at 1.66% in February.... as you say, a trend, and one that the 
Linux Detractors don't like very much :-)

0
bbgruff (6628)
4/9/2011 9:45:25 PM
On Saturday 09 April 2011 20:34 Ezekiel wrote:

> 
> "Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message 
> news:inqbhh$c5g$1@dont-email.me...
>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
xps-
>>> desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>> From the same page:
>>
>> <quote>
>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US 
>> for
>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>> </quote>
>>
>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now 
>> have
>> a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken from
>> those numbers.
>>
> 
> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number of 
> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?

I think that you are right, as far as your argument goes.
i.e. the only figures commonly available to us are NetClient figures - 
meaning % of web accesses made at a large number of sites, by which OS.

After that though, there *are* problems.
For instance, the quoted blog says "Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of 
desktops in the US, while Windows XP has dropped to 31.56%"

That isn't what they show at all.
What they show is that W7 was used for 31.71% of web accesses (on the 
monitored sites), and XP on 31.56% of web accesses on those sites.
My point is that it need not be a Desktop that's being used - unless one 
includes in "Desktop" all Netbooks etc.

I'm not contradicting the figures.  Merely pointing out that as time goes 
on, it is going to become increasingly important for us here to understand 
what the figures are that we quote, and to be prepared to define our terms.

0
bbgruff (6628)
4/9/2011 9:57:47 PM
"Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message 
news:inqila$2a5$1@dont-email.me...
> Ezekiel wrote:
>> "Lusotec" wrote:
>>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>>> <quote>
>>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>>
>>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
>>>> xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>>
>>> From the same page:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US
>>> for
>>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken
>>> from those numbers.
>>
>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number 
>> of
>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>
> I don't know how to estimate the "number of people". As for the number of
> *systems* connected to the internet with a public IP, I would randomly
> select a sample of IPs and using port scanning would determine the OS. 
> This
> method has several practical problems (e.g. legal, technical, cost).
>
> Some of the problems of this method are:
> - port scanning may be illegal;
> - distributed port scanning would be required to prevent triggering port
> scanning counter measures;
> - desktops systems running servers like services may be mistaken as server
> systems;
> - systems private IPs will not be scanned;
> - systems not connected to the internet will not be counted.
>
Other than the possible legal issues and the complete inability to measure 
computers behind a firewall it sounds like an almost viable idea. But in 
reality it falls short of basic web statistics.

The biggest problem with port scanning (should anyone attempt to use it) is 
that it doesn't show what OS people are actually using. If they were to 
port-scan the machines in my house they would get info on all sorts of 
machines that are powered-on but rarely used. From port scanning there isn't 
a way to tell what machine/OS is actually used by someone versus an unused 
machine that just happens to be connected to the network.



> Some of the advantages over web traffic statistics:
> - less affected by dynamic IPs. IP ranges/networks can be scanned in a
> relatively short ammount of time compared to IP dynamic changes;

Most dynamic IPs are long lived. I've had my same Comcast dynamic IP address 
for about 3 years now. And there's no reason why dynamic IPs would help/hurt 
one OS over the other. Any affect of IP addresses changing would affect all 
OSs proportionally.

Regardless of what Rex Ballard likes to constantly claim - there is little 
reason to believe that webstats are based on "IP address." There are simply 
too many computers connected behind a NAT firewall to use this approach. 
Most every building/company in the world would appear as a single IP 
address.



> - not affected by the tracker being blocked (e.g. HTTP blocked, javascript
> disabled, cookies blocked);

Disabling Javascript or Cookies can be done with any OS. I have no reason to 
believe that the number of people doing this is statistically significant or 
that it would favor one OS over the other.


> - not affected by "User-Agent" settings;

Again - statistically insignificant. Very few people even know what a 
"User-Agent" string is. Ask the "Gordon" advocate who made some ridiculous 
post here a few weeks ago about user agent strings which clearly showed he 
had no idea what they are. It's not 2001 any more and spoofing a user-agent 
string is very rarely needed these days. Few people even know what this is 
so the number of people actually doing this would barely register as "noise" 
in the stats.


> - not affected by the user behavior (e.g. what sites and how many times 
> the
> user visits);
This is probably the biggest factor but chosing sites with neutral content 
in widely support formats greatly negates this. I find it interesting that 
web stats are never questioned when the same sources (StatCounter, HitsLink, 
etc) reports positive figures for Firefox.


> - statistical hypothesis tests can be done on the data.
>
Impressive sounding buzz-words but exactly what "statistical hypothesis 
tests" can you do with port scanning data that you can't do with web based 
statistics.



> One more comment on the StatCounter numbers. "31.71%" and "31.56%" numbers
> have 4 significant digits. Either StatCounter has a incredibly precise way
> to make these measurements (they don't) or they have no clue about
> statistics, and measurement errors, or they don't really care.

It's not necessarily StatCounter that released 31.71% and 31.56%. They may 
have simply released the raw numbers in terms of hits/users and the person 
creating the chart may have decided to use two decimal places of precision. 
Possibly because 31% and 31% would have appeared identical and they wanted 
to show how close the numbers are.




0
zeke947 (1328)
4/9/2011 10:04:49 PM
"bbgruff" <bbgruff@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:90c32iFljuU1@mid.individual.net...
> On Saturday 09 April 2011 20:34 Ezekiel wrote:
>
>>
>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number 
>> of
>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>
> I think that you are right, as far as your argument goes.
> i.e. the only figures commonly available to us are NetClient figures -
> meaning % of web accesses made at a large number of sites, by which OS.
>
> After that though, there *are* problems.
> For instance, the quoted blog says "Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of
> desktops in the US, while Windows XP has dropped to 31.56%"
>
> That isn't what they show at all.
> What they show is that W7 was used for 31.71% of web accesses (on the
> monitored sites), and XP on 31.56% of web accesses on those sites.
> My point is that it need not be a Desktop that's being used - unless one
> includes in "Desktop" all Netbooks etc.
>

I think you're taking the authors words too literally. He (or is it a she?) 
could go into a long explanation of exactly what "desktop" means but that 
would detract from the point of the point the article is making. The point 
being that at least in the US - Win7 usage has either surpassed WinXP or 
(for the margin of error case) is very, very close to doing so. It really 
doesn't matter if this happened last week or next month - the larger point 
is that it's happening.



> I'm not contradicting the figures.  Merely pointing out that as time goes
> on, it is going to become increasingly important for us here to understand
> what the figures are that we quote, and to be prepared to define our 
> terms.
>



0
zeke947 (1328)
4/9/2011 10:11:58 PM
On Saturday 09 April 2011 23:11 Ezekiel wrote:

> 
> "bbgruff" <bbgruff@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message 
> news:90c32iFljuU1@mid.individual.net...
>> On Saturday 09 April 2011 20:34 Ezekiel wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number 
>>> of
>>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>>
>> I think that you are right, as far as your argument goes.
>> i.e. the only figures commonly available to us are NetClient figures -
>> meaning % of web accesses made at a large number of sites, by which OS.
>>
>> After that though, there *are* problems.
>> For instance, the quoted blog says "Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of
>> desktops in the US, while Windows XP has dropped to 31.56%"
>>
>> That isn't what they show at all.
>> What they show is that W7 was used for 31.71% of web accesses (on the
>> monitored sites), and XP on 31.56% of web accesses on those sites.
>> My point is that it need not be a Desktop that's being used - unless one
>> includes in "Desktop" all Netbooks etc.
>>
> 
> I think you're taking the authors words too literally. He (or is it a 
she?) 
> could go into a long explanation of exactly what "desktop" means but that 
> would detract from the point of the point the article is making. The point 
> being that at least in the US - Win7 usage has either surpassed WinXP or 
> (for the margin of error case) is very, very close to doing so. It really 
> doesn't matter if this happened last week or next month - the larger point 
> is that it's happening.


Quite so - and as I said, I'm not disputing the figures.
I'm merely commenting on that Leap of Faith - the implicit assumption by the 
author that "it was Windows, so it was a desktop".

As you say, s/he could go into a long explanation as to what a Desktop is, 
but it would be to no avail.  The only figures s/he has, and all that we 
have, are those for web accesses by NetClients.

 
>> I'm not contradicting the figures.  Merely pointing out that as time goes
>> on, it is going to become increasingly important for us here to 
understand
>> what the figures are that we quote, and to be prepared to define our 
>> terms.





0
bbgruff (6628)
4/9/2011 11:13:55 PM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:

> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
> Linux weirdos can do about it.
> 

So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around 
people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 12:54:15 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 15:29:57 -0400, Big Steel wrote:

> On 4/9/2011 3:20 PM, Lusotec wrote:
>> <quote>
>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the
>> US for April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are
>> finally leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>> </quote>
>>
>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be
>> taken from those numbers.
> 
> You are no expert on anything. What makes you right and the stats wrong?

Statistics and logic are hard, eh Big Steel?  It's okay.  I'm sure you're 
still pretty.
0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 12:59:41 AM
anonymous stated in post UvOdnX7vb5oqYj3QnZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@supernews.com on
4/9/11 5:54 PM:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
> 
>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
>> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
>> Linux weirdos can do about it.
>> 
> 
> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?

I enjoy COLA partly for watching how people react.  Look at my discussion
with TomB about why I appreciate his brand of... um... looking for a
non-offensive term... his argumentation.  Sometimes I agree with him;
sometimes I disagree.  It is interesting to figure out when he behaves in
different ways.


-- 
[INSERT .SIG HERE]


0
usenet2 (47889)
4/10/2011 1:00:18 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 15:36:00 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:

> On Sat, 9 Apr 2011 15:34:02 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
> 
>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number
>> of people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
> 
> They don't have a suggestion.
> They try not to think about it because it's just too painful for them to
> bear.

Rarely have I seen such a moronic statement.  WinXP is going away for 
good and Win7 will temporarily take its place.  No one is denying that.  
You're hallucinating.

Go to sleep.  Take a 24 hour break from COLA.  Have you even done that in 
the last 10 years?  Bet you haven't.

Pathetic old man.  It would be sad if you weren't so hateful.  :)

0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 1:05:51 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
> 
>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
>> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
>> Linux weirdos can do about it.
>> 
> 
> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around 
> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?

Hi Roy Culley!!

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 1:08:00 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:00:18 -0700, Snit wrote:

> anonymous stated in post UvOdnX7vb5oqYj3QnZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@supernews.com on
> 4/9/11 5:54 PM:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>> 
>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
>>> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
>>> Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>> 
>> 
>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
> 
> I enjoy COLA partly for watching how people react.  Look at my discussion
> with TomB about why I appreciate his brand of... um... looking for a
> non-offensive term... his argumentation.  Sometimes I agree with him;
> sometimes I disagree.  It is interesting to figure out when he behaves in
> different ways.

It's Roy Culley......

Don't waste your time.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 1:08:28 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:05:51 -0500, anonymous wrote:

> Pathetic old man.  It would be sad if you weren't so hateful.  :)

Hi Roy Culley.
How's the eyeballs going.



-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 1:09:12 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
> 
>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>> 
>> 
> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?

Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on non-
existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7 year 
after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."

So, what do you think? 

-- 
RonB
Registered Linux User #498581 
CentOS 5.5 or VectorLinux Deluxe 6.0
& Linux Mint 10 (for now)
0
ronb02noSPAM (7426)
4/10/2011 1:12:30 AM
On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 01:12:30 +0000 (UTC), RonB wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>> 
>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>> 
>>> 
>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
> 
> Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on non-
> existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7 year 
> after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."

You miss the point.
No surprise there.
It's not about Linux.

It's about Linux vermin, such as your self and nym shifting Roy Culley
who you just replied to.


> So, what do you think?

Roy Culley doesn't think
He is brain dead.


-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 1:14:22 AM
On 4/9/2011 8:59 PM, anonymous wrote:
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 15:29:57 -0400, Big Steel wrote:
>
>> On 4/9/2011 3:20 PM, Lusotec wrote:
>>> <quote>
>>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the
>>> US for April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are
>>> finally leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be
>>> taken from those numbers.
>>
>> You are no expert on anything. What makes you right and the stats wrong?
>
> Statistics and logic are hard, eh Big Steel?  It's okay.  I'm sure you're
> still pretty.

Logic and commonsense if you have any of the two should make you  go 
stand in a corner now.
0
Big
4/10/2011 1:24:01 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 21:08:00 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>> 
>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>> 
>>> 
>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
> 
> Hi Roy Culley!!

This gets more pathetic every time you type it.
0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 1:30:35 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 21:09:12 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:05:51 -0500, anonymous wrote:
> 
>> Pathetic old man.  It would be sad if you weren't so hateful.  :)
> 
> Hi Roy Culley.
> How's the eyeballs going.

I'm not going to google the eyeball thing, but wow, you're pathetic.  
Old, too, I bet.  :)
0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 1:32:12 AM
On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 01:12:30 +0000, RonB wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>> 
>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>> 
>>> 
>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
> 
> Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on
> non- existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7
> year after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."
> 
> So, what do you think?

In all honesty?  I think the guy who calls himself flatfish+++ in this 
newsgroup is one pitiful son of a bitch.  He clearly doesn't like 
himself, and he's obsessed with COLA and everyone in it.  He doesn't have 
much of a life (he wrote, what, 1400 messages in here last month?) and he 
doesn't have many friends.  He's almost certainly unmarried, has been for 
a long time (possibly all his life), and doesn't have a girlfriend.  At 
his age (probably in his late 50s or 60s), he has few prospects.  His 
life didn't turn out the way he fantasized it would when he was young, 
and he hates it.  He's a failure in life, hates himself for it, and this 
newsgroup is where he spews all the bile and hatred he has accumulated 
over the long, pathetic years of his existence.  He will probably stay 
here until his heart finally gives out, hating everybody, yet desperately 
looking for any friend he can find (watch how he behaves with DFS, 
agreeing with anything he says, laughing maniacally at the slightest joke 
-- he's like a little puppy begging for approval from the big bulldog).

The kindest thing anyone should be expected to do for him is ignore him.

That's what I think.
0
me2112 (81)
4/10/2011 1:55:46 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:55:46 -0500, anonymous wrote:


> The kindest thing anyone should be expected to do for him is ignore him.
> 
> That's what I think.

Yet you can't stop talking about me can you Roy Culley.....
I have friends at Supernews......Better be careful....


-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 2:01:41 AM
Big Steel was thinking very hard :
> On 4/9/2011 2:48 PM, RonB wrote:
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 10:12:26 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:
>>
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.</quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-
>> desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>> Yeah, but are these licenses or actual usage? I know corporations buy new
>> computers with Windows 7 licenses and image them with XP. So is that,
>> technically, a Windows 7 machine?
>>
>
> Corporations are no more doing that then there is a man in the Moon. I have 
> seen a lot of Windows 7 and Vista machines replacing XP in corporations.
>

The one I work for is...  Since our migration to Windows 7 got delayed 
until the end of 2012 - they found some problems with some core apps on 
windows 7, and they need time to upgrade the apps.  LOL...  Windows 8 
will be out before we upgrade from XP at the rate we are moving :)

-- 
Tom Shelton


0
4/10/2011 3:02:45 AM
Lusotec <nomail@nomail.not> writes:

> Ezekiel wrote:
>> "Lusotec" wrote:
>>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>>> <quote>
>>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>>
>>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows XP
>>>> has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show that
>>>> Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
>>>> xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>>
>>> From the same page:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the US
>>> for
>>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be taken 
>>> from those numbers.
>> 
>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number of
>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>
> I don't know how to estimate the "number of people". As for the number of 
> *systems* connected to the internet with a public IP, I would randomly 
> select a sample of IPs and using port scanning would determine the OS. This 
> method has several practical problems (e.g. legal, technical, cost).


LOL, You really are a dick.

Web stats are uniformly represented and give a sample. No, its not
exact, but it shows trends.

Your nonsense was nothing more than overengineered nonsense and each of
your techniques could equally be discounted : possibly more so. Portscan
indeed! *hilarious*.
0
hadronquark (21814)
4/10/2011 3:44:19 AM
On 2011-04-10, the following emerged from the brain of flatfish+++:
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:00:18 -0700, Snit wrote:
>
>> TomB
>
> It's Roy Culley......

What?

-- 
There's no place like 127.0.0.1
0
4/10/2011 6:34:23 AM
"RonB" <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> schreef in bericht 
news:inr05u$t4t$1@dont-email.me...
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>
>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>>
>>>
>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
>
> Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on 
> non-
> existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7 year
> after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."
>
> So, what do you think?
>
Thickest COLA poster: (W)Ron(g)B (awarded for life btw as obviously no one 
is ever going to pip him). 

0
clog_-_wog (697)
4/10/2011 9:15:27 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:

> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
> 
>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
>> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
>> Linux weirdos can do about it.
>> 
>> 
> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around people
> you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?

Got it in one. :-)
0
wp2061 (3218)
4/10/2011 9:15:34 AM
On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 20:55:46 -0500, anonymous wrote:

> On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 01:12:30 +0000, RonB wrote:
> 
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
>> 
>>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>> 
>>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
>> 
>> Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on
>> non- existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7
>> year after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."
>> 
>> So, what do you think?
> 
> In all honesty?  I think the guy who calls himself flatfish+++ in this
> newsgroup is one pitiful son of a bitch.  He clearly doesn't like himself,
> and he's obsessed with COLA and everyone in it.  He doesn't have much of a
> life (he wrote, what, 1400 messages in here last month?) and he doesn't
> have many friends.  He's almost certainly unmarried, has been for a long
> time (possibly all his life), and doesn't have a girlfriend.  At his age
> (probably in his late 50s or 60s), he has few prospects.  His life didn't
> turn out the way he fantasized it would when he was young, and he hates
> it.  He's a failure in life, hates himself for it, and this newsgroup is
> where he spews all the bile and hatred he has accumulated over the long,
> pathetic years of his existence.  He will probably stay here until his
> heart finally gives out, hating everybody, yet desperately looking for any
> friend he can find (watch how he behaves with DFS, agreeing with anything
> he says, laughing maniacally at the slightest joke -- he's like a little
> puppy begging for approval from the big bulldog).
> 
> The kindest thing anyone should be expected to do for him is ignore him.
> 
> That's what I think.

+1

0
wp2061 (3218)
4/10/2011 9:16:26 AM
On 2011-04-10, anonymous <me@thisdesk.com> claimed:
> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>
>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows 7
>> is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing you
>> Linux weirdos can do about it.
>> 
>
> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around 
> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?

S/H/It's mentally ill in a lot of ways.

-- 
Join Taglines Anonymous. We can help.
Aspire One, Ubuntu Netbook Remix 10.10
Friends don't let friends use Windows
0
fardblossom (4529)
4/10/2011 9:21:22 AM
"Clog_-_wog (®)" <clog_-_wog@anonimous.eu> writes:

> "RonB" <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> schreef in bericht
> news:inr05u$t4t$1@dont-email.me...
>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 19:54:15 -0500, anonymous wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 09 Apr 2011 14:54:53 -0400, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>>
>>>> It doesn't matter a hill of beans one way or the other though. Windows
>>>> 7 is steam rolling desktop Linux into the ground and there is nothing
>>>> you Linux weirdos can do about it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> So why have you spent the last 15 years of your life hanging around
>>> people you consider weirdos?  Are you mentally ill in some way?
>>
>> Let's look at the facts: flatline--- surrounds itself with a minion on non-
>> existent creatures, gives them names, and looses them on COLA 24/7 year
>> after year -- even though Linux is supposedly "so inconsequential."
>>
>> So, what do you think?
>>
> Thickest COLA poster: (W)Ron(g)B (awarded for life btw as obviously no one is
> ever going to pip him). 

Gortard already won it but I do wonder if Goblin or Alias might be
worthy runner ups.

Apparently Alias thinks Linux is causing Microsoft to fail and mighty
giant is staggering - despite record revenues and usage on the (paying)
desktop.
0
hadronquark (21814)
4/10/2011 9:32:11 AM
Verily I say unto thee, that "Ezekiel" spake thusly:
> 
> <quote>
> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
> 
> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
> </quote>
> 
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/

Hitslink disagrees:

54.39% Windows XP
24.17% Windows 7

http://marketshare.hitslink.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10

So who's right, and what does this considerable disparity say about the
reliability of Web stats?

-- 
K.                           | "Linux hackers are on a mission
http://slated.org            |  from God" ~ The Vatican
Fedora 8 (Werewolf) on sky   | 
kernel 2.6.31.5, up 54 days  | http://tinyurl.com/linuxmission
0
usenet3690 (8688)
4/10/2011 1:27:41 PM
"Homer" <usenet@slated.org> wrote in message 
news:drn878-mhu.ln1@sky.matrix...
> Verily I say unto thee, that "Ezekiel" spake thusly:
>>
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>
> Hitslink disagrees:

Not it does not. You simply can't read.


> 54.39% Windows XP
> 24.17% Windows 7
>
> http://marketshare.hitslink.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10
>
> So who's right, and what does this considerable disparity say about the
> reliability of Web stats?

It says absolutely nothing about any imaginary disparity you think exists. 
It does say a lot about your lack of reading comprehension.

The free version of Hitslink you linked to reports GLOBAL usage. Let's see 
if you can figure out the difference from this quote that I already posted:

<quote>
Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the ***US*** , while
Windows XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
<.quote>





0
zeke947 (1328)
4/10/2011 1:42:17 PM
On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:32:11 +0200, Hadron wrote:


>> Thickest COLA poster: (W)Ron(g)B (awarded for life btw as obviously no one is
>> ever going to pip him). 
> 
> Gortard already won it but I do wonder if Goblin or Alias might be
> worthy runner ups.
> 
> Apparently Alias thinks Linux is causing Microsoft to fail and mighty
> giant is staggering - despite record revenues and usage on the (paying)
> desktop.

Goblin is a sugary, supercilious moron who fancy's himself a learned
man.
He's nothing but a fat, boring, bald man.
 
-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 4:01:38 PM
On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 14:27:41 +0100, Homer wrote:

Subject fixed.



-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 4:08:51 PM
On 4/10/2011 9:27 AM, Homer wrote:
> Verily I say unto thee, that "Ezekiel" spake thusly:
>>
>> <quote>
>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>
>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>> </quote>
>>
>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>
> Hitslink disagrees:
>
> 54.39% Windows XP
> 24.17% Windows 7
>
> http://marketshare.hitslink.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10
>
> So who's right, and what does this considerable disparity say about the
> reliability of Web stats?
>

Why would the clown even care about what XP and Win 7 are doing? The 
clown will never ever say Linux has a desktop share that has passed 
either one of them, and that's all versions of Linux. :)

What a joke he is and COLA too.
0
Big
4/10/2011 5:27:50 PM
Ezekiel wrote:
> "Lusotec" wrote:
>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>> "Lusotec" wrote:
>>>> Ezekiel wrote:
>>>>> <quote>
>>>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>>>
>>>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>>>>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>>>>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>>>> </quote>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-
>>>>> xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>>>
>>>> From the same page:
>>>>
>>>> <quote>
>>>> According to the latest results of the desktop OS market share in the
>>>> US for
>>>> April 2011 collected by *StatCounter*, it looks like people are finally
>>>> leaving Windows XP behind and getting an upgrade to Windows 7.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> StatCounter is a web site visitors tracker. Extrapolating StatCounter
>>>> statistics to "desktop OS market share" is incorrect. Windows 7 may now
>>>> have a bigger desktop share than Windows XP but that fact can't be
>>>> taken from those numbers.
>>>
>>> Other than web stats/traffic - how to you suggest estimating the number
>>> of
>>> people who use Win7 vs WinXP?
>>
>> I don't know how to estimate the "number of people". As for the number of
>> *systems* connected to the internet with a public IP, I would randomly
>> select a sample of IPs and using port scanning would determine the OS.
>> This
>> method has several practical problems (e.g. legal, technical, cost).
>>
>> Some of the problems of this method are:
>> - port scanning may be illegal;
>> - distributed port scanning would be required to prevent triggering port
>> scanning counter measures;
>> - desktops systems running servers like services may be mistaken as
>> server systems;
>> - systems private IPs will not be scanned;
>> - systems not connected to the internet will not be counted.
>
> Other than the possible legal issues and the complete inability to measure
> computers behind a firewall it sounds like an almost viable idea. But in
> reality it falls short of basic web statistics.
> 
> The biggest problem with port scanning (should anyone attempt to use it)
> is that it doesn't show what OS people are actually using. If they were to
> port-scan the machines in my house they would get info on all sorts of
> machines that are powered-on but rarely used. From port scanning there
> isn't a way to tell what machine/OS is actually used by someone versus an
> unused machine that just happens to be connected to the network.

That is true, port scanning will not distinguish systems people use more 
from systems people use less or not at all, but web statistics have a 
similar problem (even if not in a similar degree).

Web statistics show (most times) what systems people use for browsing. 
Systems little or not used for browsing will not show up in the statistics 
even if they are extensively used for other purposes.

One example is (partially) blocking web access in the work place. From my 
experience it is relatively common, but don't know how common this is in 
general.

>> Some of the advantages over web traffic statistics:
>> - less affected by dynamic IPs. IP ranges/networks can be scanned in a
>> relatively short ammount of time compared to IP dynamic changes;
> 
> Most dynamic IPs are long lived. I've had my same Comcast dynamic IP
> address for about 3 years now.

Dynamic IPs are not just at the router level. Just today, my netbook 
connected to 3 different networks, with 3 different private IPs and the 
corresponding public IPs. Even ISP assigned at the router level, dynamic IPs 
can and in some ISP do change frequently.

> And there's no reason why dynamic IPs would help/hurt one OS over the 
> other. Any affect of IP addresses changing would affect all OSs 
> proportionally.

Assuming the distribution of OSs and IP durations is uniform that is true, 
but this is yet another assumption one has to make.

> Regardless of what Rex Ballard likes to constantly claim - there is little
> reason to believe that webstats are based on "IP address."

Take a look at StatCounter web site.

<quote>
Both cookies and IP addresses have their strengths and weaknesses for 
determining the uniqueness of a visitor. It is impossible to be 100% 
accurate the entire time, but with the Standard StatCounter Project you get 
the best of both worlds. Cookies for the 'Summary Stats' and IP addresses 
for the 'Detailed Log Analysis'!
</quote>
<http://statcounter.com/project/standard/stats.php?account_id=397157&login_id
=4&code=3ac7fc9db0cadc87861e97fc0b5d682d&guest_login=1&project_id=2368090>

> There are
> simply too many computers connected behind a NAT firewall to use this
> approach. Most every building/company in the world would appear as a
> single IP address.

That is true, but it does not stop web tracker from using IPs when cookies 
are blocked/cleared.

>> - not affected by the tracker being blocked (e.g. HTTP blocked,
>> javascript disabled, cookies blocked);
> 
> Disabling Javascript or Cookies can be done with any OS. I have no reason
> to believe that the number of people doing this is statistically
> significant or that it would favor one OS over the other.

Here are some reasons "to believe that the number of people doing this is 
statistically significant":
<http://www.webtrends.com/Support/KnowledgeBase/SolutionDetail.aspx?
Id=50140000000aBPHAA2>
http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=Articles.showArticle&art_aid=44063

>> - not affected by "User-Agent" settings;
> 
> Again - statistically insignificant. Very few people even know what a
> "User-Agent" string is. Ask the "Gordon" advocate who made some ridiculous
> post here a few weeks ago about user agent strings which clearly showed he
> had no idea what they are. It's not 2001 any more and spoofing a
> user-agent string is very rarely needed these days. Few people even know
> what this is so the number of people actually doing this would barely
> register as "noise" in the stats.

If I had to guess, I would also guess that it is uncommon, but this is yet 
another assumption one has to make.

>> - not affected by the user behavior (e.g. what sites and how many times
>> the user visits);
> This is probably the biggest factor but chosing sites with neutral content
> in widely support formats greatly negates this. I find it interesting that
> web stats are never questioned when the same sources (StatCounter,
> HitsLink, etc) reports positive figures for Firefox.

Never?! I have a few times pointed to problems with Firefox's web statistics 
in COLA.

>> - statistical hypothesis tests can be done on the data.
>>
> Impressive sounding buzz-words but exactly what "statistical hypothesis
> tests" can you do with port scanning data that you can't do with web based
> statistics.

With port scanning it is possible to do random sampling and use well known 
statistical/mathematical tools to analyse the data. Have fun trying to do 
the same with web statistics.

>> One more comment on the StatCounter numbers. "31.71%" and "31.56%"
>> numbers have 4 significant digits. Either StatCounter has a incredibly
>> precise way to make these measurements (they don't) or they have no clue
>> about statistics, and measurement errors, or they don't really care.
> 
> It's not necessarily StatCounter that released 31.71% and 31.56%. They may
> have simply released the raw numbers in terms of hits/users and the person
> creating the chart may have decided to use two decimal places of
> precision. Possibly because 31% and 31% would have appeared identical and
> they wanted to show how close the numbers are.

That is a reasonable explanation.

Regards.

0
nomail6807 (1699)
4/10/2011 5:46:41 PM
On Sun, 10 Apr 2011 13:27:50 -0400, Big Steel wrote:

> On 4/10/2011 9:27 AM, Homer wrote:
>> Verily I say unto thee, that "Ezekiel" spake thusly:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> Windows 7 finally overtakes Windows XP's desktop OS market share
>>>
>>> Windows 7 is now used on 31.71% of desktops in the US, while Windows
>>> XP has dropped to 31.56%. Now the lead isn't a lot but it does show
>>> that Windows XP has finally peaked and is on its way out now.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/windows-7-finally-overtakes-windows-xps-desktop-os-market-share/
>>
>> Hitslink disagrees:
>>
>> 54.39% Windows XP
>> 24.17% Windows 7
>>
>> http://marketshare.hitslink.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10
>>
>> So who's right, and what does this considerable disparity say about the
>> reliability of Web stats?
>>
> 
> Why would the clown even care about what XP and Win 7 are doing? The 
> clown will never ever say Linux has a desktop share that has passed 
> either one of them, and that's all versions of Linux. :)
> 
> What a joke he is and COLA too.

they can't talk about desktop Linux's advantages because once you
mention free, that's about it.

So instead they attack Microsoft and Windows.

It's funny to watch them strut about following Microsoft's every move
like true conspiracy loons.

-- 
flatfish+++
Please visit our hall of Linux idiots.
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
 
Desktop Linux: The Dream Is Dead
"By the time Microsoft released the Windows 7 beta 
in January 2009, Linux had clearly lost its chance at desktop glory."
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/207999/desktop_linux_the_dream_is_dead.html
0
flatfish (4841)
4/10/2011 6:26:14 PM
http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp

Shows
2011    	Win7 	Vista 	Win2003 	WinXP 	W2000 	Linux 	Mac
March   	34.1% 	7.9% 	0.9%    	42.9% 	0.2% 	5.1% 	8.0%
February 	32.2% 	8.3% 	1.0%    	44.2% 	0.2% 	5.1% 	8.1%


It seems that Corporate IT Departments are really pushing back on Windows 7=
..  Most of the Windows market seems to be based on the OEM pre-installed OS=
..  Meanwhile, Corporate IT Managers are very reluctant to push for Windows =
7 because they know that corporate wide adoption would result in job cuts, =
and one of the first jobs cut, would be their own.

It's a bit like IBM back in 1992.  IBM assumed that everybody would upgrade=
 to MVS 4.0, and pay more than the cost of the original computer for softwa=
re and hardware upgrades.  The IT Managers began looking very seriously at =
alternatives based on UNIX.

Windows 7 is nice, but it's not significantly faster than XP, it needs a hu=
ge amount of memory to get that speed, and many of the third party applicat=
ions used by corporations, don't seem to work on Windows 7.  There's no pro=
ductivity gain, and very substantial cost.  Ultimately, there's no bottom l=
ine Return On Investment (ROI).

Most of those who are pushing for Windows 7 are basing their recommendation=
 on the assumption that unless they upgrade right away, that Microsoft will=
 stop supporting Windows XP and they will be stuck.

StatCounter is a known flawed survey and least reliable.  They don't even p=
ublish their methodology.


0
rex.ballard (3732)
4/10/2011 6:41:00 PM
Lusotec wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> Ezekiel wrote:
>
>> It's not necessarily StatCounter that released 31.71% and 31.56%. They may
>> have simply released the raw numbers in terms of hits/users and the person
>> creating the chart may have decided to use two decimal places of
>> precision. Possibly because 31% and 31% would have appeared identical and
>> they wanted to show how close the numbers are.
>
> That is a reasonable explanation.

Not to anyone who has had to adapt "=-" notation in a high school chemistry
class.

-- 
"It is easier to fight for principles than to live up to them."
		-- Alfred Adler
0
ahlstromc8504 (8208)
4/10/2011 6:46:54 PM
Lusotec wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:

> Ezekiel wrote:
>
>> It's not necessarily StatCounter that released 31.71% and 31.56%. They may
>> have simply released the raw numbers in terms of hits/users and the person
>> creating the chart may have decided to use two decimal places of
>> precision. Possibly because 31% and 31% would have appeared identical and
>> they wanted to show how close the numbers are.
>
> That is a reasonable explanation.

Not to anyone who has had to adapt "+-" notation in a high school chemistry
class.

-- 
"It is easier to fight for principles than to live up to them."
		-- Alfred Adler
0
ahlstromc8504 (8208)
4/10/2011 6:56:54 PM
"Lusotec" <nomail@nomail.not> wrote in message 
news:insqe3$7c7$1@dont-email.me...
> Ezekiel wrote:


>> Again - statistically insignificant. Very few people even know what a
>> "User-Agent" string is. Ask the "Gordon" advocate who made some 
>> ridiculous
>> post here a few weeks ago about user agent strings which clearly showed 
>> he
>> had no idea what they are. It's not 2001 any more and spoofing a
>> user-agent string is very rarely needed these days. Few people even know
>> what this is so the number of people actually doing this would barely
>> register as "noise" in the stats.
>
> If I had to guess, I would also guess that it is uncommon, but this is yet
> another assumption one has to make.
>
>>> - not affected by the user behavior (e.g. what sites and how many times
>>> the user visits);
>> This is probably the biggest factor but chosing sites with neutral 
>> content
>> in widely support formats greatly negates this. I find it interesting 
>> that
>> web stats are never questioned when the same sources (StatCounter,
>> HitsLink, etc) reports positive figures for Firefox.
>
> Never?! I have a few times pointed to problems with Firefox's web 
> statistics
> in COLA.
>

By "never" I didn't mean you or any poster individually. Each time I've seen 
someone make a  "<webstats> shows Firefox beating IE"  I've never seen the 
post question the validity/accuracy of webstats. And the number of posters 
who question the accuracy of browser web stats in such threads is very 
small.



>>> - statistical hypothesis tests can be done on the data.
>>>
>> Impressive sounding buzz-words but exactly what "statistical hypothesis
>> tests" can you do with port scanning data that you can't do with web 
>> based
>> statistics.
>
> With port scanning it is possible to do random sampling and use well known
> statistical/mathematical tools to analyse the data. Have fun trying to do
> the same with web statistics.
>
>>> One more comment on the StatCounter numbers. "31.71%" and "31.56%"
>>> numbers have 4 significant digits. Either StatCounter has a incredibly
>>> precise way to make these measurements (they don't) or they have no clue
>>> about statistics, and measurement errors, or they don't really care.
>>
>> It's not necessarily StatCounter that released 31.71% and 31.56%. They 
>> may
>> have simply released the raw numbers in terms of hits/users and the 
>> person
>> creating the chart may have decided to use two decimal places of
>> precision. Possibly because 31% and 31% would have appeared identical and
>> they wanted to show how close the numbers are.
>
> That is a reasonable explanation.

The bottom line is my reply to TomB.

<quote>
The point being that at least in the US - Win7 usage has either surpassed 
WinXP or (for the margin of error case) is very, very close to doing so. It 
really doesn't matter if this happened last week or next month - the larger 
point is that it's happening.
</quote>

And this is the point of the article. People can argue until the cows come 
home whether the number of significant digits in the webstats are correct or 
if they should have measured it using this method instead of that method but 
when you throw all that nonsense aside - the bottom line remains that Win7 
is starting to surpass WinXP.





0
zeke947 (1328)
4/10/2011 11:42:21 PM
On Monday 11 April 2011 00:42 Ezekiel wrote:

> The bottom line is my reply to TomB.
> 
> <quote>
> The point being that at least in the US - Win7 usage has either surpassed 
> WinXP or (for the margin of error case) is very, very close to doing so. 
It 
> really doesn't matter if this happened last week or next month - the 
larger 
> point is that it's happening.
> </quote>
> 
> And this is the point of the article. People can argue until the cows 
come 
> home whether the number of significant digits in the webstats are correct 
or 
> if they should have measured it using this method instead of that method 
but 
> when you throw all that nonsense aside - the bottom line remains that 
Win7 
> is starting to surpass WinXP.

You are quite right.
However, do take a look at the figures for the past 30 days.
I think that the author of the original blog was quoting for a weekend - 
it's almost there for the U.S., but it seems to be the consumer that's 
driving it, not the corporate -

http://gs.statcounter.com/#os-US-daily-20110312-20110410


0
bbgruff (6628)
4/11/2011 4:50:19 PM
Reply:

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