f



Bad news for screen watchers especially if you prefer bright screens.

Hi guys and gals,

     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...

<https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>

	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)

         bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/2/2016 1:52:06 AM
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On 02/11/16 12:52, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> Hi guys and gals,
>
>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>
>
>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>
>         bliss
>
It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a 
yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the modern 
automobile lighting are at the blue end.

Doug.
-- 
Mageia release 6 for x86_64 running 4.8.1-desktop-1.mga6 with DE=Xfce
I agree with no man's opinions.  I have some of my own.
    --Turgenev, "Fathers and Sons."
0
Doug
11/2/2016 9:44:43 AM
On 11/01/2016 09:52 PM, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> Hi guys and gals,
>
>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>
>
>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>
>         bliss
>
Oh, great. Now I'll have even MORE trouble staying awake through a prime 
time TV program.

These people who have so much trouble falling asleep at night should try 
doing a little physical labor once in a while. Believe me, after a day 
of that, a couple of blue lights aren't going to stop you from sleeping.

TJ
0
TJ
11/2/2016 12:38:05 PM
On 11/02/2016 02:44 AM, Doug Laidlaw wrote:
> On 02/11/16 12:52, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>> Hi guys and gals,
>>
>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>
>>
>>
>>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>>         bliss
>>
> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a
> yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the modern
> automobile lighting are at the blue end.
>
> Doug.

	Some people are required by the needs of study or occupation these days 
to spend a lot of time looking at screens.  This is basically
a problem for the indulgent parent who must deal with the effects of
late evening exposure to the tablet screens.  Most workers in the IT
field have pretty much enough exposure at work.
	No one is going to be staring at the new LED headlights.
	The yellow tinge of incandescent bulbs does not have the
same effect as the blue-white of the LED.
	You do not seem to have read the article.  On my notebook I have
messed with the settings in display hardware to alter the gamma and 
today have a faintly pink screen.
	The f.lux software varies the screen color from whiter to redder
throughout the day and can be set for night workers in the opposite
direction(white in the evening and redder after dawn).  Some Linux 
version have f.lux in the repositories.
	
	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/2/2016 1:23:50 PM
On 11/02/2016 05:38 AM, TJ wrote:
> On 11/01/2016 09:52 PM, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>> Hi guys and gals,
>>
>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>
>>
>>
>>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>>         bliss
>>
> Oh, great. Now I'll have even MORE trouble staying awake through a prime
> time TV program.
>
> These people who have so much trouble falling asleep at night should try
> doing a little physical labor once in a while. Believe me, after a day
> of that, a couple of blue lights aren't going to stop you from sleeping.
>
> TJ

	Well when possible that is fine.  When I was younger I pursued
physical activity.  After I was in my 46th year that became impossible
and now at 79+ I am barely able to ambulate and carry home a few lbs
of food which I must then find the energy to cook.  I also have had
injuries or simple wearing  out of joints to contend with.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/2/2016 1:28:32 PM
On 11/02/2016 02:44 AM, Doug Laidlaw wrote:
> On 02/11/16 12:52, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>> Hi guys and gals,
>>
>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>
>>
>>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>>         bliss
>>
> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a
> yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the modern
> automobile lighting are at the blue end.

I had wondered about people selling yellowish "gaming glasses".  Is this 
possibly what they're for?

-- 
Cheers, Bev
   "The federal government has taken too much tax money from the
    people, too much authority from the states, and too much liberty
    with the Constitution."                         -- Ronald Reagan
0
The
11/2/2016 5:16:11 PM
On Wed, 2 Nov 2016  in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
<c5poed-2oq.ln1@dougshost.douglaidlaw.net>, Doug Laidlaw wrote:

>Bobbie Sellers wrote:

>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...

Actually, several of the flat-panel monitors on the desktops here have
a setup menu that includes a 'color' feature - this HP2009M lets me
set the illumination to 9300K, 6500K, "sRBG" and a "custom" setting.
The Acer is somewhat similar, as is the LG.

>It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a 
>yellow tinge.

That's the nature of the beast - if you look at the wonky-pedia page
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature), MOST incandescent
lamps are somewhere in the range of 2400-2600K.

>"Whuite" LEDs

I presume that to be a typ0

>in torches (flashlights)

because they tend to be under-powered - the "standard" torch (two NEDA
type 13AX - a.k.a. "D" cells and a PR-2 lamp) is nominal 1.5 watts, and
0.8 mean spherical candle power - which ain't a whole lot of lumens (if
I recall correctly, a "good" flashlight might have a peak 100 lumens in
the center of a vary narrow beam).  The LED replacement may be similar
in light levels, but is 0.063 watts because the coin-cell batteries
aren't especially powerful.     Again, looking at the wonky-pedia page
above, the light from a 5000-6500K source APPEARS brighter - meaning
you can see better with the same number of lumens.

>and in the modern automobile lighting are at the blue end.

Again, more APPARENT light for the bux.  We just replaced the lamp
over the kitchen sink - we had a 3x40W track light, and it's now a
General Electric "under counter" fluorescent replacement (model 33847,
24 inch/61 cm 823 lumen LED lamp using 9 watts on "high" setting (800
lumens is about a 60 watt incandescent).  The fascinating feature of
this particular lamp is the three position (electrical) switch is NOT
the "off/low/high" power switch (this one uses a motion sensor - wave
your hand under one side of the lamp, and it sets off/low/high), but
rather sets the color temperature (choice of Warm-White, Cool White and
Daylight).  Playing with that switch DOESN'T change the amount of power
used, so I'm guessing it's two or three sets of LEDs hidden behind the
diffuser.  Certainly was not cheap (US$50).  With the energy saved, it
will pay for itself in ten or twenty years   ;-)    Oh, and using my
50 year old Weston Master IV (photographic) light meter, the "low"
light setting is about a quarter of the "high" (guessing 200 lumens(
and the power used doesn't even show on my "Kill-a-Watt" power meter
(less than 2 watts), but the light level is more than adequate for
casual lighting (i.e. not doing the dishes, or similar).

Incandescent lamps are getting harder to find here - if you go to the
lamp section of the hardware or home-improvement store, it's just
wall-to-wall compact-fluorescent-lamps and the more expensive LED lamps
(choice of Warm-White, Cool White and Daylight lamps in 15 to 150 watt
equivalent sizes) and maybe a dozen (total) incandescents (appliance
and reading lamps mainly).  Problem is that incandescents will operate
over -50 to +60 C (-60 to +140F) or more, while the CFL and LED types
have electronics in them, and should be restricted to 0 to +40C max
(32 to 104F) which can be a problem outside here.  But then, even the
regular (full sized) fluorescent tubes have temperature limits,
especially on the low side.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/3/2016 12:18:22 AM
On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
<nvd700$llh$2@dont-email.me>, The Real Bev wrote:

>Doug Laidlaw wrote:

>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:

>>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...

>> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with
>> a yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the
>> modern automobile lighting are at the blue end.

>I had wondered about people selling yellowish "gaming glasses".  Is
>this possibly what they're for?

Nah - that's to protect your eyes from those alien ray-guns that the
bad guys are using   ;-)

Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters (using real guns
on outdoor ranges) MAY wear yellow tinted glasses (safety glasses if
you're smart), but that is to increase the contrast of the black rings
on the white paper target.  (You may notice that traffic warning signs
are black on yellow rather than black on white, so that they can be
seen better - same rational.)   I think I got my first pair of yellow
shooting glasses in 1955 or so.   You need to be wearing a hat with a
large bill (or equal) to keep the sun out of the way though.   Yellow
tinted glasses and bright sunlight don't work well together.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/3/2016 12:19:46 AM
On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
<nvcmmj$pv8$1@dont-email.me>, TJ wrote:

>Bobbie Sellers wrote:

>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...

>Oh, great. Now I'll have even MORE trouble staying awake through a
>prime time TV program.

There's something decent to watch on TV???   Wow!

>These people who have so much trouble falling asleep at night should
>try doing a little physical labor once in a while. Believe me, after a
>day of that, a couple of blue lights aren't going to stop you from
>sleeping.

There was an article about this recently - think it was probably in the
AARP magazine.    My wife bought a clock-radio some time ago, with the
large (~3 inch) 7-bar display (she can't see well without the glasses).
The display was a greenish-blue, rather than the more common orange or
red.  It lasted about two weeks before it was sent to Good-Will.  The
replacement is the same size, but red, with the intensity set to low.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/3/2016 12:21:03 AM
On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:

> Hi guys and gals,
>
>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
><https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>
> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)

Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
focus on those wavelengths.)

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/3/2016 1:01:01 AM
On 2016-11-03, Moe Trin <ibuprofin@painkiller.example.tld.invalid> wrote:

> On Wed, 2 Nov 2016  in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
> <c5poed-2oq.ln1@dougshost.douglaidlaw.net>, Doug Laidlaw wrote:
>
>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>
>>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
> Actually, several of the flat-panel monitors on the desktops here have
> a setup menu that includes a 'color' feature - this HP2009M lets me
> set the illumination to 9300K, 6500K, "sRBG" and a "custom" setting.
> The Acer is somewhat similar, as is the LG.
>
>> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a 
>> yellow tinge.
>
> That's the nature of the beast - if you look at the wonky-pedia page
> (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature), MOST incandescent
> lamps are somewhere in the range of 2400-2600K.

I've been phasing in LED replacements for the 50-watt PAR20 halogens
in our pot lights.  (They consume about 7 watts for the same amount
of light, and don't get hellishly hot like the halogens.)  The 2700K
models (warm white) work pretty well.  At least until you dim them.
The newer ones will dim decently without flickering, but they don't
get redder like the halogens do.  This is a bit disconcerting,
especially if you have one of each on the same circuit.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/3/2016 3:44:14 AM
On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi guys and gals,
>>
>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>
>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>
> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
> focus on those wavelengths.)
>

	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red 
and away from blue and green.
	Might help.
	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/3/2016 4:40:56 AM
Moe Trin <ibuprofin@painkiller.example.tld.invalid> writes:

> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters (using real guns
> on outdoor ranges) MAY wear yellow tinted glasses (safety glasses if
> you're smart), but that is to increase the contrast of the black rings
> on the white paper target.

Hey, there, Old Guy. You're the guy who bailed me out of a couple of
dialup problems awhile ago.  Good to hear from you again.

The yellow shades also help shooting (or doing anything, for that
matter) on sun + snow where the blue is strong.  IIRC, there's a
physiological explanation for why filtering the blue out sharpens
focus.

I have a pair here somewhere.  I'll have to see what my laptop looks
like with them on.

-- 
Mike Spencer                  Nova Scotia, Canada
0
Mike
11/3/2016 6:41:20 AM
Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:

> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
> focus on those wavelengths.)

I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
enough to have noticed. ;-)
-- 
Mike Spencer                  Nova Scotia, Canada
0
Mike
11/3/2016 6:45:15 AM
On 11/02/2016 05:19 PM, Moe Trin wrote:
> On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
> <nvd700$llh$2@dont-email.me>, The Real Bev wrote:
>
>>Doug Laidlaw wrote:
>
>>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>
>>>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
>>> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with
>>> a yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the
>>> modern automobile lighting are at the blue end.
>
>>I had wondered about people selling yellowish "gaming glasses".  Is
>>this possibly what they're for?
>
> Nah - that's to protect your eyes from those alien ray-guns that the
> bad guys are using   ;-)
>
> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters (using real guns
> on outdoor ranges) MAY wear yellow tinted glasses (safety glasses if
> you're smart), but that is to increase the contrast of the black rings
> on the white paper target.  (You may notice that traffic warning signs
> are black on yellow rather than black on white, so that they can be
> seen better - same rational.)   I think I got my first pair of yellow
> shooting glasses in 1955 or so.   You need to be wearing a hat with a
> large bill (or equal) to keep the sun out of the way though.   Yellow
> tinted glasses and bright sunlight don't work well together.

My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white 
again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've 
never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.

I just buy them at yard sales for a buck -- the previous owner got to 
choose he color.

-- 
Cheers, Bev
    "In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime
     is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin
     is stupidity."                              -- H.S. Thompson
0
The
11/3/2016 6:46:41 AM
On 03/11/16 06:46, The Real Bev wrote:
> My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white
> again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've
> never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.
>

IN the days of B & W photography, yellow or green filters were used to 
darken blue skies, in particular to increase contrast with white clouds, 
which stayed lighter.

I suspect the same is true of white snow and blue sky.,



-- 
You can get much farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a 
kind word alone.

Al Capone


0
The
11/3/2016 7:07:39 AM
Bobbie Sellers wrote:

> Hi guys and gals,
> 
>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
> 
> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
> 
> DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
> 
>          bliss
> 

That isn't news at all. Stories like that (I don't call these reports) are 
circulating already a long time. Somewhat the opposite also circulates: some 
people with sleeping disorders are advised a light therapy: sit in front of 
a very strong (rather blueish white light) for about 30 min, then dim the 
light. The simulation of sunset is supposed to get to sleep easier.
All this is mostly particular cases, I suspect most of it is just a 
"placebo" effect.
BTW, I consider this the biggest unsolved problem in medicine: why do 
placebo's work????

Herman Viaene
0
Ikke
11/3/2016 8:32:37 AM
On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>
>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>
>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>
>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>
>
> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red 
> and away from blue and green.

There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.

I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
Probably on there somewhere still.
0
William
11/3/2016 10:11:47 AM
On 11/03/2016 06:11 AM, William Unruh wrote:
> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>
>>>>       Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>
>>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>
>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>>
>>
>> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red
>> and away from blue and green.
>
> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.
>
> I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
> Probably on there somewhere still.
>

  F.lux is one.

-- 
Caver1
0
Caver1
11/3/2016 10:54:26 AM
On 11/02/2016 08:19 PM, Moe Trin wrote:
> On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
> <nvd700$llh$2@dont-email.me>, The Real Bev wrote:
>
>> Doug Laidlaw wrote:
>
>>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>
>>>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>
>>> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with
>>> a yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the
>>> modern automobile lighting are at the blue end.
>
>> I had wondered about people selling yellowish "gaming glasses".  Is
>> this possibly what they're for?
>
> Nah - that's to protect your eyes from those alien ray-guns that the
> bad guys are using   ;-)
>
> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters (using real guns
> on outdoor ranges) MAY wear yellow tinted glasses (safety glasses if
> you're smart), but that is to increase the contrast of the black rings
> on the white paper target.  (You may notice that traffic warning signs
> are black on yellow rather than black on white, so that they can be
> seen better - same rational.)   I think I got my first pair of yellow
> shooting glasses in 1955 or so.   You need to be wearing a hat with a
> large bill (or equal) to keep the sun out of the way though.   Yellow
> tinted glasses and bright sunlight don't work well together.
>
>         Old guy
>
My brother likes to wear yellow-tinted glasses when tractor-cultivating 
young corn where other weed control measures have been less than 
successful. He says they make the corn stand out from the weeds.

TJ
0
TJ
11/3/2016 12:47:14 PM
On 11/03/2016 03:11 AM, William Unruh wrote:
> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>
>>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>
>>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>
>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>>
>>
>> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red
>> and away from blue and green.
>
> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.
>
> I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
> Probably on there somewhere still.
>

	f.lux is referred to in the URL I posted but it is not compliled
for my OS so I simply went to the simplest (for me) correction.
	Back in my early Amiga OS days I regularly messed with color settings 
to off the overscan/interlace settings I used.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/3/2016 2:52:14 PM
On 11/03/2016 01:32 AM, Ikke wrote:
> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>
>> Hi guys and gals,
>>
>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>
>> DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>>          bliss
>>
>
> That isn't news at all. Stories like that (I don't call these reports) are
> circulating already a long time. Somewhat the opposite also circulates: some
> people with sleeping disorders are advised a light therapy: sit in front of
> a very strong (rather blueish white light) for about 30 min, then dim the
> light. The simulation of sunset is supposed to get to sleep easier.
> All this is mostly particular cases, I suspect most of it is just a
> "placebo" effect.
> BTW, I consider this the biggest unsolved problem in medicine: why do
> placebo's work????
>
> Herman Viaene


	Herman did you read the article?
	Not a newspaper story but a report on research.
  	
	Oh well you are probable a young fellow and think that you are supposed 
to be awake half the night punching your keyboard.

	Placebos work for various reasons and one is that most conditions are 
self-correcting especially when young.  Some conditions
do not self-correct and that is when you need medication of some
kind.  Other sorts of conditions self-correct with age and experience
if you have some regard for your body, eat, rest and sleep in 
appropriate amounts, you generally get over them.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/3/2016 3:13:47 PM
On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> On 11/03/2016 03:11 AM, William Unruh wrote:
>> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>>
>>>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>>
>>>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>>
>>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>>>
>>>
>>> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red
>>> and away from blue and green.
>>
>> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
>> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.
>>
>> I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
>> Probably on there somewhere still.
>>
>
> 	f.lux is referred to in the URL I posted but it is not compliled
> for my OS so I simply went to the simplest (for me) correction.


xflux for Linux

Not sure what you mean by "not compiled for my OS?


> 	Back in my early Amiga OS days I regularly messed with color settings 
> to off the overscan/interlace settings I used.
>
> 	bliss
>
0
William
11/3/2016 3:22:50 PM
On 11/03/2016 08:22 AM, William Unruh wrote:
> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>> On 11/03/2016 03:11 AM, William Unruh wrote:
>>> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>>>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>>>
>>>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red
>>>> and away from blue and green.
>>>
>>> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
>>> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.
>>>
>>> I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
>>> Probably on there somewhere still.
>>>
>>
>> 	f.lux is referred to in the URL I posted but it is not compliled
>> for my OS so I simply went to the simplest (for me) correction.
>
>
> xflux for Linux
>
> Not sure what you mean by "not compiled for my OS?

	It is not in the repositories I use but I will search on xflux when I 
have the time.
>
>
>> 	Back in my early Amiga OS days I regularly messed with color settings
>> to off the overscan/interlace settings I used.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/3/2016 3:36:09 PM
On Thu, 03 Nov 2016 06:11:47 -0400, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:

> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.

I use redshift/redshift-gtk. Does make the screen much less annoying
to use.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

-- 
Change dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org to davidwhodgins@teksavvy.com for
email replies.
0
David
11/3/2016 5:11:45 PM
On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> On 11/03/2016 01:32 AM, Ikke wrote:
>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>>
>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>
>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>
>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>
>>> DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>
>>>          bliss
>>>
>>
>> That isn't news at all. Stories like that (I don't call these reports) are
>> circulating already a long time. Somewhat the opposite also circulates: some
>> people with sleeping disorders are advised a light therapy: sit in front of
>> a very strong (rather blueish white light) for about 30 min, then dim the
>> light. The simulation of sunset is supposed to get to sleep easier.
>> All this is mostly particular cases, I suspect most of it is just a
>> "placebo" effect.
>> BTW, I consider this the biggest unsolved problem in medicine: why do
>> placebo's work????
>>
>> Herman Viaene
>
>
> 	Herman did you read the article?
> 	Not a newspaper story but a report on research.
>   	
> 	Oh well you are probable a young fellow and think that you are supposed 
> to be awake half the night punching your keyboard.
>
> 	Placebos work for various reasons and one is that most conditions are 
> self-correcting especially when young.  Some conditions
> do not self-correct and that is when you need medication of some
> kind.  Other sorts of conditions self-correct with age and experience
> if you have some regard for your body, eat, rest and sleep in 
> appropriate amounts, you generally get over them.

Except in some cases giving a pill that has no possible efficacious
ingrediant can cause the person to get well, when compared with those
who do not receive the pill. Ie, the mind seems to have some control
over the body. 

So yes, part of snake oil medicine is as you say, the disease resolved
itself and would have without any intervention. But sometimes the
disease resolves itself with snakeoil intervention (assuming that the
snakeoil itself does not cause problems, which a lot of them do) when it
would not have without the snakeoil
That is placebo.

I agree with you however that the light problem does not seem to be
placebo. Arguments have been made that the body generates melatonin at
night, and that light, esp blue light, triggers destruction of
melatonin. It is needed for sleep. Ie, there is an at least plausible
story about how light could be bad for sleep. 

>
> 	bliss
>
0
William
11/3/2016 5:16:33 PM
On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> On 11/03/2016 08:22 AM, William Unruh wrote:
>> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>> On 11/03/2016 03:11 AM, William Unruh wrote:
>>>> On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>>>>>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>>>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>>>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red
>>>>> and away from blue and green.
>>>>
>>>> There exist programs to do this automatically at night (using the
>>>> system clock) Right now I cannot remember the name of any of them.
>>>>
>>>> I had it running on my system for a while and then forgot about it.
>>>> Probably on there somewhere still.
>>>>
>>>
>>> 	f.lux is referred to in the URL I posted but it is not compliled
>>> for my OS so I simply went to the simplest (for me) correction.
>>
>>
>> xflux for Linux
>>
>> Not sure what you mean by "not compiled for my OS?
>
> 	It is not in the repositories I use but I will search on xflux when I 
> have the time.

https://justgetflux.com/linux.html

It is apparently a pre-compiled (ie not open source) program. It uses
randr to adjust the screen colour temperature at appropriate times of
the day, as defined by your location on earth. 


>>
>>
>>> 	Back in my early Amiga OS days I regularly messed with color settings
>>> to off the overscan/interlace settings I used.
>
> 	bliss
>
0
William
11/3/2016 5:19:59 PM
On 2016-11-03 07:45, Mike Spencer wrote:
> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
> 
>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>> focus on those wavelengths.)
> 
> I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
> enough to have noticed. ;-)

Police cars on my city have blue light on their roof, very intense. I
happened to be driving behind one at night and had to increase the
distance: they blind me. Worse than headlights.

On the other hand, I don't have problems with computer displays. I just
set the monitor to "warm". No need to change it during the day with
software: I want whites to remain constant.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
0
Carlos
11/3/2016 6:20:02 PM
On 2016-11-03, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:

> On 11/02/2016 08:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>
>> On 2016-11-02, Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>
>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>
>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>
>>> 	DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>
>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>
> 	Try adjusting the gamma in System Setting/Hardware/Monitor toward red 
> and away from blue and green.
> 	Might help.

I don't have much trouble with monitors.  It's all those gratuitous
brilliant blue LEDs (many of them flashing) which manufacturers insist
on putting on everything these days.  Once when I was doing sound for
a play, the board's pilot light was a blue LED that was so bright that
I had to cover it with three layers of masking tape so that I could
see anything else in the darkened hall (including the board itself).

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/3/2016 7:24:39 PM
On 2016-11-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@invalid.es> wrote:

> On 2016-11-03 07:45, Mike Spencer wrote:
>
>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>> 
>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>> 
>> I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
>> enough to have noticed. ;-)
>
> Police cars on my city have blue light on their roof, very intense. I
> happened to be driving behind one at night and had to increase the
> distance: they blind me. Worse than headlights.

Our police cars have both red and blue lights.  Again, very intense.

And don't get me started on headlights.  When I become king, I will
ban HID lights from cars, and bring back the old standards for headlight
aiming and intensity.

It's a bit of consolation that I've figured out how to aim my side
mirrors so that if I'm being followed by someone with bright headlights,
they get a dose of their own medicine.  It discourages tailgating, too.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/3/2016 7:34:06 PM
On 2016-11-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@invalid.es> wrote:
> On 2016-11-03 07:45, Mike Spencer wrote:
>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>> 
>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>> 
>> I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
>> enough to have noticed. ;-)
>
> Police cars on my city have blue light on their roof, very intense. I
> happened to be driving behind one at night and had to increase the
> distance: they blind me. Worse than headlights.
>
> On the other hand, I don't have problems with computer displays. I just
> set the monitor to "warm". No need to change it during the day with
> software: I want whites to remain constant.
>

Your "eyes" are tremendously adapatable, and readjust their set point
for what "white" is. Under incandecents, "whites" are decideddly
reddish. Under Flourescents, green (You have surely taken pictures under
flourescents). But your brain renormalises its response so white stays
white.

Now, if you are in a green lit room, and your screen is "warm" it will
probably look very reddish.

0
William
11/3/2016 8:02:22 PM
On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
<nvemfo$14f$1@dont-email.me>, The Real Bev wrote:

>Moe Trin wrote:

>> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters [...] MAY wear
>> yellow tinted glasses [...] but that is to increase the contrast of
>> the black rings on the white paper target. [...]   I think I got my
>> first pair of yellow shooting glasses in 1955 or so.   You need to
>> be wearing a hat with a large bill (or equal) to keep the sun out of
>> the way though.   Yellow tinted glasses and bright sunlight don't
>> work well together.

>My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white 
>again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've 
>never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.

Main problem I've noticed is when you either take them off, or get a
glimpse of the sun around the glasses - especially with older eyes, it
takes some time for the eyes to readjust to the light levels.

>I just buy them at yard sales for a buck -- the previous owner got to 
>choose he color.

All of mine are prescription (and hardened), so they are made to order
and cost a bit more.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/3/2016 8:12:25 PM
On Thu, 3 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
<nvfbjp$58u$1@dont-email.me>, TJ wrote:

>Moe Trin wrote:

>> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters [...] MAY wear
>> yellow tinted glasses [...], but that is to increase the contrast of
>> the black rings on the white paper target.

>My brother likes to wear yellow-tinted glasses when tractor-cultivating 
>young corn where other weed control measures have been less than 
>successful. He says they make the corn stand out from the weeds.

Similar here, with weeds in the lawn.  We can't use chemical weed
control agents in the lawn for most of the year, because the average
temperatures are well above the limits listed on the labels.  See
http://www.public.asu.edu/~aunjs/ClimateofPhoenix/wxpart1.htm  (section
IV).  If you look at the label on products like "Weed-Be-Gone" or "Weed
Stop for Lawns", you'll find that they shouldn't be used when temps
average above 85F/29C or 90F/32C), and the overnight _low_ in July may
be above that, never mind the average.  That means weed control the
old-fashioned way - feeding and watering to create a dense lawn (not
possible here) to crowd out the weeks, or walking the lawn and pulling
the weeds manually.  Most weeds are easy to see, but some (such as
oxalis) are similar in color (but not texture) until they bloom.   Of
course, the other alternative is no lawn (my front and side yards are
light colored crushed stone), or artificial grass.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/3/2016 8:14:11 PM
On 2016-11-03, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:
> On 2016-11-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@invalid.es> wrote:
>> On 2016-11-03 07:45, Mike Spencer wrote:
>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>>> 
>>>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
>>>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
>>>> focus on those wavelengths.)
>>> 
>>> I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
>>> enough to have noticed. ;-)
>>
>> Police cars on my city have blue light on their roof, very intense. I
>> happened to be driving behind one at night and had to increase the
>> distance: they blind me. Worse than headlights.
>>
>> On the other hand, I don't have problems with computer displays. I just
>> set the monitor to "warm". No need to change it during the day with
>> software: I want whites to remain constant.
>>
>
> Your "eyes" are tremendously adapatable, and readjust their set point
> for what "white" is. Under incandecents, "whites" are decideddly
> reddish. Under Flourescents, green (You have surely taken pictures under
           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> flourescents). But your brain renormalises its response so white stays
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> white.
>
> Now, if you are in a green lit room, and your screen is "warm" it will
> probably look very reddish.

The green tint problem under fluorescent lighting was mostly a
problem in the days of film photography.  The film did not react
to the spiky spectrum the same as human eyes.  See this
reference, for example:

https://books.google.com/books?id=gD8pWkA6TcwC&pg=PA554&lpg=PA554&dq=fluorescent+light+photographic+film+green&source=bl&ots=at0BgunDvR&sig=0-fQOYl3TJqo-UXSDEONayJfoHM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj4wKHBiI7QAhVB6mMKHUNqAgsQ6AEISjAJ#v=onepage&q=fluorescent%20light%20photographic%20film%20green&f=false

I have some color slides taken under fluorescent light that are
tremendously green.  IIRC, I have a magenta-colored filter for my
old 1979-era Pentax film camera to counter the interaction
between the spiky spectrum and the film.  Some more recent
documents describe a "slight" greenish tint with digital
photography, but it's nothing like it was with film.

HTH

-- 
Robert Riches
spamtrap42@jacob21819.net
(Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)
0
Robert
11/4/2016 2:50:49 AM
On 11/03/2016 12:07 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 03/11/16 06:46, The Real Bev wrote:
>> My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white
>> again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've
>> never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.
>
> IN the days of B & W photography, yellow or green filters were used to
> darken blue skies, in particular to increase contrast with white clouds,
> which stayed lighter.

RED filters.  The effect was unnatural, but very slick.

> I suspect the same is true of white snow and blue sky.,

Theory has it that the eye is more sensitive to yellow light because of 
our yellow sun.

-- 
Cheers, Bev
   "They redundantly repeated themselves over and over again
    incessantly without end ad infinitum" -- ibid.
0
The
11/4/2016 4:49:23 AM
On 11/03/2016 05:47 AM, TJ wrote:
> On 11/02/2016 08:19 PM, Moe Trin wrote:
>> On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
>> <nvd700$llh$2@dont-email.me>, The Real Bev wrote:
>>
>>> Doug Laidlaw wrote:
>>
>>>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>>
>>>>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>
>>>> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with
>>>> a yellow tinge.  "Whuite" LEDs in torches (flashlights) and in the
>>>> modern automobile lighting are at the blue end.
>>
>>> I had wondered about people selling yellowish "gaming glasses".  Is
>>> this possibly what they're for?
>>
>> Nah - that's to protect your eyes from those alien ray-guns that the
>> bad guys are using   ;-)
>>
>> Actually, for many years, competitive target shooters (using real guns
>> on outdoor ranges) MAY wear yellow tinted glasses (safety glasses if
>> you're smart), but that is to increase the contrast of the black rings
>> on the white paper target.  (You may notice that traffic warning signs
>> are black on yellow rather than black on white, so that they can be
>> seen better - same rational.)   I think I got my first pair of yellow
>> shooting glasses in 1955 or so.   You need to be wearing a hat with a
>> large bill (or equal) to keep the sun out of the way though.   Yellow
>> tinted glasses and bright sunlight don't work well together.
>>
>>         Old guy
>>
> My brother likes to wear yellow-tinted glasses when tractor-cultivating
> young corn where other weed control measures have been less than
> successful. He says they make the corn stand out from the weeds.

Orange glasses REALLY make green stand out.  Creepily so.



-- 
Cheers, Bev
   "They redundantly repeated themselves over and over again
    incessantly without end ad infinitum" -- ibid.
0
The
11/4/2016 4:50:51 AM
On 04/11/16 04:49, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 11/03/2016 12:07 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 03/11/16 06:46, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white
>>> again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've
>>> never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.
>>
>> IN the days of B & W photography, yellow or green filters were used to
>> darken blue skies, in particular to increase contrast with white clouds,
>> which stayed lighter.
>
> RED filters.  The effect was unnatural, but very slick.

Red made things VERY contrasty.
Yellow or green was a lot better - more like a polarising filter.


>
>> I suspect the same is true of white snow and blue sky.,
>
> Theory has it that the eye is more sensitive to yellow light because of
> our yellow sun.
>


-- 
"Corbyn talks about equality, justice, opportunity, health care, peace, 
community, compassion, investment, security, housing...."
"What kind of person is not interested in those things?"

"Jeremy Corbyn?"

0
The
11/4/2016 5:42:08 AM
On 2016-11-04, The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 11/03/2016 12:07 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 03/11/16 06:46, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white
>>> again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've
>>> never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.
>>
>> IN the days of B & W photography, yellow or green filters were used to
>> darken blue skies, in particular to increase contrast with white clouds,
>> which stayed lighter.
>
> RED filters.  The effect was unnatural, but very slick.
>
>> I suspect the same is true of white snow and blue sky.,
>
> Theory has it that the eye is more sensitive to yellow light because of 
> our yellow sun.

More likely because the visible band is what water is transparent at,
and eyes developed underwater and are filled with water.


>
0
William
11/4/2016 9:41:33 AM
On 04/11/16 09:41, William Unruh wrote:
> On 2016-11-04, The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 11/03/2016 12:07 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 03/11/16 06:46, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> My ski goggles are light yellow, and after a while the snow looks white
>>>> again through them.  Even though I only ski in bright sunlight, I've
>>>> never noticed excessive brightness until I take the goggles off.
>>>
>>> IN the days of B & W photography, yellow or green filters were used to
>>> darken blue skies, in particular to increase contrast with white clouds,
>>> which stayed lighter.
>>
>> RED filters.  The effect was unnatural, but very slick.
>>
>>> I suspect the same is true of white snow and blue sky.,
>>
>> Theory has it that the eye is more sensitive to yellow light because of
>> our yellow sun.
>
> More likely because the visible band is what water is transparent at,
> and eyes developed underwater and are filled with water.
>
ISTR that eyes developed more than once.

Insects are particularly happy with UV.


>
>>


-- 
To ban Christmas, simply give turkeys the vote.
0
The
11/4/2016 10:00:52 AM
In article <nvebqe0ljs@news4.newsguy.com>, 
cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid says...
> 
> On 2016-11-03, Moe Trin <ibuprofin@painkiller.example.tld.invalid> wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 2 Nov 2016  in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
> > <c5poed-2oq.ln1@dougshost.douglaidlaw.net>, Doug Laidlaw wrote:
> >
> >> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> >
> >>>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
> >
> > Actually, several of the flat-panel monitors on the desktops here have
> > a setup menu that includes a 'color' feature - this HP2009M lets me
> > set the illumination to 9300K, 6500K, "sRBG" and a "custom" setting.
> > The Acer is somewhat similar, as is the LG.
> >
> >> It isn't just screens.  "White" incandescent globes emit light with a 
> >> yellow tinge.
> >
> > That's the nature of the beast - if you look at the wonky-pedia page
> > (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature), MOST incandescent
> > lamps are somewhere in the range of 2400-2600K.
> 
> I've been phasing in LED replacements for the 50-watt PAR20 halogens
> in our pot lights.  (They consume about 7 watts for the same amount
> of light, and don't get hellishly hot like the halogens.)  The 2700K
> models (warm white) work pretty well.  At least until you dim them.
> The newer ones will dim decently without flickering, but they don't
> get redder like the halogens do.  This is a bit disconcerting,
> especially if you have one of each on the same circuit.

The latest generation of LED bulbs from Philips 
does a pretty job of emulating the reddening of 
incandescents.  It's not perfect but it's good 
enough.  Now the question is what I do with the 
two in the chandelier that don't do that (I've 
been replacing them on an attrition basis).
0
J
11/6/2016 11:42:35 PM
In article <nvcpl7$4vv$1@dont-email.me>, 
bliss@mouse-potato.com says...
> 
> On 11/02/2016 05:38 AM, TJ wrote:
> > On 11/01/2016 09:52 PM, Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> >> Hi guys and gals,
> >>
> >>     Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
> >>
> >> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>     DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
> >>
> >>         bliss
> >>
> > Oh, great. Now I'll have even MORE trouble staying awake through a prime
> > time TV program.
> >
> > These people who have so much trouble falling asleep at night should try
> > doing a little physical labor once in a while. Believe me, after a day
> > of that, a couple of blue lights aren't going to stop you from sleeping.
> >
> > TJ
> 
> 	Well when possible that is fine.  When I was younger I pursued
> physical activity.  After I was in my 46th year that became impossible
> and now at 79+ I am barely able to ambulate and carry home a few lbs
> of food which I must then find the energy to cook.  I also have had
> injuries or simple wearing  out of joints to contend with.

I don't have any trouble watching TV then 
falling asleep (or reading on a tablet or 
whatever).  My trouble is that I wake up after 
about 4 hours and the reason for that is 
something that I don't think changing light 
bulbs is going to fix.
0
J
11/6/2016 11:46:56 PM
In article <nvg3fe21fjd@news3.newsguy.com>, 
cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid says...
> 
> On 2016-11-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@invalid.es> wrote:
> 
> > On 2016-11-03 07:45, Mike Spencer wrote:
> >
> >> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
> >> 
> >>> Hah!  They can have it.  Now I have scientific justification for my
> >>> hatred of the blue-LED craze.  (Aside from my eyes' inability to
> >>> focus on those wavelengths.)
> >> 
> >> I think the focus thing is true for everybody.  You're just clueful
> >> enough to have noticed. ;-)
> >
> > Police cars on my city have blue light on their roof, very intense. I
> > happened to be driving behind one at night and had to increase the
> > distance: they blind me. Worse than headlights.
> 
> Our police cars have both red and blue lights.  Again, very intense.
> 
> And don't get me started on headlights.  When I become king, I will
> ban HID lights from cars, and bring back the old standards for headlight
> aiming and intensity.
> 
> It's a bit of consolation that I've figured out how to aim my side
> mirrors so that if I'm being followed by someone with bright headlights,
> they get a dose of their own medicine.  It discourages tailgating, too.

I suspect HID is on the way out--LED brings too 
much good stuff to the party.

On the other hand, don't really expect "the old 
standards" to make a comeback.  Florida used to 
inspect headlight aiming.  The gadget they used 
was mainly a way for some seller of gadgets to 
bilk the government--didn't matter where the 
headlights were pointed, the guy would jiggle 
the thing for a while and you'd pass.


0
J
11/6/2016 11:54:57 PM
In article <nvfk6g$4g9$2@dont-email.me>, 
bliss@mouse-potato.com says...
> 
> On 11/03/2016 01:32 AM, Ikke wrote:
> > Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> >
> >> Hi guys and gals,
> >>
> >>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
> >>
> >> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
> >>
> >> DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
> >>
> >>          bliss
> >>
> >
> > That isn't news at all. Stories like that (I don't call these reports) are
> > circulating already a long time. Somewhat the opposite also circulates: some
> > people with sleeping disorders are advised a light therapy: sit in front of
> > a very strong (rather blueish white light) for about 30 min, then dim the
> > light. The simulation of sunset is supposed to get to sleep easier.
> > All this is mostly particular cases, I suspect most of it is just a
> > "placebo" effect.
> > BTW, I consider this the biggest unsolved problem in medicine: why do
> > placebo's work????
> >
> > Herman Viaene
> 
> 
> 	Herman did you read the article?
> 	Not a newspaper story but a report on research.

It was a magazine article.  Scientific American 
is not a scientific journal, it is a 
popularization magazine.  When an article is 
written by the principal investigators in the 
line of research it is reporting it is generally 
pretty good, but this particular article was 
written by some guy with a "journalism" degree 
who seems to write magazine articles for a 
living.
   	
> 	Oh well you are probable a young fellow and think that you are supposed 
> to be awake half the night punching your keyboard.

I don't think that at 63, _I_ qualify as a 
"young guy" but I don't have any trouble going 
to sleep after punching a keyboard.

And it seems to have escaped your notice that 
there is no difference today between a computer 
monitor and a television except that the 
televison has a built-in tuner.
 
> 	Placebos work for various reasons and one is that most conditions are 
> self-correcting especially when young.  Some conditions
> do not self-correct and that is when you need medication of some
> kind.  Other sorts of conditions self-correct with age and experience
> if you have some regard for your body, eat, rest and sleep in 
> appropriate amounts, you generally get over them.

So why do people given placebos get better when 
people not given placebos don't?

0
J
11/7/2016 12:05:51 AM
On 11/06/2016 04:05 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> In article <nvfk6g$4g9$2@dont-email.me>,
> bliss@mouse-potato.com says...
>>
>> On 11/03/2016 01:32 AM, Ikke wrote:
>>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi guys and gals,
>>>>
>>>>      Sad news but remediable.  Should be spread around...
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/blue-leds-light-up-your-brain/?WT.mc_id=SA_HLTH_20161101>
>>>>
>>>> DEA is going to be after this deleterious stimulant. ;^)
>>>>
>>>>          bliss
>>>>
>>>
>>> That isn't news at all. Stories like that (I don't call these reports) are
>>> circulating already a long time. Somewhat the opposite also circulates: some
>>> people with sleeping disorders are advised a light therapy: sit in front of
>>> a very strong (rather blueish white light) for about 30 min, then dim the
>>> light. The simulation of sunset is supposed to get to sleep easier.
>>> All this is mostly particular cases, I suspect most of it is just a
>>> "placebo" effect.
>>> BTW, I consider this the biggest unsolved problem in medicine: why do
>>> placebo's work????
>>>
>>> Herman Viaene
>>
>>
>> 	Herman did you read the article?
>> 	Not a newspaper story but a report on research.
>
> It was a magazine article.  Scientific American
> is not a scientific journal, it is a
> popularization magazine.  When an article is
> written by the principal investigators in the
> line of research it is reporting it is generally
> pretty good, but this particular article was
> written by some guy with a "journalism" degree
> who seems to write magazine articles for a
> living.
>    	
>> 	Oh well you are probable a young fellow and think that you are supposed
>> to be awake half the night punching your keyboard.
>
> I don't think that at 63, _I_ qualify as a
> "young guy" but I don't have any trouble going
> to sleep after punching a keyboard.
>
> And it seems to have escaped your notice that
> there is no difference today between a computer
> monitor and a television except that the
> televison has a built-in tuner.

	I don't stare much at TV because I prefer to look briefly at the
characters then turn aside to listen as I work at the Pavilion.
>
>> 	Placebos work for various reasons and one is that most conditions are
>> self-correcting especially when young.  Some conditions
>> do not self-correct and that is when you need medication of some
>> kind.  Other sorts of conditions self-correct with age and experience
>> if you have some regard for your body, eat, rest and sleep in
>> appropriate amounts, you generally get over them.
>
> So why do people given placebos get better when
> people not given placebos don't?
>

	How do you know they don't get better?

	If they do they will not tell the doctor that they got better
because it costs money to deal with doctors.

	With my condition rest will make me feel better and has many times in 
the past but it is just a placebo effect and if I exert
myself I will get physically ill again.  This affects cognition
and memory making me more confused and before I knew enough to
rest way too much(from my youthful POV) I could not do simple
tasks like setting up the configuration for a TCP/IP stack on
the Amiga.  Sitting at the computer reading the docs, and the
information was gone from my mind before I could switch from
docs to configuration editor.

	I have spent lots of money trying to find causes and treatment
for the condition but no tests are free and people with this illness
present a market for quackery.  When I was newly ill I ended up flat
on my back after trying to resume my exercise routine with influenza- 
like symptoms over and over again,  Each time I got sick I lost strength 
and endurance.
	
	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/7/2016 12:37:16 AM
On 2016-11-06, J. Clarke <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <nvg3fe21fjd@news3.newsguy.com>, 
> cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid says...
> 
>> And don't get me started on headlights.  When I become king, I will
>> ban HID lights from cars, and bring back the old standards for headlight
>> aiming and intensity.
>> 
>> It's a bit of consolation that I've figured out how to aim my side
>> mirrors so that if I'm being followed by someone with bright headlights,
>> they get a dose of their own medicine.  It discourages tailgating, too.
>
> I suspect HID is on the way out--LED brings too 
> much good stuff to the party.
>
> On the other hand, don't really expect "the old 
> standards" to make a comeback.  Florida used to 
> inspect headlight aiming.  The gadget they used 
> was mainly a way for some seller of gadgets to 
> bilk the government--didn't matter where the 
> headlights were pointed, the guy would jiggle 
> the thing for a while and you'd pass.

We used to have vehicle inspection stations here in B.C. until they were
dismantled around 1982 as a "cost-saving measure".  Everyone took for
granted that you'd be flunked on your headlights - and near each testing
station was a service station that had the same equipment and which would
adjust your lights quickly and cheaply.

Back then we were taught that it was rude and dangerous to drive with
high beams in the presence of other traffic.  New cars' daytime running
lights - now mandated by the federal government - are often implemented
using high beams.  It's just one more of the kind of reversals that
politicians are famous for.

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/7/2016 2:42:42 AM
On 06/11/16 23:42, J. Clarke wrote:
> Now the question is what I do with the
> two in the chandelier that don't do that (I've
> been replacing them on an attrition basis).

Exchange them with ones that are in silly places - the light in the 
cupboard etc.


-- 
“It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of 
making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people 
who pay no price for being wrong.”

Thomas Sowell
0
The
11/7/2016 8:01:09 AM
Moe Trin <ibuprofin@painkiller.example.tld.invalid> writes:

> On Wed, 2 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.os.linux.mageia, in article
> <nvcmmj$pv8$1@dont-email.me>, TJ wrote:
>

>>These people who have so much trouble falling asleep at night should
>>try doing a little physical labor once in a while. Believe me, after a
>>day of that, a couple of blue lights aren't going to stop you from
>>sleeping.
>
> There was an article about this recently - think it was probably in the
> AARP magazine.    My wife bought a clock-radio some time ago, with the
> large (~3 inch) 7-bar display (she can't see well without the glasses).
> The display was a greenish-blue, rather than the more common orange or
> red.  It lasted about two weeks before it was sent to Good-Will.  The
> replacement is the same size, but red, with the intensity set to low.
>

That may have been due more to the sensitivity of the eye to green and
yellow-green light than to it being blueish. A green or yellow light of
equal luminosity as a red one will appear to be brighter and thus may
make it harder to sleep.

I never use my alarm clock to tell the time in the middle of the
night. I wear a watch with a dial that lights up, and it has hands, so I
don't actually have to read anything. I just look at the position of the
hands.

I haven't actually set my alarm clock in a long time. I wake up in
plenty of time to get ready for work without an alarm. The only time I
need it is for a few days after we set the clocks ahead in the spring.

I suffer from insomnia sometimes, and it doesn't matter how much or how
little physical activity I've had. A few months ago I went for 4 days
without sleeping, and I was _very_ tired. So snarky little remarks about
"try some physical labor" just make me roll my eyes. 


0
Bud
11/21/2016 11:55:18 AM
On Mon, 21 Nov 2016, in the Usenet newsgroup comp.os.linux.misc, in article
<uMKdnfFAx4k1fa_FnZ2dnUU78N_NnZ2d@supernews.com>, Bud Frede wrote:

>Moe Trin <ibuprofin@painkiller.example.tld.invalid> writes:

>> My wife bought a clock-radio some time ago, with the large (~3 inch)
>> 7-bar display (she can't see well without the glasses).  The display
>> was a greenish-blue, rather than the more common orange or red.  It
>> lasted about two weeks before it was sent to Good-Will.  The
>> replacement is the same size, but red, with the intensity set to low.

>That may have been due more to the sensitivity of the eye to green and
>yellow-green light than to it being blueish. A green or yellow light of
>equal luminosity as a red one will appear to be brighter and thus may
>make it harder to sleep.

The peak response of the eye is around 5500 Angstrom units, which is
slightly on the green (5100 A) side of yellow (5600 A).  A blue is
closer to 4600 A while red is roughly 6600 A) and using that as a crude
scale, call the old display closer to 4750 A - decidedly blue.   Color
temperatures (measured in degrees Kelvin) are a completely different
animal from Angstrom units (wavelength in tenths of a picometer, or
1e-10 meters), which is why I name the "nominal" values.

>I wear a watch with a dial that lights up, and it has hands,

That's modern - my (1950s) Rolex has the good old-fashioned radioactive
dots and lines on the hands.   Batteries not required (though it is a
self-winding mechanical - I do have another that you have to wind by
hand, but I rarely wear it any more).

>so I don't actually have to read anything. I just look at the position
>of the hands.

Her problem (and that of many older people) is that without the glasses
she can't see the watch, much less the hands.  That was the reason for
the 3 inch (76 mm) tall numeric display, compared to the more common
5/8 inch (16 mm) display on the the clock in the second bedroom.

>I haven't actually set my alarm clock in a long time.

"There is no snooze button on a cat who wants breakfast." --Unknown

>I wake up in plenty of time to get ready for work without an alarm.

I'm retired - but am conditioned to crank at ~06:40.  The two cats
also help.

>The only time I need it is for a few days after we set the clocks
>ahead in the spring.

An advantage here in Arizona - only the Navajo Nation (essentially
much of the Northeast quarter of the state) observe DST.

>I suffer from insomnia sometimes, and it doesn't matter how much or how
>little physical activity I've had. A few months ago I went for 4 days
>without sleeping, and I was _very_ tired.

Sounds like something to see the doctor about.

        Old guy
0
Moe
11/22/2016 1:06:36 AM
Reply: