f



reboot failed because systemd ???

For some reason systemd just decided to stop taking requests, so I
thought I'd reboot.

# shutdown -r now
Failed to start reboot.target: Failed to activate service 'org.freedesktop.systemd1': timed out
See system logs and 'systemctl status reboot.target' for details.
Failed to open /dev/initctl: No such device or address
Failed to talk to init daemon.
# systemctl status reboot.target
Failed to get properties: Connection timed out
#

Nothing I think of would achieve a normal controlled reboot. And nothing
in the log files.

  1. shutdown -r now
  2. reboot
  3. ctrl-alt-del
  4. kill -INT 1
  5. kill -HUP 1
  6. kill -9 1

I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.

Any tips?

Elijah
------
not impressed with this failure mode
0
Eli
11/16/2016 4:43:59 AM
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On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:43:59 -0500, Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

> For some reason systemd just decided to stop taking requests, so I
> thought I'd reboot.

File system full?

> I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
> Any tips?

Learn the magic sysrq keys.
While holding down the alt+ctrl+sysrq keys, press the following keys.
RSEISUB (Raising Skinny Elephants Is Still Utterly Boring).

Regards, Dave Hodgins

-- 
Change dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org to davidwhodgins@teksavvy.com for
email replies.
0
David
11/16/2016 5:05:55 AM
On 11/15/2016 08:43 PM, Eli the Bearded wrote:
> For some reason systemd just decided to stop taking requests, so I
> thought I'd reboot.
>
> # shutdown -r now
> Failed to start reboot.target: Failed to activate service 'org.freedesktop.systemd1': timed out
> See system logs and 'systemctl status reboot.target' for details.
> Failed to open /dev/initctl: No such device or address
> Failed to talk to init daemon.
> # systemctl status reboot.target
> Failed to get properties: Connection timed out
> #
>
> Nothing I think of would achieve a normal controlled reboot. And nothing
> in the log files.
>
>   1. shutdown -r now
>   2. reboot
>   3. ctrl-alt-del
>   4. kill -INT 1
>   5. kill -HUP 1
>   6. kill -9 1
>
> I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
>
> Any tips?
>
> Elijah
> ------
> not impressed with this failure mode
>

	I am lucky enough to use PCLinux OS 2016.03 and it does not
use systemd.  I do not much care for systemd perhaps respecting it
a bit more than a Trump or a Bannon.  Even in PCLinuxOS 2016.07
with the KDE incomplete Plasma 5 gets by without systemd.  There
are other distributions about without systemd.  Look around at
Distrowatch and try out some different distributions.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/16/2016 5:09:27 AM
In comp.os.linux.misc, Bobbie Sellers  <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> 	I am lucky enough to use PCLinux OS 2016.03 and it does not
> use systemd.  I do not much care for systemd perhaps respecting it
> a bit more than a Trump or a Bannon.  Even in PCLinuxOS 2016.07

Thanks, but that is not a helpful suggestion. I have and use more than
one distro, I'm interested in understanding THIS ONE right now, not
re-OSing.

Elijah
------
admitedly has heard little to like about systemd
0
Eli
11/16/2016 6:17:18 AM
In comp.os.linux.misc, David W. Hodgins <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>> For some reason systemd just decided to stop taking requests, so I
>> thought I'd reboot.
> File system full?

No, failed to properly recover from hibernate. Networking was also down
(which was how I noticed systemd not being responsive).

> > I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
> > Any tips?
> 
> Learn the magic sysrq keys.
> While holding down the alt+ctrl+sysrq keys, press the following keys.
> RSEISUB (Raising Skinny Elephants Is Still Utterly Boring).

Reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_SysRq_key I don't think the
RSEI bit would have been needed. X11 was running just fine. I could
start new xterms, consult man pages, and save notes to disk. I just had
no networking and no reboot. 

Does this stuff have a man page?

Elijah
------
ha ha, of course the answer is no, right?
0
Eli
11/16/2016 6:36:25 AM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 06:36:25 +0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.misc, David W. Hodgins <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
>> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>> For some reason systemd just decided to stop taking requests, so I
>>> thought I'd reboot.
>> File system full?
>
> No, failed to properly recover from hibernate. Networking was also down
> (which was how I noticed systemd not being responsive).
>
>> > I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
>
> Reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_SysRq_key I don't think the
> RSEI bit would have been needed. X11 was running just fine. I could
> start new xterms, consult man pages, and save notes to disk. I just had
> no networking and no reboot. 

Only time I had a problem somewhat like yours was when dbus service died.

> Does this stuff have a man page?

Of course.
    man systemd.index
    man journalctl

Some example usages, as root:
   systemctl --failed
   journalctl | grep -iE "error|warn|fail"
0
Bit
11/16/2016 7:40:46 AM
Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.misc, Bobbie Sellers  <bliss@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
>>       I am lucky enough to use PCLinux OS 2016.03 and it does not
>> use systemd.  I do not much care for systemd perhaps respecting it
>> a bit more than a Trump or a Bannon.  Even in PCLinuxOS 2016.07
> 
> Thanks, but that is not a helpful suggestion. I have and use more than
> one distro, I'm interested in understanding THIS ONE right now, not
> re-OSing.

Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
avoid encountering it again in the future.  So it is a "tip", (and you
asked for "tips" in general).  It is just not a tip you want to make
use of.

0
Rich
11/16/2016 12:27:31 PM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 01:36:25 -0500, Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

> Reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_SysRq_key I don't think the
> RSEI bit would have been needed. X11 was running just fine. I could
> start new xterms, consult man pages, and save notes to disk. I just had
> no networking and no reboot.

The keys are all included as a safety factor, to ensure all processes
have been stopped, and disk writes have been completed, before the
reboot.

> Does this stuff have a man page?
> ha ha, of course the answer is no, right?

Correct. The keys are documented in /usr/share/doc/kernel-doc/sysrq.txt
 from the kernel-doc package though.

The phrase raising skinny elephants is still utterly boring, is one I
find quite easy to remember. Much easier then reviewing the doc file
for each key that can be used, and figuring out which ones should be
used, in which order.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

-- 
Change dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org to davidwhodgins@teksavvy.com for
email replies.
0
David
11/16/2016 6:50:39 PM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 00:05:55 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:
>
> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:43:59 -0500, Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>
>> I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
>> Any tips?
>
> Learn the magic sysrq keys.
> While holding down the alt+ctrl+sysrq keys, press the following keys.
> RSEISUB (Raising Skinny Elephants Is Still Utterly Boring).

I memorized REISUB. AFAIK it doesn't stand for anything. But spelled
backwards it BUSIER.
-- 
Andreas
You know you are a redneck if
your handkerchief doubles as your shirt sleeve.
0
Andreas
11/16/2016 9:02:53 PM
In comp.os.linux.misc, Rich  <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
> avoid encountering it again in the future.

My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
time to research things, but less money to spend on things.

Elijah
------
we are not all hobbiests pursuing feelgood goals
0
Eli
11/17/2016 1:07:00 AM
On 2016-11-16 07:17, Eli the Bearded wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.misc, Bobbie Sellers  <> wrote:
>> 	I am lucky enough to use PCLinux OS 2016.03 and it does not
>> use systemd.  I do not much care for systemd perhaps respecting it
>> a bit more than a Trump or a Bannon.  Even in PCLinuxOS 2016.07
> 
> Thanks, but that is not a helpful suggestion. I have and use more than
> one distro, I'm interested in understanding THIS ONE right now, not
> re-OSing.

Well, I would tentatively classify in the "aye, these things happen"
section, and continue :-)

There is a recently discovered bug on systemd that causes similar
symptoms. But it needs a human running a wrong command

NOTIFY_SOCKET=/run/systemd/notify systemd-notify ""

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
0
Carlos
11/17/2016 11:13:33 AM
Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.misc, Rich  <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
>> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
>> avoid encountering it again in the future.
> 
> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.

And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
picking up by osmosis.

And with a topic as divisive and heated as systemd, asking a systemd
question *will* get at least one comment of "stop using the damn thing
then".  So letting us know you are chained to systemd and can't escape
up front might have had one of two outcomes:

  1) the "stop using the damn thing then" comment would not have been
     posted
  or
  2) when the inevitable "stop ..." comment was posted, you could point
     back to the original and quote the portion of the original where
     you might have stated something like: "I'm chained to it due to my
     job, so switching away from it is not a viable option"
0
Rich
11/17/2016 11:40:14 AM
On 17/11/16 11:40, Rich wrote:
> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>> In comp.os.linux.misc, Rich  <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>>> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
>>> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
>>> avoid encountering it again in the future.
>>
>> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
>> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.
>
> And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
> of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
> picking up by osmosis.
>
> And with a topic as divisive and heated as systemd, asking a systemd
> question *will* get at least one comment of "stop using the damn thing
> then".  So letting us know you are chained to systemd and can't escape
> up front might have had one of two outcomes:
>
>   1) the "stop using the damn thing then" comment would not have been
>      posted
>   or
>   2) when the inevitable "stop ..." comment was posted, you could point
>      back to the original and quote the portion of the original where
>      you might have stated something like: "I'm chained to it due to my
>      job, so switching away from it is not a viable option"
>

Sound advice.

I recently responded to a questionless post  of the 'my garblewidget is 
making a strange noise when I press its grobbulator toggle' with

"That's nice of it"


Its hard work framing questions accurately.

If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5 
time as much and bought a Mac.;-)



-- 
"Corbyn talks about equality, justice, opportunity, health care, peace, 
community, compassion, investment, security, housing...."
"What kind of person is not interested in those things?"

"Jeremy Corbyn?"

0
The
11/17/2016 12:28:24 PM
Rich <rich@example.invalid> writes:
> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>> Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>>> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
>>> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
>>> avoid encountering it again in the future.
>> 
>> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
>> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.
>
> And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
> of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
> picking up by osmosis.

Persnoally I would assume that if someone states they’re using a
particular platform, they have a good reason to do so.  Most of us want
to get some work done, rather change Linux distributions every few
weeks.

-- 
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/
0
Richard
11/17/2016 1:57:12 PM
On 17/11/16 13:57, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
> Rich <rich@example.invalid> writes:
>> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>> Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>>>> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
>>>> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
>>>> avoid encountering it again in the future.
>>>
>>> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
>>> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.
>>
>> And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
>> of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
>> picking up by osmosis.
>
> Persnoally I would assume that if someone states they’re using a
> particular platform, they have a good reason to do so.  Most of us want
> to get some work done, rather change Linux distributions every few
> weeks.
>
I fear you may be projecting your own psyche into the motivations of 
others: There are many people to whom Linux is an absorbing hobby...or 
almost a religion....


-- 
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's 
too dark to read.

Groucho Marx


0
The
11/17/2016 2:43:23 PM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 16:02:53 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach wrote:

> On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 00:05:55 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:43:59 -0500, Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
>>> Any tips?
>>
>> Learn the magic sysrq keys.
>> While holding down the alt+ctrl+sysrq keys, press the following keys.
>> RSEISUB (Raising Skinny Elephants Is Still Utterly Boring).
> 
> I memorized REISUB. AFAIK it doesn't stand for anything. But spelled
> backwards it BUSIER.

Me too. And I find the single pronounceable word "reisub" to be easier
to remember than any of the mnemonic phrases.
0
Joe
11/17/2016 3:41:53 PM
On 2016-11-17 15:43, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 17/11/16 13:57, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
>> Rich <> writes:


>> Persnoally I would assume that if someone states they’re using a
>> particular platform, they have a good reason to do so.  Most of us want
>> to get some work done, rather change Linux distributions every few
>> weeks.
>>
> I fear you may be projecting your own psyche into the motivations of
> others: There are many people to whom Linux is an absorbing hobby...or
> almost a religion....

For many of us, after using a distribution for years, changing to
another is an ordeal, only done for very serious reasons.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
0
Carlos
11/17/2016 4:17:41 PM
On 2016-11-17, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 17/11/16 11:40, Rich wrote:
>> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>> In comp.os.linux.misc, Rich  <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>>>> Well, yes, it does not answer your actual question.  But it would also
>>>> mean you would save the time spent trying to figure it out and you'd
>>>> avoid encountering it again in the future.
>>>
>>> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
>>> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.
>>
>> And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
>> of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
>> picking up by osmosis.
>>
>> And with a topic as divisive and heated as systemd, asking a systemd
>> question *will* get at least one comment of "stop using the damn thing
>> then".  So letting us know you are chained to systemd and can't escape
>> up front might have had one of two outcomes:
>>
>>   1) the "stop using the damn thing then" comment would not have been
>>      posted
>>   or
>>   2) when the inevitable "stop ..." comment was posted, you could point
>>      back to the original and quote the portion of the original where
>>      you might have stated something like: "I'm chained to it due to my
>>      job, so switching away from it is not a viable option"
>>
>
> Sound advice.
>
> I recently responded to a questionless post  of the 'my garblewidget is 
> making a strange noise when I press its grobbulator toggle' with
>
> "That's nice of it"
>
>
> Its hard work framing questions accurately.
>
> If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5 
> time as much and bought a Mac.;-)

And that would have helped how? Who would have sorted the stuff out?
Apple? Sure. Next month?
Much more likely to get helpful advice here. 
But certainly when asking for help, remembering that noone else can read
your mind. 
HOwever, I know, having been guilty of posting contextless help requests
at times, an assumption is the expectation/hope that the problem, even
minimally described, is so common that someone will know the solution. 
Of course that is very very rarely true, but I have sometimes managed to
guess the problem of others, despite highly inadequate information.
(Usually unfortunately I guess wrongly).


>
>
>
0
William
11/17/2016 4:33:22 PM
On 2016-11-17, Joe Beanfish <joebeanfish@nospam.duh> wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 16:02:53 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 16 Nov 2016 00:05:55 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:43:59 -0500, Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I ended up having to resort to the power switch. Ubuntu 16.04.1 LTS.
>>>> Any tips?
>>>
>>> Learn the magic sysrq keys.
>>> While holding down the alt+ctrl+sysrq keys, press the following keys.
>>> RSEISUB (Raising Skinny Elephants Is Still Utterly Boring).
>> 
>> I memorized REISUB. AFAIK it doesn't stand for anything. But spelled
>> backwards it BUSIER.
>
> Me too. And I find the single pronounceable word "reisub" to be easier
> to remember than any of the mnemonic phrases.

HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have any
key labeled that.
0
William
11/17/2016 4:36:08 PM
On 17/11/16 16:33, William Unruh wrote:
>> If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5
>> > time as much and bought a Mac.;-)
> And that would have helped how? Who would have sorted the stuff out?
> Apple? Sure. Next month?

well apple make money my solving MOST of the n00b questions in store etc.

> Much more likely to get helpful advice here.

True...

> But certainly when asking for help, remembering that noone else can read
> your mind.
> HOwever, I know, having been guilty of posting contextless help requests
> at times, an assumption is the expectation/hope that the problem, even
> minimally described, is so common that someone will know the solution.

The problem there is that these days, there is google. If google has 
failed to find the problem for you, its pretty recondite and chances are 
you are the first or at any rate one of only half a dozen, to experience 
the issue.

And often no one can be arsed to fix it anyway.

Here is a screenshot (aisle riot solitaire) from September 2014

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%20Ends/Screenshot-Maze.png

I, and others,  logged it as a bug

Here is a screenshot taken today

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%20Ends/maze.png

Notice any difference? Nope, me neither. 2 years and two on this on this 
bug is STILL there....

> Of course that is very very rarely true, but I have sometimes managed to
> guess the problem of others, despite highly inadequate information.
> (Usually unfortunately I guess wrongly).

Oh, I've done better than that, with just enough information I have 
pinpointed a problem exactly, but then I spend several years heading up 
tech support, and that's what you have to do there if you can't afford a 
subcontinent outsourcing facility and a script...


-- 
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, 
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."

Jonathan Swift.
0
The
11/17/2016 5:04:23 PM
On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 11:36:08 -0500, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:

> HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have any
> key labeled that.

The print screen key, usually the first key to the right of the f12 key.

My current keyboard also just labels it Print Screen, while two older
keyboards I have around label in PrtSc on one line, and SysRq on a second
line.

I forget whether it's the alt key, or the ctrl key that switches that
key between the two. Not testing that right now. :-)

Regards, Dave Hodgins

-- 
Change dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org to davidwhodgins@teksavvy.com for
email replies.
0
David
11/17/2016 5:45:02 PM
On 11/17/2016 08:17 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2016-11-17 15:43, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 17/11/16 13:57, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
>>> Rich <> writes:
>
>
>>> Persnoally I would assume that if someone states they’re using a
>>> particular platform, they have a good reason to do so.  Most of us want
>>> to get some work done, rather change Linux distributions every few
>>> weeks.
>>>
>> I fear you may be projecting your own psyche into the motivations of
>> others: There are many people to whom Linux is an absorbing hobby...or
>> almost a religion....

	When I saw those words I was inspired and wrote the following
post.  After I wrote it I pondered briefly what to do with it and
finally decided to change the Subject header line.

	Followups are set to alt.os.linux.pclinuxos but you can edit that to 
your taste.  Since it is general comp.os.linux.misc would suit
as well.  LUG meetings twice a month might be considered religious
observances.

>
> For many of us, after using a distribution for years, changing to
> another is an ordeal, only done for very serious reasons.
>
	For me Linux is an absorbing hobby with which I hope to get
some work done.
	I switched from Mandriva 2010.2 after Mandriva 2011 would
not run on my old Compaq notebook,  It took me a couple of years
to get to the PCLinuxOS which is a fork started before Mandrake
merged with Connectiva.
	A couple of years back my Compaq failed and I needed another
notebook and ended up with my present Pavilion.  PCLOS at that time
was not developed so far as to permit dual-booting under UEFI and the 
Pavilion had that feature so I started using Mageia 4.1.  Early this 
year I learned that PCLinuxOS would now support UEFI or rather EFI
and so I went back to it and within a few months had switched my
main activities to it.

	Last spring I managed to get my hands on a couple of
salvaged Dell E2620s one of which worked and the the other is
now Parts.
	On the working Dell I have an afunctional Windows 7
and the master installation of PCLinuxOS 2016.03 and which
like this Pavilion I keep fully updated,
	Next in is PCLinuxOS 2016.07 with the KDE's Plasma
  5 preview and it is a long way from the functionality of
  KDE's Plasma 4.14.18 but I manage to get it to work though.
for my simplest tasks.
	I have two other OSes on this system but these are usually
just visitors, Salix, Q4OS with Trinity 14.0.2 Trinity is a fork
of KDE's DE 3.5.9.  I will have to find a another OS using Trinity
before I can say much about it because Q4OS seems to be set up
to be used by children.   It uses a BusyBox sort of utilities
bundled together but it does not have Midnight Commander and
when I downloaded it could not check on the .rpm/deb.  It
is based on Debian GNU/Linux 8 "Jessie" distribution. No
later kernel than the 3.1.6(may have the exact number wrong)
is listed.  I searched on kernel and no number kernel showed
up. In addition the protection level is such that it makes it
quite difficult to copy off information to external media.

	On PCLinux OS I have, using similar tools access to
all the numbered kernels released and am presently using
4.8.8.
	In addition on that same box i have had Lubuntu XFCE and
the powerful but painful for a KDE user Ubuntu Studio.  In
the past I have had other distributions including Mageia6
which fell over every time it updated.  I also had Open
Mandriva 3.0 installed and while it beat the other systems
to the repositories it still was lacking a fully functional
Desktop Environment so after enduring a few updates which
did nothing for the smoothness or speed of operation
I wiped it out.
	
	So what work do I do on these machines aside from
keeping them updated.  I principally write about Linux,
anime, manga, and do some minor political work.  For
SF-LUG I make cds/dvds of recent major releases and
less well-known distributions which somehow attract
my attention such as PCLOS-Baby-mate-2015.10 which
I wiped after tests showed it unable to be stable after
updates,  That is a community release.
	 I provide a short column of simple Linux news
for the Champaign-Urbana Computer User Group'S
monthly e-publication the status Register at the request
of the publisher, an old online pal from the Team Amiga
mailing list.  <http://www.cucug.org/>

	What I look for in a Linux Distribution is how
much like an CBM Amiga Computer I can make it feel.
	Of course unless you used an Amiga you have no
idea what I am trying to do but the Amiga was the first
computer I used with a GUI, a dual-pane file manager that you
could configure, SID1.3 then SID2: Word Pro and Final Writer
word processing programs and Textra text processor with
bookmarks.  It had an easily configurable TCP/IP stack, Miami
and I used AWeb, a simple and rapidly outdated browser.
It had a tiny OS with pre-emptive multi-tasking which other
consumer level systems took years to catch up with.

	My first computer was the C=64 and I did word
processing there with Paperclip, the Batteries Included
word processor with inserted commands,  I also used the
C=128/64 which with dual processing, ran CP/M  I found
I did not much care for CP/M amd my next move was to the
Amiga.   I got computers because I am a rotten typist
and I wanted to write.  I have gotten better at both.
Even with the handicap of being unable to sit at the
computer for many hours as I used to do my work output
is about 20x what it was on the C=64.
	I have used XP, Vista, and 8.1 and I pity
whoever must either thru ignorance or the sad
necessities of work use that system.  I am not religious
about it but in the SF-LUG we will help anyone who
want to escape the tool of oppression, Microsoft Windows.

	bliss

-- 
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
0
Bobbie
11/17/2016 6:23:26 PM
In comp.os.linux.misc, Rich  <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>> My job requires using Ubuntu. Your answer is would give me much more
>> time to research things, but less money to spend on things.
> And that there is an *extremely* useful bit of knowledge that *not one*
> of us here on the other end of a Usenet server from you have any way of
> picking up by osmosis.

It is just as irrelevant to the question I asked as my preference in
editor.

Elijah
------
does not really care how you can read news and polish floors in Sublime
0
Eli
11/18/2016 12:18:41 AM
with <op.yq219cdqa3w0dxdave@hodgins.homeip.net> David W. Hodgins wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 11:36:08 -0500, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:

>> HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have
>> any key labeled that.
*SKIP*
> I forget whether it's the alt key, or the ctrl key that switches that
> key between the two. Not testing that right now. :-)

It's left [alt].  That's important because right [alt] doesn't work.
Also they need to check /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq .  The value might be
surprising (learned it hard way).

-- 
Torvalds' goal for Linux is very simple: World Domination
Stallman's goal for GNU is even simpler: Freedom
0
Eric
11/18/2016 10:12:44 AM
On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:45:02 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:

> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 11:36:08 -0500, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:
> 
>> HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have any
>> key labeled that.
> 
> The print screen key, usually the first key to the right of the f12 key.
> 
> My current keyboard also just labels it Print Screen, while two older
> keyboards I have around label in PrtSc on one line, and SysRq on a second
> line.
> 
> I forget whether it's the alt key, or the ctrl key that switches that
> key between the two. Not testing that right now. :-)

It's Alt. "h" is safe to test as it just prints a help message.
0
Joe
11/18/2016 2:23:49 PM
On 2016-11-18 15:23, Joe Beanfish wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:45:02 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 11:36:08 -0500, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have any
>>> key labeled that.
>>
>> The print screen key, usually the first key to the right of the f12 key.
>>
>> My current keyboard also just labels it Print Screen, while two older
>> keyboards I have around label in PrtSc on one line, and SysRq on a second
>> line.
>>
>> I forget whether it's the alt key, or the ctrl key that switches that
>> key between the two. Not testing that right now. :-)
> 
> It's Alt. "h" is safe to test as it just prints a help message.

Here nothing happens. Not even a message in the log.

Telcontar:~ # cat /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq
0
Telcontar:~ #

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
0
Carlos
11/18/2016 11:18:45 PM
William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> writes:

> On 2016-11-17, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5 
>> time as much and bought a Mac.;-)
>
> And that would have helped how? Who would have sorted the stuff out?
> Apple? Sure. Next month?

But Apple has Geniuses!

Actually, I was told by a Mac use that the Apple Store has a Genius Bar,
to which I replied that the bar is probably pretty low.

> Much more likely to get helpful advice here. 
>
> But certainly when asking for help, remembering that noone else can read
> your mind. 

I've always found that, the more helpful your question, the more helpful
the advice will be. :)
0
Bud
11/21/2016 1:40:51 PM
On 21/11/16 13:40, Bud Frede wrote:
> Actually, I was told by a Mac use that the Apple Store has a Genius
> Bar, to which I replied that the bar is probably pretty low.

Pure genius! It's a good thing I had put the mug down and swallowed earlier.


-- 
How fortunate for governments that the people they administer don't think.

Adolf Hitler

0
The
11/21/2016 1:45:27 PM
On 2016-11-21, Bud Frede <frede@mouse-potato.com> wrote:

> William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> writes:
>
>> On 2016-11-17, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5 
>>> time as much and bought a Mac.;-)
>>
>> And that would have helped how? Who would have sorted the stuff out?
>> Apple? Sure. Next month?
>
> But Apple has Geniuses!
>
> Actually, I was told by a Mac use that the Apple Store has a Genius Bar,
> to which I replied that the bar is probably pretty low.

<chuckle> That one's a keeper.

>> Much more likely to get helpful advice here. 
>>
>> But certainly when asking for help, remembering that noone else can read
>> your mind. 
>
> I've always found that, the more helpful your question, the more helpful
> the advice will be. :)

Truer words were never spoken.

User: Something's wrong with the system.
Me:   What seems to be the problem?
User: It doesn't work!
Me:   OK, what happened?
User: It gave a funny message.
(Then begins a lengthy ordeal in which I try to get the user
to read the message without misreading words, omitting anything,
or applying their own interpretation.  Grrr...)

-- 
/~\  cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ /  I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
 X   Top-posted messages will probably be ignored.  See RFC1855.
/ \  HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored.  Join the ASCII ribbon campaign!
0
Charlie
11/21/2016 4:29:51 PM
On Sat, 19 Nov 2016 00:18:45 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote:

> On 2016-11-18 15:23, Joe Beanfish wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:45:02 -0500, David W. Hodgins wrote:
>> 
>>> On Thu, 17 Nov 2016 11:36:08 -0500, William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> HOwever, remind me what the Sysreq key is. None of my systems have any
>>>> key labeled that.
>>>
>>> The print screen key, usually the first key to the right of the f12 key.
>>>
>>> My current keyboard also just labels it Print Screen, while two older
>>> keyboards I have around label in PrtSc on one line, and SysRq on a second
>>> line.
>>>
>>> I forget whether it's the alt key, or the ctrl key that switches that
>>> key between the two. Not testing that right now. :-)
>> 
>> It's Alt. "h" is safe to test as it just prints a help message.
> 
> Here nothing happens. Not even a message in the log.
> 
> Telcontar:~ # cat /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq
> 0
> Telcontar:~ #

As expected since you have it disabled.

https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/sysrq.txt
0
Joe
11/21/2016 6:30:51 PM
In article <o0v7dv2cnf@news3.newsguy.com>, 
cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid says...
> 
> On 2016-11-21, Bud Frede <frede@mouse-potato.com> wrote:
> 
> > William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> writes:
> >
> >> On 2016-11-17, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >>
> >>> If you just wanted someone to sort stuff out, you should have paid 5 
> >>> time as much and bought a Mac.;-)
> >>
> >> And that would have helped how? Who would have sorted the stuff out?
> >> Apple? Sure. Next month?
> >
> > But Apple has Geniuses!
> >
> > Actually, I was told by a Mac use that the Apple Store has a Genius Bar,
> > to which I replied that the bar is probably pretty low.
> 
> <chuckle> That one's a keeper.
> 
> >> Much more likely to get helpful advice here. 
> >>
> >> But certainly when asking for help, remembering that noone else can read
> >> your mind. 
> >
> > I've always found that, the more helpful your question, the more helpful
> > the advice will be. :)
> 
> Truer words were never spoken.
> 
> User: Something's wrong with the system.
> Me:   What seems to be the problem?
> User: It doesn't work!
> Me:   OK, what happened?
> User: It gave a funny message.
> (Then begins a lengthy ordeal in which I try to get the user
> to read the message without misreading words, omitting anything,
> or applying their own interpretation.  Grrr...)

On the opposite extreme, I have one client who 
insists on going through all the symptoms in ad 
nauseum detail before he'll even let me look at 
the machine.  This would be fine if he had 
arcane problems of the sort that require 
extensive analysis, but his problem is typically 
EBKC.  


0
J
12/3/2016 9:27:16 PM
Reply: