f



Somebody please PLEASE tell me how to install Linux on Windows (oh the pain, the PAIN of Linux installs!)

In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
trivia about AMD chips.  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
(see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
drive.  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
movement after all.  For a minute.

Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
(specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?  Keep in mind due to
the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.

When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
just getting it to install.  I see that not much has changed in Linux
land over the last 10 years, not unlike that scene from the first
Crocodile Dundee movie where Paul Hogan turns on a TV many years after
"I Love Lucy" stopped production, sees the same show in rerun
syndication, and rightly concludes that not much has changed in TV
programming.

Same as it ever was.  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

RL

"Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" -- Yiddish
proverb.
0
raylopez99 (937)
11/28/2007 10:09:19 AM
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raylopez99 wrote:
> In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> trivia about AMD chips.  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> drive.  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
> nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> movement after all.  For a minute.
> 
> Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
> (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?  Keep in mind due to
> the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.
> 
> When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
> fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
> just getting it to install.  I see that not much has changed in Linux
> land over the last 10 years, not unlike that scene from the first
> Crocodile Dundee movie where Paul Hogan turns on a TV many years after
> "I Love Lucy" stopped production, sees the same show in rerun
> syndication, and rightly concludes that not much has changed in TV
> programming.
> 
> Same as it ever was.  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
> 
> RL
> 
> "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" -- Yiddish
> proverb.
I gave you instructions. Please read them.

Tony(UK)
0
ajsnot (2)
11/28/2007 10:26:20 AM
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:09:19 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

> In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on how
> to install Linux onto a SATA drive,

I wonder why?

<quote>
Now tell me how to install
Linux you dum basturd.
</quote>

I guess that, until you mend your manners and learn to spell, you'll just 
have to figure it out on your own.

0
nomail4 (589)
11/28/2007 10:40:55 AM
AJS wrote:

> raylopez99 wrote:

<snip>

>> "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" -- Yiddish
>> proverb.
> I gave you instructions. Please read them.
> 
> Tony(UK)

YHBT.

-- 
Operating systems: FreeBSD 6.2 (64bit), PC-BSD 1.4,
Testing: FreeBSD 7.0-BETA 3
Linux systems: Kubuntu 7.10 "Gutsy" amd64,
Debian 4.0, PCLinuxOS 2007.
0
wp2118 (191)
11/28/2007 10:48:07 AM
Hello,

In comp.os.linux.misc raylopez99 <raylopez99@yahoo.com> wrote:

> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.

what about spending the money for a legal Vista version? Then you get
what you want. Forget about Linux then. You can live without Linux and
Linux, however, can without you ;-)

Have a nice day,   gk

0
gk24 (7)
11/28/2007 11:15:09 AM
Georg Klein wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> In comp.os.linux.misc raylopez99 <raylopez99@yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
>> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
>> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.
> 
> what about spending the money for a legal Vista version? Then you get
> what you want. Forget about Linux then. You can live without Linux and
> Linux, however, can without you ;-)
> 
> Have a nice day,   gk
> 
He still has to install it.

The obvious brand for this idiot is APPLE. He'll pay through the nose 
and feel twice the prick!


0
The
11/28/2007 11:58:52 AM
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:09:19 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

> In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> trivia about AMD chips.  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> drive.  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
> nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> movement after all.  For a minute.
> 
> Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows

INsert the disc containing Linux, reboot and follow the instuctions. IF
you have a Live CD that is installable, there is usually a large,
prominent icon saying INSTALL. Is that plain enough?

If you have Windows on a separate drive you need have no fears of losing
it. Most good distros will simply add it to the boot sequence. 

> (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?  Keep in mind due to
> the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.

Give me a good reason why anyone should bother to help you when you ignore
everything useful said to you?

> 
> When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
> fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
> just getting it to install.  I see that not much has changed in Linux

You are *TOTALLY, UTTERLY* wrong. It has changed out of all recognition,
and the parts that have changed *most* are installation and
desktop-readiness. Stop being deliberately stupid. YOu have been told
several times that you are totally wrong about Linux, yet you repeat the
nonsense time and again, and still expect help.

-- 
Kier


0
vallon (8614)
11/28/2007 3:28:22 PM
Kier wrote:

> Stop being deliberately stupid.

Stop feeding the troll.

0
chrisv (22840)
11/28/2007 4:24:12 PM
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:09:19 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:

> In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> trivia about AMD chips.  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> drive.  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
> nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> movement after all.  For a minute.
> 
> Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
> (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?  Keep in mind due to
> the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.
> 
> When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
> fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
> just getting it to install.  I see that not much has changed in Linux
> land over the last 10 years, not unlike that scene from the first
> Crocodile Dundee movie where Paul Hogan turns on a TV many years after
> "I Love Lucy" stopped production, sees the same show in rerun
> syndication, and rightly concludes that not much has changed in TV
> programming.
> 
> Same as it ever was.  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
> 
> RL
> 
> "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" -- Yiddish
> proverb.

It's basically a very complex proposition to install Linux on a system
which already has MS installed. You must:

1) verify in BIOS that you can boot from a CD or DVD
2) boot from the Linux CD or DVD
3) follow the onscreen instructions

At the end you will have a dual boot system all set up and ready to go.

0
ray65 (5421)
11/28/2007 5:57:28 PM
On Nov 28, 1:57 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:09:19 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
> > In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> > how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> > trivia about AMD chips.

In that thread you explained that you had a pirated copy of Vista that
wouldn't activate properly.  Having established that you are a pirate,
you really don't have a right to install Vista.

On the other hand, you should be able to legally install Linux pretty
easily.

> >  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> > (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> > drive.

There are a number of different Linux Distributions.  I haven't
installed Mandriva lately, but I am familiar with SUSE (which I
prefer), Fedora (more basic but effective), and Ubuntu (a recently
emenging desktop version of Linux).

Ideally, if you have the Windows installation media, you should
probably install Windows first, but allocate a partition rather than
the entire disk.  If it is too late and you have allocated the entire
hard drive, this is not a problem.  You can still use either fips or
parted to shrink the Windows/Vista partition and this will make space
for the Linux partition.  A commercial product called Partition Magic
will given you even more reliable repartitioning and can pre-allocate
the ext3 Linux partitions as well as the Swap partition.  The SUSE and
Ubuntu distributions will let you boot into a Linux powered installer
that will automate the partitioning for you.

If you like, you can just create a single "root" partition and a
single "swap" partition.  The advantage of a swap partition.  Many
more experienced Linux installers also create a dedicated "/home"
partition, which allows them to keep personal data while switching
between different Linux distributions.

Once you have allocated the "free space" to Linux, you can install
Linux into that partition.  Linux will then offer you the option of
installing GRUB, which will allow you to choose between Linux and
Windows when you boot your hard drive.  Normally, the installation
software will also give you the option of setting your "default"
operating system.

> >  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
> > nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> > I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> > movement after all.  For a minute.

There are serveral different Linux diistributions, and many have
different offerings within the distirbution.  For example, there are
Mandriva, SUSE, and Ubuntu DVDs which include a huge selection of
software.  You can boot the DVD, install the "core" system which is
pretty basic, mostly configured to work a bit like Windows with
Office.  Once the core system has been installed, the additional
software can be installed.  There are different GUI interfaces for
installing these packages, but the GUI interface makes it very easy to
go "shopping" for numerous applications.

Other distributions are CD based installations.  These include only
the "base" systems and core graphics functions, but the application
can be installed easily and the additional applications can be
installed using an internet connection.  If you have a high speed
internet connection, this is often a practical alternative to
downloading a DVD.

DVDs can often be found at local bookstores, Borders, Barnes & Noble,
and many other book stores have Magazine racks which carry several
different distributions.  Normally, these magazines sell for around
$10-$15 per issue.  Linux Format, Linux +, and several others out of
the United Kingdom are easily find.  In the book area, usually in the
computer section, you can find books containing Linux CDs or Linux
DVDs.  Often these are older versions, but this isn't a problem since
the automatic update process will provide you the upgrades in about an
hour if you want them.

If you can't get a physical CD-ROM, or DVD, you can download your own
copy as an ISO image and use it to generate the CD using a freely
downloaded Windows application.  Commercial CD burning applications
such as Nero and EZ-CD creator also have this capability.  The CD
burner provided with Windows XP does not have this capability.

> > Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> > go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
> > (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?

Another approach is to use a virtual machine.  Assuming you have a
LEGAL copy of Vista which has already been PROPERLY installed, this is
the easiest way to "Test Drive" several different Linux distributions.

You can download VMWare PLayer from http://vmware.com/download/player/

You can then download a number of "appliance" versions of Linux.
Try http://vmware.com/appliances/ for a catalog of appliances
 ranging from very simple browser and e-mail appliances,
to very complex server environments.

Look at the "most frequently downloaded",
http://vmware.com/appliances/directory/1066

> >  Keep in mind due to
> > the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> > leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> > in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> > fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.

Another thing you might want to consider is taking out some
"insurance".  Using VMware converter, you can create a "virtual
appliance" from your installed Windows system.  This appliance can
either be used with Windows or with Linux as the "core" operating
system.

http://vmware.com/download/converter/

> > When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
> > fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
> > just getting it to install.

Getting Linux to install is getting easier and easier.  If you have a
"Linux Ready" PC, it's often possible to install Linux on a PC
preloaded with Windows XP in less than 30 minutes.

The best way find out if your PC is "Linux Ready" is to obtain or
create a bootable CD, often referred to as a "Live-CD" and attempt to
boot from the CD-ROM.  This will often let you know whether your
hardware has elements that are "Linux Hostile".  This is really
important to know before attempting a Linux installation, since
installation into Linux hostile hardware can often require complex
secondary downloads, special drivers, and may even additional hardware
such as additional WiFi cards,

> >  I see that not much has changed in Linux
> > land over the last 10 years,

Since all you did was "install" Linux 10 years ago, you wouldn't
really know would you?

There have been numerous improvements.  10 years ago, 1997, KDE was in
it's infancy, GNOME was still rather primitive, the kernel wasn't as
efficient, and most PCs were only 32 bit, most file system limited
file sizes to 2 Gb per file.  Office suites existed, but were more
limited in their ability.  There were applications, but the number of
available applications have more than tripled, possibly even 10-fold
compared to Linux distributions of the 1997 era.  These days, it's not
uncommon for fully featured Linux distributions to fill an entire
DVD.  1997 Linux distributions with everything would often take less
than 1 600 MByte CD-ROM.

Today, Linux supports 64 bit multi-core processors, supports high
resolution displays, high speed graphics cards, including OpenGL
compatible graphics cards.  Even Windows didn't have USB, now Linux
supports USB, FireWire, SAS, and SATA drives, as well as EIDE, SCSI-3,
and other high-end hard drives and solid-state drives such as flash
devices.

> > not unlike that scene from the first
> > Crocodile Dundee movie where Paul Hogan turns on a TV many years after
> > "I Love Lucy" stopped production, sees the same show in rerun
> > syndication, and rightly concludes that not much has changed in TV
> > programming.
>
> > Same as it ever was.  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

That is really amusing.  When I Love Lucy first aired in the late
1950s, the shows were in black-and-white, they were often shot live,
the shows that were video taped were often erased within a few days
after the show was aired.  In most markets, there were only 3
networks, there was no public television, and there were extremely
tight restrictions on content.  Entertainers suspected of being
"Communists" (mostly just moderates or liberals) were black-listed and
had to have their work submitted to the studios via "Fronts".  Others
had to get out of show-biz entirely.

Today, there are over 200 channels on most cable boxes, as well as
Direct-TV.  There are both Liberal and Conservative networks, there
are enterntainment channels dedicated to entire genres that used to
only see a few hours per week during the 1950s and 1960s.  Channels
dedicated cartoons, Disney movies, history, comedy, science, military,
news, and even old movies and old television programs.

Similarly, Linux has also expanded.  The games are better, the
applications are better, there is full support for Java, applications
from Sun, IBM, Borland, and numerous others.  There are more
commercial applications, and entirely new documents.

> > RL
>
> > "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me" -- Yiddish
> > proverb.

There is one principle which cannot help but to keep one in
ignorance,  contempt prior to investigation.  - A.A Big Book.

> It's basically a very complex proposition to install Linux on a system
> which already has MS installed. You must:
>
> 1) verify in BIOS that you can boot from a CD or DVD
> 2) boot from the Linux CD or DVD
> 3) follow the onscreen instructions
>
> At the end you will have a dual boot system all set up and ready to go.

There are at least 1/2 dozen ways to have Windows and Linux on the
same machine.  Dual-boot is one.  Live-CDs is another, VMWare Player
is another, Xen is another, Microsoft's Virtual PC is another, and
booting from memory sticks or externel USB drives may also be an
option.

Start simple, with a live-cd or VWare player solution, find out what
Linux can (and can't) do, try using a properly configured Linux system
for at least 4 hours per day for at least 90 days.

 You might still decide that you prefer Windows, which is a legitimate
choice, but at least you will be making an informed choice, rather
than just spewing Microsoft's propaganda.  At least you didn't try to
tell us how Linux only supported a command line interface.

The command line interface is still available, and expands the
capabilities of users, but there are still LOTS of GUI based
applications and GUI interfaces to scripted or compiled applications.

Rex Ballard
0
rex.ballard (3732)
11/28/2007 8:56:08 PM
Thanks Rex Ballard for your long winded post.  My comments below.

On Nov 28, 12:56 pm, Rex Ballard <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Nov 28, 1:57 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:09:19 -0800, raylopez99 wrote:
> > > In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> > > how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> > > trivia about AMD chips.
>
> In that thread you explained that you had a pirated copy of Vista that
> wouldn't activate properly.  Having established that you are a pirate,
> you really don't have a right to install Vista.
>

Actually, the latest is that the putatively pirated DVD is actually
working (I had confused activation with validation--first you must
activate THEN validate, which I didn't do in the right order; but now
it seems to be working).


> On the other hand, you should be able to legally install Linux pretty
> easily.
>
> > >  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> > > (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> > > drive.
>
> There are a number of different Linux Distributions.  I haven't
> installed Mandriva lately, but I am familiar with SUSE (which I
> prefer), Fedora (more basic but effective), and Ubuntu (a recently
> emenging desktop version of Linux).

OK. Stop. You are clearly knowledgeable, as I've said before.  Since
your time, believe it or not, is money to me, I need your expert
advice:  I've decided to keep this Core 2 Duo system (it's just too
good for a rank beginner--I can get more out of it) and give instead
as a gift to a newbie user an old Pentium II machine with a 40 GB HD,
512 MB RAM.  What Linux Distro will support such a machine if I need a
GUI and a basic internet browser for light net surfing, and a light
email program?  Thanks in advance.  Something very basic, not esoteric
like "TinyLinux or "Linux running from a USB memory stick" or other
such stuff.  Oh yeah:  this old system has Windows NT running on it,
and I might even dual boot, but frankly I forgot how to do that (I've
done it before however--about 10 years ago, but it took a couple of
days and I don't have the time now).

On to your next points---please read on Rex as I have specific
questions I would kindly like answered.  Then I'll insult you, as is
my style (it wouldn't be right for an alleged troll not to insult a
COLA member), and then I'll sign off.  Thanks.

>
> Ideally, if you have the Windows installation media, you should
> probably install Windows first, but allocate a partition rather than
> the entire disk.  If it is too late and you have allocated the entire
> hard drive, this is not a problem.  You can still use either fips or
> parted to shrink the Windows/Vista partition and this will make space
> for the Linux partition.  A commercial product called Partition Magic
> will given you even more reliable repartitioning and can pre-allocate
> the ext3 Linux partitions as well as the Swap partition.  The SUSE and
> Ubuntu distributions will let you boot into a Linux powered installer
> that will automate the partitioning for you.

Yes, yes. right.  I do have Partion Magic (registered copy).  No
problem.   I will resize and leave an unformatted or new partition in
place for Linux. If you recall, when you install SUSE does it see
first the unpartitioned / unformatted part?  Or the entire disk?  Or
both?  (I think Linux uses it's own formatting...let me fire up PM
right now and find out...hold on... OK, I found out.  PM (actually I
have Acronis Disc Director but it's equivalent) says that Linux
formatting is "Linux Ext2, Ext3, ReiserFS and Swap".  Of the four if
you have a favorite please let me know.  Now my SPECIFIC question is
this:  I am afraid that I'll accidentally or otherwise overwrite my
NTFS partition, because installation programs sometimes default into
certain modes and have a mind of their own.  With this in mind, I
intend (on this older system, or maybe on this newer system too):  to
make a partition IN THE LINUX FORMAT (one of the above four).  Then, I
ASSUME (I need your input here) that during installation the Linux
distro CD will "see" the Linux formatted partiton "first" and "want to
go there to reside", rather than go on my NTFS boot sector primary
partition.  Is this a fair assumption?  Or, even better, will the
Linux distro install program give me a choice on the screen of where
to install the Linux kernel (i.e., at the Linux formatted portion of
the drive or on the NTFS portion perhaps, after NTFS is reformatted to
Linux format?).  If so, this gives me a lot of peace of mind to try
Linux.  My nightmare is that "automatically" SUSE or some other stupid
LInux distro will try and seize control of the entire C drive and
overwrite NTFS/Windows--don't laugh, I would not be surprised if some
Linux programmer who wrote the install program thinks this is a good
idea, to "force" users to convert to Linux.  Anti-virus programs have
done similar stuff when it comes to uninstall (think Norton).  Ok, I
think I made my point.  Thanks in advance.


>
> If you like, you can just create a single "root" partition and a
> single "swap" partition.  The advantage of a swap partition.  Many
> more experienced Linux installers also create a dedicated "/home"
> partition, which allows them to keep personal data while switching
> between different Linux distributions.
>

Yes, actually Vista now mandates the same thing.  You cannot store
data in the Program portion of Vista.


> Once you have allocated the "free space" to Linux, you can install
> Linux into that partition.

Yes, but please answer the above whether the program gives you a
choice.

> Linux will then offer you the option of
> installing GRUB, which will allow you to choose between Linux and
> Windows when you boot your hard drive.  Normally, the installation
> software will also give you the option of setting your "default"
> operating system.

That's nice.

>
> > >  It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look
> > > nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> > > I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> > > movement after all.  For a minute.
>
> There are serveral different Linux diistributions, and many have
> different offerings within the distirbution.  For example, there are
> Mandriva, SUSE, and Ubuntu DVDs which include a huge selection of
> software.  You can boot the DVD, install the "core" system which is
> pretty basic, mostly configured to work a bit like Windows with
> Office.  Once the core system has been installed, the additional
> software can be installed.  There are different GUI interfaces for
> installing these packages, but the GUI interface makes it very easy to
> go "shopping" for numerous applications.

DVDs are very cool in that you store more.  I am looking forward to
the HDVD/Blu-ray readers coming out next year--I intend to use them to
store image files of the HDs in my system--ie. for data backup.

>
> Other distributions are CD based installations.  These include only
> the "base" systems and core graphics functions, but the application
> can be installed easily and the additional applications can be
> installed using an internet connection.  If you have a high speed
> internet connection, this is often a practical alternative to
> downloading a DVD.

Yes.  But this non-power newbie has a dial up modem.  Maybe I'll find
a cheap DVD reader and replace her CD reader with it, as a compromise.

>
> DVDs can often be found at local bookstores, Borders, Barnes & Noble,
> and many other book stores have Magazine racks which carry several
> different distributions.  Normally, these magazines sell for around
> $10-$15 per issue.  Linux Format, Linux +, and several others out of
> the United Kingdom are easily find.  In the book area, usually in the
> computer section, you can find books containing Linux CDs or Linux
> DVDs.  Often these are older versions, but this isn't a problem since
> the automatic update process will provide you the upgrades in about an
> hour if you want them.

OK, thanks.  I know.  RedHat 5, which I installed 10 years ago (dual
booted with NT) was in the back of a book on LInux.

>
> If you can't get a physical CD-ROM, or DVD, you can download your own
> copy as an ISO image and use it to generate the CD using a freely
> downloaded Windows application.  Commercial CD burning applications
> such as Nero and EZ-CD creator also have this capability.  The CD
> burner provided with Windows XP does not have this capability.

Yes, that's true.  Why Windows lacks .ISO burning is a mystery to me.
I use Nero 8 (pirated but works fine).

>
> > > Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> > > go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
> > > (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?
>
> Another approach is to use a virtual machine.  Assuming you have a
> LEGAL copy of Vista which has already been PROPERLY installed, this is
> the easiest way to "Test Drive" several different Linux distributions.
>
> You can download VMWare PLayer fromhttp://vmware.com/download/player/

No way am I going this route.  This is a gimmick.

>
> You can then download a number of "appliance" versions of Linux.
> Tryhttp://vmware.com/appliances/for a catalog of appliances
>  ranging from very simple browser and e-mail appliances,
> to very complex server environments.
>
> Look at the "most frequently downloaded",http://vmware.com/appliances/directory/1066
>

No way.  This is not kosher, I can smell it.  I'll pass.

> > >  Keep in mind due to
> > > the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> > > leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> > > in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> > > fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.
>
> Another thing you might want to consider is taking out some
> "insurance".  Using VMware converter, you can create a "virtual
> appliance" from your installed Windows system.  This appliance can
> either be used with Windows or with Linux as the "core" operating
> system.

No virtual.  For virtual you need massive (supercomputer) hardware for
decent performance.  I'm not even sure Core 2 Duo by Intel has enough
horsepower, IMO.  Wine?  Joke.  I'll pass.  Virtual needs quad-core+
mPs IMO.  Five years away.

>
> http://vmware.com/download/converter/
>
> > > When I last tried (and succeeded) using Linux over 10 years ago, in
> > > fact I had it dual booted onto an NT machine, the "fun" of Linux was
> > > just getting it to install.
>
> Getting Linux to install is getting easier and easier.  If you have a
> "Linux Ready" PC, it's often possible to install Linux on a PC
> preloaded with Windows XP in less than 30 minutes.

OK, sales pitch mode ON I see.  Right.  Move on.  And the IRS says you
can fit your taxes on the EZ forms in 30 minutes.  Right.

>
> The best way find out if your PC is "Linux Ready" is to obtain or
> create a bootable CD, often referred to as a "Live-CD" and attempt to
> boot from the CD-ROM.  This will often let you know whether your
> hardware has elements that are "Linux Hostile".  This is really
> important to know before attempting a Linux installation, since
> installation into Linux hostile hardware can often require complex
> secondary downloads, special drivers, and may even additional hardware
> such as additional WiFi cards,

Aha!  So perhaps I was in "Live-CD" mode with Mandriva the other day.
Must have been.  Interesting.  I did like Mandriva, but I was running
it with top of the line Intel hardware.

(Stuff deleted)

> Today, Linux supports 64 bit multi-core processors, supports high
> resolution displays, high speed graphics cards, including OpenGL
> compatible graphics cards.  Even Windows didn't have USB, now Linux
> supports USB, FireWire, SAS, and SATA drives, as well as EIDE, SCSI-3,
> and other high-end hard drives and solid-state drives such as flash
> devices.

Interesting.  Linux beat Windows to USB?  Didn't know that.

[Stuff about I Love Lucy deleted]


I need to insult you now Rex.  Nothing personal, but from your photo
you look like that alleged serial killer ex-cop in Chicago region USA
that made his fourth wife disappear.  Actually I know a women who
married close to a dozen times and her husbands died really fast.
Suspicious.  A serial killer spouse, pretty scary.  Like a non-funny
movie of "I Married a Mobster" or somesuch movie.

Plus you look like a pedophile.

And you type too much online.  Get a life.

Bye.

RL
0
raylopez99 (937)
11/29/2007 3:24:57 PM
raylopez99 wrote:

> In another thread (http://tinyurl.com/2us2ep) I got no real help on
> how to install Linux onto a SATA drive, though I idid learn some
> trivia about AMD chips.  But when attempting to install Linux Mandriva
> (see the above thread) I noticed that Mandriva only ran off the hard
> drive.

Don't you mean "CD"? Then you seem to have obtained the Live CD version. A
nice demo indeed, but nothing like the real deal. Then again: it's a good
test to see if the graphics card, networking and HD access all work
properly. If so, you an safely install the actual OS.

> It was akin to a demo rather than a real OS.  It did look 
> nice, I'll grant you that.  For a minute, as a Microsoft shareholder,
> I was briefly worried that maybe there was something to this Linux
> movement after all.  For a minute.
> 
> Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
> go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
> (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive? Keep in mind due to 
> the particularities of this system (see the above thread) I'm very
> leary of trying to install another OS unless I absolutely have to, and
> in fact I'll probably only install Linux if Vista activation yet again
> fails, but I'd like to research how to do so just in case.

Step 1: Get the full Mandriva 2008 install DVD. If you wish, I could even
send you one by snail mail. But if you have even a moderately fast ADSL
line, the ISO download should be done overnight from one of the many
mirrors.
Step 2: Make sure you have free HD space to install Mandriva on; if all HD
space is dedicated to Vista, you may have to reinstall Vista on a smaller
partition to create space. This is because you can't alter Vista's NTFS
partition size any more to make room for Linux, and you'll have to manually
re-enable Vista booting; both these issues have to do with changes in NTFS,
and the Windows Vista boot loader, respectively (resizing and painless
dual-boot setup works just fine with XP and older Windows versions, but for
reasons unknown, Microsoft chose to make the changes mentioned). See also
http://www.pronetworks.org/forum/about78184.html
Step 3: Insert Mandriva DVD, boot machine and follow instructions. Again:
don't try resizing the Vista partition to free up disk space.
Step 4: Manually enter the changes in GRUB as described in the above linked
page to be able to boot into Vista again.
Step 5: Go to http://easyurpmi.zarb.org/ to greatly expand the software
choice for Mandriva, and install libcss, lame and some more protected or
patent-burdened stuff which can't be included on the official DVD.

Richard Rasker
-- 
http://www.linetec.nl/
0
spamtrap12 (1976)
11/29/2007 9:42:53 PM
On Nov 29, 1:42 pm, Richard Rasker <spamt...@linetec.nl> wrote:
>
> Don't you mean "CD"? Then you seem to have obtained the Live CD version.

Right, CD was meant.


> nice demo indeed, but nothing like the real deal. Then again: it's a good
> test to see if the graphics card, networking and HD access all work
> properly. If so, you an safely install the actual OS.

OK.  But I got Vista (pirate version) to work finally--I was not
validating correctly (first activate, THEN validate).


> Step 2: Make sure you have free HD space to install Mandriva on; if all HD
> space is dedicated to Vista, you may have to reinstall Vista on a smaller
> partition to create space. This is because you can't alter Vista's NTFS
> partition size any more to make room for Linux, and you'll have to manually
> re-enable Vista booting; both these issues have to do with changes in NTFS,
> and the Windows Vista boot loader, respectively (resizing and painless
> dual-boot setup works just fine with XP and older Windows versions, but for
> reasons unknown, Microsoft chose to make the changes mentioned)

Nice urban legend Richard.  But in fact Vista has a tool built in to
allow resizing, and in FAT32 if you want, or unformatted.  Just tried
it.  Didn't see any Linux formats, but a third party tool can do that.

Thanks for your offers for help, but I'm in the major leagues now
(Vista Ultimate, like the name says), and I don't feel like going back
to AA.

But I might need your help later next year for an old piece of junk
Pentium II that I want to turn into a web surfer.

Goodbye.  My last post in this thread.

RL
0
raylopez99 (937)
11/29/2007 10:49:38 PM
Richard Rasker wrote:

> raylopez99 wrote:
....
>> Now can anybody please point me to a site or otherwise tell me how to
>> go about installing Linux onto a machine that has Windows
>> (specifically, Windows Vista) on its hard drive?
....

> Step 1: Get the full Mandriva 2008 install DVD.
[snip step 2-5]

I forgot Step 6: If one thing or the other doesn't work perfectly right
away, don't come shouting "Linux sucks" or the likes, but simply ask for
help and advice. After all, your Vista install wasn't exactly without
hurdles either. If your last serious Linux experience dates from ten years
back, you might encounter one or two things which may require some
assistance,if only because you're not familiar with it -- Linux simply
isn't Windows. Then again, installing Linux these days is usually a
no-brainer.

Richard Rasker
-- 
http://www.linetec.nl/
0
spamtrap12 (1976)
11/30/2007 3:32:01 PM
On Nov 30, 7:32 am, Richard Rasker <spamt...@linetec.nl> wrote:
> Richard Rasker
> --http://www.linetec.nl/

True enough.  In fact, I found Vista activation/validation two-step
model was the subject of a patent infringement suit recently that MSFT
lost; plaintiff has filed yet another suit saying MSFT is still
infringing.  Interesting stuff.

RL
0
raylopez99 (937)
11/30/2007 5:16:39 PM
Reply: