I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years now
and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree) might
be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
point.

All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
much of a chance of actually finding work.

With no companies (that I could find) offering any jobs to people with
little experience, what exactly is the new graduate (who may well have 6
years worth of non-professional programming under their belt) to do?

Rich.

Rich ���� wrote:

> I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years now
> and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree) might
> be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
> point.
> 
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.
> 
> With no companies (that I could find) offering any jobs to people with
> little experience, what exactly is the new graduate (who may well have 6
> years worth of non-professional programming under their belt) to do?
If you could impress an employer that you knew how to find what had 
already been written to do what he wanted done, with the least risk of 
sabotage software and the highest uptime, you'd get hired.

write your own pop-up stopper and get RICH!

Rich ���� wrote:

> I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years now
> and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree) might
> be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
> point.
> 
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.
> 
> With no companies (that I could find) offering any jobs to people with
> little experience, what exactly is the new graduate (who may well have 6
> years worth of non-professional programming under their belt) to do?

It goes in cycles.  Over here in NZ at the moment, a degree is worth 
more than experience.  A few years ago it was the other way 'round.  A 
few months from now it may be different again.

A degree will at the least get you in the door.  You might be able to 
secure an internship or something similar, which will give you a shot at 
getting the experience.  Once you have both of course you're well 
prepared for both extremes of the cycle.

-- 
Corey Murtagh
The Electric Monk
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur!"

Rich ���� writes:

> I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years
now
> and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree)
might
> be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
> point.
>
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.
>
> With no companies (that I could find) offering any jobs to people with
> little experience, what exactly is the new graduate (who may well have 6
> years worth of non-professional programming under their belt) to do?

Keep on keepin' on. Things come in waves and we are at a low point now.  A
degree shows that you are "learnable" so if worse came to worst it would
provide a foot in the door in other areas.  You will surely have as many
bona fides as someone with a degree in this thing called "Business".

"Rich ����" <1@1.1> wrote in message news:<ZKRib.6528$7B.57065615@news-text.cableinet.net>...
> I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years now
> and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree) might
> be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
> point.
> 
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.
> 
> With no companies (that I could find) offering any jobs to people with
> little experience, what exactly is the new graduate (who may well have 6
> years worth of non-professional programming under their belt) to do?
> 
> Rich.

Everything you have said is true, but I think it is great learning 
all of these interesting skills. I recently made an OpenOffice
spreadsheet for keeping track of how much money is in my bank
account, and last night I learned how to add Autorun to
CDs that I burn to make my application start automatically when I
insert one of my CDs into a machine.  Every week, through searching
and trial and error, I learn how to do new things.  

The so-called "industry" with all of its shrinking profits and
opportunities treats people like you and I like we are worthless
nitwits.  But the important thing is how you feel and not how
you are perceived by yes-men and stooges.  And right now, I feel
pretty damn smart!  Rejoice and revel in your wizardry!

dos-man

"Rich ����" <1@1.1> schreef in bericht
news:ZKRib.6528$7B.57065615@news-text.cableinet.net...
> I have been slowly plugging away at learning to program for a few years
now
> and I am also studying for my computing degree. My aim (in the degree)
might
> be to lean towards programming but I'm beginning to wonder if there is any
> point.
>
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.

I got hired on a C++ job without any substantial knowledge of the C++
language. Learned most from the lead programmer on the job. Don't give up
hope.

Floris

Day Brown wrote:

> If you could impress an employer that you knew how to find what had 
> already been written to do what he wanted done, with the least risk of 
> sabotage software and the highest uptime, you'd get hired.

Your misguided faith in the ability of a manager to make a decision 
based on fact and reason will get you into trouble.

It's about politics.  The political formula is rather simple steps.

1) Find out what the people you want power over feel emotional about.

2) Give into these emotions for exchange of "power".

3) Do selfish things with that power.

4) Profit.

Now, if your hiring manager reacts to facts and reason, the formulas 
given above work fine.  However, more commonly, hiring managers have no 
idea what a fact looked like even if it smacked them in the head.

So, let's not confuse this situation with the facts as they should be.

</flame>

Gianni Mariani <gi2nospam@mariani.ws> wrote in message news:<bmki4n$ta@dispatch.concentric.net>...
> Day Brown wrote:
> 
> > If you could impress an employer that you knew how to find what had 
> > already been written to do what he wanted done, with the least risk of 
> > sabotage software and the highest uptime, you'd get hired.
> 
> Your misguided faith in the ability of a manager to make a decision 
> based on fact and reason will get you into trouble.
> 
> It's about politics.  The political formula is rather simple steps.
> 
> 1) Find out what the people you want power over feel emotional about.
> 
> 2) Give into these emotions for exchange of "power".
> 
> 3) Do selfish things with that power.
> 
> 4) Profit.

If it really worked like that then stage 4 would not yield profit. 
Nice vent though!

"Rich ����" <1@1.1> a �crit dans le message de
news:ZKRib.6528$7B.57065615@news-text.cableinet.net...
> All the jobs I have seen require 5 years professional experience, so this
> leaves me thinking that even if I did extremely well, I still don't stand
> much of a chance of actually finding work.

One or 2 years ago, there was adds requiring 3 years experience in C#, a
language that was not yet 2 years old at the time !!!

People who write these adds are HR peoplen simply follow formulaic
guidelines, with no idea on what is needed technically.

Do not give up, the technical interview is what counts.