f



3/Three usability issues in Mac OS X 10.8.5: Re(storing/covering) huge files from its Trash bin, renamed Time Machine's disk drive, and bring back Finder's sidebar external USB HDD icons?

Hi again.

I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an 
updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:

I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I 
decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the 
folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy. 
Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?

2. I renamed an external HDD's name that was used for Time Machine (TM) 
back up. When I went to back up, it told me it couldn't. So, I looked at 
TM settings. I noticed it was looking for the old name even though it 
was the same exact disk. I told it to reuse the renamed disk to resume. 
Why is it that picky on my renamed disk drive?

3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external 
USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make 
it come back.

Thank you in advance. :)
-- 
"Don't step on ants... they're people too." --a quote from ANTZ movie.
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0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 4:11:14 PM
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In article <07edndf9S_Q_FszPnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
 Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

> Hi again.
> 
> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an 
> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
> 
> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I 
> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the 
> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy. 
> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
> 
> 2. I renamed an external HDD's name that was used for Time Machine (TM) 
> back up. When I went to back up, it told me it couldn't. So, I looked at 
> TM settings. I noticed it was looking for the old name even though it 
> was the same exact disk. I told it to reuse the renamed disk to resume. 
> Why is it that picky on my renamed disk drive?
> 
> 3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external 
> USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make 
> it come back.
> 
> Thank you in advance. :)

Not sure I follow what you did here.

You out a 4.5GB BigFolder/ into the Trash.  Was it originally on volume 
Mac HDD and already on the Desktop or somewhere else?  Or on some other 
disk?  If you drag it back to the Desktop, you're either doing a UNIX mv 
if it's on the same volume OR any of the subfolders in BigFolder require 
additional privileges to move the folder.  Otherwise, you do a cp.

You can't, AFAIK, rename devices on TM.  That's the way TM was designed.  
Contact Apple if you have issues with TM.  There are User Forums where 
you can vent your spleen to your hearts content about why and how MacOS 
isn't working the way you want to.  Here, all we can really say is 
"Thank you for sharing".

You should be able to Unhide the sidebar from the View menu.  Did you 
look there?

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically ignored]


0
vilain2 (2187)
10/6/2013 4:57:50 PM
On 2013.10.06 12:11 , Ant wrote:
> Hi again.
>
> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an
> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
>
> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?

Maybe you deleted a different copy and then dragged it out of the trash 
to where the other copy already existed.

To be sure you put back something where you deleted it from: point at 
the file/folder in trash, right click and "Put back".

Files in the trash are not actually anywhere different. They are simply 
marked as trash and listed in the volume trash folder (hidden ".Trashes" 
folder) and made invisible to the user when viewing that volume/folders 
- except via the Trash bin.  (The trash "folder" shows trash from many 
folders and drives - but each drive has its own .Trashes "folder" where 
trashed files are "located").

> 2. I renamed an external HDD's name that was used for Time Machine (TM)
> back up. When I went to back up, it told me it couldn't. So, I looked at
> TM settings. I noticed it was looking for the old name even though it
> was the same exact disk. I told it to reuse the renamed disk to resume.
> Why is it that picky on my renamed disk drive?

See Michael's reply.

>
> 3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external
> USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make
> it come back.

   Finder | Preferences | Sidebar  [ DEVICES ...]


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/6/2013 6:42:23 PM
On 10/6/2013 9:57 AM PT, Michael Vilain typed:

> You out a 4.5GB BigFolder/ into the Trash.  Was it originally on volume
> Mac HDD and already on the Desktop or somewhere else?  Or on some other
> disk?  If you drag it back to the Desktop, you're either doing a UNIX mv
> if it's on the same volume OR any of the subfolders in BigFolder require
> additional privileges to move the folder.  Otherwise, you do a cp.

It was originally in a 13.3" MacBook Pro (mid-2012)'s internal HDD's 
/Archives/. I told Finder to put back into it by dragging the folder 
from Trash bin back to / through Finder windows. Same exact place/location.


> You can't, AFAIK, rename devices on TM.  That's the way TM was designed.

Uh, I was able to rename both external drives through Finder and desktop 
with their mounted icons.


> Contact Apple if you have issues with TM.  There are User Forums where
> you can vent your spleen to your hearts content about why and how MacOS
> isn't working the way you want to.  Here, all we can really say is
> "Thank you for sharing".

I did post in Apple forum, but nothing so far. Is there somewhere to 
else to send in my feedbacks?


> You should be able to Unhide the sidebar from the View menu.  Did you
> look there?

No, I removed the devices from Sidebar. Sidebar is still there. I just 
want to bring back the device icons in Sidebar that I removed. I noticed 
my TimeMachine drive does come back, but not the FAT32 one. Here is a 
screen shot/capture of it in action: http://i.imgur.com/dkGrRM6.gif ...
-- 
"Since the world began, we have never exterminated. We probably shall 
never exterminate as much as one single insect species. If there was 
ever an example of an insect we cannot destroy, the fire ant is it." 
--an entomologist quote mentioned by Leonard Nimoy on In The Search Of: 
Deadly Ants (1978)
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
A song is/was playing on this computer: Christopher Tin - Baba Yetu
0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 6:53:38 PM
On 10/6/2013 11:42 AM PT, Alan Browne typed:

>> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an
>> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
>>
>> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
>> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
>> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
>> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
>
> Maybe you deleted a different copy and then dragged it out of the trash
> to where the other copy already existed.
>
> To be sure you put back something where you deleted it from: point at
> the file/folder in trash, right click and "Put back".

Ah, I did not see that option but then I was using the 13.3" MacBook 
Pro's trackpad without an external mouse hooked up for easy right 
access. In Windows, I just move to the new location assuming it is on 
the same drive.


> Files in the trash are not actually anywhere different. They are simply
> marked as trash and listed in the volume trash folder (hidden ".Trashes"
> folder) and made invisible to the user when viewing that volume/folders
> - except via the Trash bin.  (The trash "folder" shows trash from many
> folders and drives - but each drive has its own .Trashes "folder" where
> trashed files are "located").

So if user moves it out of the Trash folder on the SAME drive, it should 
be a move/unmarked from deletion if emptied.


>> 3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external
>> USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make
>> it come back.
>
>    Finder | Preferences | Sidebar  [ DEVICES ...]

Perfect!!!!! That's a strange place for them. I looking in View menu's 
options. Sheesh. I noticed there are three different options: Full, 
some, or none. It sounds like user can't select which device to hide or 
show?
-- 
"Thanks for giving me the courage to eat all those ants." --unknown
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
A song is/was playing on this computer: Milk Inc. & Christopher Lawrence 
- Good Enough (Baby Doc's Old School Mix)
0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 7:07:15 PM
On 2013.10.06 15:07 , Ant wrote:
> On 10/6/2013 11:42 AM PT, Alan Browne typed:
>
>>> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an
>>> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
>>>
>>> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
>>> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
>>> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
>>> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
>>
>> Maybe you deleted a different copy and then dragged it out of the trash
>> to where the other copy already existed.
>>
>> To be sure you put back something where you deleted it from: point at
>> the file/folder in trash, right click and "Put back".
>
> Ah, I did not see that option but then I was using the 13.3" MacBook
> Pro's trackpad without an external mouse hooked up for easy right
> access. In Windows, I just move to the new location assuming it is on
> the same drive.

A right-click on a trackpad is usually two-fingers touching the pad, or 
one finger clicking the lower right corner of the pad.

>> Files in the trash are not actually anywhere different. They are simply
>> marked as trash and listed in the volume trash folder (hidden ".Trashes"
>> folder) and made invisible to the user when viewing that volume/folders
>> - except via the Trash bin.  (The trash "folder" shows trash from many
>> folders and drives - but each drive has its own .Trashes "folder" where
>> trashed files are "located").
>
> So if user moves it out of the Trash folder on the SAME drive, it should
> be a move/unmarked from deletion if emptied.

It simply puts it in the folder that you drag it to (move) or copies it 
to a folder on another drive. In the later case the copy in trash 
remains in trash.

>>> 3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external
>>> USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make
>>> it come back.
>>
>>    Finder | Preferences | Sidebar  [ DEVICES ...]
>
> Perfect!!!!! That's a strange place for them. I looking in View menu's
> options. Sheesh. I noticed there are three different options: Full,
> some, or none. It sounds like user can't select which device to hide or
> show?

It is Apple OS X.  It is good.  Even when it isn't.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/6/2013 7:28:08 PM
In article <_aqdnSas5IVVJMzPnZ2dnUVZ_qqdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> A right-click on a trackpad is usually two-fingers touching the pad, or 
> one finger clicking the lower right corner of the pad.

Right or left corner, depending on how you set it up.
System Preferences/Point & Click/Secondary click

But it's either two-finger tap or clicking the corner in Mountain Lion (and 
maybe Lion); in Snow Leopard, you could have both.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/6/2013 8:01:31 PM
In article <OJadnUnixskuLMzPnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
 Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

> No, I removed the devices from Sidebar. Sidebar is still there. I just 
> want to bring back the device icons in Sidebar that I removed. I noticed 
> my TimeMachine drive does come back, but not the FAT32 one.

Just drag it there from the Desktop or the computer's window.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/6/2013 8:02:52 PM
>> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
>> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
>> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
>> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?

Generally, restoring an item is a "move", not a "copy".

However, a copy happens if the system views the item being restored from
the trash as being on a volume that is different from the destination.

The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
items from multiple places.

Dragging an item from volume 2 to the Trash actually moves it to the
..Trashes directory for volume 2. But it appears in your Trash folder in
Finder along with deleted documents from Volume 1.

When you drag it from the Finder's Trash to the Desktop, by default, it
thinks you want to move it to your home drive on volume 1, and since
that item still resides on volume 2, it needs to be copied over to the
home desktop on volume 1.



0
10/6/2013 8:05:27 PM
On 10/6/2013 1:02 PM PT, Michelle Steiner typed:

>> No, I removed the devices from Sidebar. Sidebar is still there. I just
>> want to bring back the device icons in Sidebar that I removed. I noticed
>> my TimeMachine drive does come back, but not the FAT32 one.
>
> Just drag it there from the Desktop or the computer's window.

Hmm, I tried that earlier but nothing happened. Anyways, I got it fixed 
from Alan's re(ply/sponse) in Finder's Preferences.
-- 
"... I'd wait for a hot Texas day, see? Tie him to a stake, get an ant 
trail going. You know, Texas red ants, inch long! Just love to bite into 
human flesh, catch what I'm saying here? See, they're eating him alive, 
nice and slow like..." --Ross Perot in Saturday Night Live's Debate '92 
skit.
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 8:07:43 PM
In article <07edndf9S_Q_FszPnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
 Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

> Hi again.
> 
> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an 
> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
> 
> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I 
> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the 
> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy. 
> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?

Why didn't you just open the Trash, Select the folder, and type Ctrl-Z?

-- 
PRAY, v.  To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
0
tom_stiller (1288)
10/6/2013 8:12:42 PM
On 10/6/2013 1:01 PM PT, Michelle Steiner typed:

>> A right-click on a trackpad is usually two-fingers touching the pad, or
>> one finger clicking the lower right corner of the pad.
>
> Right or left corner, depending on how you set it up.
> System Preferences/Point & Click/Secondary click
>
> But it's either two-finger tap or clicking the corner in Mountain Lion (and
> maybe Lion); in Snow Leopard, you could have both.

Hmm. I will have to try again later. Sometimes it thinks I am doing 
something else like doing that show everything (have to hit esc key to 
get out of it), not left clicking, etc. I think it is the way I have my 
fingers (I am disabled and have no thumbs on both of my small hands) on 
the trackpads. I am not a fan of touch screen and gestures. I still 
prefer clicky keyboards, trackballs, and external simple light wired 
mice (not those pointy sticks on keyboards).
-- 
"Let him who boasts the knowledge of actually existing things, first 
tell us of the nature of the ant." --Saint Basil quote from his letter 
XVI written against Eunomius the Heretic
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 8:13:01 PM
On 10/6/2013 1:12 PM PT, Tom Stiller typed:
 >> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an
>> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
>>
>> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
>> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
>> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
>> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
>
> Why didn't you just open the Trash, Select the folder, and type Ctrl-Z?

It was too late (no undo). It was minutes later. :(
-- 
"As I watch the busy ants on the trail and around the ant pile, I am 
impressed by the fact that they are doers and not just believers." --CR 1967
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
0
ant (886)
10/6/2013 8:13:41 PM
Tom Stiller wrote:
> In article <07edndf9S_Q_FszPnZ2dnUVZ_sqdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
>   Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:
>
>> Hi again.
>>
>> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an
>> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
>>
>> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I
>> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the
>> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy.
>> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
>
> Why didn't you just open the Trash, Select the folder, and type Ctrl-Z?
>
All you had to do was click on the file while you the the Control 
(⌥)down and choose Put Away.

This was an old command That was in OS9 on down and was Chopped when OX 
first came out. Finally after enough pestering over the years they 
brought it back

-- 
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:pjonescet@comcast.net
0
pjonescet (208)
10/6/2013 9:54:00 PM
On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei 
<jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> items from multiple places.
 
Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.

If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
it.

One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be 
tedious.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/7/2013 10:02:19 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> > items from multiple places.
>  
> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.

the trash is *not* for storage. 

if you don't want something deleted, do not put it in the trash. 

if you put something in the trash, you obviously do not want it.
otherwise, why put it there at all? put it in a folder someplace if you
want to keep it.

> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> it.

don't put anything you want to keep in the trash. 

however, there are third party apps that let you do that.

> One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be 
> tedious.

very.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/7/2013 10:05:13 PM
On 2013.10.07 18:02 , John Varela wrote:
> On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei
> <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>
>> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
>> items from multiple places.
>
> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.

It's not for storage - it's an "oops" step of 2nd to last resort.


>
> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
> it.
>
> One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be
> tedious.

I don't think you can - perhaps with sudo.

Hmm - I'm definitely not a terminal cowboy - but I threw something in 
the trash and navigated to it.  Won't list "ls -al" anything (permission 
denied).

Shelled as admin and tried ls there with sudo:
total 0
d-wx-wx-wt@  2 root  wheel    68 Sep 26 22:41 .
drwxr-xr-x  39 root  wheel  1394 Oct  7 18:55 ..

No sign of the file.  Maybe 'cause it belongs to the other account.

So logged into admin, created a file and deleted that.  Verified it was 
in the trash.  Entered terminal and navigated to the trash ...

nothing showing other than the . and .. sudo or not sudo.

So - Trashes is a special place indeed and does not allow one to screw 
around - at least not easily.

And "empty trash" applies to all the mounted volumes.

Moral of the story?  Do your backups and don't trash anything you're not 
sure of and if not sure, check the trash before emptying it.

Just don't temporarily put anything in there that you might need.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/7/2013 11:43:25 PM
On 2013-10-07 22:02:19 +0000, John Varela said:

> On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei
> <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> 
>> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
>> items from multiple places.
> 
> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> 
> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
> it.

<http://www.cocoatech.com/pathfinder/>

Hugely helpful app.

(No, not terribly cheap.  But like many other things, one can periodically
find it in a bundle.  As much as I use it, it's worth full price to me.  YMMV.)

0
BreadWithSpam (1707)
10/8/2013 12:01:14 AM
In article <wv6dncgTAI-D2s7PnZ2dnUVZ_qGdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2013.10.07 18:02 , John Varela wrote:
> > On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei
> > <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> >> items from multiple places.
> >
> > Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> > on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
> > then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
> > and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> 
> It's not for storage - it's an "oops" step of 2nd to last resort.
> 
> 
> >
> > If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
> > it.
> >
> > One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be
> > tedious.
> 
> I don't think you can - perhaps with sudo.
> 
> Hmm - I'm definitely not a terminal cowboy - but I threw something in 
> the trash and navigated to it.  Won't list "ls -al" anything (permission 
> denied).
> 
> Shelled as admin and tried ls there with sudo:
> total 0
> d-wx-wx-wt@  2 root  wheel    68 Sep 26 22:41 .
> drwxr-xr-x  39 root  wheel  1394 Oct  7 18:55 ..
> 
> No sign of the file.  Maybe 'cause it belongs to the other account.
> 
> So logged into admin, created a file and deleted that.  Verified it was 
> in the trash.  Entered terminal and navigated to the trash ...
> 
> nothing showing other than the . and .. sudo or not sudo.
> 
> So - Trashes is a special place indeed and does not allow one to screw 
> around - at least not easily.
> 
> And "empty trash" applies to all the mounted volumes.
> 
> Moral of the story?  Do your backups and don't trash anything you're not 
> sure of and if not sure, check the trash before emptying it.
> 
> Just don't temporarily put anything in there that you might need.

There are several ".Trashes" folders. one in "/", one in each users home 
folder, and one on each mounted volume. Superuser privs are required to 
delete files from any but the user's home directory.

-- 
PRAY, v.  To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
0
tom_stiller (1288)
10/8/2013 12:13:42 AM
On 2013.10.07 20:13 , Tom Stiller wrote:
> In article <wv6dncgTAI-D2s7PnZ2dnUVZ_qGdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2013.10.07 18:02 , John Varela wrote:
>>> On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei
>>> <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
>>>> items from multiple places.
>>>
>>> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
>>> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
>>> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
>>> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
>>
>> It's not for storage - it's an "oops" step of 2nd to last resort.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
>>> it.
>>>
>>> One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be
>>> tedious.
>>
>> I don't think you can - perhaps with sudo.
>>
>> Hmm - I'm definitely not a terminal cowboy - but I threw something in
>> the trash and navigated to it.  Won't list "ls -al" anything (permission
>> denied).
>>
>> Shelled as admin and tried ls there with sudo:
>> total 0
>> d-wx-wx-wt@  2 root  wheel    68 Sep 26 22:41 .
>> drwxr-xr-x  39 root  wheel  1394 Oct  7 18:55 ..
>>
>> No sign of the file.  Maybe 'cause it belongs to the other account.
>>
>> So logged into admin, created a file and deleted that.  Verified it was
>> in the trash.  Entered terminal and navigated to the trash ...
>>
>> nothing showing other than the . and .. sudo or not sudo.
>>
>> So - Trashes is a special place indeed and does not allow one to screw
>> around - at least not easily.
>>
>> And "empty trash" applies to all the mounted volumes.
>>
>> Moral of the story?  Do your backups and don't trash anything you're not
>> sure of and if not sure, check the trash before emptying it.
>>
>> Just don't temporarily put anything in there that you might need.
>
> There are several ".Trashes" folders. one in "/", one in each users home
> folder, and one on each mounted volume. Superuser privs are required to
> delete files from any but the user's home directory.

Ah ... I didn't nav around enough.  Some other day for such ... time for 
beddie byes ... or Netflix anyway.



-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/8/2013 12:21:27 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.

Then he shouldn't have put them there in the first place.  It's a trash 
can, not a storage bin.

> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> it.

Unmount all the other drives.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/8/2013 2:03:47 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei 
> <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> 
> > The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> > items from multiple places.
>  
> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> 
> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> it.
> 
> One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be 
> tedious.

I don't use Trash to store stuff, regardless of it's location.  If a 
file is in the Trash folder, it's there until I empty the trash and 
already deleted as far as I'm concerned.

What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
for specific volumes?

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically ignored]


0
vilain2 (2187)
10/8/2013 4:19:51 AM
In article <071020131805138710%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>, John Varela
> <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> > > items from multiple places.
> >  
> > Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> > on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> > then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> > and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> 
> the trash is *not* for storage. 
> 
> if you don't want something deleted, do not put it in the trash. 
> 
> if you put something in the trash, you obviously do not want it.
> otherwise, why put it there at all? put it in a folder someplace if you
> want to keep it.

I completely agree with you in principle that trash is not a place for 
storage. However (you knew that was coming), 'if you want to keep it' 
can be problematic. I regularly encounter clients who have this thought: 
'I _think_ I'm done with this file, and I want to get it out of the way 
so I don't accidentally open it or confuse it with a later version. Yet, 
I may just still need it.' A very real-world circumstance. 

What I suggest is a 'pretrash' folder on the Desktop. The client can 
drag candidates for disposal there for temporary storage and then purge 
the contents in the usual way when they're sure the items should go. 
(The usual caveats about letting a temporary folder get bloated because 
nothing is ever deleted apply.)

Usage Note: You have to create a pretrash folder for _each_ mounted 
volume ('pretrash Disk1', 'pretrash Disk2', etc.) and drag only items 
from that volume to that volume's pretrash to prevent duplicating the 
item. While multiple pretrashes can be confusing to some, those aren't 
usually the users who have more than one mounted volume.
0
fmoore (1430)
10/8/2013 3:38:50 PM
In article <fmoore-5FB575.11385008102013@mx05.eternal-september.org>,
Fred Moore <fmoore@gcfn.org> wrote:

> > the trash is *not* for storage. 
> > 
> > if you don't want something deleted, do not put it in the trash. 
> > 
> > if you put something in the trash, you obviously do not want it.
> > otherwise, why put it there at all? put it in a folder someplace if you
> > want to keep it.
> 
> I completely agree with you in principle that trash is not a place for 
> storage. However (you knew that was coming), 'if you want to keep it' 
> can be problematic. I regularly encounter clients who have this thought: 
> 'I _think_ I'm done with this file, and I want to get it out of the way 
> so I don't accidentally open it or confuse it with a later version. Yet, 
> I may just still need it.' A very real-world circumstance. 

how is it real world? 

do these same people put paper documents in the trash can next to their
desk for storage?

do they then wonder where those documents went after whoever usually
empties the trash did so? 

or do they put a sign on the trash can saying 'do not empty, important
documents stored here' ? 

trash means it's no longer needed. that's why it's called trash. 

if someone wants to keep a file, they should not put it in the trash.
very simple.

> What I suggest is a 'pretrash' folder on the Desktop. The client can 
> drag candidates for disposal there for temporary storage and then purge 
> the contents in the usual way when they're sure the items should go. 
> (The usual caveats about letting a temporary folder get bloated because 
> nothing is ever deleted apply.)

that's one way.

keep in mind that deleted files can be recovered from a time machine
backup, and not just the latest one either, so there's really no need
to do any of this nonsense.

if a file that was put in the trash is needed for some reason, pull it
off a backup. 

> Usage Note: You have to create a pretrash folder for _each_ mounted 
> volume ('pretrash Disk1', 'pretrash Disk2', etc.) and drag only items 
> from that volume to that volume's pretrash to prevent duplicating the 
> item. 

you could also use labels, aka tags, and not have to move the file
anywhere. just label it with a particular colour that indicates it's
not important anymore but don't want to trash just yet.

> While multiple pretrashes can be confusing to some, those aren't 
> usually the users who have more than one mounted volume.

also true.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/8/2013 3:51:59 PM
On Tue, 8 Oct 2013 04:19:51 UTC, Michael Vilain 
<vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei 
> > <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> > 
> > > The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> > > items from multiple places.
> >  
> > Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> > on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> > then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> > and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> > 
> > If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> > it.
> > 
> > One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be 
> > tedious.
> 
> I don't use Trash to store stuff, regardless of it's location.  If a 
> file is in the Trash folder, it's there until I empty the trash and 
> already deleted as far as I'm concerned.

The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
 
> What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> for specific volumes?

I can't think of a specific example involving the Mac Trash but I 
can tell you that I have from time to time gone digging into the 
physical trash can next to my desk looking for a receipt or other 
item that I shouldn't have tossed just yet.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/9/2013 1:33:41 AM
On Tue, 8 Oct 2013 02:03:47 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> > on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> > then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> > and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> 
> Then he shouldn't have put them there in the first place.  It's a trash 
> can, not a storage bin.
> 
> > If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> > it.
> 
> Unmount all the other drives.

Can't unmount the boot drive.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/9/2013 1:34:07 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-dHXIgBkzNjKY@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > I don't use Trash to store stuff, regardless of it's location.  If a 
> > file is in the Trash folder, it's there until I empty the trash and 
> > already deleted as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.

the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
that changed with multifinder.

if you put something in the trash, you have said you do not want it.

if you think you might want it at some point, do not put it in the
trash.

or, just pull it off a backup.

> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > for specific volumes?
> 
> I can't think of a specific example involving the Mac Trash but I 
> can tell you that I have from time to time gone digging into the 
> physical trash can next to my desk looking for a receipt or other 
> item that I shouldn't have tossed just yet.

that only works if you remember to look before emptying the trash, or
before it's emptied for you.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/9/2013 2:47:05 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-NYQf3dXwytee@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> > > it.
> > 
> > Unmount all the other drives.
> 
> Can't unmount the boot drive.

Boot from another drive.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/9/2013 3:49:58 AM
In article <081020132247057371%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> > Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> > else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> 
> the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.

Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you 
quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/9/2013 3:51:26 AM
In article <michelle-D9330F.20512608102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> > > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> > > Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> > > else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> > 
> > the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
> 
> Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you 
> quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.

i knew it emptied on eject, but it's been so long since singlefinder.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/9/2013 6:16:12 AM
On 2013.10.08 21:34 , John Varela wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Oct 2013 02:03:47 UTC, Michelle Steiner
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
>>   "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
>>> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
>>> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
>>> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
>>
>> Then he shouldn't have put them there in the first place.  It's a trash
>> can, not a storage bin.
>>
>>> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
>>> it.
>>
>> Unmount all the other drives.
>
> Can't unmount the boot drive.


It really comes back to : don't use the trash as storage.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/9/2013 9:01:27 PM
On Wed, 9 Oct 2013 03:51:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <081020132247057371%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
>  nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> 
> > > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> > > Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> > > else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> > 
> > the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.

I had me one of those in 1984 but I don't recall how the Trash 
worked.

> Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you 
> quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.
 
So how does that rebut my statement that Apple must expect users to 
retrieve things from the Trash or there wouldn't be a Trash? And 
require the user to take an action to empty the Trash.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/9/2013 11:43:34 PM
On 2013.10.09 19:43 , John Varela wrote:
> On Wed, 9 Oct 2013 03:51:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> In article <081020132247057371%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
>>   nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>> The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
>>>> Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or
>>>> else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
>>>
>>> the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
>
> I had me one of those in 1984 but I don't recall how the Trash
> worked.
>
>> Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you
>> quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.
>
> So how does that rebut my statement that Apple must expect users to
> retrieve things from the Trash or there wouldn't be a Trash? And
> require the user to take an action to empty the Trash.

I'd be happiest if the Trash would self empty items more than n days old 
- then I could ignore it (like the trash in Apple Mail).

(I hear there are apps that will do that sort of thing but I haven't 
looked into it).

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/10/2013 12:19:47 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ukl5WNYULbdG@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be 
> > > > recovered. Apple must think that people want to recover things 
> > > > from Trash or else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> > > 
> > > the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
> 
> I had me one of those in 1984 but I don't recall how the Trash worked.
> 
> > Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when 
> > you quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.
>  
> So how does that rebut my statement that Apple must expect users to 
> retrieve things from the Trash or there wouldn't be a Trash? And require 
> the user to take an action to empty the Trash.

If the user didn't know that running a program would empty the trash, and 
he used the trash as a storage bin, he would get very pissed off.  If Apple 
had intended for the trash to be a storage bin, they wouldn't have let it 
be emptied without the user deliberately emptying it.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/10/2013 12:28:13 AM
John Varela wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Oct 2013 04:19:51 UTC, Michael Vilain
> <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:
>
>> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
>>   "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei
>>> <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
>>>> items from multiple places.
>>>
>>> Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
>>> on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and
>>> then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too,
>>> and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
>>>
>>> If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know
>>> it.
>>>
>>> One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be
>>> tedious.
>>
>> I don't use Trash to store stuff, regardless of it's location.  If a
>> file is in the Trash folder, it's there until I empty the trash and
>> already deleted as far as I'm concerned.
>
> The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or
> else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
>
>> What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only
>> for specific volumes?
>
> I can't think of a specific example involving the Mac Trash but I
> can tell you that I have from time to time gone digging into the
> physical trash can next to my desk looking for a receipt or other
> item that I shouldn't have tossed just yet.
>

Trash Folder gives the user an opportunity change their mind. Or put 
back files or folders  that were mistakenly thrown away. It was such a 
good idea when MS came out with windows they copied the idea only they 
called it the Waste Basket. You can do much the same in the waste basket 
on windows as you can in Trash on the Mac.

-- 
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:pjonescet@comcast.net
0
pjonescet (208)
10/10/2013 12:40:42 AM
On 13-10-09 20:19, Alan Browne wrote:

> I'd be happiest if the Trash would self empty items more than n days old 
> - then I could ignore it (like the trash in Apple Mail).
> 
> (I hear there are apps that will do that sort of thing but I haven't 
> looked into it).


Trash Timer from Hieper Software. Does exactly that and works well,
qietly and without fuss.
0
10/10/2013 1:27:40 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ukl5WNYULbdG@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Wed, 9 Oct 2013 03:51:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > In article <081020132247057371%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
> >  nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> > 
> > > > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> > > > Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> > > > else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> > > 
> > > the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
> 
> I had me one of those in 1984 but I don't recall how the Trash 
> worked.
> 
> > Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you 
> > quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.
>  
> So how does that rebut my statement that Apple must expect users to 
> retrieve things from the Trash or there wouldn't be a Trash? And 
> require the user to take an action to empty the Trash.

It allows for an "oh shit" without requiring a confirmation every time a 
file gets trashed.

-- 
PRAY, v.  To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
0
tom_stiller (1288)
10/10/2013 2:52:05 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-dHXIgBkzNjKY@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.

That's like saying the only reason to have a garbage can is so last 
night's dinner scraps can be retrieved.

-- 
D.F. Manno | dfmanno@mail.com
GOP delenda est!
0
dfmanno (398)
10/10/2013 4:30:35 PM
On 13-10-10 12:30, D.F. Manno wrote:

> That's like saying the only reason to have a garbage can is so last 
> night's dinner scraps can be retrieved.

If that were the case, there would be no garbage can. There would be a
shredder icon with files actually deleted as soon as you drag them to it.

The trash can system allows an "undo". The shredder doesn't unless you
use unreliable "undelete" disk tools.

0
10/10/2013 6:52:51 PM
In article <tom_stiller-8A505B.22520509102013@news.individual.net>,
 Tom Stiller <tom_stiller@yahoo.com> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ukl5WNYULbdG@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 9 Oct 2013 03:51:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > 
> > > In article <081020132247057371%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
> > >  nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > > The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> > > > > Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> > > > > else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
> > > > 
> > > > the original mac auto-emptied the trash when the floppy was ejected.
> > 
> > I had me one of those in 1984 but I don't recall how the Trash 
> > worked.
> > 
> > > Heck, the original Mac auto emptied when you ran an application; when you 
> > > quit the app and returned to the Finder, the trash was empty.
> >  
> > So how does that rebut my statement that Apple must expect users to 
> > retrieve things from the Trash or there wouldn't be a Trash? And 
> > require the user to take an action to empty the Trash.
> 
> It allows for an "oh shit" without requiring a confirmation every time a 
> file gets trashed.

I suspect the second part is probably the key to its existence.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR
0
jollyroger (11010)
10/11/2013 2:12:31 AM
On Wed, 9 Oct 2013 01:33:41 UTC, "John Varela" 
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 8 Oct 2013 04:19:51 UTC, Michael Vilain 
> <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:
> 
> > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-LDCzcU51dSYE@localhost>,
> >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > 
> > > On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 20:05:27 UTC, JF Mezei 
> > > <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > The "Desktop" and Trash directories are special in that they can contain
> > > > items from multiple places.
> > >  
> > > Which is a usability problem at times. For example, to free up space
> > > on a portable drive, move no-longer-needed files to the Trash and 
> > > then empty Trash. But that empties Trash on all other drives, too, 
> > > and maybe the User for whatever reason would rather not do that.
> > > 
> > > If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to know 
> > > it.
> > > 
> > > One could go to Terminal and rm the unwanted files but that can be 
> > > tedious.
> > 
> > I don't use Trash to store stuff, regardless of it's location.  If a 
> > file is in the Trash folder, it's there until I empty the trash and 
> > already deleted as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> The only reason to have a Trash folder is so stuff can be recovered.
> Apple must think that people want to recover things from Trash or 
> else OS X wouldn't have a Trash folder.
>  
> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > for specific volumes?
> 
> I can't think of a specific example involving the Mac Trash but I 
> can tell you that I have from time to time gone digging into the 
> physical trash can next to my desk looking for a receipt or other 
> item that I shouldn't have tossed just yet.

Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual 
fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few 
steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I 
realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to 
insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the 
spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the 
Trash and then copy and paste.

Incidentally, and on-topic to the apps group, "Plain Clip" is a 
really handy little program. It resides in my Dock. When wanting to 
copy and paste from (for example) a financial statement to a 
spreadsheet, copy the number to the clipboard, then go to the Dock 
and click on the Plain Clip icon. Plain Clip strips all the 
formatting from what's on the clipboard, so when the item is pasted 
into the spreadsheet (or document or whatever) it takes the 
formatting of the target, not the source. I use it a lot.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/11/2013 6:48:59 PM
On 2013.10.11 14:48 , John Varela wrote:

> Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
> fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
> steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
> realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
> insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
> desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
> spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
> Trash and then copy and paste.

Why print a statement?

I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them. 
  I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant", 
"Bank", "Investments" and so on).

It's very rare that I have to print anything from there.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/11/2013 7:56:00 PM
On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
 
> Why print a statement?
> 
> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them. 
>   I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant", 
> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).

Account needs a paper copy?


-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/11/2013 8:24:06 PM
Joe from NY wrote:
> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>
>> Why print a statement?
>>
>> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them.
>>    I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant",
>> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
>
> Account needs a paper copy?
>
>
There is always the possibility whee you have stored electronically 
could be lost. And Most cases your only allowed to keep the last 6 
months suppose for tax purpose you need something from a Year ago.

-- 
Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.      "If it's Fixed, Don't Break it"
http://www.phillipmjones.net    mailto:pjonescet@comcast.net
0
pjonescet (208)
10/11/2013 8:36:12 PM
On 2013.10.11 16:24 , Joe from NY wrote:
> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>
>> Why print a statement?
>>
>> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them.
>>    I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant",
>> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
>
> Account needs a paper copy?

I have no accounts of any kind needing a paper copy for statements.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/11/2013 9:11:16 PM
On 2013.10.11 16:36 , PhillipJones wrote:
> Joe from NY wrote:
>> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>>
>>> Why print a statement?
>>>
>>> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them.
>>>    I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant",
>>> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
>>
>> Account needs a paper copy?
>>
>>
> There is always the possibility whee you have stored electronically
> could be lost. And Most cases your only allowed to keep the last 6
> months suppose for tax purpose you need something from a Year ago.

I have electronic copies of almost everything going back over 7 years. 
Well backed up.

Further, my bank keeps everything I transact there available online for 
several years (photos of cheques, statement pdf's, and so on).


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/11/2013 9:13:00 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-2fpcPMSWpwLw@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> Plain Clip strips all the formatting from what's on the clipboard, so 
> when the item is pasted into the spreadsheet (or document or whatever) 
> it takes the formatting of the target, not the source. I use it a lot.

Command-Option-Shift-V pastes with the formatting of the target, not the 
source, in many applications, including Numbers.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/12/2013 3:37:37 AM
On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote

:> On 2013.10.11 16:24 , Joe from NY wrote:
>> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>> 
>>> Why print a statement?
>>> 
>>> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them.
>>> I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant",
>>> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
>> 
>> Account needs a paper copy?
> 
> I have no accounts of any kind needing a paper copy for statements.
> 
> 

Sorry: that should have been "accountant," the guy who does my taxes.

-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/12/2013 12:28:48 PM
On 2013.10.12 08:28 , Joe from NY wrote:
> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>
> :> On 2013.10.11 16:24 , Joe from NY wrote:
>>> On Oct 11, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>>>
>>>> Why print a statement?
>>>>
>>>> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them.
>>>> I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant",
>>>> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
>>>
>>> Account needs a paper copy?
>>
>> I have no accounts of any kind needing a paper copy for statements.
>>
>>
>
> Sorry: that should have been "accountant," the guy who does my taxes.

I do my own taxes (generally) but when I have used an accountant I've 
send docs electronically.  (Last time was well over 5 years ago).


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/12/2013 12:34:23 PM
On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 19:56:00 UTC, Alan Browne 
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2013.10.11 14:48 , John Varela wrote:
> 
> > Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
> > fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
> > steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
> > realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
> > insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
> > desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
> > spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
> > Trash and then copy and paste.
> 
> Why print a statement?

Because I choose to.

I have statements that reach back to long before there was a WWW to 
download from.
 
> I only receive electronic statements, and I certainly do not print them. 
>   I keep all personal financials in a set of folders ("Merchant", 
> "Bank", "Investments" and so on).
> 
> It's very rare that I have to print anything from there.
 


-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/12/2013 8:06:41 PM
In article <vilain-BE4490.21195107102013@news.individual.net>, Michael
Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> for specific volumes?

Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by
dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still
on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up
space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 

I can empty the trash, but since I don't usually bother emptying the
trash, I could have several gigabytes of files on my desktop computer.
This means if I do empty the trash to clean the USB drive, I will have
to wait for the desktop trash to be deleted as well. I would like to be
able to empty the trash on just the USB memory drive.

-- 
Jim Gibson
0
jimsgibson (533)
10/12/2013 10:44:52 PM
In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
<JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > for specific volumes?
> 
> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by
> dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still
> on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up
> space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 

finder menu, empty trash.

> I can empty the trash, but since I don't usually bother emptying the
> trash, I could have several gigabytes of files on my desktop computer.
> This means if I do empty the trash to clean the USB drive, I will have
> to wait for the desktop trash to be deleted as well. I would like to be
> able to empty the trash on just the USB memory drive.

then you ought to empty it a bit more often.

do you leave trash piling up in your house for months at a time?
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 1:08:43 AM
In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
 Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > for specific volumes?
> 
> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use 
> to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the 
> drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 

Why not just reformat the drive?

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/13/2013 3:44:00 AM
On 2013.10.12 18:44 , Jim Gibson wrote:
> In article <vilain-BE4490.21195107102013@news.individual.net>, Michael
> Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:
>
>> What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only
>> for specific volumes?
>
> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by
> dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still
> on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up
> space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient.
>
> I can empty the trash, but since I don't usually bother emptying the
> trash, I could have several gigabytes of files on my desktop computer.
> This means if I do empty the trash to clean the USB drive, I will have
> to wait for the desktop trash to be deleted as well. I would like to be
> able to empty the trash on just the USB memory drive.

It's a ridiculous case.  The trash is for trash not storage.

It is there because you might accidentally delete something and so can 
pull it out.

It is there because some apps delete files in some cases and you might 
want to recover them.

It is not there for you to wait a few days or weeks and mull it over 
before emptying the trash.

Empty it.  You'll feel better in the morning.




-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 2:02:39 PM
In message <michelle-8238DD.20440012102013@news.eternal-september.org> 
  Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
>  Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

>> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
>> > for specific volumes?
>> 
>> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use 
>> to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
>> all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
>> drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the 
>> drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 

> Why not just reformat the drive?

And why would that necessitate emptying ONLY the USB trash? The items in
the trash are in the TRASH. Do you sort through your kitchen trash and
think, "Hmm, maybe I'll hang on to these coffee grounds for a bit, and
that banana peel might be useful..."?



-- 
'I thought we could do it without anyone getting hurt. By using our
brains.' 'Can't. History don't work like that. Blood first, then
brains.' 'Mountains of skulls,' said Truckle.  'There's got to be a
better way than fighting,' said Mr Saveloy.  'Yep. Lots of 'em. Only
none of 'em work.'
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/13/2013 2:28:05 PM
In article <slrnl5lbfl.1mq3.g.kreme@jaka.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> >> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but 
> >> > only for specific volumes?
> >> 
> >> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to 
> >> use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by 
> >> dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are 
> >> still on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free 
> >> up space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> 
> > Why not just reformat the drive?
> 
> And why would that necessitate emptying ONLY the USB trash? The items in 
> the trash are in the TRASH.

He asked how he could empty the trash only on the USB drive; I gave him a 
suggestion on how to do it.  Unlike you, I did not voice a value judgement.

> Do you sort through your kitchen trash and think, "Hmm, maybe I'll hang 
> on to these coffee grounds for a bit, and that banana peel might be 
> useful..."?

No, I don't; nor do I use my Mac's trash can as a storage bin; I know 
better than that.

But when someone does something that's ill advised, and it doesn't affect 
you, why do you get so upset?

Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a garbage 
can.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/13/2013 2:57:23 PM
On 10/12/2013 1:06 PM PT, John Varela typed:

>>> Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
>>> fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
>>> steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
>>> realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
>>> insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
>>> desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
>>> spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
>>> Trash and then copy and paste.
>>
>> Why print a statement?
>
> Because I choose to.
>
> I have statements that reach back to long before there was a WWW to
> download from.

Ditto. Hardcopies for my folks and me.
-- 
"I don't know how good ants are at swimmin', but I'd be willing to bet 
that a good fire'd get their attention." --MacGyver in Trumbo's World 
episode
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
0
ant (886)
10/13/2013 3:03:15 PM
On 2013.10.12 23:44 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
>   Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only
>>> for specific volumes?
>>
>> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use
>> to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging
>> all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the
>> drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the
>> drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient.
>
> Why not just reformat the drive?

While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the drawback 
of reinforcing a bad habit.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 3:06:00 PM
On 2013.10.13 11:03 , Ant wrote:
> On 10/12/2013 1:06 PM PT, John Varela typed:
>
>>>> Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
>>>> fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
>>>> steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
>>>> realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
>>>> insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
>>>> desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
>>>> spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
>>>> Trash and then copy and paste.
>>>
>>> Why print a statement?
>>
>> Because I choose to.
>>
>> I have statements that reach back to long before there was a WWW to
>> download from.
>
> Ditto. Hardcopies for my folks and me.

Why?

I used to keep paper hardcopies of all my statements going back 7 years. 
  And every spring I'd gather the prior year's statements and bundle 
them and every spring I'd reach for the oldest bundle and trash it.

I had two drawers in an old dresser I kept in the garage where I kept them.

How many times over 20 years or so that I had to go back and look up 
something in there?


                                    Z E R O

Paper files take up space and serve no purpose at all.  I'll soon be rid 
of the oldest ones.

As for the digital ones if they linger on my computer for longer than 7 
years I won't really care very much as they don't take physical space 
and hard drives tend to grow much faster than my ability to fill them.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 3:28:05 PM
In article <michelle-8238DD.20440012102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
>  Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > for specific volumes?
> > 
> > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use 
> > to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> > all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> > drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the 
> > drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> 
> Why not just reformat the drive?

Takes too long.

-- 
Jim Gibson
0
jimsgibson (533)
10/13/2013 4:10:59 PM
In article <121020132108436432%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
> <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > for specific volumes?
> > 
> > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> > use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by
> > dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still
> > on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up
> > space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> 
> finder menu, empty trash.

Doesn't that empty trash for all mounted devices?

> 
> > I can empty the trash, but since I don't usually bother emptying the
> > trash, I could have several gigabytes of files on my desktop computer.
> > This means if I do empty the trash to clean the USB drive, I will have
> > to wait for the desktop trash to be deleted as well. I would like to be
> > able to empty the trash on just the USB memory drive.
> 
> then you ought to empty it a bit more often.

Can't be bothered.

> 
> do you leave trash piling up in your house for months at a time?

Have you been talking to my neighbors?

-- 
Jim Gibson
0
jimsgibson (533)
10/13/2013 4:12:09 PM
In article <c5adnYHWj61KK8fPnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> > Why not just reformat the drive?
> 
> While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the drawback 
> of reinforcing a bad habit.

I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/13/2013 4:30:20 PM
On 2013.10.13 12:12 , Jim Gibson wrote:
> In article <121020132108436432%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
> <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

>> then you ought to empty it a bit more often.
>
> Can't be bothered.

But you can be bothered to end up in a situation where you can't empty 
the trash on your USB drive to free up space w/o emptying trashes on 
other drives that you don't want to empty but that you don't really care 
about anyway?


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 4:30:32 PM
On 2013.10.13 12:30 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <c5adnYHWj61KK8fPnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>>> Why not just reformat the drive?
>>
>> While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the drawback
>> of reinforcing a bad habit.
>
> I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.

I think we've been trolled.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 4:40:04 PM
In article <131020130910599221%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
<JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > > for specific volumes?
> > > 
> > > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use 
> > > to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> > > all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> > > drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the 
> > > drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> > 
> > Why not just reformat the drive?
> 
> Takes too long.

nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.

it's normally quicker than emptying the trash because it doesn't need
to walk the file system. it just clears the entire directory at once.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 6:51:27 PM
In article <131020130912093414%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
<JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > > for specific volumes?
> > > 
> > > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> > > use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by
> > > dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still
> > > on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up
> > > space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> > 
> > finder menu, empty trash.
> 
> Doesn't that empty trash for all mounted devices?

yes, and since whatever is in the trash is not needed, that doesn't
matter.

you also gain some free space for other files.

> > > I can empty the trash, but since I don't usually bother emptying the
> > > trash, I could have several gigabytes of files on my desktop computer.
> > > This means if I do empty the trash to clean the USB drive, I will have
> > > to wait for the desktop trash to be deleted as well. I would like to be
> > > able to empty the trash on just the USB memory drive.
> > 
> > then you ought to empty it a bit more often.
> 
> Can't be bothered.

then you have to deal with the downsides of your methods.

> > do you leave trash piling up in your house for months at a time?
> 
> Have you been talking to my neighbors?

yes, and you should heard what they said about you.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 6:51:29 PM
In article <michelle-39BD77.09302013102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > 
> > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the drawback 
> > of reinforcing a bad habit.
> 
> I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.

then he gets to deal with the problems of using trash as storage.

the solution is simple.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 6:51:31 PM
On Oct 13, 2013, Alan Browne wrote

:> On 2013.10.13 11:03 , Ant wrote:
>> On 10/12/2013 1:06 PM PT, John Varela typed:
>> 
>>>>> Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
>>>>> fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
>>>>> steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
>>>>> realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
>>>>> insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
>>>>> desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
>>>>> spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
>>>>> Trash and then copy and paste.
>>>> 
>>>> Why print a statement?
>>> 
>>> Because I choose to.
>>> 
>>> I have statements that reach back to long before there was a WWW to
>>> download from.
>> 
>> Ditto. Hardcopies for my folks and me.
> 
> Why?
> 
> I used to keep paper hardcopies of all my statements going back 7 years. 
>   And every spring I'd gather the prior year's statements and bundle 
> them and every spring I'd reach for the oldest bundle and trash it.
> 
> I had two drawers in an old dresser I kept in the garage where I kept them.
> 
> How many times over 20 years or so that I had to go back and look up 
> something in there?
> 
> 
>                                     Z E R O
> 
> Paper files take up space and serve no purpose at all.  I'll soon be rid 
> of the oldest ones.
> 
> As for the digital ones if they linger on my computer for longer than 7 
> years I won't really care very much as they don't take physical space 
> and hard drives tend to grow much faster than my ability to fill them.
> 
> 

Why do you care -- why does it bother you so much -- what other people do 
with their records? I'm just curious.

-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/13/2013 8:00:13 PM
On 2013.10.13 16:00 , Joe from NY wrote:
> On Oct 13, 2013, Alan Browne wrote
>
> :> On 2013.10.13 11:03 , Ant wrote:
>>> On 10/12/2013 1:06 PM PT, John Varela typed:
>>>
>>>>>> Well, it happened to me a few minutes ago. I downloaded a mutual
>>>>>> fund monthly statement, printed it out, tossed the printout a few
>>>>>> steps away to my desk, and put the file in the Trash. Then I
>>>>>> realized I wanted to extract the cost basis from the statement to
>>>>>> insert in a spreadsheet. Rather than get up, walk a few steps to the
>>>>>> desk and back to fetch the paper and then type the number into the
>>>>>> spreadsheet, it was much easier to retrieve the statement from the
>>>>>> Trash and then copy and paste.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why print a statement?
>>>>
>>>> Because I choose to.
>>>>
>>>> I have statements that reach back to long before there was a WWW to
>>>> download from.
>>>
>>> Ditto. Hardcopies for my folks and me.
>>
>> Why?
>>
>> I used to keep paper hardcopies of all my statements going back 7 years.
>>    And every spring I'd gather the prior year's statements and bundle
>> them and every spring I'd reach for the oldest bundle and trash it.
>>
>> I had two drawers in an old dresser I kept in the garage where I kept them.
>>
>> How many times over 20 years or so that I had to go back and look up
>> something in there?
>>
>>
>>                                      Z E R O
>>
>> Paper files take up space and serve no purpose at all.  I'll soon be rid
>> of the oldest ones.
>>
>> As for the digital ones if they linger on my computer for longer than 7
>> years I won't really care very much as they don't take physical space
>> and hard drives tend to grow much faster than my ability to fill them.
>>
>>
>
> Why do you care -- why does it bother you so much -- what other people do
> with their records? I'm just curious.


It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies, 
esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the 
fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and 
eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier 
to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send 
me) than to refer to some pile of paper.

It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted 
e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of 
invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in 
their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.

Yes it bothers me too - needlessly printing an invoice is definitely not 
a green practice.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 8:25:25 PM
In message <michelle-D40738.07572313102013@news.eternal-september.org> 
  Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <slrnl5lbfl.1mq3.g.kreme@jaka.local>,
>  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

>> >> > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but 
>> >> > only for specific volumes?
>> >> 
>> >> Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to 
>> >> use to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by 
>> >> dragging all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are 
>> >> still on the drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free 
>> >> up space on the drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
>> 
>> > Why not just reformat the drive?
>> 
>> And why would that necessitate emptying ONLY the USB trash? The items in 
>> the trash are in the TRASH.

> He asked how he could empty the trash only on the USB drive; I gave him a 
> suggestion on how to do it.  Unlike you, I did not voice a value judgement.

I didn't voice a value judgement, I voiced a question why someone would
want to keep items that are in the trash.

>> Do you sort through your kitchen trash and think, "Hmm, maybe I'll hang 
>> on to these coffee grounds for a bit, and that banana peel might be 
>> useful..."?

> No, I don't; nor do I use my Mac's trash can as a storage bin; I know 
> better than that.

> But when someone does something that's ill advised, and it doesn't affect 
> you, why do you get so upset?

I'm not upset even a tiny bit.

> Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a garbage 
> can.

Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.

-- 
2 is not equal to 3, not even for large values of 2.  Grabel's Law
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/13/2013 8:35:04 PM
On 10/13/2013 11:51 AM PT, nospam typed:

 >>> Why not just reformat the drive?
>>
>> Takes too long.
>
> nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.

Maybe he is formatting incorrectly. Full formats take a while. Quick 
formats are fast.
-- 
"Even the wishes of a small ant reach heaven." --Japanese
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
A song is/was playing on this computer: Kylie Minogue - Red Blooded 
Woman 132.5bpm(DJGarryM's Ext Album Mix)
0
ant (886)
10/13/2013 9:12:36 PM
In article <1eudnZakiuRZkcbPnZ2dnUVZ_qednZ2d@earthlink.com>, Ant
<ant@zimage.comANT> wrote:

>  >>> Why not just reformat the drive?
> >>
> >> Takes too long.
> >
> > nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.
> 
> Maybe he is formatting incorrectly. Full formats take a while. Quick 
> formats are fast.

reformatting is always quick. it clears the directory and files are
gone. 

what is slow is when people zero all sectors, sometimes erroneously
called 'low level format'. that's rarely needed. it just wastes time.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 10:23:01 PM
In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies, 
> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the 
> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and 
> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier 
> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send 
> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.

i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper. 

searching paper is no easier than searching paper.

> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted 
> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of 
> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in 
> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.

it's what they're used to.

they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
changing means less work for them.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 10:23:03 PM
In article <slrnl5m0vq.2tnq.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a garbage 
> > can.
> 
> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.

garbage is typically stuff that can rot, smell or attract rodents or
animals, namely food. 

trash is everything else, such as paper, plastic, etc. it can sit in a
pile for years.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/13/2013 10:23:04 PM
On 2013.10.13 18:23 , nospam wrote:
> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies,
>> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the
>> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and
>> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier
>> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send
>> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.
>
> i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper.

Yes.

>
> searching paper is no easier than searching paper.
>
>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
>
> it's what they're used to.
>
> they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
> changing means less work for them.

As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet 
group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to 
get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the 
change.

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/13/2013 10:31:51 PM
In article <slrnl5m0vq.2tnq.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
> > garbage can.
> 
> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.

Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/14/2013 12:17:54 AM
In message <michelle-77DD11.17175413102013@news.eternal-september.org> 
  Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <slrnl5m0vq.2tnq.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
>  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

>> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
>> > garbage can.
>> 
>> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.

> Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.

They are completely interchangeable. "Take out the trash" doesn't mean
to take out the non-food waste, and means exactly the same thing as
"Take out the garbage."

-- 
Q: Does anyone know how many LOCs were in the Space Shuttle' codebase?
A: 45. It was written in perl (paraphrased Slashdot discussion)
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/14/2013 12:43:02 AM
\On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 22:31:51 UTC, Alan Browne 
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2013.10.13 18:23 , nospam wrote:
> > In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
> > <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies,
> >> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the
> >> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and
> >> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier
> >> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send
> >> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.
> >
> > i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper.
> 
> Yes.
> 
> >
> > searching paper is no easier than searching paper.
> >
> >> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
> >> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
> >> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
> >> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
> >
> > it's what they're used to.
> >
> > they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
> > changing means less work for them.
> 
> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet 
> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to 
> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the 
> change.
 
You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
business.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 2:41:46 AM
In article <slrnl5mfgm.1an.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> >> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
> >> > garbage can.
> >> 
> >> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.
> 
> > Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.
> 
> They are completely interchangeable.

no they aren't. there is a difference.

try putting trash in the garbage disposal. let us know how well that
works out.

> "Take out the trash" doesn't mean
> to take out the non-food waste,

actually, it does.

> and means exactly the same thing as
> "Take out the garbage."

no, it doesn't, and some places want it separated.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/14/2013 11:23:24 AM
In article <141020130723243204%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <slrnl5mfgm.1an.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis
> <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> 
> > >> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
> > >> > garbage can.
> > >> 
> > >> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.
> > 
> > > Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.
> > 
> > They are completely interchangeable.
> 
> no they aren't. there is a difference.
> 
> try putting trash in the garbage disposal. let us know how well that
> works out.
> 
> > "Take out the trash" doesn't mean
> > to take out the non-food waste,
> 
> actually, it does.
> 
> > and means exactly the same thing as
> > "Take out the garbage."
> 
> no, it doesn't, and some places want it separated.

That's the key. The the meanings of the terms are colloquial.

-- 
PRAY, v.  To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
0
tom_stiller (1288)
10/14/2013 12:29:46 PM
On Oct 13, 2013, John Varela wrote

:>> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet 
>> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to 
>> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the 
>> change.
>  
> You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
> the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
> business.

+101

-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/14/2013 1:22:00 PM
On 2013.10.13 22:41 , John Varela wrote:
> \On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 22:31:51 UTC, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2013.10.13 18:23 , nospam wrote:
>>> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
>>> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies,
>>>> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the
>>>> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and
>>>> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier
>>>> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send
>>>> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.
>>>
>>> i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper.
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>>>
>>> searching paper is no easier than searching paper.
>>>
>>>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
>>>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
>>>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
>>>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
>>>
>>> it's what they're used to.
>>>
>>> they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
>>> changing means less work for them.
>>
>> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet
>> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to
>> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the
>> change.
>
> You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
> the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's
> business.

And I asked you to explain what those good reasons are.  Please 
enlighten me.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/14/2013 3:00:04 PM
On 2013.10.09 21:27 , JF Mezei wrote:
> On 13-10-09 20:19, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>> I'd be happiest if the Trash would self empty items more than n days old
>> - then I could ignore it (like the trash in Apple Mail).
>>
>> (I hear there are apps that will do that sort of thing but I haven't
>> looked into it).
>
>
> Trash Timer from Hieper Software. Does exactly that and works well,
> qietly and without fuss.

Thanks.  Just installed.

This was mentioned in the past and I didn't do anything about it.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/14/2013 3:24:17 PM
In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted 
> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of 
> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in 
> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.

The one that still gets me is the domain name registrar I started out 
with.

Right from the first year's renewal circa 2001 they would send me 2 or 3 
separate letters trying to persuade me to pay by credit card, with only 
the last one containing the actual bill.  Each of the preliminary 
letters was several sheets of paper instead of the single sheet which 
would have sufficed.

They have finally whittled that down to one email and one 2 page letter.  
I have all my other regular bills delivered electronically and it's 
absurd that the one still using paper bills is a domain registrar.

I'll OCR their payment slip to pay it via online banking.

P.S. They have been so determined over the years to persuade me to pay 
by credit card that they triggered my stubborn streak and I'm not 
budging :-)

-- 
Paul Sture
0
nospam9740 (2260)
10/14/2013 4:50:07 PM
In article <141020130723243204%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <slrnl5mfgm.1an.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis
> <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> 
> > >> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
> > >> > garbage can.
> > >> 
> > >> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.
> > 
> > > Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.
> > 
> > They are completely interchangeable.
> 
> no they aren't. there is a difference.
> 
> try putting trash in the garbage disposal. let us know how well that
> works out.
> 
> > "Take out the trash" doesn't mean
> > to take out the non-food waste,
> 
> actually, it does.
> 
> > and means exactly the same thing as
> > "Take out the garbage."
> 
> no, it doesn't, and some places want it separated.

OED as in Dictionary.app:

garbage
noun
wasted or spoiled food and other refuse, as from a kitchen or household.
� a thing that is considered worthless or meaningless: a store full of 
overpriced garbage.
� Computing unwanted data in a computer's memory.

-- 
Paul Sture
0
nospam9740 (2260)
10/14/2013 4:53:45 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 15:00:04 UTC, Alan Browne 
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2013.10.13 22:41 , John Varela wrote:
> > \On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 22:31:51 UTC, Alan Browne
> > <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2013.10.13 18:23 , nospam wrote:
> >>> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
> >>> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies,
> >>>> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the
> >>>> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and
> >>>> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier
> >>>> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send
> >>>> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.
> >>>
> >>> i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper.
> >>
> >> Yes.
> >>
> >>>
> >>> searching paper is no easier than searching paper.
> >>>
> >>>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
> >>>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
> >>>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
> >>>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
> >>>
> >>> it's what they're used to.
> >>>
> >>> they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
> >>> changing means less work for them.
> >>
> >> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet
> >> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to
> >> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the
> >> change.
> >
> > You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
> > the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's
> > business.
> 
> And I asked you to explain what those good reasons are.  Please 
> enlighten me.
 
Are you really that obtuse? Didn't I just tell you it's none of your
goddam business? There's no reason I should defend my actions to 
you.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 6:03:33 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 13:22:00 UTC, Joe from NY <giu@invalid.invalid> 
wrote:

> On Oct 13, 2013, John Varela wrote
> 
> :>> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet 
> >> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to 
> >> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the 
> >> change.
> >  
> > You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
> > the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
> > business.
> 
> +101
 
I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 6:04:40 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 00:43:02 UTC, Lewis 
<g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <michelle-77DD11.17175413102013@news.eternal-september.org> 
>   Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > In article <slrnl5m0vq.2tnq.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
> >  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> 
> >> > Oh, and by the way, there's a difference between a trash can and a 
> >> > garbage can.
> >> 
> >> Is there? Trash and garbage are perfect synonyms for me.
> 
> > Garbage is food waste; trash is everything else.
> 
> They are completely interchangeable. "Take out the trash" doesn't mean
> to take out the non-food waste, and means exactly the same thing as
> "Take out the garbage."
 
That's just shorthand speech. According to M-W, garbage is 
specifically food waste, with extended meanings:

Full Definition of TRASH
1
:  something worth little or nothing: as
a :  junk, rubbish
b (1) :  empty talk :  nonsense (2) :  inferior or worthless writing
or artistic matter (as a television show); especially :  such matter
intended purely for sensational entertainment (3) :  trash talk
2
:  something in a crumbled or broken condition or mass; especially :
 debris from pruning or processing plant material
3
:  a worthless person; also :  such persons as a group :  riffraff
See trash defined for English-language learners �
See trash defined for kids �

Full Definition of GARBAGE
1
a :  food waste
b :  discarded or useless material
2
a :  trash 1b
b :  inaccurate or useless data

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 6:13:38 PM
On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 16:30:20 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <c5adnYHWj61KK8fPnZ2dnUVZ_tOdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> 
> > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > 
> > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the drawback 
> > of reinforcing a bad habit.
> 
> I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
 
I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash 
as temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said 
is that I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash 
erroneously or before I was really done with it, and then want to 
retrieve it.

If you people never make errors, well goody for you. I do make 
errors and it's nice to be able to correct them.

So please stop setting up and knocking down straw men.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 6:22:38 PM
On 2013.10.14 14:03 , John Varela wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 15:00:04 UTC, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2013.10.13 22:41 , John Varela wrote:
>>> \On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 22:31:51 UTC, Alan Browne
>>> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2013.10.13 18:23 , nospam wrote:
>>>>> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>, Alan Browne
>>>>> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's ironic to me that on a usenet group that is about technologies,
>>>>>> esp. personal computing, that some people aren't taking advantage of the
>>>>>> fact that one great use for computers is to organize information and
>>>>>> eliminate the accumulation of useless paper records.  It is far easier
>>>>>> to search paper records (like the pdf's that my banks and merchands send
>>>>>> me) than to refer to some pile of paper.
>>>>>
>>>>> i think you mean searching pdfs versus a pile of paper.
>>>>
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> searching paper is no easier than searching paper.
>>>>>
>>>>>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
>>>>>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
>>>>>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
>>>>>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
>>>>>
>>>>> it's what they're used to.
>>>>>
>>>>> they are unaware of the advantages of electronic formats and why
>>>>> changing means less work for them.
>>>>
>>>> As I say in the 1st para above I'm referring to people who use a usenet
>>>> group that is about technology.  Most have had more than enough years to
>>>> get used to the idea but are too stubborn or irrationally fearful of the
>>>> change.
>>>
>>> You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
>>> the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's
>>> business.
>>
>> And I asked you to explain what those good reasons are.  Please
>> enlighten me.
>
> Are you really that obtuse? Didn't I just tell you it's none of your
> goddam business? There's no reason I should defend my actions to
> you.

Absolutely true.    (Not the obtuse part of course).

On the other hand you could enlighten us with why you waste paper 
(trees, energy, $) and ink ($) and the place to store them when 
computers do so so efficiently in all respects while making record 
seeking a question of a simple search.

This after all was supposed to be one of the great benefits of the 
computing age - less paper use - and while that took a long time to get 
going (indeed the opposite is true in most offices ...) with most 
merchants sending statements in pdf (or making them available for 
download) it seems absolutely archaic to print the damned things...

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/14/2013 6:26:05 PM
On 2013.10.14 12:50 , Paul Sture wrote:
> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted
>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of
>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in
>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
>
> The one that still gets me is the domain name registrar I started out
> with.
>
> Right from the first year's renewal circa 2001 they would send me 2 or 3
> separate letters trying to persuade me to pay by credit card, with only
> the last one containing the actual bill.  Each of the preliminary
> letters was several sheets of paper instead of the single sheet which
> would have sufficed.
>
> They have finally whittled that down to one email and one 2 page letter.
> I have all my other regular bills delivered electronically and it's
> absurd that the one still using paper bills is a domain registrar.
>
> I'll OCR their payment slip to pay it via online banking.
>
> P.S. They have been so determined over the years to persuade me to pay
> by credit card that they triggered my stubborn streak and I'm not
> budging :-)

A little protest goes a long way.


-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/14/2013 6:26:54 PM
On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 16:10:59 UTC, Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> 
wrote:

> In article <michelle-8238DD.20440012102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
> Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > In article <121020131544528731%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
> >  Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > > for specific volumes?
> > > 
> > > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to use 
> > > to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> > > all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> > > drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on the 
> > > drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> > 
> > Why not just reformat the drive?
> 
> Takes too long.
 
I use a portable hard drive to copy my iPhoto library to another 
computer by sneakernet, and face the exact same situation you cite. 
Michelle's suggestion strikes me as a good one. Next time I'm going 
to follow it.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 6:28:34 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > 
> > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > 
> > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
>  
> I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is that 
> I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.

So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  If I 
want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with Time 
Machine.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/14/2013 8:04:26 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ydS8rXDuguO7@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things 
> > > the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
> > > business.
> > 
> > +101
>  
> I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.

As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so 
"+101" means "+1" 100 times more.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/14/2013 8:06:40 PM
On Oct 14, 2013, John Varela wrote

:>>> You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things
>>> the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
>>> business.
>> 
>> +101
>  
> I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.

It's just Google+ speak. +1 = "I like what you said."
I multiplied it manyfold because I really like what you said.

-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/14/2013 8:11:48 PM
On Oct 14, 2013, Michelle Steiner wrote

:> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ydS8rXDuguO7@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
>>>> You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things 
>>>> the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
>>>> business.
>>> 
>>> +101
>> 
>> I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.
> 
> As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so 
> "+101" means "+1" 100 times more.
> 
> 

Correct, Michelle.

-- 
Joey from New York
Among those whom I like or admire, I can find�no common denominator,
but among those�whom I love, I can: all of them make me laugh.
� �-- WH Auden

0
giu (20)
10/14/2013 8:55:32 PM
> On Oct 14, 2013, Michelle Steiner wrote

>> As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so 
>> "+101" means "+1" 100 times more.

No, I means:
	I agree,  I disagree, I agree after all.


+111 would have signified huge agreement :-)
0
10/14/2013 9:15:39 PM
In article <131020131451272235%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <131020130910599221%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
> <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > > > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but only 
> > > > > for specific volumes?
> > > > 
> > > > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> > > > use 
> > > > to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> > > > all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> > > > drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on
> > > > the 
> > > > drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> > > 
> > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > 
> > Takes too long.
> 
> nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.

I tried it both ways, after I had inserted a USB drive and waited for
it to mount.

1. Reformat -- 30 seconds
a. Find Disk Utility in the dock and click
b. Wait for Disk Utility to start and scan for drives
c. Find USB memory drive in list (involved scrolling down because this
system has eleven drives mounted.)
d. Click on Erase tab
e. Switch Format popup menu to "ExFAT" (most of my USB drives are FAT
because I use them to exchange files with Windows users.)
f. Click on Erase button
g. Confirm desire to erase in dialog window
.... and its done.

2. Erase/Empty Trash - 10 seconds
a. Double click drive icon to open top-level directory.
b. Select all files (usually just one directory)
c. Command-Delete to erase all selected files.
d. Select Empty Trash from File menu.
.... and its done.

My original post in this thread was in response to the question "What
is the use case for emptying the trash on a single drive?" Now, I am
being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
format drives. I don't use the trash except to hold deleted files, and
I know how to format drives. I also do not compulsively empty the trash
frequently, as I see no need to do so.

What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
(except John Varela) seems to understand why.

-- 
Jim Gibson
0
jimsgibson (533)
10/14/2013 9:44:19 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > > 
> > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > > 
> > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
> >  
> > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is that 
> > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
> 
> So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  If I 
> want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with Time 
> Machine.
 
I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
importance put into it recently.

My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 9:56:24 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 21:44:19 UTC, Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> 
wrote:

> this system has eleven drives mounted

Oh. That does make a difference. I just have the system drive, the 
Time Machine drive, and depending on what I'm doing, the portable 
drive or a drive for a clone backup. (Except for TM or when actually
making a backup I don't keep any backup drive electrically connected
to either the computer or the power because we get thunderstorms 
around here.) 

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 10:02:04 PM
On 2013.10.14 17:44 , Jim Gibson wrote:

> What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
> will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
> (except John Varela) seems to understand why.

That last is not a bad idea - but it still reinforces bad system 
operation habits.  You could try TrashTimer as Mezei suggests (I'm 
trying it now).

-- 
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of shit by the clean end."
                                                  -Unknown
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/14/2013 10:04:50 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 21:44:19 UTC, Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> 
wrote:

> I am
> being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> format drives.

Ain't that a pisser? I was writing, designing, and specifying 
software probably before most of these people were born, and they 
presume to give me unsolicited advice.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/14/2013 10:07:07 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
> >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > 
> > > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > > > 
> > > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > > > 
> > > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
> > >  
> > > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> > > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is that 
> > > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> > > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
> > 
> > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  If I 
> > want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with Time 
> > Machine.
>  
> I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
> to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
> importance put into it recently.
> 
> My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.

But there probably was a copy on the TM before you moved it to the trash.

-- 
PRAY, v.  To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf
of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy. -- Ambrose Bierce
0
tom_stiller (1288)
10/14/2013 10:20:35 PM
In article <141020131444193319%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
 Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> My original post in this thread was in response to the question "What
> is the use case for emptying the trash on a single drive?" Now, I am
> being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> format drives. I don't use the trash except to hold deleted files, and
> I know how to format drives. I also do not compulsively empty the trash
> frequently, as I see no need to do so.
> 
> What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
> will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
> (except John Varela) seems to understand why.

I can imagine other legitimate use cases like that for such 
functionality as well. 

Have you considered using Automator to create a Service that would 
present a list of trashes from which you could choose to empty?

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR
0
jollyroger (11010)
10/14/2013 11:49:08 PM
In article <141020131444193319%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
<JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > 
> > > Takes too long.
> > 
> > nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.
> 
> I tried it both ways, after I had inserted a USB drive and waited for
> it to mount.
> 
> 1. Reformat -- 30 seconds
> a. Find Disk Utility in the dock and click
> b. Wait for Disk Utility to start and scan for drives
> c. Find USB memory drive in list (involved scrolling down because this
> system has eleven drives mounted.)
> d. Click on Erase tab
> e. Switch Format popup menu to "ExFAT" (most of my USB drives are FAT
> because I use them to exchange files with Windows users.)
> f. Click on Erase button
> g. Confirm desire to erase in dialog window
> ... and its done.

you can't include the time to launch disk utility, but nevertheless,
all of that is a contrived scenario.

most people have one, maybe two drives, not 11, so there is no
scrolling. 

they also use the default format, so there's no delay there either.

> 2. Erase/Empty Trash - 10 seconds
> a. Double click drive icon to open top-level directory.
> b. Select all files (usually just one directory)
> c. Command-Delete to erase all selected files.
> d. Select Empty Trash from File menu.
> ... and its done.

the time it takes to empty the trash depends on how many files there
are and how big they are. you don't say how many, so i will assume two
very small text files, since you use the plural.

in other words, it's a bogus comparison.

obviously, if you have a couple of small files it will be quicker to
empty than to reformat. however, it doesn't take very many files to
where a reformat will be quicker, sometimes dramatically so.

try moving the contents of an entire drive with os x on it, over
~500,000 files, into the trash and then emptying it. 

then time how long it takes to reformat. the cool thing about
reformatting is that it doesn't care if there were files on it before,
so you can reformat after the trash is emptied.

the difference will be *huge*.

> My original post in this thread was in response to the question "What
> is the use case for emptying the trash on a single drive?" Now, I am
> being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> format drives. I don't use the trash except to hold deleted files, and
> I know how to format drives. I also do not compulsively empty the trash
> frequently, as I see no need to do so.

if you only use the trash for deleted files, then just empty the trash
and be done with it. 

if you aren't storing anything there, then it won't matter that it
deletes files from other drives.

> What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
> will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
> (except John Varela) seems to understand why.

from your own description of what you do, there's no reason for it.

the trash is *not* a storage locker. if you want to empty it, empty it.
you said you don't store stuff in the trash, so why only empty one
drive's trash?
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/14/2013 11:53:00 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-tgfTe06U5fwP@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > I am
> > being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> > format drives.
> 
> Ain't that a pisser? I was writing, designing, and specifying 
> software probably before most of these people were born, and they 
> presume to give me unsolicited advice.

the age card is always a last resort, and you did solicit advice.

anyway, back then there was no trash. if you deleted a file, it was
*gone*. you had to be very careful on what you deleted. 

the same applies now. only put into the trash what you want to delete.
you did it then and you can do it now.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/14/2013 11:53:02 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  
> > If I want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it 
> > with Time Machine.
>  
> I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen to 
> think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any importance 
> put into it recently.

That's why I wrote "a few hours"; it's not a schedule, but is when I think 
to do it.  And sometimes, but rarely, it is immediately.

> My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.

Nor does mine, but almost always the document is in TM before I put it in 
the trash.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/15/2013 1:16:44 AM
In article <141020131444193319%JimSGibson@gmail.com>,
 Jim Gibson <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> In article <131020131451272235%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
> <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> 
> > In article <131020130910599221%JimSGibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
> > <JimSGibson@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > > > > What use-case can you site where you want to empty the trash but 
> > > > > > only 
> > > > > > for specific volumes?
> > > > > 
> > > > > Happens to me all the time: I have a USB memory drive that I want to
> > > > > use 
> > > > > to exchange files with someone. I plug it in and erase it by dragging 
> > > > > all of the contents to the trash. However, the files are still on the 
> > > > > drive, so I would like to erase them permanently to free up space on
> > > > > the 
> > > > > drive and not give extraneous files to the recipient. 
> > > > 
> > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > 
> > > Takes too long.
> > 
> > nonsense. it takes just seconds, maybe 10 seconds at the most.
> 
> I tried it both ways, after I had inserted a USB drive and waited for
> it to mount.
> 
> 1. Reformat -- 30 seconds
> a. Find Disk Utility in the dock and click
> b. Wait for Disk Utility to start and scan for drives
> c. Find USB memory drive in list (involved scrolling down because this
> system has eleven drives mounted.)
> d. Click on Erase tab
> e. Switch Format popup menu to "ExFAT" (most of my USB drives are FAT
> because I use them to exchange files with Windows users.)
> f. Click on Erase button
> g. Confirm desire to erase in dialog window
> ... and its done.
> 
> 2. Erase/Empty Trash - 10 seconds
> a. Double click drive icon to open top-level directory.
> b. Select all files (usually just one directory)
> c. Command-Delete to erase all selected files.
> d. Select Empty Trash from File menu.
> ... and its done.
> 
> My original post in this thread was in response to the question "What
> is the use case for emptying the trash on a single drive?" Now, I am
> being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> format drives. I don't use the trash except to hold deleted files, and
> I know how to format drives. I also do not compulsively empty the trash
> frequently, as I see no need to do so.
> 
> What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
> will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
> (except John Varela) seems to understand why.

If you're an Apple Developer, you can log into Apple Development forums 
and file this on the bug tracking system as a Request for Enhancement.  
If you're not a Developer, it's free (as in they get your personal info) 
and once you have a developer ID, there's stuff you have access to that 
regular users don't, like programming tools and manuals.

That's the cost of complaining.  You have report the complaint to the 
person or organization that can fix it.  And you have to live longer.  
Keep going at this rate, you'll last to 120.  As my 88yo mom will tell 
you, growing old is not for sissies.

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically ignored]


0
vilain2 (2187)
10/15/2013 2:16:18 AM
In article <vilain-2A23D2.19161814102013@news.individual.net>,
 Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> As my 88yo mom will tell you, growing old is not for sissies.

I have that on one of my tee shirts.  I got it when I ran in the AZ Senior 
Olympics a few years ago.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/15/2013 3:41:51 AM
In message <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-Z5zIcXGcySiD@localhost> 
  John Varela <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> Full Definition of TRASH
> 1
>:  something worth little or nothing: as
> a :  junk, rubbish
> b (1) :  empty talk :  nonsense (2) :  inferior or worthless writing
> or artistic matter (as a television show); especially :  such matter
> intended purely for sensational entertainment (3) :  trash talk
> 2
>:  something in a crumbled or broken condition or mass; especially :
>  debris from pruning or processing plant material
> 3
>:  a worthless person; also :  such persons as a group :  riffraff
> See trash defined for English-language learners »
> See trash defined for kids »

> Full Definition of GARBAGE
> 1
> a :  food waste
> b :  discarded or useless material
> 2
> a :  trash 1b
> b :  inaccurate or useless data

So, one of the meanings of garbage is food waste. Not all the meanings,
not most of the meanings, not the only meaning, but ONE.

-- 
Some people are like a Slinky toy - not really good for anything, but
you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs.
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/15/2013 4:18:10 AM
In message <nospam-9D7FA5.18500614102013@news.chingola.ch> 
  Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

>> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted 
>> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of 
>> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in 
>> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.

> The one that still gets me is the domain name registrar I started out 
> with.

I have moved all my domains to hover, the first domain registrar that
has not made me feel like i needed a bleach shower after dealing with
them.

I just go a fake spam renewal notice from someone taking up the old
Network solutions tactic of sending a fake bill for $75/year on one of
my domains.

-- 
What if there were no hypothetical questions?
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/15/2013 4:21:13 AM
In article <slrnl5pgg2.sgu.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> So, one of the meanings of garbage is food waste. Not all the meanings, 
> not most of the meanings, not the only meaning, but ONE.

The primary meaning.

-- 
All usenet users are quirky, but some are more quirky than others.
0
michelle14 (19004)
10/15/2013 4:41:08 AM
In article <slrnl5pglp.sgu.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <nospam-9D7FA5.18500614102013@news.chingola.ch> 
>   Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> > In article <MfWdnfPU0ocpnMbPnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> >  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> 
> >> It is also intriguing to me that while most companies have adopted 
> >> e-mail or statement downloading in order to reduce their cost of 
> >> invoicing then people throw that advantage out, create paper piles in 
> >> their homes - and for that matter waste money on paper and ink.
> 
> > The one that still gets me is the domain name registrar I started out 
> > with.
> 
> I have moved all my domains to hover, the first domain registrar that
> has not made me feel like i needed a bleach shower after dealing with
> them.

I know what you mean.

> I just go a fake spam renewal notice from someone taking up the old
> Network solutions tactic of sending a fake bill for $75/year on one of
> my domains.

Noted.

-- 
Paul Sture
0
nospam9740 (2260)
10/15/2013 5:12:52 PM
In article <michelle-0A1594.13064014102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
 Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ydS8rXDuguO7@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > > You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things 
> > > > the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
> > > > business.
> > > 
> > > +101
> >  
> > I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.
> 
> As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so 
> "+101" means "+1" 100 times more.

Or 9 times more...

-- 
Paul Sture
0
nospam9740 (2260)
10/15/2013 5:21:30 PM
In article <nospam-C91E4E.19213015102013@news.chingola.ch>,
 Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:

> In article <michelle-0A1594.13064014102013@news.eternal-september.org>,
>  Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-ydS8rXDuguO7@localhost>,
> >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > 
> > > > > You know, you really are an ass. I have good reason for doing things 
> > > > > the way I do, and my reason is none of your or that other jerk's 
> > > > > business.
> > > > 
> > > > +101
> > >  
> > > I don't understand. Is that binary or what? Pleas explain.
> > 
> > As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so 
> > "+101" means "+1" 100 times more.
> 
> Or 9 times more...

/South Philly accent=on/

Yo, Cheese Steak! Wherdaya tink ya geddoff telling binary jokes herh, 
huh?!? Whadayatink dis is, a computer forum? Da foist quoted paragraph 
up derh should clue ya dat it ain't!

/South Philly accent=off/

;)
0
fmoore (1430)
10/15/2013 7:46:08 PM
On Tue, 15 Oct 2013 04:41:08 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <slrnl5pgg2.sgu.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
>  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> 
> > So, one of the meanings of garbage is food waste. Not all the meanings, 
> > not most of the meanings, not the only meaning, but ONE.
> 
> The primary meaning.
 
And the only one relevant to this thread.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 6:18:54 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:20:35 UTC, Tom Stiller 
<tom_stiller@yahoo.com> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > 
> > > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
> > >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > > > > 
> > > > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
> > > >  
> > > > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> > > > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is that 
> > > > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> > > > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
> > > 
> > > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  If I 
> > > want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with Time 
> > > Machine.
> >  
> > I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
> > to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
> > importance put into it recently.
> > 
> > My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> > there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.
> 
> But there probably was a copy on the TM before you moved it to the trash.
 
Perhaps I wasn't clear. There wouldn't be a copy on TM unless the 
file was on the drive and not in the trash at least overnight or, if
wanted some days later, over a weekend.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 6:21:15 PM
On Tue, 15 Oct 2013 01:16:44 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  
> > > If I want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it 
> > > with Time Machine.
> >  
> > I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen to 
> > think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any importance 
> > put into it recently.
> 
> That's why I wrote "a few hours"; it's not a schedule, but is when I think 
> to do it.  And sometimes, but rarely, it is immediately.
> 
> > My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> > there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.
> 
> Nor does mine, but almost always the document is in TM before I put it in 
> the trash.
 
In the example I cited way upthread, I got an email that my 
statement was ready, I downloaded the statement, copied data into 
spreadsheets, printed the pdf, and then trashed it. From email to 
trash wasn't more than a couple of hours.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 6:24:55 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:04:50 UTC, Alan Browne 
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2013.10.14 17:44 , Jim Gibson wrote:
> 
> > What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
> > will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
> > (except John Varela) seems to understand why.
> 
> That last is not a bad idea - but it still reinforces bad system 
> operation habits.  You could try TrashTimer as Mezei suggests (I'm 
> trying it now).
 
Just exactly what makes you think that you get to define what are 
good and bad system operating habits?

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 6:26:14 PM
On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 23:53:02 UTC, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> 
wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-tgfTe06U5fwP@localhost>, John Varela
> <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > I am
> > > being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> > > format drives.
> > 
> > Ain't that a pisser? I was writing, designing, and specifying 
> > software probably before most of these people were born, and they 
> > presume to give me unsolicited advice.
> 
> the age card is always a last resort, and you did solicit advice.

That about age is a new one on me.

And when did I solicit advice? At the start of this subthread I did 
say, "If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to
know it." With one or two exceptions I didn't get an answer to the 
rhetorical question that wasn't even stated as a question. Instead, 
I got several jerks accusing me of maltreating my computer.
 
> anyway, back then there was no trash. if you deleted a file, it was
> *gone*. you had to be very careful on what you deleted. 

Back when? To me, "back when" was Hollerith cards and tape drives. I
even used paper tape on ASR Teletype machines. The term "erase" 
didn't exist.

I do recall in the TRS-80 and DOS days having undelete utilities, so
I don't know what era you're talking about. Do you?
 
> the same applies now. only put into the trash what you want to delete.
> you did it then and you can do it now.

When did I do it? We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
recall ever having wanted to.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 6:38:57 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-YudVWrQewQIh@localhost>,
 "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:20:35 UTC, Tom Stiller 
> <tom_stiller@yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
> >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > 
> > > On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> > > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
> > > >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > > > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
> > > > >  
> > > > > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> > > > > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is 
> > > > > that 
> > > > > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> > > > > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
> > > > 
> > > > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  
> > > > If I 
> > > > want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with 
> > > > Time 
> > > > Machine.
> > >  
> > > I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
> > > to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
> > > importance put into it recently.
> > > 
> > > My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> > > there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.
> > 
> > But there probably was a copy on the TM before you moved it to the trash.
>  
> Perhaps I wasn't clear. There wouldn't be a copy on TM unless the 
> file was on the drive and not in the trash at least overnight or, if
> wanted some days later, over a weekend.

Huh? At the moment my Time Machine has backups for each of the last 24 
hours. Unless you've mucked about with the configuration, why do you say 
the file would have to be not-in-the-trash overnight? Of course it may 
well be gone after more than 24 hours are past, but for the first day it 
should be available unless you're really quick to create and delete.
0
jccw (11)
10/16/2013 7:02:03 PM
On Wed, 16 Oct 2013 19:02:03 UTC, John White 
<jccw@jccw.removeme.org> wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-YudVWrQewQIh@localhost>,
>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:20:35 UTC, Tom Stiller 
> > <tom_stiller@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
> > >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> > > > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
> > > > >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
> > > > > > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
> > > > > >  
> > > > > > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
> > > > > > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is 
> > > > > > that 
> > > > > > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
> > > > > > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
> > > > > 
> > > > > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  
> > > > > If I 
> > > > > want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with 
> > > > > Time 
> > > > > Machine.
> > > >  
> > > > I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
> > > > to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
> > > > importance put into it recently.
> > > > 
> > > > My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
> > > > there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.
> > > 
> > > But there probably was a copy on the TM before you moved it to the trash.
> >  
> > Perhaps I wasn't clear. There wouldn't be a copy on TM unless the 
> > file was on the drive and not in the trash at least overnight or, if
> > wanted some days later, over a weekend.
> 
> Huh? At the moment my Time Machine has backups for each of the last 24 
> hours. Unless you've mucked about with the configuration, why do you say 
> the file would have to be not-in-the-trash overnight? Of course it may 
> well be gone after more than 24 hours are past, but for the first day it 
> should be available unless you're really quick to create and delete.

You're quite right and your precision is admirable. 

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/16/2013 7:59:57 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-zzhMkOCQtGHM@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > > I am
> > > > being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> > > > format drives.
> > > 
> > > Ain't that a pisser? I was writing, designing, and specifying 
> > > software probably before most of these people were born, and they 
> > > presume to give me unsolicited advice.
> > 
> > the age card is always a last resort, and you did solicit advice.
> 
> That about age is a new one on me.

then why did you bring it up? why does it matter what you were doing
long ago? how is it even relevant? 

> And when did I solicit advice? 

when you first posted.

> At the start of this subthread I did 
> say, "If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to
> know it." 

looks like solicitation to me.

> With one or two exceptions I didn't get an answer to the 
> rhetorical question that wasn't even stated as a question. Instead, 
> I got several jerks accusing me of maltreating my computer.

truth hurts.

> > anyway, back then there was no trash. if you deleted a file, it was
> > *gone*. you had to be very careful on what you deleted. 
> 
> Back when? To me, "back when" was Hollerith cards and tape drives. I
> even used paper tape on ASR Teletype machines.

is that supposed to impress me? 

the age card never works. and by the way, i used to use paper tape and
teletypes too, with 110 baud acoustic modems. i used card punches too
although not that often. the high speed dectape readers were rather
cool to watch. and who can forget those giant 24" disk packs that you
had to spin down before removing them. 

when i said 'back then' i meant 'back then'. 

> The term "erase" 
> didn't exist.

actually it did.

> I do recall in the TRS-80 and DOS days having undelete utilities, so
> I don't know what era you're talking about. Do you?

i know quite well what era i'm talking about.

> > the same applies now. only put into the trash what you want to delete.
> > you did it then and you can do it now.
> 
> When did I do it?

'back then'.

> We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> recall ever having wanted to.

once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.

you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
next day.

so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
you can do the same now.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/16/2013 9:13:34 PM
On Wed, 16 Oct 2013 21:13:34 UTC, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> 
wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-zzhMkOCQtGHM@localhost>, John Varela
> <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > > > I am
> > > > > being accused of using Trash as a storage place and not knowing how to
> > > > > format drives.
> > > > 
> > > > Ain't that a pisser? I was writing, designing, and specifying 
> > > > software probably before most of these people were born, and they 
> > > > presume to give me unsolicited advice.
> > > 
> > > the age card is always a last resort, and you did solicit advice.
> > 
> > That about age is a new one on me.
> 
> then why did you bring it up? why does it matter what you were doing
> long ago? how is it even relevant? 
> 
> > And when did I solicit advice? 
> 
> when you first posted.
> 
> > At the start of this subthread I did 
> > say, "If there's a way to delete Trash on only one drive I'd like to
> > know it." 
> 
> looks like solicitation to me.

Even if it is a solilcitation it has nothing to do with retrieving 
items from Trash.
 
> > With one or two exceptions I didn't get an answer to the 
> > rhetorical question that wasn't even stated as a question. Instead, 
> > I got several jerks accusing me of maltreating my computer.
> 
> truth hurts.

The truth is that you are one of the jerks. Does that truth hurt?
 
> > > anyway, back then there was no trash. if you deleted a file, it was
> > > *gone*. you had to be very careful on what you deleted. 
> > 
> > Back when? To me, "back when" was Hollerith cards and tape drives. I
> > even used paper tape on ASR Teletype machines.
> 
> is that supposed to impress me? 

You are not a person I wish to impress.
 
> the age card never works. and by the way, i used to use paper tape and
> teletypes too, with 110 baud acoustic modems. i used card punches too
> although not that often. the high speed dectape readers were rather
> cool to watch. and who can forget those giant 24" disk packs that you
> had to spin down before removing them. 
> 
> when i said 'back then' i meant 'back then'. 

Disks? You had disks? We had drums.
 
> > The term "erase" 
> > didn't exist.
> 
> actually it did.

Yeah, you could erase a tape. There was no such thing as erasing a 
file.
 
> > I do recall in the TRS-80 and DOS days having undelete utilities, so
> > I don't know what era you're talking about. Do you?
> 
> i know quite well what era i'm talking about.

You just can't describe it.
 
> > > the same applies now. only put into the trash what you want to delete.
> > > you did it then and you can do it now.
> > 
> > When did I do it?
> 
> 'back then'.
>
> > We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> > done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> > recall ever having wanted to.
> 
> once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.
> 
> you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
> next day.
> 
> so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
> you can do the same now.

Couldn't use the trash for storage becasue there was no trash.

I used to sympathize with you when JR and others got on your case 
but no more. They are right: you are a damned fool. I never said I 
use the trash as storage. You made that up. Learn to read for 
comprehension.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/17/2013 12:34:03 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-kMMXXydmxthm@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > the age card never works. and by the way, i used to use paper tape and
> > teletypes too, with 110 baud acoustic modems. i used card punches too
> > although not that often. the high speed dectape readers were rather
> > cool to watch. and who can forget those giant 24" disk packs that you
> > had to spin down before removing them. 
> > 
> > when i said 'back then' i meant 'back then'. 
> 
> Disks? You had disks? We had drums.

the computing center had the drums. the minicomputers in the labs had
the disk packs, and people could store their work on them, sort of like
saving to a floppy many years later.

> > > The term "erase" 
> > > didn't exist.
> > 
> > actually it did.
> 
> Yeah, you could erase a tape. There was no such thing as erasing a 
> file.

yes there was. some tape drives supported it. not all. 

and i as referring to a disk anyway. if you deleted a file, it was gone.

> > > We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> > > done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> > > recall ever having wanted to.
> > 
> > once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.
> > 
> > you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
> > next day.
> > 
> > so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
> > you can do the same now.
> 
> Couldn't use the trash for storage becasue there was no trash.

exactly the point.

> I used to sympathize with you when JR and others got on your case 
> but no more. They are right: you are a damned fool. I never said I 
> use the trash as storage. You made that up. Learn to read for 
> comprehension.

i didn't make it up at all and several other people said the same thing.

i don't know if it was you or someone else, but someone said they had
several gigs of stuff in the trash and didn't want to empty it, thus
the request to selectively empty it for just one volume. that very
clearly means that the trash is being used for storage.

the reality is that anything in the trash is not needed anymore,
otherwise why put it there in the first place?

therefore, there is no reason to selectively empty the trash only for
one volume. empty the trash and be done with it.

in the unlikely event you need a file that was trashed, pull it off a
backup. time machine makes that very easy.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/17/2013 3:12:09 AM
On 2013-10-14 21:15:39 +0000, JF Mezei said:

>> 
>> On Oct 14, 2013, Michelle Steiner wrote
> 
>>> As I understand it, "+1" means "I like that/I agree with that", etc., so
>>> "+101" means "+1" 100 times more.
> 
> No, I means:
> 	I agree,  I disagree, I agree after all.

You sure it isn't just +5 (once reasonably converted to decimal)?

0
BreadWithSpam (1707)
10/17/2013 3:28:29 AM
On 2013-10-14 22:04:50 +0000, Alan Browne said:

> On 2013.10.14 17:44 , Jim Gibson wrote:
> 
>> What I would like is a right-click menu option on a drive icon that
>> will let me empty the trash on that drive only. I'm sorry if nobody
>> (except John Varela) seems to understand why.
> 
> That last is not a bad idea - but it still reinforces bad system 
> operation habits.  You could try TrashTimer as Mezei suggests (I'm 
> trying it now).

As I mentioned elsewhere, Path Finder allows you to empty the trash on 
only a given drive.

Not free, or even that cheap (look for a bundle).  But incredibly 
useful program in my experience.


0
BreadWithSpam (1707)
10/17/2013 3:30:54 AM
In message <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-zNKieKBdGrtb@localhost> 
  John Varela <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Oct 2013 04:41:08 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

>> In article <slrnl5pgg2.sgu.g.kreme@mbp55.local>,
>>  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>> 
>> > So, one of the meanings of garbage is food waste. Not all the meanings, 
>> > not most of the meanings, not the only meaning, but ONE.
>> 
>> The primary meaning.
>  
> And the only one relevant to this thread.

Not at all. The primary meaning is a list of things. This includes,
"refuse". Refuse is something thrown away, trash.

If I ask someone where the garbage is, they do not hesitate because I am
not throwing out food. We put the trash cans out for the garbage
collectors on Tuesdays, or we take the garbage out for the trash truck.

-- 
A Clean House Is A Sign Of A Misspent Life
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/17/2013 4:11:21 AM
In message <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-YudVWrQewQIh@localhost> 
  John Varela <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:20:35 UTC, Tom Stiller 
> <tom_stiller@yahoo.com> wrote:

>> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-77jTn3tiqK9V@localhost>,
>>  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
>> 
>> > On Mon, 14 Oct 2013 20:04:26 UTC, Michelle Steiner 
>> > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>> > 
>> > > In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-l0SUx4Z6zodq@localhost>,
>> > >  "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
>> > > 
>> > > > > > > Why not just reformat the drive?
>> > > > > > 
>> > > > > > While an excellent technical solution for the case it has the 
>> > > > > > drawback of reinforcing a bad habit.
>> > > > > 
>> > > > > I doubt that anything any of us say cause him to change that habit.
>> > > >  
>> > > > I don't believe Jim or anyone else here has said that we use Trash as 
>> > > > temporary storage. I certainly haven't said it. What I have said is that 
>> > > > I occasionally realize I've put something in the Trash erroneously or 
>> > > > before I was really done with it, and then want to retrieve it.
>> > > 
>> > > So do I, but I empty the trash after a few hours, not days or weeks.  If I 
>> > > want to retrieve the document after I empty the trash, I get it with Time 
>> > > Machine.
>> >  
>> > I don't empty trash on any sort of schedule. I do it when I happen 
>> > to think of it and also am sure that there's been nothing of any 
>> > importance put into it recently.
>> > 
>> > My Time Machine doesn't save the trash, so anything that wasn't 
>> > there overnight or, later, over the weekend won't be in TM.
>> 
>> But there probably was a copy on the TM before you moved it to the trash.
>  
> Perhaps I wasn't clear. There wouldn't be a copy on TM unless the 
> file was on the drive and not in the trash at least overnight or, if
> wanted some days later, over a weekend.

This was not true the first time you said it. It is still not true.

-- 
Come on. Somewhere at the edge of the bell curve is the girl for me.
0
g.kreme (3671)
10/17/2013 4:12:26 AM
In article <161020132312092839%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> i don't know if it was you or someone else, but someone said they had
> several gigs of stuff in the trash and didn't want to empty it, thus
> the request to selectively empty it for just one volume. that very
> clearly means that the trash is being used for storage.

That was me. The reason I didn't want to do a global empty trash was
because it would take too long, because I had several GBs in the trash
on my boot drive. I was trying to give some files to a co-worker, and
he was standing right there in my cubicle waiting for me. I didn't want
to make him wait any longer than necessary. I also wanted to clean up
the USB memory drive before giving it to him. A selective empty trash
on the USB drive would have been the optimal solution for me in that
situation.

I WAS NOT USING TRASH FOR STORAGE!

Got that? You really can be an idiotic, arrogant jerk at times.

-- 
Jim Gibson
0
jimsgibson (533)
10/17/2013 9:27:56 PM
When I need to clean a USB key, I use the command line.

cd /Volumes/Untitled  (or whetever the USB key is named)
rm -r .Trashes

and also delete the other hidden files/directories like the spotlight
one, and the .fseventsd  (for my GPS this is important because their
presence causes the GPS to not startup :-(
0
10/17/2013 9:50:54 PM
On 2013.10.17 17:27 , Jim Gibson wrote:
> In article <161020132312092839%nospam@nospam.invalid>, nospam
> <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>
>> i don't know if it was you or someone else, but someone said they had
>> several gigs of stuff in the trash and didn't want to empty it, thus
>> the request to selectively empty it for just one volume. that very
>> clearly means that the trash is being used for storage.
>
> That was me. The reason I didn't want to do a global empty trash was
> because it would take too long, because I had several GBs in the trash
> on my boot drive. I was trying to give some files to a co-worker, and
> he was standing right there in my cubicle waiting for me. I didn't want
> to make him wait any longer than necessary. I also wanted to clean up
> the USB memory drive before giving it to him. A selective empty trash
> on the USB drive would have been the optimal solution for me in that
> situation.
>
> I WAS NOT USING TRASH FOR STORAGE!
>
> Got that? You really can be an idiotic, arrogant jerk at times.

You're the jerk for not using the function as intended and then ending 
up in a silly situation.  It takes very little time to empty the trash 
(just invoke it) and then do other things ... it needs no help and 
doesn't prevent you from doing something else.

For that matter there is the freeware that will do it after a pre-set time.

You might not be using trash as storage - but you've really cluttered 
the alleyway by not taking it out ...


-- 
"Quotation, n: The act of repeating erroneously the words of another."
                                                 -Ambrose Bierce
0
alan.browne (4546)
10/17/2013 10:04:29 PM
In article <171020131427564991%jimsgibson@gmail.com>, Jim Gibson
<jimsgibson@gmail.com> wrote:

> > i don't know if it was you or someone else, but someone said they had
> > several gigs of stuff in the trash and didn't want to empty it, thus
> > the request to selectively empty it for just one volume. that very
> > clearly means that the trash is being used for storage.
> 
> That was me. The reason I didn't want to do a global empty trash was
> because it would take too long, because I had several GBs in the trash
> on my boot drive.

keeping several gigs of stuff in the trash is not normal.

> I was trying to give some files to a co-worker, and
> he was standing right there in my cubicle waiting for me. I didn't want
> to make him wait any longer than necessary. I also wanted to clean up
> the USB memory drive before giving it to him. A selective empty trash
> on the USB drive would have been the optimal solution for me in that
> situation.

emptying the trash is the correct solution.

> I WAS NOT USING TRASH FOR STORAGE!

you are if you wanted to empty the trash only of certain files and keep
other files.

that's what storage means.

the fact that those files were in the trash means you did not want
them, so emptying the entire trash has no downside.

furthermore, if you put them there and saw no reason to remove them by
the time you needed to erase the usb stick, then you really did not
need any of those files. 

if you wanted to keep those other files, do not put them in the trash.

> Got that? You really can be an idiotic, arrogant jerk at times.

as can you.

if you didn't put several gigs of stuff in the trash and keep it there,
you wouldn't have this problem.

i know a mac consultant who when visiting clients, empties their trash
moments after arriving.

initially, a few bitched, but he explained that the trash is not
storage and if you want to keep a file, do not put it in the trash.
that quickly ended their bad habits.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/18/2013 12:53:46 AM
On Sunday, October 6, 2013 9:11:14 AM UTC-7, Ant wrote:
> Hi again.
> 
> 
> 
> I just ran into a weird/an odd usability issue that bugged me in an 
> 
> updated Mac OS X 10.8.5 earlier:
> 
> 
> 
> I tossed a huge 4.5 GB folder into Mac OS X 10.8.5's Trash bin. I 
> 
> decided to restore it back to the same exact place by dragging the 
> 
> folder back to the same place in Finder. However, it did a copy. 
> 
> Shouldn't it be a move? Isn't there a restore to the back place option?
> 
> 
> 
> 2. I renamed an external HDD's name that was used for Time Machine (TM) 
> 
> back up. When I went to back up, it told me it couldn't. So, I looked at 
> 
> TM settings. I noticed it was looking for the old name even though it 
> 
> was the same exact disk. I told it to reuse the renamed disk to resume. 
> 
> Why is it that picky on my renamed disk drive?
> 
> 
> 
> 3. Also, how do I get back Finder's sidebar icon for mounted external 
> 
> USB HDD? I accidently removed it. Unmounting and remounting doesn't make 
> 
> it come back.
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you in advance. :)
> 
> -- 
> 
> "Don't step on ants... they're people too." --a quote from ANTZ movie.
> 
>     /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
> 
>    / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
> 
>   | |o   o| |
> 
>      \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
> 
>       ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
> 
> Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.


Yes!

Tom
0
tadapope (50)
10/18/2013 2:22:34 AM
On 13-10-17 20:53, nospam wrote:

> if you wanted to keep those other files, do not put them in the trash.

Here is an exmaple that happened to me. a 25 gig file on drive A. I copy
it along with others to drive 2 where it is meant to be stored.

Because I used Finder, the copy seemed to complete without errors, so I
dicthed the files on drive 1 into the trash.

Found out a few days later that the 25 gig file was not completely
copied. So I brough the file out of trash, and this type used command
line to copy the file with a -v to make sure I would see if there were
errors. It copied succesfully and the size of the new file was the same
as the source. So I dragged it back to the trash but didn't empty it yet.


And ever since someone here mentioned TrashTimer to me, it has been
great because it only deletes files after X days in the trash, so I can
just put stuff there and know that I have about a week to recover if
need be, and not have to worrry about the trash growing out of proportions.

If disk space in an issue, I can alsways issue an "empty trash" from the
Finder, or use rm to selectively delete a few files in the .Trashes folder


0
10/18/2013 5:00:54 AM
In article <5260c088$0$59833$c3e8da3$e074e489@news.astraweb.com>, JF
Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> > if you wanted to keep those other files, do not put them in the trash.
> 
> Here is an exmaple that happened to me. a 25 gig file on drive A. I copy
> it along with others to drive 2 where it is meant to be stored.
> 
> Because I used Finder, the copy seemed to complete without errors, so I
> dicthed the files on drive 1 into the trash.

that's a well known finder bug, not a reason to keep a 25 gig file in
the trash.

finder does not verify copies for speed purposes. apple considers it a
feature. i wish i was kidding.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/18/2013 7:09:22 AM
On 10/17/2013 7:22 PM PT, Saint Isidore Patron Saint of the Internet typed:

> Yes!

Yes?
-- 
"Where there is sugar, there are bound to be ants." --Malay Proverb
    /\___/\         Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
   / /\ /\ \                Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
  | |o   o| |
     \ _ /        If crediting, then use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
      ( )         If e-mailing, then axe ANT from its address if needed.
Ant is currently not listening to any songs on this computer.
0
ant (886)
10/18/2013 12:42:03 PM
On Fri, 18 Oct 2013 05:00:54 UTC, JF Mezei 
<jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 13-10-17 20:53, nospam wrote:
> 
> > if you wanted to keep those other files, do not put them in the trash.
> 
> Here is an exmaple that happened to me. a 25 gig file on drive A. I copy
> it along with others to drive 2 where it is meant to be stored.
> 
> Because I used Finder, the copy seemed to complete without errors, so I
> dicthed the files on drive 1 into the trash.
> 
> Found out a few days later that the 25 gig file was not completely
> copied. So I brough the file out of trash, and this type used command
> line to copy the file with a -v to make sure I would see if there were
> errors. It copied succesfully and the size of the new file was the same
> as the source. So I dragged it back to the trash but didn't empty it yet.
> 
> 
> And ever since someone here mentioned TrashTimer to me, it has been
> great because it only deletes files after X days in the trash, so I can
> just put stuff there and know that I have about a week to recover if
> need be, and not have to worrry about the trash growing out of proportions.
> 
> If disk space in an issue, I can alsways issue an "empty trash" from the
> Finder, or use rm to selectively delete a few files in the .Trashes folder
 
Good example. The idiot is going to say you could have retrieved it 
from Time Machine and maybe you could have, but fetching from Trash 
was quicker and easier. And there was no wait for the file to be 
moved from the TM drive to the target drive.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/19/2013 12:09:03 AM
On Thu, 17 Oct 2013 03:12:09 UTC, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> 
wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-kMMXXydmxthm@localhost>, John Varela
> <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > the age card never works. and by the way, i used to use paper tape and
> > > teletypes too, with 110 baud acoustic modems. i used card punches too
> > > although not that often. the high speed dectape readers were rather
> > > cool to watch. and who can forget those giant 24" disk packs that you
> > > had to spin down before removing them. 
> > > 
> > > when i said 'back then' i meant 'back then'. 
> > 
> > Disks? You had disks? We had drums.
> 
> the computing center had the drums. the minicomputers in the labs had
> the disk packs, and people could store their work on them, sort of like
> saving to a floppy many years later.

Minicomputers? Along with drums?

I'm talking about vacuum tubes. If you've never seen a vacuum tube I
still have a few. Would you like me to send you one?

> > > > The term "erase" 
> > > > didn't exist.
> > > 
> > > actually it did.
> > 
> > Yeah, you could erase a tape. There was no such thing as erasing a 
> > file.
> 
> yes there was. some tape drives supported it. not all. 

Maybe. Not in the 1950s.

> and i as referring to a disk anyway. if you deleted a file, it was
> gone.

If you had a disk.

> > > > We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> > > > done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> > > > recall ever having wanted to.
> > > 
> > > once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.
> > > 
> > > you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
> > > next day.
> > > 
> > > so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
> > > you can do the same now.
> > 
> > Couldn't use the trash for storage becasue there was no trash.
> 
> exactly the point.

I've mentioned before that Apple puts the Trash folder(s) on their 
computers for a reason. I have said that several times and you have 
never addressed that point because you can't.

> > I used to sympathize with you when JR and others got on your case 
> > but no more. They are right: you are a damned fool. I never said I 
> > use the trash as storage. You made that up. Learn to read for 
> > comprehension.
> 
> i didn't make it up at all and several other people said the same
> thing.

And when they read the response they dropped the topic.

> i don't know if it was you or someone else, but someone said they had
> several gigs of stuff in the trash and didn't want to empty it, thus
> the request to selectively empty it for just one volume. that very
> clearly means that the trash is being used for storage.
> 
> the reality is that anything in the trash is not needed anymore,
> otherwise why put it there in the first place?
> 
> therefore, there is no reason to selectively empty the trash only for
> one volume. empty the trash and be done with it.
> 
> in the unlikely event you need a file that was trashed, pull it off a
> backup. time machine makes that very easy.

One more time: Apple puts the Trash folder(s) on their computers for
a reason. What do you think the reason is?

At this point I don't know if I'm baiting you or you're baiting me, 
but either way I am weary of this. There's no point in arguing with 
someone like you so I'm dropping out.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/19/2013 12:51:22 AM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-eXKw3Llc6Vw0@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > > > We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> > > > > done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> > > > > recall ever having wanted to.
> > > > 
> > > > once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.
> > > > 
> > > > you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
> > > > next day.
> > > > 
> > > > so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
> > > > you can do the same now.
> > > 
> > > Couldn't use the trash for storage becasue there was no trash.
> > 
> > exactly the point.
> 
> I've mentioned before that Apple puts the Trash folder(s) on their 
> computers for a reason. I have said that several times and you have 
> never addressed that point because you can't.

they put it there because people occasionally make a mistake.

they didn't put it there to store stuff indefinitely.

and i've addressed this many times, as have others. you refuse to
acknowledge that, and you are using the trash in a way other than how
it was intended and therefore are going to run into problems.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/19/2013 1:12:25 AM
On Sat, 19 Oct 2013 01:12:25 UTC, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> 
wrote:

> In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-eXKw3Llc6Vw0@localhost>, John Varela
> <newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> > > > > > We tossed paper tape into a trash basket when 
> > > > > > done. It was easy to retrieve had we wanted to, though I can't 
> > > > > > recall ever having wanted to.
> > > > > 
> > > > > once the janitor emptied the trash, you could no longer retrieve it.
> > > > > 
> > > > > you certainly didn't put it in the trash thinking it would be there the
> > > > > next day.
> > > > > 
> > > > > so just like i said, you weren't using the trash as storage then and
> > > > > you can do the same now.
> > > > 
> > > > Couldn't use the trash for storage becasue there was no trash.
> > > 
> > > exactly the point.
> > 
> > I've mentioned before that Apple puts the Trash folder(s) on their 
> > computers for a reason. I have said that several times and you have 
> > never addressed that point because you can't.
> 
> they put it there because people occasionally make a mistake.
> 
> they didn't put it there to store stuff indefinitely.
> 
> and i've addressed this many times, as have others. you refuse to
> acknowledge that, and you are using the trash in a way other than how
> it was intended and therefore are going to run into problems.

And Jim and I have said repeatedly that we are using it exactly as 
designed and not for storage. Learn to read for comprehension. Good 
day. Take the last word if you want it.

-- 
John Varela
0
newlamps (599)
10/19/2013 9:04:48 PM
In article <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-Z15tKde2XG0M@localhost>, John Varela
<newlamps@verizon.net> wrote:

> > > I've mentioned before that Apple puts the Trash folder(s) on their 
> > > computers for a reason. I have said that several times and you have 
> > > never addressed that point because you can't.
> > 
> > they put it there because people occasionally make a mistake.
> > 
> > they didn't put it there to store stuff indefinitely.
> > 
> > and i've addressed this many times, as have others. you refuse to
> > acknowledge that, and you are using the trash in a way other than how
> > it was intended and therefore are going to run into problems.
> 
> And Jim and I have said repeatedly that we are using it exactly as 
> designed and not for storage.

if you're not using it for storage, then there won't be any problem in
emptying it.

the fact that you don't want to empty it in order to keep some files
means you *are* using it for storage and contrary to how it was
designed and contrary to what you're saying you are doing.
0
nospam59 (11089)
10/20/2013 1:07:35 AM
Reply:

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