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Classic won't work with HP printer

A client of mine has a small ethernet network, using 1 iMac Flat-Panel and 2
eMacs. There's an Asante' hub to connect them and an HP 4050 TN printer.One
of the eMacs was bought maybe 6 months ago, and the other was bought about
10 days ago. The latest eMac won't print on the HP printer, although the
others will, whether in os x or classic.  These three are mostly used on a
proprietary program, DentalMac.

When I discovered the printing problem on the latest eMac, I tried printing
from SimpleText (in Classic). I get an error message "SimpleText is unable
to print this document. Please use the Chooser to select a printer."
I did that, selected LaserWriter 8, driver, selected the HP 4050 Series
printer, made sure AppleTalk was on, and tried again, same error message.

I called HP Tech Support, and was asked to check a variety of things,
including the Configuration page(s). I was advised to go to Extensions
Manager, set for base os 9.2.2 extensions, try again, same problem. Did also
Print & Fax setups in System Preferences to try to get it to print in OS X,
no dice.

I checked everything in the "About this Mac" info, to see if the 2 eMacs
differed. Couldn't find anything different in CPU, CPU speed, boot ROM
version, etc. I haven't yet tried just switching the 2 eMacs.

At that point, HP Technical Support pointed out that Classic "is not fully
supported by Hewlett-Packard. It is not a native operating system but a
virtual operating system running on top of Mac OS X (HP software is designed
and tested for native operating system....At this time, support offered for
Mac os 9 Classic is on a "best effort" basis..."

Does anyone have any suggestions?
Ed

0
kearnser (70)
3/4/2005 3:25:08 PM
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In article <BE4DE804.FCF4%kearnser@comcast.net>,
 Ed Kearns <kearnser@comcast.net> wrote:

> A client of mine has a small ethernet network, using 1 iMac Flat-Panel and 2
> eMacs. There's an Asante' hub to connect them and an HP 4050 TN printer.One
> of the eMacs was bought maybe 6 months ago, and the other was bought about
> 10 days ago. The latest eMac won't print on the HP printer, although the
> others will, whether in os x or classic.  These three are mostly used on a
> proprietary program, DentalMac.
> 
> When I discovered the printing problem on the latest eMac, I tried printing
> from SimpleText (in Classic). I get an error message "SimpleText is unable
> to print this document. Please use the Chooser to select a printer."
> I did that, selected LaserWriter 8, driver, selected the HP 4050 Series
> printer, made sure AppleTalk was on, and tried again, same error message.
> 
> I called HP Tech Support, and was asked to check a variety of things,
> including the Configuration page(s). I was advised to go to Extensions
> Manager, set for base os 9.2.2 extensions, try again, same problem. Did also
> Print & Fax setups in System Preferences to try to get it to print in OS X,
> no dice.
> 
> I checked everything in the "About this Mac" info, to see if the 2 eMacs
> differed. Couldn't find anything different in CPU, CPU speed, boot ROM
> version, etc. I haven't yet tried just switching the 2 eMacs.
> 
> At that point, HP Technical Support pointed out that Classic "is not fully
> supported by Hewlett-Packard. It is not a native operating system but a
> virtual operating system running on top of Mac OS X (HP software is designed
> and tested for native operating system....At this time, support offered for
> Mac os 9 Classic is on a "best effort" basis..."
> 
> Does anyone have any suggestions?
> Ed

Start complaining to the DentalMac support people that you're paying 
good money for a program that's running on an unsupported OS.  MacOS 9 
hasn't been updated in quite some time nor will it be.  Ask when they're 
releasing their MacOS X version.  You can even borrow my mother's black 
whip if you need it.

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...



0
vilain (1505)
3/5/2005 12:07:03 AM
On Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:25:08 -0500, Ed Kearns wrote
(in article <BE4DE804.FCF4%kearnser@comcast.net>):

> A client of mine has a small ethernet network, using 1 iMac Flat-Panel and 2
> eMacs. There's an Asante' hub to connect them and an HP 4050 TN printer.One
> of the eMacs was bought maybe 6 months ago, and the other was bought about
> 10 days ago. The latest eMac won't print on the HP printer, although the
> others will, whether in os x or classic.  These three are mostly used on a
> proprietary program, DentalMac.
> 
> When I discovered the printing problem on the latest eMac, I tried printing
> from SimpleText (in Classic). I get an error message "SimpleText is unable
> to print this document. Please use the Chooser to select a printer."
> I did that, selected LaserWriter 8, driver, selected the HP 4050 Series
> printer, made sure AppleTalk was on, and tried again, same error message.
> 
> I called HP Tech Support, and was asked to check a variety of things,
> including the Configuration page(s). I was advised to go to Extensions
> Manager, set for base os 9.2.2 extensions, try again, same problem. Did also
> Print & Fax setups in System Preferences to try to get it to print in OS X,
> no dice.
> 
> I checked everything in the "About this Mac" info, to see if the 2 eMacs
> differed. Couldn't find anything different in CPU, CPU speed, boot ROM
> version, etc. I haven't yet tried just switching the 2 eMacs.
> 
> At that point, HP Technical Support pointed out that Classic "is not fully
> supported by Hewlett-Packard. It is not a native operating system but a
> virtual operating system running on top of Mac OS X (HP software is designed
> and tested for native operating system....At this time, support offered for
> Mac os 9 Classic is on a "best effort" basis..."
> 
> Does anyone have any suggestions?
> Ed
> 

HP is talking out their ass. The problem is that HP's installer for their 
printer drivers for OS X stinks, and their installer for their printer 
drivers for OS 9 stinks worse.

I don't have that particular printer, but in the past other HP printers have 
been made to behave by:

1 installing the drivers under OS 9 (if possible) or Classic (if not)

2 getting the printer to work under OS X _first_. (This sometimes can be a 
chore... certain USB laser printers were a pain and a half to get to work 
right.)

3 get the now working under OS X printer to work under OS 9. Again, this can 
be a pain, particularly with the above-mentioned USB lasers. On some USB 
lasers, HP uses Apple's old Apple Printer Utility (last updated: 1998) to 
create a 'virtual printer'. This is Not Good, as this 'virtual printer' is a 
desktop printer, and OS X/Classic doesn't support OS 9 desktop printers. As 
Apple abandoned APU _years_ before OS X was released, it's really rather 
silly of HP to rely on it.

Now, you _can_ make the 'virtual printer' work under OS X/Classic, _if it is 
already installed_. _I_ have never been able to figure out how to install it 
under OS X/Classic, as APU dies a terrible agonised death every time I start 
it under Classic and I've long since given up even trying.

That said... you have a LJ4050. I _do_ hope that you don't have the USB 
version, 'cause if you do, I suspect that you're screwed. If you have the USB 
version, I'd get the Direct Jet thing and put the printer on Ethernet. You'll 
have no trouble at all then. If you have the network version, well, frankly, 
I'd need more data 'cause it should Just Work. Certainly HP printers attached 
via Ethernet Just Work around here. Plug 'em in, turn 'em on, install the 
PPD, print. No muss, no fuss. (As long as you stay away from the never to be 
sufficiently damned HP installers, that is. If you _do_ run HP's installers, 
be sure to run Disk Utility and repair permissions immediately afterwards, 
HP's installers _will_ screw up your permissions.)

-- 
We are Microsoft of Borg. You will be assimilated. Stability is irrelevant. 
Where _you_ want to go to today is irrelevant. We will add your currency to 
our own. Bend over right now. Resistance is futile.

0
charlesd (460)
3/5/2005 5:11:51 PM
You have to install the HP Driver from within OS9 and not just the 
Classic  mode.

Go to System Preference and set your computer to boot up into OS9.
Reboot, then install the HP driver in OS9.
Go to Control Panels and reset your computer to boot into OSX.
Reboot, then install the HP driver in OSX.
Now you should be able to print in either OS.

On 2005-03-04 07:25:08 -0800, Ed Kearns <kearnser@comcast.net> said:

> A client of mine has a small ethernet network, using 1 iMac Flat-Panel and 2
> eMacs. There's an Asante' hub to connect them and an HP 4050 TN printer.One
> of the eMacs was bought maybe 6 months ago, and the other was bought about
> 10 days ago. The latest eMac won't print on the HP printer, although the
> others will, whether in os x or classic.  These three are mostly used on a
> proprietary program, DentalMac.
> 
> When I discovered the printing problem on the latest eMac, I tried printing
> from SimpleText (in Classic). I get an error message "SimpleText is unable
> to print this document. Please use the Chooser to select a printer."
> I did that, selected LaserWriter 8, driver, selected the HP 4050 Series
> printer, made sure AppleTalk was on, and tried again, same error message.
> 
> I called HP Tech Support, and was asked to check a variety of things,
> including the Configuration page(s). I was advised to go to Extensions
> Manager, set for base os 9.2.2 extensions, try again, same problem. Did also
> Print & Fax setups in System Preferences to try to get it to print in OS X,
> no dice.
> 
> I checked everything in the "About this Mac" info, to see if the 2 eMacs
> differed. Couldn't find anything different in CPU, CPU speed, boot ROM
> version, etc. I haven't yet tried just switching the 2 eMacs.
> 
> At that point, HP Technical Support pointed out that Classic "is not fully
> supported by Hewlett-Packard. It is not a native operating system but a
> virtual operating system running on top of Mac OS X (HP software is designed
> and tested for native operating system....At this time, support offered for
> Mac os 9 Classic is on a "best effort" basis..."
> 
> Does anyone have any suggestions?
> Ed


0
none37 (30)
3/6/2005 3:47:50 AM
Charles Dyer <charlesd@newsguy.com> wrote:

> Incorrect. Classic prints... if you install the drivers.

_And_ if the OS 9 drivers work in Classic.  Unfortunately, not all do.
For example, I have to clients who bought HP PSC 1350 all-in-one units
(without consulting me first, of course) to use with tray-loading and
slot-loading iMacs running OS 9.2.2 and Panther.  Both print without
problem when booted in OS 9 but when attempting to print in Classic
they're informed that Classic printing only works on a network.

-- 
Mike Rosenberg
<http://www.macconsult.com> Macintosh consulting services for NE Florida
<http://bogart-tribute.net> Tribute to Humphrey Bogart
Toyota Prius fans: Check out alt.autos.toyota.prius
0
mike2 (2270)
3/6/2005 3:08:03 PM
On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 10:08:03 -0500, Mike Rosenberg wrote
(in article <1gszylh.5j84r21ynye28N%mike@POSTTOGROUP.invalid>):

> Charles Dyer <charlesd@newsguy.com> wrote:
> 
>> Incorrect. Classic prints... if you install the drivers.
> 
> _And_ if the OS 9 drivers work in Classic.  Unfortunately, not all do.
> For example, I have to clients who bought HP PSC 1350 all-in-one units
> (without consulting me first, of course) to use with tray-loading and
> slot-loading iMacs running OS 9.2.2 and Panther.  Both print without
> problem when booted in OS 9 but when attempting to print in Classic
> they're informed that Classic printing only works on a network.
> 
> 

Hmmm... I had a 1350 handy and tried it out. Around here, attempting to print 
to the 1350 gets as far as Print Monitor launching. PM then freezes solid. 
The only way out is to force-quit PM and delete by hand the spool file from 
the PM folder, as if you _don't_ do that PM launches, and freezes, again the 
next time Classic is opened.

HP's drivers are worse than I'd thought.

-- 
We are Microsoft of Borg. You will be assimilated. Stability is irrelevant. 
Where _you_ want to go to today is irrelevant. We will add your currency to 
our own. Bend over right now. Resistance is futile.

0
charlesd (460)
3/6/2005 5:50:22 PM
Charles Dyer <charlesd@newsguy.com> wrote:

> Hmmm... I had a 1350 handy and tried it out.

Wow, that's way too convenient!  :-)

> Around here, attempting to print to the 1350 gets as far as Print Monitor
> launching. PM then freezes solid. The only way out is to force-quit PM and
> delete by hand the spool file from the PM folder, as if you _don't_ do
> that PM launches, and freezes, again the next time Classic is opened.

Yes, I've seen that happen, too.

-- 
Mike Rosenberg
<http://www.macconsult.com> Macintosh consulting services for NE Florida
<http://bogart-tribute.net> Tribute to Humphrey Bogart
Toyota Prius fans: Check out alt.autos.toyota.prius
0
mike2 (2270)
3/6/2005 7:31:05 PM
On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 14:31:05 -0500, Mike Rosenberg wrote
(in article <1gt0a8l.bagkfl2ot0hbN%mike@POSTTOGROUP.invalid>):

> Charles Dyer <charlesd@newsguy.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hmmm... I had a 1350 handy and tried it out.
> 
> Wow, that's way too convenient!  :-)

Apple was pushing them hard. The price after rebate was _less_ than the cost 
of replacement ink cartridges.

They are, of course, worth every penny.

it could be worse. They could be Lexmark Z23s. Those things don't even make 
good doorstops, they're too light and flimsy.

> 
>> Around here, attempting to print to the 1350 gets as far as Print Monitor
>> launching. PM then freezes solid. The only way out is to force-quit PM and
>> delete by hand the spool file from the PM folder, as if you _don't_ do
>> that PM launches, and freezes, again the next time Classic is opened.
> 
> Yes, I've seen that happen, too.
> 
> 



-- 
We are Microsoft of Borg. You will be assimilated. Stability is irrelevant. 
Where _you_ want to go to today is irrelevant. We will add your currency to 
our own. Bend over right now. Resistance is futile.

0
charlesd (460)
3/6/2005 8:30:34 PM
in article 2005030519475016807%none@attbicom, MS at none@attbi.com wrote on
3/5/05 10:47 PM:
However, that won't work, if you have the later Macs that are not bootable
except in os x.
Ed

> You have to install the HP Driver from within OS9 and not just the
> Classic  mode.
> 
> Go to System Preference and set your computer to boot up into OS9.
> Reboot, then install the HP driver in OS9.
> Go to Control Panels and reset your computer to boot into OSX.
> Reboot, then install the HP driver in OSX.
> Now you should be able to print in either OS.
> 
> On 2005-03-04 07:25:08 -0800, Ed Kearns <kearnser@comcast.net> said:
> 
>> A client of mine has a small ethernet network, using 1 iMac Flat-Panel and 2
>> eMacs. There's an Asante' hub to connect them and an HP 4050 TN printer.One
>> of the eMacs was bought maybe 6 months ago, and the other was bought about
>> 10 days ago. The latest eMac won't print on the HP printer, although the
>> others will, whether in os x or classic.  These three are mostly used on a
>> proprietary program, DentalMac.
>> 
>> When I discovered the printing problem on the latest eMac, I tried printing
>> from SimpleText (in Classic). I get an error message "SimpleText is unable
>> to print this document. Please use the Chooser to select a printer."
>> I did that, selected LaserWriter 8, driver, selected the HP 4050 Series
>> printer, made sure AppleTalk was on, and tried again, same error message.
>> 
>> I called HP Tech Support, and was asked to check a variety of things,
>> including the Configuration page(s). I was advised to go to Extensions
>> Manager, set for base os 9.2.2 extensions, try again, same problem. Did also
>> Print & Fax setups in System Preferences to try to get it to print in OS X,
>> no dice.
>> 
>> I checked everything in the "About this Mac" info, to see if the 2 eMacs
>> differed. Couldn't find anything different in CPU, CPU speed, boot ROM
>> version, etc. I haven't yet tried just switching the 2 eMacs.
>> 
>> At that point, HP Technical Support pointed out that Classic "is not fully
>> supported by Hewlett-Packard. It is not a native operating system but a
>> virtual operating system running on top of Mac OS X (HP software is designed
>> and tested for native operating system....At this time, support offered for
>> Mac os 9 Classic is on a "best effort" basis..."
>> 
>> Does anyone have any suggestions?
>> Ed
> 
> 

0
kearnser (70)
3/6/2005 10:43:35 PM
On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 17:43:35 -0500, Ed Kearns wrote
(in article <BE50F1C7.FF36%kearnser@comcast.net>):

> However, that won't work, if you have the later Macs that are not bootable
> except in os x.
> Ed
> 
>> You have to install the HP Driver from within OS9 and not just the
>> Classic  mode.
>> 
>> Go to System Preference and set your computer to boot up into OS9.
>> Reboot, then install the HP driver in OS9.
>> Go to Control Panels and reset your computer to boot into OSX.
>> Reboot, then install the HP driver in OSX.
>> Now you should be able to print in either OS.

1 please, please, please, don't top-post.

2 it's hardly Apple's problem if HP does something silly with their printer 
drivers and/or their printer driver installers. We've been over this ground 
before, with other printers, with scanners, with some other hardware. The 
answer then was simple: vote with your wallet and don't buy certain 
equipment.

3 it's hardly Apple's problem if some other vendor doesn't want to support 
their app any more and doesn't supply an OS X version. The answer then was as 
above: don't buy certain software.

Now, if you _must_ run software which demands OS 9, by definition you're not 
going to be able to buy new equipment to run it on. Just as you can't buy new 
equipment which demands OS 8, or OS 7, or OS 6... You _can_ get second-hand 
equipment which runs those OSes.

-- 
We are Microsoft of Borg. You will be assimilated. Stability is irrelevant. 
Where _you_ want to go to today is irrelevant. We will add your currency to 
our own. Bend over right now. Resistance is futile.

0
charlesd (460)
3/6/2005 11:14:54 PM
Reply: