Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
music stations on the Internet?

The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
speaker or speakers in the other room.

Robert

In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
> music stations on the Internet?
> 
> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
> speaker or speakers in the other room.
> 
> Robert

if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
ApE box and your stereo will play it.

You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
the Mac.  Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
wire.  If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.  If you use a iMic USB 
device, it will drive regular headphones.  It just won't be very loud.

Go with the ApE box ($99) and your stereo (or a boombox with the right 
cables).

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically by ignored]

In article <vilain-E0BD01.00542508092009@individual.net>,
 Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.

That would be Airport Express, not AP Extreme.

-- Michelle

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Using two Airport Expresses [Expressi ;-) ], one hooked to the den's
stereo system, one in the living room to a small Sony 2-speaker
desktop size box with an iPhone dock.  Routing through iTunes to both
works great.
Richard

Michael Vilain wrote:
> In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
>> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
>> music stations on the Internet?
>>
>> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
>> speaker or speakers in the other room.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
> Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
> ApE box and your stereo will play it.
> 
> You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
> the Mac.  Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
> wire.  If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
> of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.  If you use a iMic USB 
> device, it will drive regular headphones.  It just won't be very loud.
> 
> Go with the ApE box ($99) and your stereo (or a boombox with the right 
> cables).

Thanks, people. Your idea sounds good, but I don't think it'll work.

I'm a subscriber to live365.com (http://www.live365.com) � because it 
has a lot of radio stations.

It claims to have 6,000 Internet radio stations, while Itunes has only a 
paltry selection of a few dozen.

The Apple site 
(http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/features/airtunes.html) says that 
Airport Express works with Itunes. It doesn't say it works with live365.com.

Robert

In article <cHtpm.44180$PH1.2500@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

>nk it'll work.
> 
> I'm a subscriber to live365.com (http://www.live365.com) � because it 
> has a lot of radio stations.
> 
> It claims to have 6,000 Internet radio stations, while Itunes has only a 
> paltry selection of a few dozen.
> 
> The Apple site 
> (http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/features/airtunes.html) says that 
> Airport Express works with Itunes. It doesn't say it works with live365.com.
> 
> Robert
  Would Airfoil work with your set-up through the AE? 
http://rogueamoeba.com/airfoil/mac/

-- 
Searching is half the fun: life is much more manageable when thought
of as a scavenger hunt as opposed to a surprise party. 
Jimmy Buffett 

In article <cHtpm.44180$PH1.2500@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> The Apple site 
> (http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/features/airtunes.html) says that 
> Airport Express works with Itunes. It doesn't say it works with live365.com.

iTunes is a software application; live365.com is a web site.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <vilain-E0BD01.00542508092009@individual.net>,
 Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 

You meant "Airport Express"?

In article <cHtpm.44180$PH1.2500@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> writes:
>Michael Vilain wrote:
>> In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
>>> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
>>> music stations on the Internet?
>>>
>>> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
>>> speaker or speakers in the other room.
>>>
>>> Robert
>> 
>> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
>> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
>> Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
>> ApE box and your stereo will play it.
>> 
>> You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
>> the Mac.  Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
>> wire.  If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
>> of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.  If you use a iMic USB 
>> device, it will drive regular headphones.  It just won't be very loud.
>> 
>> Go with the ApE box ($99) and your stereo (or a boombox with the right 
>> cables).
>
>Thanks, people. Your idea sounds good, but I don't think it'll work.
>
>I'm a subscriber to live365.com (http://www.live365.com) � because it 
>has a lot of radio stations.
>
>It claims to have 6,000 Internet radio stations, while Itunes has only a 
>paltry selection of a few dozen.

Why?  Can't you type a URL into the iTunes->Advanced>Open Audio Stream
URL textbox?

Being affiliated with one of the first stations listed in iTunes 1.0,
I see no advantage to paying for or subscribing to live365.

-- 
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

  http://www.quirkfactory.com/popart/asskey/eqn2.png
  
  "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"

In article <vilain-E0BD01.00542508092009@individual.net>,
 Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:

> In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> > Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
> > another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
> > music stations on the Internet?
> > 
> > The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
> > speaker or speakers in the other room.
> > 
> > Robert
> 
> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
> Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
> ApE box and your stereo will play it.
> 
> You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
> the Mac.

You'll need to use powered speakers, or some sort of amplifier. The 
Mac's output is sufficient for headphones, but not for loudspeakers.

> Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
> wire.

That is true, but it is insignifiant.

> If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
> of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.

That cannot happen. The (inconsequentially greater) voltage drop will 
not cause more current to be drawn; just the opposite.

If you use an amplifier and place it in the other room, you may have a 
problem with a "ground loop", which will cause hum to show up in the 
audio. That can be resolved by using some sort of isolation transformers 
in the audio lines. I don't have any sources, but a bit of googling 
should point you in the right direction.

If you put the amplifier adjacent to the Mac and run long wires to the 
speakers, that cannot happen.

Isaac

On 9/8/09 9:51 AM, in article
michelle-77BF0F.07515008092009@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <cHtpm.44180$PH1.2500@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> The Apple site 
>> (http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/features/airtunes.html) says that
>> Airport Express works with Itunes. It doesn't say it works with live365.com.
> 
> iTunes is a software application; live365.com is a web site.

And, the part about "a few dozen" stations available via iTunes is
questionable. Hell, the 'Talk and Spoken Word" section alone has to have
more than I can count because I have to scroll on my 24" monitor to get to
the end.

Michael Vilain wrote:
> In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
>> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
>> music stations on the Internet?
>>
>> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
>> speaker or speakers in the other room.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo. 

Would it plug into the stereo's Mic or Phones outlet?

> The 
> Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
> ApE box and your stereo will play it.
> 
> You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
> the Mac.  Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
> wire.  If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
> of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.  If you use a iMic USB 
> device, it will drive regular headphones.  It just won't be very loud.
> 
> Go with the ApE box ($99) and your stereo (or a boombox with the right 
> cables).

In article <WOOpm.44304$PH1.28328@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Michael Vilain wrote:

[...]

> > if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> > box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo. 
> 
> Would it plug into the stereo's Mic or Phones outlet?

Into its aux inlet.

Notes:
- Michael (must have) meant the AirportExpress
- if you would run a cable from the Mac's sound out to the stereo, *all* 
your Mac's sound will go there, including system beeps, etc.
- out of the box only iTunes can stream to an AirportExpress, and the 
AirportExpress can only handle Apple's favorite codecs. OGGs won't work, 
for example -- the third-party app Airfoil let's you send the sound of 
any app to the AirportExpress. (I've never used it myself though. iTunes 
is good enough for me.)

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

In article <user-4351F1.00570810092009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
 Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:

>k, 
> for example -- the third-party app Airfoil let's you send the sound of 
> any app to the AirportExpress. (I've never used it myself though. iTunes 
> is good enough for me.)

    Love Airfoil for the stuff iTunes can't. For example Deep Tracks 
from Sirius or my John Hiatt station from Pandora (or my Christmas 
station when the time comes) all go to the B&O stereo for better quality 
than from the speakers. I also can get them on the deck or down in the 
basement should I desire.

-- 
Searching is half the fun: life is much more manageable when thought
of as a scavenger hunt as opposed to a surprise party. 
Jimmy Buffett 

In article <user-4351F1.00570810092009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
 Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:

> In article <WOOpm.44304$PH1.28328@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> > Michael Vilain wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> > > if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
> > > box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo. 
> > 
> > Would it plug into the stereo's Mic or Phones outlet?
> 
> Into its aux inlet.
> 
> Notes:
> - Michael (must have) meant the AirportExpress
> - if you would run a cable from the Mac's sound out to the stereo, *all* 
> your Mac's sound will go there, including system beeps, etc.
> - out of the box only iTunes can stream to an AirportExpress, and the 
> AirportExpress can only handle Apple's favorite codecs. OGGs won't work, 
> for example -- the third-party app Airfoil let's you send the sound of 
> any app to the AirportExpress. (I've never used it myself though. iTunes 
> is good enough for me.)

I'm coming to this thread late, but I have a RocketFM gizmo - a USB FM 
Transmitter. You can find them on eBay. It is discontinued (by Griffin, 
I believe) and the driver for Leopard and Snow Leopard may not be on 
their web site, but if you contact them they will send it to you. 
Getting it in the right position and the volume controls is a bit 
fiddly, but once it's working, it works really well...

-- 

"If you can, tell me something happy."
- Marybones

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <WOOpm.44304$PH1.28328@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <WOOpm.44304$PH1.28328@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Michael Vilain wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>>> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
>>> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo. 

> 
> Into its aux inlet.
> 
> Notes:
> - Michael (must have) meant the AirportExpress
> - if you would run a cable from the Mac's sound out to the stereo, *all* 
> your Mac's sound will go there, including system beeps, etc.
> - out of the box only iTunes can stream to an AirportExpress, and the 
> AirportExpress can only handle Apple's favorite codecs. OGGs won't work, 
> for example -- the third-party app Airfoil let's you send the sound of 
> any app to the AirportExpress. (I've never used it myself though. iTunes 
> is good enough for me.)
> 

> >> Would it plug into the stereo's Mic or Phones outlet?
> Into its aux inlet.

It doesn't have an aux inlet. It only has a "Phones" inlet, which 
doesn't work when the Airport Express cable is plugged into it. (I have 
a Curtis Multifunction LCD Display mini stereo.)

So I shopped for powered speakers. I found a nice set for $40 (Altec 
Lansing VS2620) but the salesman said it's for computers - not steros, 
so I didn't buy them.

I just shopped for a powered speaker. Can anyone recommend a cheap set 
for less than $75

Robert

VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
> In article <cHtpm.44180$PH1.2500@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> writes:
>> Michael Vilain wrote:
>>> In article <u2mpm.44176$PH1.15294@edtnps82>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
>>>> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
>>>> music stations on the Internet?
>>>>
>>>> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
>>>> speaker or speakers in the other room.
>>>>
>>>> Robert
>>> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
>>> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
>>> Mac will broadcast whatever iTunes is playing through "Airtunes" to the 
>>> ApE box and your stereo will play it.
>>>
>>> You may have problems driving speakers with the right impedance through 
>>> the Mac.  Voltage does drop with distance due to the resistance in the 
>>> wire.  If it pulls to much current to drive the speakers through 40 ft. 
>>> of wire, you could have a problem with the Mac.  If you use a iMic USB 
>>> device, it will drive regular headphones.  It just won't be very loud.
>>>
>>> Go with the ApE box ($99) and your stereo (or a boombox with the right 
>>> cables).
>> Thanks, people. Your idea sounds good, but I don't think it'll work.
>>
>> I'm a subscriber to live365.com (http://www.live365.com) � because it 
>> has a lot of radio stations.
>>
>> It claims to have 6,000 Internet radio stations, while Itunes has only a 
>> paltry selection of a few dozen.
> 
> Why?  Can't you type a URL into the iTunes->Advanced>Open Audio Stream
> URL textbox?
> 
> Being affiliated with one of the first stations listed in iTunes 1.0,
> I see no advantage to paying for or subscribing to live365.

Thanks. I hadn't realized that there are so many stations on Itunes. I 
cancelled my subscription to live365 and have switched back to Itunes, 
which seems to be just as good.

Robert

AES wrote:
> In article <vilain-E0BD01.00542508092009@individual.net>,
>  Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> wrote:
> 
>> if your iMac has a wireless connection, you can buy an Airport Extreme 
>> box, configure it to use Airtunes, and plug it into your stereo.  The 
> 
> You meant "Airport Express"?

I don't think I need Extreme because the salesman who sold me Express 
today didn't tell me I need Extreme.

Robert

Richard Hix wrote:
> Using two Airport Expresses [Expressi ;-) ], one hooked to the den's
> stereo system, one in the living room to a small Sony 2-speaker
> desktop size box with an iPhone dock.  Routing through iTunes to both
> works great.
> Richard

I wonder why the Express brochure shows in the illustration for the 
setup of the:

"Existing Wireless Network and Stream Music to Your Home Stereo" with an 
Airport Extreme Base Station attached to the computer's Ethernet port 
and broadcasting signals to the Airport Express.

And there's no illustration in the brochure that shows the setup with an 
Iphone dock.

Also, I just bought two Altec powered speakers but they won't hook into 
my Curtis mini stereo, so I have to return them to a store and buy a new 
stereo instead.

This is so confusing and frustrating. I should have known it would be 
like this.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Richard Hix wrote:
>> Using two Airport Expresses [Expressi ;-) ], one hooked to the den's
>> stereo system, one in the living room to a small Sony 2-speaker
>> desktop size box with an iPhone dock.  Routing through iTunes to both
>> works great.
>> Richard
> 
> I wonder why the Express brochure shows in the illustration for the 
> setup of the:
> 
> "Existing Wireless Network and Stream Music to Your Home Stereo" with an 
> Airport Extreme Base Station attached to the computer's Ethernet port 
> and broadcasting signals to the Airport Express.
> 
> And there's no illustration in the brochure that shows the setup with an 
> Iphone dock.
> 
> Also, I just bought two Altec powered speakers but they won't hook into 
> my Curtis mini stereo, so I have to return them to a store and buy a new 
> stereo instead.
> 
> This is so confusing and frustrating. I should have known it would be 
> like this.
> 
> Robert

Okay; I got it, finally. Thanks.

Robert

In article <0JEsm.45551$PH1.15422@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[... something to hook an AirportExpress' audio out to]

> So I shopped for powered speakers. I found a nice set for $40 (Altec 
> Lansing VS2620) but the salesman said it's for computers - not steros, 

"Powered speakers", are boxes containing both an amp and speaker. So, 
yes, those cannot be connected to yet another amp. But that's exactly 
the point of "powerd speakers" -- to not also need a separate amp. So I 
don't understand why you're looking for powered speakers if you want to 
hook them up to your amp... Makes no sense.

You want either an amp and speakers, each in a separate box, or you want 
an amp and speakers both in the same box.

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Would it be feasible to string a cord from my late 2006 Imac into 
> another room, where one or more speakers would play music broadcast by 
> music stations on the Internet?
> 
> The distance would be about 40 feet from the computer in one room to the 
> speaker or speakers in the other room.
> 
> Robert

I set up a network that works � but only sometimes.

I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed it in 
my dining room.

I got them to link wirelessly to my Imac, which is in my office.

But sometimes when I switch the speakers, on there's no sound of music, 
or the music suddenly stops.

So then I go to the Imac, and click on the Itunes icon, and then click 
in the lower, right corner of the Itunes screen, where it says, 
"Multiple Speakers (2)".

Then a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's firewall settings 
prevent you from using Itunes".

So I click in that window in the "Open Firewall Settings". But I don't 
know what to alter there.

So I go back to Itunes, where I click in the lower, right corner of the 
window on "Multiple Speakers (2)".

Then a popup window shows that "Computer" is unchecked and "Base Station 
08c999" is checked, so I put a check mark beside "Computer" and then the 
music emanates from both the computer and the speakers.

Robert

In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[...]

> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed it in 
> my dining room.

Congrats :)

> I got them to link wirelessly to my Imac, which is in my office.
> 
> But sometimes when I switch the speakers, on there's no sound of music, 
> or the music suddenly stops.
> 
> So then I go to the Imac, and click on the Itunes icon, and then click 
> in the lower, right corner of the Itunes screen, where it says, 
> "Multiple Speakers (2)".
> 
> Then a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> prevent you from using Itunes".

Some version of iTunes (or Mac OS X?) introduced that bug. AFAIK it has 
been fixed. I certainly haven't seen it happen in ages (iTunes 8.2.1 
under 10.5.8), but it is possible that I only achieved that by tinkering 
with "something"...

Shouldn't be too hard to find discussion of that bug through a search 
engine. And it shouldn't be too hard to ensure that your OS and iTunes 
versions are up to date ;)

> So I click in that window in the "Open Firewall Settings". But I don't 
> know what to alter there.

Nor does anyone else, if you don't say what your settings are :) Still, 
my bet is on that bug, not your firewall settings (if the firewall would 
be blocking AirTunes, it would be doing that all the time, not now and 
then).

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed it in 
>> my dining room.
> 
> Congrats :)
> 
>> I got them to link wirelessly to my Imac, which is in my office.
>>
>> But sometimes when I switch the speakers, on there's no sound of music, 
>> or the music suddenly stops.
>>
>> So then I go to the Imac, and click on the Itunes icon, and then click 
>> in the lower, right corner of the Itunes screen, where it says, 
>> "Multiple Speakers (2)".
>>
>> Then a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's firewall settings 
>> prevent you from using Itunes".
> 
> Some version of iTunes (or Mac OS X?) introduced that bug. AFAIK it has 
> been fixed. I certainly haven't seen it happen in ages (iTunes 8.2.1 
> under 10.5.8), but it is possible that I only achieved that by tinkering 
> with "something"...
> 
> Shouldn't be too hard to find discussion of that bug through a search 
> engine. And it shouldn't be too hard to ensure that your OS and iTunes 
> versions are up to date ;)
> 
>> So I click in that window in the "Open Firewall Settings". But I don't 
>> know what to alter there.
> 
> Nor does anyone else, if you don't say what your settings are :) Still, 
> my bet is on that bug, not your firewall settings (if the firewall would 
> be blocking AirTunes, it would be doing that all the time, not now and 
> then).

Thanks, Sander.

I found this page:

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066

with this hint:

"Aha. Just solved my own problem. Turned out the problem was my main 
wireless router (Netgear), which creates the wireless network that the 
Airport Express then joins. The netgear's firewall was blocking ports 
5000 & 6000. I created a custom service (under Port Forwarding/Port 
Triggering, then Add Custom Service) which I gave ports 5000-6000, UDP 
mode, and pointed it at the Airport Express's IP address."

On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port Forwarding" with the 
computer's Help search engine but there's nothing.

So I don't know how to do this.

My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your connection 
from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > Airport." Sharing > 
Options is set to "Automatic".

Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.

Under Sharing > Services, nothing has a checkmark beside it.

I updated Itunes yesterday to the latest version.

OS is 10.4.11.

Robert

In article <dDVzm.47407$Db2.6789@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> > [...]
> > 
> >> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed it in 
> >> my dining room.
> >> [... sometimes] a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> >> prevent you from using Itunes".

[...]

> <http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066>
> [...] On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port Forwarding" with the 
> computer's Help search engine but there's nothing.

Forget that. I see no reason to expect your problem to have anything to 
do with port forwarding at all.

You haven't told us how you have configured your Airport Express. Is it 
only doing AirTunes? Or are you also letting it be a wireless access 
point, router, dhcp server, or whatever?

> My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your connection 
> from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > Airport." Sharing > 
> Options is set to "Automatic".

Irrelevant.

> Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.

Select that one, and hit the "Advanced..." button. IIRC, you need to 
make sure that "Block UDP Traffic" and "Stealth mode" or not checked.

(Only relevant if your Firewall is on. But you shouldn't have it off 
anyway, so...)

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <dDVzm.47407$Db2.6789@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed it in 
>>>> my dining room.
>>>> [... sometimes] a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's firewall settings 
>>>> prevent you from using Itunes".
> 
> [...]
> 
>> <http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066>
>> [...] On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port Forwarding" with the 
>> computer's Help search engine but there's nothing.
> 
> Forget that. I see no reason to expect your problem to have anything to 
> do with port forwarding at all.
> 
> You haven't told us how you have configured your Airport Express. 

Sorry, Sander. I thought I had written the relevant settings, below.

> Is it 
> only doing AirTunes? Or are you also letting it be a wireless access 
> point, router, dhcp server, or whatever?

I don't know. How can I determine that? Thanks.

Every day I have to fiddle around with the settings to get the music to 
emanate again from the Express box and I have to keep walking between 
the two rooms to hear if the music working on the Express box, and 
usually it's not. Usually the music comes from the computer, but not the 
Express.

>> My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your connection 
>> from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > Airport." Sharing > 
>> Options is set to "Automatic".
> 
> Irrelevant.
> 
>> Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.
> 
> Select that one, and hit the "Advanced..." button. IIRC, you need to 
> make sure that "Block UDP Traffic" and "Stealth mode" or not checked.
> 
> (Only relevant if your Firewall is on. But you shouldn't have it off 
> anyway, so...)

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
>> In article <dDVzm.47407$Db2.6789@edtnps83>,
>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>>> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed 
>>>>> it in my dining room.
>>>>> [... sometimes] a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's 
>>>>> firewall settings prevent you from using Itunes".
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> <http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066>
>>> [...] On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port Forwarding" 
>>> with the computer's Help search engine but there's nothing.
>>
>> Forget that. I see no reason to expect your problem to have anything 
>> to do with port forwarding at all.
>>
>> You haven't told us how you have configured your Airport Express. 
> 
> Sorry, Sander. I thought I had written the relevant settings, below.
> 
>> Is it only doing AirTunes? Or are you also letting it be a wireless 
>> access point, router, dhcp server, or whatever?
> 
> I don't know. How can I determine that? Thanks.
> 
> Every day I have to fiddle around with the settings to get the music to 
> emanate again from the Express box and I have to keep walking between 
> the two rooms to hear if the music working on the Express box, and 
> usually it's not. Usually the music comes from the computer, but not the 
> Express.
> 
>>> My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your 
>>> connection from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > 
>>> Airport." Sharing > Options is set to "Automatic".
>>
>> Irrelevant.
>>
>>> Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.
>>
>> Select that one, and hit the "Advanced..." button. IIRC, you need to 
>> make sure that "Block UDP Traffic" and "Stealth mode" or not checked.

It's already set up like that.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
>>> In article <dDVzm.47407$Db2.6789@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
>>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>>
>>>>>> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and installed 
>>>>>> it in my dining room.
>>>>>> [... sometimes] a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's 
>>>>>> firewall settings prevent you from using Itunes".
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> <http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066>
>>>> [...] On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port Forwarding" 
>>>> with the computer's Help search engine but there's nothing.
>>>
>>> Forget that. I see no reason to expect your problem to have anything 
>>> to do with port forwarding at all.
>>>
>>> You haven't told us how you have configured your Airport Express. 
>>
>> Sorry, Sander. I thought I had written the relevant settings, below.
>>
>>> Is it only doing AirTunes? Or are you also letting it be a wireless 
>>> access point, router, dhcp server, or whatever?
>>
>> I don't know. How can I determine that? Thanks.
>>
>> Every day I have to fiddle around with the settings to get the music 
>> to emanate again from the Express box and I have to keep walking 
>> between the two rooms to hear if the music working on the Express box, 
>> and usually it's not. Usually the music comes from the computer, but 
>> not the Express.
>>
>>>> My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your 
>>>> connection from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > 
>>>> Airport." Sharing > Options is set to "Automatic".
>>>
>>> Irrelevant.
>>>
>>>> Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.
>>>
>>> Select that one, and hit the "Advanced..." button. IIRC, you need to 
>>> make sure that "Block UDP Traffic" and "Stealth mode" or not checked.
> 
> It's already set up like that.
> 
> Robert

Now when I open Airport Utility, a message says, "Airport was unable to 
find any Apple wireless devices. Make sure the wireless device you want 
to use i8 plugged in and within range of your computer and click rescan 
to try again."

I pressed "Rescan" multiple times, but the network isn't found. The 
Manual Setup rectangle is gray. Everything under Base Station and 
Settings pop-down menus is gray.

In the upper, right corner of my screen the airport logo is black and 
and I can scroll down to my network name and the name is checked, but in 
Itunes, in the lower, right pop-up window, where it says Multiple 
Speakers, the popup says Computer with a check mark beside it, but 
there's no more Base Station 08c999 listed.

The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
restarted the computer.

I also downloaded the latest Airport Utility from the Apple site (v. 
5.4.2) and used it, as well as Airport Disk Utility and Internet Connect.

I also called my ISP and got the tech to help me to change the name of 
my network and restart the router to reset the name of the network and 
disable WEP encryption, but still I can't get music to play on the 
Airport Express now.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>> Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
>>>> In article <dDVzm.47407$Db2.6789@edtnps83>,
>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> In article <3vpym.46674$Db2.6940@edtnps83>,
>>>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I bought an Airport Express and and powered speakers and 
>>>>>>> installed it in my dining room.
>>>>>>> [... sometimes] a message pops up, saying, "Your computer's 
>>>>>>> firewall settings prevent you from using Itunes".
>>>>
>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>>> <http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1788066>
>>>>> [...] On my Imac I looked up "Port Forwarding" and "Port 
>>>>> Forwarding" with the computer's Help search engine but there's 
>>>>> nothing.
>>>>
>>>> Forget that. I see no reason to expect your problem to have anything 
>>>> to do with port forwarding at all.
>>>>
>>>> You haven't told us how you have configured your Airport Express. 
>>>
>>> Sorry, Sander. I thought I had written the relevant settings, below.
>>>
>>>> Is it only doing AirTunes? Or are you also letting it be a wireless 
>>>> access point, router, dhcp server, or whatever?
>>>
>>> I don't know. How can I determine that? Thanks.
>>>
>>> Every day I have to fiddle around with the settings to get the music 
>>> to emanate again from the Express box and I have to keep walking 
>>> between the two rooms to hear if the music working on the Express 
>>> box, and usually it's not. Usually the music comes from the computer, 
>>> but not the Express.
>>>
>>>>> My Sharing control panel > Internet settings say "Share your 
>>>>> connection from > Built-in Ethernet" and "To computers using > 
>>>>> Airport." Sharing > Options is set to "Automatic".
>>>>
>>>> Irrelevant.
>>>>
>>>>> Under Sharing > Firewall > Allow, "Itunes Music Sharing" is checked.
>>>>
>>>> Select that one, and hit the "Advanced..." button. IIRC, you need to 
>>>> make sure that "Block UDP Traffic" and "Stealth mode" or not checked.
>>
>> It's already set up like that.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Now when I open Airport Utility, a message says, "Airport was unable to 
> find any Apple wireless devices. Make sure the wireless device you want 
> to use i8 plugged in and within range of your computer and click rescan 
> to try again."
> 
> I pressed "Rescan" multiple times, but the network isn't found. The 
> Manual Setup rectangle is gray. Everything under Base Station and 
> Settings pop-down menus is gray.
> 
> In the upper, right corner of my screen the airport logo is black and 
> and I can scroll down to my network name and the name is checked, but in 
> Itunes, in the lower, right pop-up window, where it says Multiple 
> Speakers, the popup says Computer with a check mark beside it, but 
> there's no more Base Station 08c999 listed.
> 
> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
> restarted the computer.
> 
> I also downloaded the latest Airport Utility from the Apple site (v. 
> 5.4.2) and used it, as well as Airport Disk Utility and Internet Connect.
> 
> I also called my ISP and got the tech to help me to change the name of 
> my network and restart the router to reset the name of the network and 
> disable WEP encryption, but still I can't get music to play on the 
> Airport Express now.
> 
> Robert

I wonder if my Network control panel is at fault. It shows two 
Locations: Automatic and Location 31/05/07 2:16 PM. It's set to the 
latter – not to Automatic.

Robert

In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[...]

> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
> restarted the computer.

A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure out 
what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if things 
still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a problem 
with your Mac or iTunes.

Do this:
- reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its reset 
button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
something like that -- see the manual)
- let it start up
- if you get a steady green light, you're done

If not, come back here again ;)


[*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
>> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
>> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
>> restarted the computer.
> 
> A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure out 
> what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if things 
> still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a problem 
> with your Mac or iTunes.
> 
> Do this:
> - reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its reset 
> button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
> something like that -- see the manual)
> - let it start up
> - if you get a steady green light, you're done
> 
> If not, come back here again ;)

Thanks much Sander!

I forgot to mention that I tried that unfolded paper clip trick last 
evening, after I searched with a search engine for the error message 
that Itunes kept giving me. But the paper clip procedure didn't work.

I even unplugged the Express sticking in the paper clip. After I plugged 
it in again, it flashed green rapidly for a few seconds. It doesn't 
normally do that, so I assume that the settings were reset to the 
defaults.  Then the light went back to steady amber for a few minutes, 
and then went back to slowly flashing yellow.
> 
> 
> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
> you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
> wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)

I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that the 
Imac uses to connect to the Net.

Robert

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
>> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
>> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
>> restarted the computer.
> 
> A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure out 
> what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if things 
> still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a problem 
> with your Mac or iTunes.
> 
> Do this:
> - reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its reset 
> button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
> something like that -- see the manual)
> - let it start up
> - if you get a steady green light, you're done
> 
> If not, come back here again ;)
> 
> 
> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
> you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
> wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)

Could the problem be that Appletalk for Airport is deactivated?

I just noticed in System Preferences > Network > Show: Network Status > 
Airport, that "Make Appletalk Active" is unchecked.


Or could it be the VPN is interfering? Last evening when troubleshooting 
I accidentally pressed a button that configured VPN (L2TP). The Network 
control panel now says VPN (L2TP) is configured but inactive.


I also wonder if I've got the order wrong in Network control panel > 
Network Port configuration. All five things are checked there, in this 
order:

Bluetooth
Built-in Ethernet
Built-in Firewire
Airport
VPN ((L2TP)

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
>> In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
>>> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
>>> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
>>> restarted the computer.
>>
>> A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure 
>> out what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if 
>> things still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a 
>> problem with your Mac or iTunes.
>>
>> Do this:
>> - reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its 
>> reset button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
>> something like that -- see the manual)
>> - let it start up
>> - if you get a steady green light, you're done
>>
>> If not, come back here again ;)
>>

To my tremendous relief, after about eight to ten hours of 
troubleshooting since last eveniing, I got it working again. (Everything 
wireless is extremely complex and a pain in the ass, I've found!) I'm 
not sure which of the many and repeated steps I took worked, but I wrote 
many notes to help me in case these problems happen again.

Now, for the first time, the Express's light is flashing alernately 
green and orange. What does this signify?

Robert

Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Now, for the first time, the Express's light is flashing alernately 
> green and orange. What does this signify?

Not recalling off-hand, I used my "computer expertise"
(<http://xkcd.com/627/> ) to google "airport express lights". See the
top hit, which is

<http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2610>


-- 
Richard Maine                    | Good judgment comes from experience;
email: last name at domain . net | experience comes from bad judgment.
domain: summertriangle           |  -- Mark Twain

In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
> > you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
> > wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
> 
> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that the 
> Imac uses to connect to the Net.

Is the Airport connected to the router?

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Richard Maine wrote:
> Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Now, for the first time, the Express's light is flashing alernately 
>> green and orange. What does this signify?
> 
> Not recalling off-hand, I used my "computer expertise"
> (<http://xkcd.com/627/> ) to google "airport express lights". See the
> top hit, which is
> 
> <http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2610>

That wasn't helpful. The page you referred to says, "Alternating 
amber/green  	When multiple AirPort Express base stations are available 
during setup, you can trigger this behavior by using the Identify 
feature." I don't understand that, because it's so poorly written, so 
even if I had found that page myself, it wouldn't have helped to solve 
the problem. There's plenty of information on the Net, but much of it is 
so poorly written that it's useless.

I just checked Airport Utility > Help > Identify. It says to give your 
Airport Express a unique name so it can be easily identified. I've done 
that since I bought the device over a month ago, yet I'm still having 
the same problem of music stopping every day on the Express and not 
knowing how to fix it.

Robert

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
>>> you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
>>> wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that the 
>> Imac uses to connect to the Net.
> 
> Is the Airport connected to the router?

The Imac is connected to the router.

In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, and 
the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>
>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
> 
> The Imac is connected to the router.
> 
> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, and 
> the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
> 
> Robert

Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.

In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.

A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
firewall settings."

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
>>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
>>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>>
>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>>
>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>
>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
> 
> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
> right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
> 
> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
> another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
> firewall settings."
> 
> Robert

Although I had run Airport Utility several times, I got a message this 
evening for the first time, advising that the firmware needed to be 
updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2. I followed the instructions to update the 
firmware, and now, for the first time since I bought the Airport Express 
over a month ago, I'm getting a solid green light on the machine.

Yet I'm still getting the error message (above) and a window appears 
saying "Connecting to Airtunes" but the connection isn't happening and 
the horizontal barbershop poll keeps on moving.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
>>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
>>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>>
>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>>
>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>
>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
> 
> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
> right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
> 
> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
> another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
> firewall settings."
> 
> Robert

I found this page about a firmware update for Airport Express to version 
6.3 on the Apple site ( 
http://support.apple.com/downloads/AirPort_Express_Firmware_Update_6_3_for_Mac_OS_X).

On that page, the first issue listed as being resolved by the update is 
"Resolves issue with Audio dropout when playing to AirPort Express with 
AirTunes".

So I downloaded the firmware update,and opened it, but it can't find any 
Airport Express to update.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP 
>>>>>> server. Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? 
>>>>>> (Modems, routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP 
>>>>>> server.)
>>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>>>
>>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>>>
>>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>>
>>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>>
>>> Robert
>>
>> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
>>
>> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the 
>> bottom, right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
>>
>> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
>> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection 
>> name, another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall 
>> settings prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your 
>> computer's firewall settings."
>>
>> Robert
> 
> I found this page about a firmware update for Airport Express to version 
> 6.3 on the Apple site ( 
> http://support.apple.com/downloads/AirPort_Express_Firmware_Update_6_3_for_Mac_OS_X). 
> 
> 
> On that page, the first issue listed as being resolved by the update is 
> "Resolves issue with Audio dropout when playing to AirPort Express with 
> AirTunes".
> 
> So I downloaded the firmware update,and opened it, but it can't find any 
> Airport Express to update.
> 
> Robert

And when I search my computer for Airport Express, all that shows up 
under Application is the firmware updater.

The updater has an "Other" box, and when I click on there, it asks for 
an IP address and password of the device to be updated, and I don't know 
what the IP address and password are.

Robert

In article <yhQEm.50133$PH1.20209@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > Is the Airport connected to the router?
> 
> The Imac is connected to the router.


You have to connect the router to the Airport first.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article <llREm.50153$PH1.5421@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> the firmware needed to be updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2

Vice versa, I imagine.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <llREm.50153$PH1.5421@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Robert Montgomery wrote:
> > Robert Montgomery wrote:
> >> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> >>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
> >>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
> >>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
> >>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
> >>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
> >>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
> >>>
> >>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
> >>
> >> The Imac is connected to the router.
> >>
> >> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
> >> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
> >>
> >> Robert
> > 
> > Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
> > 
> > In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
> > right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
> > 
> > A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
> > connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
> > another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> > prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
> > firewall settings."
> > 
> > Robert
> 
> Although I had run Airport Utility several times, I got a message this 
> evening for the first time, advising that the firmware needed to be 
> updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2. I followed the instructions to update the 
> firmware, and now, for the first time since I bought the Airport Express 
> over a month ago, I'm getting a solid green light on the machine.
> 
> Yet I'm still getting the error message (above) and a window appears 
> saying "Connecting to Airtunes" but the connection isn't happening and 
> the horizontal barbershop poll keeps on moving.
> 
> Robert

Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <jollyroger-A5AF69.08511825102009@news.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > the firmware needed to be updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2
> 
> Vice versa, I imagine.

I think he meant 7.4.2, not 4.4.2.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <jollyroger-A5AF69.08511825102009@news.individual.net>,
>  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> 
>>> the firmware needed to be updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2
>> Vice versa, I imagine.
> 
> I think he meant 7.4.2, not 4.4.2.

I'm sorry; I meant 7.4.1 to 7.4.2.

Robert

M-M wrote:
> In article <yhQEm.50133$PH1.20209@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>> The Imac is connected to the router.
> 
> 
> You have to connect the router to the Airport first.

If I did that, I'd be bypassing the main function of the device.

Airport Utility > Help says:

"AirPort lets you bring the online world to every room in your house — 
without the unsightly cable clutter associated with computers connected 
to the Internet.

You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
tools."

The router is connected with a cable to the Imac, and the Imac is 
connected to the Internet. The Express – which is in the next room – is 
not meant to be connected with a cable to the router.

Robert

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <llREm.50153$PH1.5421@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
>>>>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
>>>>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)

>>>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.

>>>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?

>>>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>>>
>>>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>>>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>>>
>>>> Robert


>>> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
>>>
>>> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
>>> right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
>>>
>>> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
>>> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
>>> another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
>>> prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
>>> firewall settings."
>>>
>>> Robert
>> Although I had run Airport Utility several times, I got a message this 
>> evening for the first time, advising that the firmware needed to be 
>> updated form 7.4.1 to 4.4.2. I followed the instructions to update the 
>> firmware, and now, for the first time since I bought the Airport Express 
>> over a month ago, I'm getting a solid green light on the machine.
>>
>> Yet I'm still getting the error message (above) and a window appears 
>> saying "Connecting to Airtunes" but the connection isn't happening and 
>> the horizontal barbershop poll keeps on moving.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?

When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
 >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.

I also tried Network > Show: Airport > TCP/IP > Configure IPV6 > and 
switched from Configure IPV6 Automatically to Off, and saved the network 
settings, but after that I still got the "Connecting to Robert's Airport 
Express" window with the horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving, 
so I turned IPV6 back to "Automatic" and saved the Network settings again.

I found some relevant information about Airtunes malfunctioning at 
http://forums.macosxhints.com/archive/index.php/t-75970.html, but 
ultimately it hasn't helped.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>>>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP 
>>>>>>> server. Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? 
>>>>>>> (Modems, routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a 
>>>>>>> DHCP server.)
>>>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>>>>
>>>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>>>
>>>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>>>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>>>
>>>> Robert
>>>
>>> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
>>>
>>> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the 
>>> bottom, right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
>>>
>>> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
>>> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection 
>>> name, another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall 
>>> settings prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change 
>>> your computer's firewall settings."
>>>
>>> Robert
>>
>> I found this page about a firmware update for Airport Express to 
>> version 6.3 on the Apple site ( 
>> http://support.apple.com/downloads/AirPort_Express_Firmware_Update_6_3_for_Mac_OS_X). 
>>
>>
>> On that page, the first issue listed as being resolved by the update 
>> is "Resolves issue with Audio dropout when playing to AirPort Express 
>> with AirTunes".
>>
>> So I downloaded the firmware update,and opened it, but it can't find 
>> any Airport Express to update.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> And when I search my computer for Airport Express, all that shows up 
> under Application is the firmware updater.
> 
> The updater has an "Other" box, and when I click on there, it asks for 
> an IP address and password of the device to be updated, and I don't know 
> what the IP address and password are.
> 
> Robert

Apparently, I've already got firmware version 6.3, because when I 
search on my computer for "Airport Express", a folder is listed at 
Robert > library > Application Support > Apple > Airport > Firmware > 
Airport Express.

When I use Get Info on that last file, called Airport Express, it says 
"6.3 basebinary", so the reason Airtunes isn't working apparently is not 
  because of this firmware being out-of-date.

Robert

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
>> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
>> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
>> restarted the computer.
> 
> A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure out 
> what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if things 
> still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a problem 
> with your Mac or iTunes.
> 
> Do this:
> - reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its reset 
> button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
> something like that -- see the manual)
> - let it start up
> - if you get a steady green light, you're done
> 
> If not, come back here again ;)
> 
> 
> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. Do 
> you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, routers, 
> wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)


Thanks, Sander.

How can I tell if I have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses?

I don't have a modem, but I have a router.

I have access to the router's specs in my browser, which I was informed 
of by my ISP. (I don't know what you call those specs exactly.)

I'm looking at the DHCP page there in my browser.

It lists various stuff, like "DHCP Server Enabled" and the button for 
that is on.

There's a range of starting and ending IP addresses.

And there are two Host names: one is "robert-airport-express" and the 
other is "unknown", which is followed by a bunch of letters and numbers 
with hyphens.


Something else that just occurred to me: Does it matter what channel I'm 
on? It says I'm on channel 11.

Robert

Robert Montgomery wrote:
> Robert Montgomery wrote:
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <Q2FEm.49186$Db2.41904@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> [*] It might be waiting to receive an IP adress from a DHCP server. 
>>>>> Do you have a DHCP server handing out IP addresses? (Modems, 
>>>>> routers, wirelsss acces points all tend to contain a DHCP server.)
>>>> I don't know. How can I find out? I have a D-Link 604+ router that 
>>>> the Imac uses to connect to the Net.
>>>
>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>>
>> The Imac is connected to the router.
>>
>> In the next room, the Express is connected to the powered speakers, 
>> and the Express and the speakers are plugged into outlets.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Again the music isn't coming from the speakers.
> 
> In Itunes, when I click on the Multiple Speakers popup menu the bottom, 
> right corner, I  scroll to my airport connection name.
> 
> A window appears with the names "Computer" and the name of my airport 
> connection. When I put a check mark beside the airport connection name, 
> another window appears that says, "Your computer's firewall settings 
> prevent you from using Airtunes. To use Airtunes, change your computer's 
> firewall settings."
> 
> Robert

In Airport Utility > Summary > Status says "Normal", and there's a green 
circle next to the word "Normal".

And I'm able to access my wireless name in the Airport pop down menu at 
the top of my screen.

And the light is steady green on the Airport Express in the next room.

Is it possible that despite this, there's a problem with the settings I 
have in Airport Utlility, which would explain why I'm not getting music 
anymore from the Express?

Robert

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <dtxEm.49157$Db2.16146@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> The yellow light is still flashing on the Airport Express, as it did 
>> before sometimes, whether or not it was working at a given time. I 
>> unplugged it for a couple of minutes and plugged it in again. I also 
>> restarted the computer.
> 
> A blinking yellow light means that the Airport Express can't figure out 
> what to do[*]. A steady green light is what you need. Only if things 
> still don't work *then* does it make sense to see if there is a problem 
> with your Mac or iTunes.
> 
> Do this:
> - reset the Airport Express (stick an folded-out paperclip in its reset 
> button for some 30  seconds or so, until it beepds or flashes or 
> something like that -- see the manual)
> - let it start up
> - if you get a steady green light, you're done
> 
> If not, come back here again ;)

The music isn't playing on the Express now, and in Itunes, I keep 
getting this message: Airtunes > Connecting to Robert Airport Express, 
but the barbershop pole pattern keeps on moving.

On my router's configuration page, I switched from channel 11 to 6, 
saved the change and restarted my router. It didn't work.

So I switched from channel 6 to 1, saved the change and restarted my 
router. That also didn't work.

I confirmed in Istumbler that the channel changes had gone through.

Robert

In article <_O%Em.49288$Db2.29609@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > You have to connect the router to the Airport first.
> 
> If I did that, I'd be bypassing the main function of the device.
> 
> Airport Utility > Help says:
> 
> "AirPort lets you bring the online world to every room in your house — 
> without the unsightly cable clutter associated with computers connected 
> to the Internet.
> 
> You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
> tools."
> 
> The router is connected with a cable to the Imac, 


Right. It says right there that you *don't* connect your computer to the 
internet with a cable, and that is what you did anyhow.

You need to bring your cable into the room with the speakers.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article 
<nospam.m-m-18FC96.21185525102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
 M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:

> > You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
> > tools."
> > 
> > The router is connected with a cable to the Imac, 
> 
> Right. It says right there that you *don't* connect your computer to the 
> internet with a cable, and that is what you did anyhow.
> 
> You need to bring your cable into the room with the speakers.

No he doesn't.  All he should need to do is connect the Airport Express via 
WiFi with the wireless router.

I think that the problem may be that AirTunes requires an Airport Extreme, 
Time Capsule, or another Airport Express as the router, and will not work 
with any third-party wireless router.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

M-M wrote:
> In article <_O%Em.49288$Db2.29609@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> You have to connect the router to the Airport first.
>> If I did that, I'd be bypassing the main function of the device.
>>
>> Airport Utility > Help says:
>>
>> "AirPort lets you bring the online world to every room in your house — 
>> without the unsightly cable clutter associated with computers connected 
>> to the Internet.
>>
>> You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
>> tools."
>>
>> The router is connected with a cable to the Imac, 
> 
> 
> Right. It says right there that you *don't* connect your computer to the 
> internet with a cable, and that is what you did anyhow.
> 
> You need to bring your cable into the room with the speakers.

I'm confused by your statement.

I've had Internet connectivity for about 15 years, and all that time the 
  computers were hooked up to the Internet with a cable, so I haven't 
changed that aspect of my connectivity in all those years.

Robert

M-M wrote:
> In article <yhQEm.50133$PH1.20209@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> Is the Airport connected to the router?
>> The Imac is connected to the router.
> 
> 
>u have to connect the router to the Airport first.

Okay, this is so frustrating and time-consuming that I'm willing to 
compromise by wiring the setup instead of having it wireless.

So I took the advice I read on the Internet, by trying to string an 
Ethernet cable from the Express to the Imac, but I can't because there's 
only one slot available on the Imac, and that's used for the cable that 
runs between the Imac and the router.

So I hooked up the cable from the Express to the router instead, so that 
I'd then have an Express to router to Imac connection.

Then Itunes recognized the Express again, but I lost Internet connectivity.

Robert

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article 
> <nospam.m-m-18FC96.21185525102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
>  M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:
> 
>>> You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
>>> tools."
>>>
>>> The router is connected with a cable to the Imac, 
>> Right. It says right there that you *don't* connect your computer to the 
>> internet with a cable, and that is what you did anyhow.
>>
>> You need to bring your cable into the room with the speakers.
> 
> No he doesn't.  All he should need to do is connect the Airport Express via 
> WiFi with the wireless router.
> 
> I think that the problem may be that AirTunes requires an Airport Extreme, 
> Time Capsule, or another Airport Express as the router, and will not work 
> with any third-party wireless router.

On the Apple Web site at 
http://www.apple.com/findouthow/mac/#wirelessmusic > Wireless > 
Streaming music wirelessly, there's a video that shows how to set up 
wireless music playing.

It's true that it doesn't show a router, but I've been reading 
extensively about this topic and nowhere have I read that having a 
router attached to the Mac would interfere with Airtunes.

Routers or modems are standard with desktop computers; you need one to 
connect a desktop computer to the Internet, so I'm sure there would be 
lots of documentation about this if routers caused interference.

Robert

In article <ww7Fm.50276$PH1.766@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> It's true that it doesn't show a router, but I've been reading 
> extensively about this topic and nowhere have I read that having a 
> router attached to the Mac would interfere with Airtunes.
> 
> Routers or modems are standard with desktop computers; you need one to 
> connect a desktop computer to the Internet, so I'm sure there would be 
> lots of documentation about this if routers caused interference.

It is not a matter of interference; a wireless router is necessary, but I 
believe that it has to be an Apple branded wireless router.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <ww7Fm.50276$PH1.766@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> > It's true that it doesn't show a router, but I've been reading 
> > extensively about this topic and nowhere have I read that having a 
> > router attached to the Mac would interfere with Airtunes.
> > 
> > Routers or modems are standard with desktop computers; you need one to
> > connect a desktop computer to the Internet, so I'm sure there would be
> > lots of documentation about this if routers caused interference.
> 
> It is not a matter of interference; a wireless router is necessary, but I
> believe that it has to be an Apple branded wireless router.

It doesn't. I know several people who use an Airport Express in
combination with a non-Apple primary router.

The problem in this case MIGHT be that Robert is trying to use the
Airport Express to create an independent wireless network, and connect
the iMac to that network at the same time as connecting the iMac via
Ethernet to the D-Link DSL-604+ router.

This is implied by the earlier mention of a wireless network called
"Base Station 08Cc999", which is the default name for a wireless network
created by an Apple Airport base station.

This configuration could confuse things, as the iMac might lose track of
which network is being used to access the Airport Express, especially if
the two networks have been set up to use the same range of IP addresses.

As the D-Link is a wireless router, the best configuration would be to
set up the D-Link to create a wireless network, the Airport Express to
"Join" that wireless network, and turn off Airport on the iMac (also
turn off Internet Sharing - it is only confusing the situation and won't
help).

This will result in the iMac having a single active network connection
(Ethernet to the D-Link), and it will access the Airport Express via
that network. The D-Link will forward (bridge) all traffic between
Ethernet and WiFi as required for the Airport Express and iMac to talk
to each other.

-- 
David Empson
dempson@actrix.gen.nz

David Empson wrote:
> Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
>> In article <ww7Fm.50276$PH1.766@edtnps82>,
>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>
>>> It's true that it doesn't show a router, but I've been reading 
>>> extensively about this topic and nowhere have I read that having a 
>>> router attached to the Mac would interfere with Airtunes.
>>>
>>> Routers or modems are standard with desktop computers; you need one to
>>> connect a desktop computer to the Internet, so I'm sure there would be
>>> lots of documentation about this if routers caused interference.

>> It is not a matter of interference; a wireless router is necessary, but I
>> believe that it has to be an Apple branded wireless router.
> 
> It doesn't. I know several people who use an Airport Express in
> combination with a non-Apple primary router.
> 
> The problem in this case MIGHT be that Robert is trying to use the
> Airport Express to create an independent wireless network, and connect
> the iMac to that network at the same time as connecting the iMac via
> Ethernet to the D-Link DSL-604+ router.
> 
> This is implied by the earlier mention of a wireless network called
> "Base Station 08Cc999", which is the default name for a wireless network
> created by an Apple Airport base station.
> 
> This configuration could confuse things, as the iMac might lose track of
> which network is being used to access the Airport Express, especially if
> the two networks have been set up to use the same range of IP addresses.
> 
> As the D-Link is a wireless router, the best configuration would be to
> set up the D-Link to create a wireless network, the Airport Express to
> "Join" that wireless network, and turn off Airport on the iMac (also
> turn off Internet Sharing - it is only confusing the situation and won't
> help).
> 
> This will result in the iMac having a single active network connection
> (Ethernet to the D-Link), and it will access the Airport Express via
> that network. The D-Link will forward (bridge) all traffic between
> Ethernet and WiFi as required for the Airport Express and iMac to talk
> to each other.

Thanks, David.

How could I set up the D-Link 604+ router to create a wireless network?

Robert

In article <kc8Fm.50280$PH1.24512@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery
<info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > As the D-Link is a wireless router, the best configuration would be to
> > set up the D-Link to create a wireless network, the Airport Express to
> > "Join" that wireless network, and turn off Airport on the iMac (also
> > turn off Internet Sharing - it is only confusing the situation and won't
> > help).
> > 
> > This will result in the iMac having a single active network connection
> > (Ethernet to the D-Link), and it will access the Airport Express via
> > that network. The D-Link will forward (bridge) all traffic between
> > Ethernet and WiFi as required for the Airport Express and iMac to talk
> > to each other.
> 
> How could I set up the D-Link 604+ router to create a wireless network?

google says that's an old router which only supports 802.11b and wep. 

you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your
existing network and using the airport for a wifi network, particularly
if you have the latest 802.11n version of the express. even if you have
the older 802.11g version, you are *still* ahead.

be sure to disable wifi on the d-link, but leave dhcp on so the airport
can get an ip address. use the airport config wizard to set up a new
wifi network (it's really bridge mode but i forget what apple calls
it). pick wpa for security, along with a long passphrase.

In article <251020092008084122%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> > How could I set up the D-Link 604+ router to create a wireless 
> > network?
> 
> google says that's an old router which only supports 802.11b and wep. 
> 
> you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your 
> existing network and using the airport for a wifi network, particularly 
> if you have the latest 802.11n version of the express. even if you have 
> the older 802.11g version, you are *still* ahead.

The problem with that is that he AE needs to be in the other room to 
connect to the speakers.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

nospam wrote:
> In article <kc8Fm.50280$PH1.24512@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery
> <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>> As the D-Link is a wireless router, the best configuration would be to
>>> set up the D-Link to create a wireless network, the Airport Express to
>>> "Join" that wireless network, and turn off Airport on the iMac (also
>>> turn off Internet Sharing - it is only confusing the situation and won't
>>> help).
>>>
>>> This will result in the iMac having a single active network connection
>>> (Ethernet to the D-Link), and it will access the Airport Express via
>>> that network. The D-Link will forward (bridge) all traffic between
>>> Ethernet and WiFi as required for the Airport Express and iMac to talk
>>> to each other.
>> How could I set up the D-Link 604+ router to create a wireless network?
> 
> google says that's an old router which only supports 802.11b and wep. 
> 
> you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your
> existing network and using the airport for a wifi network, particularly
> if you have the latest 802.11n version of the express. even if you have
> the older 802.11g version, you are *still* ahead.
> 
> be sure to disable wifi on the d-link, but leave dhcp on so the airport
> can get an ip address. use the airport config wizard to set up a new
> wifi network (it's really bridge mode but i forget what apple calls
> it). pick wpa for security, along with a long passphrase.

Thanks, nospam.

How can I disable wifi on the d-link? I looked at the d-link's 
configuration page, but I don't see wifi there.

I hard-wired the setup by connecting an Ethernet cable between the 
Express and the D-Link, but that caused the Internet connection to be cut.

Robert

In article <michelle-5AD66F.20321325102009@news.eternal-september.org>,
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> > > How could I set up the D-Link 604+ router to create a wireless 
> > > network?
> > 
> > google says that's an old router which only supports 802.11b and wep. 
> > 
> > you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your 
> > existing network and using the airport for a wifi network, particularly 
> > if you have the latest 802.11n version of the express. even if you have 
> > the older 802.11g version, you are *still* ahead.
> 
> The problem with that is that he AE needs to be in the other room to 
> connect to the speakers.

that would be a problem. personally, i'd get an 802.11g router to
replace the aging dlink, even if if 802.11b has sufficient bandwidth
for an audio stream (i'm not sure it actually does).

In article <TS8Fm.50281$PH1.18185@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery
<info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> How can I disable wifi on the d-link? I looked at the d-link's 
> configuration page, but I don't see wifi there.

i don't have one, but based on this link, you go to the wireless tab to
configure it. however, i don't see an on/off button in the screen shot,
and it might be possible that you can't turn it off, unless the button
off screen somewhere or on a different page.

in the event that you do leave it on (since the airport apparently
needs to be in the next room), turn off turbo and pick a 13 character
wep pass phrase and put it in the first box only. that maps to a 128
bit key and is a lot easier than entering in hex.

<http://www.thinkbroadband.com/hardware/reviews/58-dlink-dsl604.html>

> I hard-wired the setup by connecting an Ethernet cable between the 
> Express and the D-Link, but that caused the Internet connection to be cut.

how did you configure the airport?

In article <251020092008084122%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your
> existing network and using the airport for a wifi network


Right. I cannot understand why he needs to use 2 routers.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article <michelle-5AD66F.20321325102009@news.eternal-september.org>,
 Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> The problem with that is that he AE needs to be in the other room to 
> connect to the speakers.


so bring the cable into the speaker room. Or buy another AE.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article <201Fm.49304$Db2.15349@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
>
> > Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?
> 
> When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
> Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
> then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
>  >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
> Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
> horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
> goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
> Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.

Why?

You're only adding problem on top of problem by turning it back on. If 
you would leave it off for now, you've eliminated one aspect of why you 
are having trouble communicating with the damned thing!

> I also tried Network > Show: Airport > TCP/IP > Configure IPV6 > and 
> switched from Configure IPV6 Automatically to Off, and saved the network 
> settings, but after that I still got the "Connecting to Robert's Airport 
> Express" window with the horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving, 
> so I turned IPV6 back to "Automatic" and saved the Network settings again.
> 
> I found some relevant information about Airtunes malfunctioning at 
> http://forums.macosxhints.com/archive/index.php/t-75970.html, but 
> ultimately it hasn't helped.

I think it's likely your D-Link 604+ router is the source of the 
problem. Your firewall settings are another separate problem that 
coincidentally is happening at the same time, complicating the 
situation. Do yourself a favor and turn the firewall off until you solve 
the actual problem.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

nospam wrote:
> In article <TS8Fm.50281$PH1.18185@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery
> <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> How can I disable wifi on the d-link? I looked at the d-link's 
>> configuration page, but I don't see wifi there.
> 
> i don't have one, but based on this link, you go to the wireless tab to
> configure it. however, i don't see an on/off button in the screen shot,
> and it might be possible that you can't turn it off, unless the button
> off screen somewhere or on a different page.
> 
> in the event that you do leave it on (since the airport apparently
> needs to be in the next room), turn off turbo and pick a 13 character
> wep pass phrase and put it in the first box only. that maps to a 128
> bit key and is a lot easier than entering in hex.

I have no idea what that means. It's way over my head.
> 
> <http://www.thinkbroadband.com/hardware/reviews/58-dlink-dsl604.html>
> 
>> I hard-wired the setup by connecting an Ethernet cable between the 
>> Express and the D-Link, but that caused the Internet connection to be cut.
> 
> how did you configure the airport?

It's now not configured, because all the settings have been lost � 
again. Every time I rescan now in Airport Utility, the device fails to 
find the wireless Internet connection.

I just tried ethernet-cabling the Express to the router, but that cuased 
my Internet connection to drop.

I'm tempted to give up my dream of getting music to play in the 
adjoining room. I just spent the last two days on this problem. Now I'm 
being told I have to embark on an entirely new tack � one which, I'm 
sure � will be fraught with lots more difficulties, especially because 
what you're proposing sounds like jerry-rigging, so there's probably not 
much documentation available.

If I have to buy a new router, I have to deal with all the headaches 
that will surely ensue. The more I try to solve this problem, the more 
problematic it becomes.

It's too bad that I can't return the Express to the store; I've had it 
for more than 30 days.

If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478

Once again, a claim that I can "set up [wirelessly] in minutes" 
(according to Apple Web site, and the Express brochure and the Apple 
store clerk and folks in the newsgroup)  is a complete fantasy and crock 
of crap.

Robert

In article <1u9Fm.50284$PH1.46216@edtnps82>, Robert Montgomery
<info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > in the event that you do leave it on (since the airport apparently
> > needs to be in the next room), turn off turbo and pick a 13 character
> > wep pass phrase and put it in the first box only. that maps to a 128
> > bit key and is a lot easier than entering in hex.
> 
> I have no idea what that means. It's way over my head.

it's easier than it sounds but you can just leave wep off and not use a
password at all. wep is so easy to crack, it doesn't really matter. 

the part about turbo is a non-standard extra that d-link added and will
not work with an airport or any other wifi device (except if it uses
the exact same chipset as the d-link, there's a possibility).

> It's now not configured, because all the settings have been lost � 
> again. Every time I rescan now in Airport Utility, the device fails to 
> find the wireless Internet connection.

can anything else see the wifi connection? if not, you need to fix that
first.

> I just tried ethernet-cabling the Express to the router, but that cuased 
> my Internet connection to drop.

that shouldn't happen, and it's hard to determine why via usenet. my
first guess is both have dhcp enabled.

> It's too bad that I can't return the Express to the store; I've had it 
> for more than 30 days.

you could put it on ebay, they go for close to what they sell for new.

> If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
> low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478

that doesn't appear to have wifi, so you'd need to run a cable to the
airport.

i would strongly suggest getting an another airport express or an
airport extreme, or even a time capsule if you want time machine
backups. they're a lot easier to set up, and apple should be able to
help you get airtunes to work since it's all apple products.

if you get a d-link or anything else, apple will say 'we don't support
it' and you're basically on your own. that alone might be worth paying
a little extra for an airport.

if you do get something else, literally anything will suffice. 802.11g
routers are dirt cheap now. there's probably something on sale this
week, or will be next week, for well under $50, maybe even half that.

> Once again, a claim that I can "set up [wirelessly] in minutes" 
> (according to Apple Web site, and the Express brochure and the Apple 
> store clerk and folks in the newsgroup)  is a complete fantasy and crock 
> of crap.

actually it isn't that difficult, and there is always the possibility
you have a hardware issue, especially since it can't see the wifi
connection.

In article 
<nospam.m-m-1E1B52.23595925102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
 M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:

> > you would be *far* better off hardwiring the airport express to your
> > existing network and using the airport for a wifi network
> 
> Right. I cannot understand why he needs to use 2 routers.

The way that AirTunes works is like this:

Computer<-->WiFi Router<-->Airport Express-->audio system.

Computer to WiFi Router is either WiFi or Ethernet
WiFi Router to Airport Express is either WiFi or Ethernet (usually WiFi)
Airport Express to audio system is audio cables (TosLink or analog).

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> I think that the problem may be that AirTunes requires an Airport Extreme,
> Time Capsule, or another Airport Express as the router, and will not work
> with any third-party wireless router.

No, that's not the problem. The Express _does_ work for AirTunes
streaming with non-Apple routers.

-- 
My latest dance performance <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvB98fgse-s>

Mac and geek T-shirts & gifts <http://designsbymike.net/shop/mac.cgi>
Prius shirts/bumper stickers <http://designsbymike.net/shop/prius.cgi>

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <201Fm.49304$Db2.15349@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Jolly Roger wrote:
>>
>>> Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?
>> When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
>> Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
>> then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
>>  >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
>> Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
>> horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
>> goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
>> Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.
> 
> Why?

The same reason as everyone else who uses a firewall, obviously: to 
protect against enemy fire.

All of the information I've read says to keep the shields up at all times.

> You're only adding problem on top of problem by turning it back on. If 
> you would leave it off for now, you've eliminated one aspect of why you 
> are having trouble communicating with the damned thing!
> 
>> I also tried Network > Show: Airport > TCP/IP > Configure IPV6 > and 
>> switched from Configure IPV6 Automatically to Off, and saved the network 
>> settings, but after that I still got the "Connecting to Robert's Airport 
>> Express" window with the horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving, 
>> so I turned IPV6 back to "Automatic" and saved the Network settings again.
>>
>> I found some relevant information about Airtunes malfunctioning at 
>> http://forums.macosxhints.com/archive/index.php/t-75970.html, but 
>> ultimately it hasn't helped.
> 
> I think it's likely your D-Link 604+ router is the source of the 
> problem. Your firewall settings are another separate problem that 
> coincidentally is happening at the same time, complicating the 
> situation. Do yourself a favor and turn the firewall off until you solve 
> the actual problem.

Robert

In article <64lFm.49489$Db2.38027@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <201Fm.49304$Db2.15349@edtnps83>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Jolly Roger wrote:
> >>
> >>> Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?
> >> When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
> >> Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
> >> then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
> >>  >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
> >> Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
> >> horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
> >> goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
> >> Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.
> > 
> > Why?
> 
> The same reason as everyone else who uses a firewall, obviously: to 
> protect against enemy fire.
> 
> All of the information I've read says to keep the shields up at all times.

That's silly. Your D-Link router has a firewall. There's no need to run 
two firewalls back to back like that.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <1u9Fm.50284$PH1.46216@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> I'm tempted to give up my dream of getting music to play in the 
> adjoining room. I just spent the last two days on this problem. Now I'm 
> being told I have to embark on an entirely new tack � one which, I'm 
> sure � will be fraught with lots more difficulties, especially because 
> what you're proposing sounds like jerry-rigging, so there's probably not 
> much documentation available.
> 
> If I have to buy a new router, I have to deal with all the headaches 
> that will surely ensue. The more I try to solve this problem, the more 
> problematic it becomes.

It's not nearly as complicated as you make it out to be. No offense 
intended, but you're having this much trouble because you're making 
decisions out of ignorance.

> If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
> low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478

Have you considered the "lowest price" may not be exactly conducive to 
"just works"? 

I would think the plug-and-play nature of Apple's Airport Extreme router 
would be quite attractive to someone who obviously doesn't know much 
about networking!

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <1j86pfq.9wfgpw1b0rsgsN%mikePOST@TOGROUPmacconsult.com>,
 mikePOST@TOGROUPmacconsult.com (Mike Rosenberg) wrote:

> Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > I think that the problem may be that AirTunes requires an Airport Extreme,
> > Time Capsule, or another Airport Express as the router, and will not work
> > with any third-party wireless router.
> 
> No, that's not the problem. The Express _does_ work for AirTunes
> streaming with non-Apple routers.

I had to pack my Linksys WRT-56GL because the uVerse wireless router 
couldn't be configured with it.  I spent a good part of 2 hours with the 
tech and we couldn't get the two to bridge.  So, I just bit the bullet 
and packed the router away.  The uVerse router is fine with my AE and 
Airtunes and my HP printer now connects wirelessly (didn't on the 
Linksys).

My guess is this guy is either going to get it working all by his 
lonesome and be happy after all the advise given here.  Or he'll screw 
the pooch and be back.  

I'll take door #2.

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically by ignored]

In article <jollyroger-648E73.23121626102009@news.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
> > low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478
> 
> Have you considered the "lowest price" may not be exactly conducive to 
> "just works"? 

Not only that, it's not a wireless router, and he needs a wireless router 
to use AirTunes.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <64lFm.49489$Db2.38027@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> In article <201Fm.49304$Db2.15349@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?
>>>> When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
>>>> Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
>>>> then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
>>>>  >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
>>>> Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
>>>> horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
>>>> goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
>>>> Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.
>>> Why?
>> The same reason as everyone else who uses a firewall, obviously: to 
>> protect against enemy fire.
>>
>> All of the information I've read says to keep the shields up at all times.
> 
> That's silly. Your D-Link router has a firewall. There's no need to run 
> two firewalls back to back like that.

I didn't know that. I just searched on the Web and found out that the 
D-Link 604+ does indeed have a firewall. I'm impressed with your 
knowledge, Jolly.

But I just checked my D-Link's configuration page, and it says that the 
firewall is disabled.

And I'm afraid to change my firewall settings. Are you sure that I can 
activate the D-Link's firewall, and disable my Imac's firewall, without 
any bad consequences?

Robert

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <1u9Fm.50284$PH1.46216@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> I'm tempted to give up my dream of getting music to play in the 
>> adjoining room. I just spent the last two days on this problem. Now I'm 
>> being told I have to embark on an entirely new tack � one which, I'm 
>> sure � will be fraught with lots more difficulties, especially because 
>> what you're proposing sounds like jerry-rigging, so there's probably not 
>> much documentation available.
>>
>> If I have to buy a new router, I have to deal with all the headaches 
>> that will surely ensue. The more I try to solve this problem, the more 
>> problematic it becomes.
> 
> It's not nearly as complicated as you make it out to be. No offense 
> intended, but you're having this much trouble because you're making 
> decisions out of ignorance.
> 
>> If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
>> low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478
> 
> Have you considered the "lowest price" may not be exactly conducive to 
> "just works"? 

Yes. That's why I asked for opinions about that router.

> I would think the plug-and-play nature of Apple's Airport Extreme router 
> would be quite attractive to someone who obviously doesn't know much 
> about networking!

Is that so? I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router. The Apple Web 
site (http://www.apple.com/airportextreme/features/frequency.html) 
doesn't identify the Airport Extreme as a router. It identifies it as a 
device for "wirelsss network users" and as a "base station". I didn't 
know that "base station" is synonymous with "router".


Are you sure that an Airport Extreme would replace the D-Link 604+ 
router without any negative side effects? Advice must be clear for me to 
comprehend it.

(Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless 
connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express 
and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room, 
and that turned out not be be the case. It's been made clear by this 
thread that I must additionally either buy a more modern router, or 
fiddle with the delicate network settings on my current D-Link router 
and maybe Imac, too.)

I thought I already have a wireless connection, because I was able to 
wirelessly connect my Imac with a PC in the next room, so I must have 
misunderstood what was meant by having a wireless connection. I didn't 
know that "having a wireless connection" can mean two totally different 
things.

Robert

On Oct 28, 9:44=A0am, Robert Montgomery <info-bl...@northern-data-
tech.net> wrote:

> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless
> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express
> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room,

You don't even need a wireless connection if your iMac has an Airport
(or Airport Extreme) card installed. I have an old "desk-lamp" iMac
with the Airport card installed (it wouldn't take the Extreme), I am
connected to the 'Net via an ethernet connection from my DSL modem,
and I use an Airport Express to pipe music to my stereo in another
room.

The problems you are having have nothing to do with a lack of
equipment.

I do have a wireless router as well, but that's for giving a laptop
computer access to the Internet.

In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Is that so? I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router. The Apple Web 
> site (http://www.apple.com/airportextreme/features/frequency.html) 
> doesn't identify the Airport Extreme as a router. It identifies it as a 
> device for "wirelsss network users" and as a "base station". I didn't 
> know that "base station" is synonymous with "router".


base station = router

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

>  I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router.


both the Airport Express and the Airport Extreme are routers but only 
the Express will do Airtunes. The Extreme has more ethernet connections, 
if you need that. They both support wireless printing.

It's very simple as I said before. If you cannot bring the cable into 
the room with the speakers, then get 2 Airport routers and they will 
work very well together.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article 
<nospam.m-m-C3544F.18235928102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
 M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:

> base station = router

base station == router

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[...]

> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless 
> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express 
> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room, 
> and that turned out not be be the case.

Just FWIW: as I was one of those advising that, of course I do feel some 
responsibility to help you further getting it to actually work. But from 
your recent barrage of messages (with lots of needless quoting) I got 
completely lost as to what you have configured how, what you have and 
haven't tried, and what happens when you do x.

Good to see that a few others seem to understand the problem, though :)

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

James Dale Guckert wrote:
> On Oct 28, 9:44 am, Robert Montgomery <info-bl...@northern-data-
> tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless
>> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express
>> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room,
> 
> You don't even need a wireless connection if your iMac has an Airport
> (or Airport Extreme) card installed. I have an old "desk-lamp" iMac
> with the Airport card installed (it wouldn't take the Extreme), I am
> connected to the 'Net via an ethernet connection from my DSL modem,
> and I use an Airport Express to pipe music to my stereo in another
> room.
> 
> The problems you are having have nothing to do with a lack of
> equipment.
> 
> I do have a wireless router as well, but that's for giving a laptop
> computer access to the Internet.

My Imac does have an Airport card.

So you're contradicting David's statement that my router is causing the 
problem (by acting as a DHCP server and broadcasting its own IP address?)

Robert

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless 
>> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express 
>> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room, 
>> and that turned out not be be the case.
> 
> Just FWIW: as I was one of those advising that, of course I do feel some 
> responsibility to help you further getting it to actually work. But from 
> your recent barrage of messages (with lots of needless quoting) I got 
> completely lost as to what you have configured how, what you have and 
> haven't tried, and what happens when you do x.
> 
> Good to see that a few others seem to understand the problem, though :)

I understand your confusion, Sander.

I'm sorry about the quoting. I thought that would help to refresh 
people's memory of the issues.

Your confusion demonstrates that the issue is not "very simple", which 
is what M-M claimed.

Robert

In article <zyDGm.49845$Db2.6654@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

>  the issue is not "very simple", which 
> is what M-M claimed.


It would be if you get rid of your d-link router.

-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

M-M wrote:
> In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>>  I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router.
> 
> both the Airport Express and the Airport Extreme are routers but only 
> the Express will do Airtunes. The Extreme has more ethernet connections, 
> if you need that. 

> 
>>> It's very simple as I said before. If you cannot bring the cable into 
>>> the room with the speakers, then get 2 Airport routers and they will 
>>> work very well together.

In the second message of the thread, Michael recommended an Extreme, but 
Michele. AES and Sander responded that the recommendation should have 
been Express, so they seem to contradict your statement that only 
Extreme does Airtunes.

So we've had disagreement even among the experts here about which device 
would do the job, so obviously it's not "very simple".

Also, if it were very simple, this thread wouldn't be as long as it is.

Also, in the very first response of the thread, Michael wrote that it 
would work if I have a wireless connection. I DO have a wireless 
connection. But after about 40 or 50 messages in this thread, it was 
determined that I don't have the right kind of wireless connection, and 
that I need to buy a "Wi-Fi" router.

Also, when I went to an Apple store and described my setup and my desire 
to play music wirelessly in the next room, the salesman who then sold me 
the Express advised that all I needed was the Express and the cable to 
connect to the speakers. He's the most zealous Mac fan I've met, but he 
also gave me incomplete advice, so obviously the situation is not "very 
simple".

I did attach the Express to the router with an Ethernet cable, but then 
my Internet connection was cut off.

So I think I shall buy an Airport Extreme "base station" router to 
replace my apparently obsolete D-Link 604+ base station router.

Robert

In article <9fEGm.49853$Db2.5175@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> In the second message of the thread, Michael recommended an Extreme, but 
> Michele. AES and Sander responded that the recommendation should have 
> been Express, so they seem to contradict your statement that only 
> Extreme does Airtunes.

He said that only the Express does Airtunes; he did not say that only the 
Extreme does Airtunes.

> So we've had disagreement even among the experts here about which device 
> would do the job, so obviously it's not "very simple".

Nope; no disagreement, just your misreading.

> So I think I shall buy an Airport Extreme "base station" router to 
> replace my apparently obsolete D-Link 604+ base station router.

That is probably your best bet.  And have the Apple Genius at the store 
tell you exactly how to configure the Extreme and the Express for Airtunes.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <9fEGm.49853$Db2.5175@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> In the second message of the thread, Michael recommended an Extreme, but 
> Michele. AES and Sander responded that the recommendation should have 
> been Express, so they seem to contradict your statement that only 
> Extreme does Airtunes.


Only the Express does Airtunes. The Extreme does not have the Audio-out 
port.

 
> Also, when I went to an Apple store and described my setup and my desire 
> to play music wirelessly in the next room, the salesman who then sold me 
> the Express advised that all I needed was the Express and the cable to 
> connect to the speakers. He's the most zealous Mac fan I've met, but he 
> also gave me incomplete advice, so obviously the situation is not "very 
> simple".


He is correct. You connect the Express to the router via ethernet cable, 
and to your stereo via the audio cable (and to a USB printer if you'd 
like to print wirelessly.)


> I did attach the Express to the router with an Ethernet cable, but then 
> my Internet connection was cut off.

Are you still using the D-Link? Did you configure the Express correctly?

> 
> So I think I shall buy an Airport Extreme "base station" router to 
> replace my apparently obsolete D-Link 604+ base station router.


Only if you can't get your internet cable into the same room as the 
speakers. Two expresses will do just as well if you can't move the cable.




-- 
m-m
http://www.mhmyers.com

In article 
<nospam.m-m-AA6CA6.17280830102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
 M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:

> He is correct. You connect the Express to the router via ethernet cable,

or via WiFi.

> > So I think I shall buy an Airport Extreme "base station" router to 
> > replace my apparently obsolete D-Link 604+ base station router.
> 
> 
> Only if you can't get your internet cable into the same room as the 
> speakers. Two expresses will do just as well if you can't move the cable.

True, but only if he doesn't need multiple ethernet ports and/or a usb hard 
drive connected to the router.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article 
<nospam.m-m-B16E37.11452130102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
 M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:

> In article <zyDGm.49845$Db2.6654@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> >  the issue is not "very simple", which 
> > is what M-M claimed.
> 
> It would be if you get rid of your d-link router.

Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
AirTunes from working?

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

In article <user-4B988E.02290531102009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
 Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:

> Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
> AirTunes from working?

It might be that it's not compatible.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <1u9Fm.50284$PH1.46216@edtnps82>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> I'm tempted to give up my dream of getting music to play in the 
> >> adjoining room. I just spent the last two days on this problem. Now I'm 
> >> being told I have to embark on an entirely new tack � one which, I'm 
> >> sure � will be fraught with lots more difficulties, especially because 
> >> what you're proposing sounds like jerry-rigging, so there's probably not 
> >> much documentation available.
> >>
> >> If I have to buy a new router, I have to deal with all the headaches 
> >> that will surely ensue. The more I try to solve this problem, the more 
> >> problematic it becomes.
> > 
> > It's not nearly as complicated as you make it out to be. No offense 
> > intended, but you're having this much trouble because you're making 
> > decisions out of ignorance.
> > 
> >> If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
> >> low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478
> > 
> > Have you considered the "lowest price" may not be exactly conducive to 
> > "just works"? 
> 
> Yes. That's why I asked for opinions about that router.

Ok. Personally, I wouldn't waste my time or money on it.

> > I would think the plug-and-play nature of Apple's Airport Extreme router 
> > would be quite attractive to someone who obviously doesn't know much 
> > about networking!
> 
> Is that so? I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router. The Apple Web 
> site (http://www.apple.com/airportextreme/features/frequency.html) 
> doesn't identify the Airport Extreme as a router. It identifies it as a 
> device for "wirelsss network users" and as a "base station". I didn't 
> know that "base station" is synonymous with "router".
> 
> Are you sure that an Airport Extreme would replace the D-Link 604+ 
> router without any negative side effects? Advice must be clear for me to 
> comprehend it.

It would replace it and then some. It has *more* functionality - not 
less.

> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless 
> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express 
> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room, 
> and that turned out not be be the case. It's been made clear by this 
> thread that I must additionally either buy a more modern router, or 
> fiddle with the delicate network settings on my current D-Link router 
> and maybe Imac, too.)
> 
> I thought I already have a wireless connection, because I was able to 
> wirelessly connect my Imac with a PC in the next room, so I must have 
> misunderstood what was meant by having a wireless connection. I didn't 
> know that "having a wireless connection" can mean two totally different 
> things.

No, that's what a wireless connection is. You do have one.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
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JR

M-M wrote:
> In article <9fEGm.49853$Db2.5175@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> In the second message of the thread, Michael recommended an Extreme, but 
>> Michele. AES and Sander responded that the recommendation should have 
>> been Express, so they seem to contradict your statement that only 
>> Extreme does Airtunes.
> 
> 
> Only the Express does Airtunes. The Extreme does not have the Audio-out 
> port.
> 
>  
>> Also, when I went to an Apple store and described my setup and my desire 
>> to play music wirelessly in the next room, the salesman who then sold me 
>> the Express advised that all I needed was the Express and the cable to 
>> connect to the speakers. He's the most zealous Mac fan I've met, but he 
>> also gave me incomplete advice, so obviously the situation is not "very 
>> simple".
> 
> 
> He is correct. You connect the Express to the router via ethernet cable, 
> and to your stereo via the audio cable (and to a USB printer if you'd 
> like to print wirelessly.)
> 
> 
>> I did attach the Express to the router with an Ethernet cable, but then 
>> my Internet connection was cut off.

If I connect the Express to the router in the other room, it's not a 
wireless connection. The aim was not to have to trouble with the cable 
snaking from one room to the other.

And the sales clerk at the Apple reseller didn't know that my router is 
too old to do the job and so he didn't warn me that the Express and 
cable that he sold me might be insufficient to pipe music wirelessly, 
and he didn't warn that I would have to replace my router as well.

I've learned that I should replace the router only after this long 
discourse.

> Are you still using the D-Link? Did you configure the Express correctly?

Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.

Robert

In article <michelle-8B44C8.16234728102009@news.eternal-september.org>,
 Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article 
> <nospam.m-m-C3544F.18235928102009@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
>  M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> wrote:
> 
> > base station = router
> 
> base station == router

Either one works : )

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <%WZFm.50570$PH1.26361@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <64lFm.49489$Db2.38027@edtnps83>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Jolly Roger wrote:
> >>> In article <201Fm.49304$Db2.15349@edtnps83>,
> >>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Jolly Roger wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Do you get the message if you turn off the firewall on this computer?
> >>>> When I turn off the firewall, and then click in Itunes on "Robert's 
> >>>> Airport Express" in the popup window in Itunes's lower, right corner, I 
> >>>> then no longer get the ""Your computer's firewall settings
> >>>>  >>> prevent you from using Airtunes" message, but I still get the 
> >>>> Airtunes' "Connecting to Robert's Airport Express" window with the 
> >>>> horizontal barbershop pole that keeps moving for a few minutes before it 
> >>>> goes away, and there's still no check mark beside "Robert's Airport 
> >>>> Express" in Itunes, so I turned the firewall back on.
> >>> Why?
> >> The same reason as everyone else who uses a firewall, obviously: to 
> >> protect against enemy fire.
> >>
> >> All of the information I've read says to keep the shields up at all times.
> > 
> > That's silly. Your D-Link router has a firewall. There's no need to run 
> > two firewalls back to back like that.
> 
> I didn't know that. I just searched on the Web and found out that the 
> D-Link 604+ does indeed have a firewall. I'm impressed with your 
> knowledge, Jolly.
> 
> But I just checked my D-Link's configuration page, and it says that the 
> firewall is disabled.
> 
> And I'm afraid to change my firewall settings. Are you sure that I can 
> activate the D-Link's firewall, and disable my Imac's firewall, without 
> any bad consequences?

I don't have hands-on experience with D-Link's firewalls, but I am 
willing to say that in general, the firewall provided by a hardware 
router such as this, is well-suited to protect computers plugged into 
it. So the answer is yes, with the understanding that I can't make any 
guarantees that the particular D-Link 604 unit you have is problem-free 
or configured / functioning correctly. Then again, we can say similar 
things about your computer (is the firewall configured and running 
correctly, etc).

Anyhow, if I were you, I'd get an Airport Extreme, configure it to be 
the singular firewall for all devices in my house, get audio streaming 
working and be done with it!

BTW, I stream music from my Mac Pro through my Airport Extreme to an 
Airport Express in another room which is plugged into speakers all the 
time. It works great!

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <user-4B988E.02290531102009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
>  Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:
> 
>> Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
>> AirTunes from working?
> 
> It might be that it's not compatible.

Michael  Villain wrote:

> The length of this thread and the apparent density of Mr. Montgomery 
> makes me wonder if this is a Marc Conrad sockpuppet or someone that just 
> shouldn't be using computers.  It's almost as if Mr. Montgomery is 
> _trying_ to have difficulty understanding our instructions.  The 
> question is, how much longer will it go on before he gets bored pulling 
> our collective legs or we cotton to his intentional technical density or 
> he just hires a kid from the local junior college to set it up for him.
> 
> Time will tell...

Why don't you ask Michael Villain how the router prevents Airtunes from 
working? Apparently he knows everything.

After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
fully understand the situation, and meanwhile Michael Villain is 
insulting me (a mid-tier user) of being stupid.

Why don't you explain it to me and the other experts, smart ass Michael 
Villain?

Robert

In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.

If the Airport Express is configured correctly, when you run Airport 
Utility on your Mac, you will see the Airport Express in the list on the 
left side of the window.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > In article <user-4B988E.02290531102009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
> >  Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:
> > 
> >> Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
> >> AirTunes from working?
> > 
> > It might be that it's not compatible.
> 
> Michael  Villain wrote:
> 
> > The length of this thread and the apparent density of Mr. Montgomery 
> > makes me wonder if this is a Marc Conrad sockpuppet or someone that just 
> > shouldn't be using computers.  It's almost as if Mr. Montgomery is 
> > _trying_ to have difficulty understanding our instructions.  The 
> > question is, how much longer will it go on before he gets bored pulling 
> > our collective legs or we cotton to his intentional technical density or 
> > he just hires a kid from the local junior college to set it up for him.
> > 
> > Time will tell...
> 
> Why don't you ask Michael Villain how the router prevents Airtunes from 
> working? Apparently he knows everything.
> 
> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
> fully understand the situation, and meanwhile Michael Villain is 
> insulting me (a mid-tier user) of being stupid.
> 
> Why don't you explain it to me and the other experts, smart ass Michael 
> Villain?

Yes that was a bit harsh. 

I think while it's obvious you don't understand some things about 
networking, I don't think you are intentionally trying to sabotage your 
chances at getting this working.  : )

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
> 
> If the Airport Express is configured correctly, when you run Airport 
> Utility on your Mac, you will see the Airport Express in the list on the 
> left side of the window.

Well, I did have it listed there a few times before, but it's not there 
now. I gave up trying to set it up again with my current configuration, 
because it's been revealed here that I should either change my settings 
somehow to avoid the conflict of having both the router and the Express 
sending out DHCP IP addresses, or get a more up-to-date router.

I don't know how to change the router settings to avoid the IP address 
conflict, so I decided to buy a new router to replace my old D-Link.

Is there a good brand of router that's cheaper than the Apple Extremes?

Robert

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <user-4B988E.02290531102009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
>>>  Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
>>>> AirTunes from working?
>>> It might be that it's not compatible.
>> Michael  Villain wrote:
>>
>>> The length of this thread and the apparent density of Mr. Montgomery 
>>> makes me wonder if this is a Marc Conrad sockpuppet or someone that just 
>>> shouldn't be using computers.  It's almost as if Mr. Montgomery is 
>>> _trying_ to have difficulty understanding our instructions.  The 
>>> question is, how much longer will it go on before he gets bored pulling 
>>> our collective legs or we cotton to his intentional technical density or 
>>> he just hires a kid from the local junior college to set it up for him.
>>>
>>> Time will tell...
>> Why don't you ask Michael Villain how the router prevents Airtunes from 
>> working? Apparently he knows everything.
>>
>> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
>> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
>> fully understand the situation, and meanwhile Michael Villain is 
>> insulting me (a mid-tier user) of being stupid.
>>
>> Why don't you explain it to me and the other experts, smart ass Michael 
>> Villain?
> 
> Yes that was a bit harsh. 
> 
> I think while it's obvious you don't understand some things about 
> networking, I don't think you are intentionally trying to sabotage your 
> chances at getting this working.  : )

Thanks, Jolly.

I think Micheal Villain is a hypocrite. My intentions are innocent, but 
his may not be. Consider the definition of "Villain": "a person guilty 
or capable of a crime or wickedness". Michael's surname aptly describes 
his character.

Robert

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <Fx_Fm.50578$PH1.27455@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

>>>> If I were to buy a new router, would this one be good? It's price is 
>>>> low: http://www.dlink.ca/products/?pid=478
>>> Have you considered the "lowest price" may not be exactly conducive to 
>>> "just works"? 
>> Yes. That's why I asked for opinions about that router.
> 
> Ok. Personally, I wouldn't waste my time or money on it.
> 
>>> I would think the plug-and-play nature of Apple's Airport Extreme router 
>>> would be quite attractive to someone who obviously doesn't know much 
>>> about networking!
>> Is that so? I didn't know the Airport Extreme is a router. The Apple Web 
>> site (http://www.apple.com/airportextreme/features/frequency.html) 
>> doesn't identify the Airport Extreme as a router. It identifies it as a 
>> device for "wirelsss network users" and as a "base station". I didn't 
>> know that "base station" is synonymous with "router".
>>
>> Are you sure that an Airport Extreme would replace the D-Link 604+ 
>> router without any negative side effects? Advice must be clear for me to 
>> comprehend it.
> 
> It would replace it and then some. It has *more* functionality - not 
> less.
> 
>> (Remember: I was advised by some folks that if I have a wireless 
>> connection, I needed to buy only powered speakers, an Airport Express 
>> and a cable to run between them, to get music to play in the next room, 
>> and that turned out not be be the case. It's been made clear by this 
>> thread that I must additionally either buy a more modern router, or 
>> fiddle with the delicate network settings on my current D-Link router 
>> and maybe Imac, too.)
>>
>> I thought I already have a wireless connection, because I was able to 
>> wirelessly connect my Imac with a PC in the next room, so I must have 
>> misunderstood what was meant by having a wireless connection. I didn't 
>> know that "having a wireless connection" can mean two totally different 
>> things.
> 
> No, that's what a wireless connection is. You do have one.

So I assume, then, that the PC in the next room (that I connected 
wirelessly to my Imac) doesn't act as a DHCP server.

The conflict as I understand it is between the Express and my D-Link 
router both being DHCP servers.

Robert

In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > In article <user-4B988E.02290531102009@newsreader.euronet.nl>,
> >  Sander Tekelenburg <user@domain.invalid> wrote:
> > 
> >> Just out of curiosity: how exactly does that that router prevent 
> >> AirTunes from working?
> > 
> > It might be that it's not compatible.
> 
> Michael  Villain wrote:
> 
> > The length of this thread and the apparent density of Mr. Montgomery 
> > makes me wonder if this is a Marc Conrad sockpuppet or someone that just 
> > shouldn't be using computers.  It's almost as if Mr. Montgomery is 
> > _trying_ to have difficulty understanding our instructions.  The 
> > question is, how much longer will it go on before he gets bored pulling 
> > our collective legs or we cotton to his intentional technical density or 
> > he just hires a kid from the local junior college to set it up for him.
> > 
> > Time will tell...
> 
> Why don't you ask Michael Villain how the router prevents Airtunes from 
> working? Apparently he knows everything.
> 
> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
> fully understand the situation, and meanwhile Michael Villain is 
> insulting me (a mid-tier user) of being stupid.
> 
> Why don't you explain it to me and the other experts, smart ass Michael 
> Villain?
> 
> Robert

Every once and a while, we get someone like Zara or Pyrim or Marc Conrad 
who raise the signal to noise ratio of the group by posting stuff just 
for the fun of it.  Marc is known for posting "I have a problem" stuff 
that clearly he doesn't really want help with.  

After 50+ emails to try to describe your networking setup (Marc posts 
opaque posts with minimal information to encourage people to post "tell 
us more" posts), you are still describing your computer and situation.  
Color me suspicious rather than hypocritical.  I realize that not 
everyone on the world knows everything, me included (even though it's 
very often all about me but I'm getting better at telling when it's 
not).  And the advantage of my name is that I always go that word right 
on spelling tests.  Ooops, I forgot, this email is not about me.

When I originally posted about your topic, I mentioned how I had to turn 
my cabled system into a WiFi system with a suitable wireless router 
(Linksys WRT54GL) that's "known to work" with Airtunes and an Airport 
Express box (I erroneously named it an Airport Extreme but others in the 
group soon corrected my mistake).  I was actually trying to help.  But 
as the message wore on and the discussions dragged out to minute detail, 
I began to wonder about your voracity.  

We're now at the 100+ mark and you're still having problems.  If this is 
part of a "I want to do it myself" project, great.  Leastways you won't 
flood your basement.  But I do apologize for thinking that you were not 
genuinely having problems and struggling to figure this whole thing with 
WiFi out.  Good luck.

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically by ignored]

In article <pQ_Gm.51000$PH1.21210@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> The conflict as I understand it is between the Express and my D-Link 
> router both being DHCP servers.

That can't be known with certainty without knowing how you have the 
Airport Express configured. Try this:

1. Open Airport Utility.
2. Select the Airport Express on the left side of the window.
3. Click "Manual Setup".
4. Post a screen shot of the Summary tab to a reply to this post.

..
..
..

How To Post Screen Shots To Newsgroups

You can post a screenshot link using a service like ImageShack. 
ImageShack
is an easy-to-use free media hosting service. It can be used to upload
images. Registration is not required in order to upload files.

1. On your keyboard, press Command-Shift-4.
2. On your keyboard, press the space bar.
3. Click the window you want. A picture file will appear on the desktop.
4. Go to http://imageshack.us/.
5. Click Browse, then navigate to and select the picture file.
6. Click "start upload!".
7. Paste the "Direct link to image" URL in a newsgroup message.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <UD_Gm.50992$PH1.8458@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Jolly Roger wrote:
> > In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
> >> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
> >> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
> >> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
> > 
> > If the Airport Express is configured correctly, when you run Airport 
> > Utility on your Mac, you will see the Airport Express in the list on the 
> > left side of the window.
> 
> Well, I did have it listed there a few times before, but it's not there 
> now. 

That indicates a problem to me. 

> I gave up trying to set it up again with my current configuration, 
> because it's been revealed here that I should either change my settings 
> somehow to avoid the conflict of having both the router and the Express 
> sending out DHCP IP addresses, or get a more up-to-date router.

How do we know for sure you have such a conflict? Are you sure you have 
configured your Airport Express to be a DHCP server??

> I don't know how to change the router settings to avoid the IP address 
> conflict, so I decided to buy a new router to replace my old D-Link.

That's probably just as well. I've never considered D-Link's routers to 
be among the better routers out there.

> Is there a good brand of router that's cheaper than the Apple Extremes?

Define "good" please.  : )

Seriously, none of them will come close to matching the plug-and-play 
and ease of use of the Airport Extreme. You do get what you pay for. In 
this case, you get additional headaches in the form of hard-to-use and 
less secure configuration interfaces with the cheaper ones.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
> fully understand the situation,

The problem is largely due to the fact that you have not clearly explained 
the situation.

To get airtunes to work, the computer, the router/base-station, and the 
Airport Express must all be on the same network.  That means that the 
router and the Airport Express must be connected to each other, either via 
an ethernet cable or via WiFi.  And the router must be compatible with 
airtunes.  Also, if there is any encryption required by the router (WEP or 
WPA), the Airport Express must be configured with the right password.

I don't know whether the router is compatible with airtunes.  I don't know 
whether you have airtunes' port blocked on the router.

I do know that your router is 802.11b, which is the slowest WiFi 
connection, and may not be airtunes capable.

You would probably be best off (except financially, because "buying" 
involves spending money) buying a new router/base station.  The two best 
options are the Airport Extreme and another Airport Express.

The Extreme is more expensive than the Express, but the Express would 
require you connect the Mac as well as the airtunes Express via wifi, 
because it has only one ethernet port.  The Extreme would allow you to 
connect either or both via ethernet or wifi (or mix one of each), but is 
more expensive.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <jollyroger-B24299.10371631102009@news.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> > > base station = router
> > 
> > base station == router
> 
> Either one works : )

depending on one's language.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.

That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
done via software.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

In article <UD_Gm.50992$PH1.8458@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[...]

> it's been revealed here that I should either change my settings 
> somehow to avoid the conflict of having both the router and the Express 
> sending out DHCP IP addresses, or get a more up-to-date router.

Nonsense. *If* the problem is that you have two DHCP servers active, 
then the obvious solution is to switch one of those off (the one on the 
AirportExpress, I'd say).

> [...] so I decided to buy a new router to replace my old D-Link.

You could. But it seems to me that nobody here yet knows what your 
actual problem is, so another router might solve exactly nothing.

-- 
Sander Tekelenburg, <http://www.euronet.nl/~tekelenb/>

Mac user: "Macs only have 40 viruses, tops!"
PC user: "SEE! Not even the virus writers support Macs!"

Jolly Roger wrote:

> In article <%WZFm.50570$PH1.26361@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> In article <64lFm.49489$Db2.38027@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

>> And I'm afraid to change my firewall settings. Are you sure that I can 
>> activate the D-Link's firewall, and disable my Imac's firewall, without 
>> any bad consequences?
> 
> I don't have hands-on experience with D-Link's firewalls, but I am 
> willing to say that in general, the firewall provided by a hardware 
> router such as this, is well-suited to protect computers plugged into 
> it. So the answer is yes, with the understanding that I can't make any 
> guarantees that the particular D-Link 604 unit you have is problem-free 
> or configured / functioning correctly. Then again, we can say similar 
> things about your computer (is the firewall configured and running 
> correctly, etc).
> 
> Anyhow, if I were you, I'd get an Airport Extreme, configure it to be 
> the singular firewall for all devices in my house, get audio streaming 
> working and be done with it!
> 
> BTW, I stream music from my Mac Pro through my Airport Extreme to an 
> Airport Express in another room which is plugged into speakers all the 
> time. It works great!

Thanks, Jolly.

Robert

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
> 
> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
> done via software.

That's false.

The dictionary in my Imace defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".

Robert

Sander Tekelenburg wrote:
> In article <UD_Gm.50992$PH1.8458@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>> it's been revealed here that I should either change my settings 
>> somehow to avoid the conflict of having both the router and the Express 
>> sending out DHCP IP addresses, or get a more up-to-date router.
> 
> Nonsense. *If* the problem is that you have two DHCP servers active, 
> then the obvious solution is to switch one of those off (the one on the 
> AirportExpress, I'd say).

There's no button on the Airport Express that I could turn off.

And even if there were, if I switched it off, I wouldn't be able to 
stream music from my Mac into the next room, where the Express and the 
speakers are.

>> [...] so I decided to buy a new router to replace my old D-Link.
> 
> You could. But it seems to me that nobody here yet knows what your 
> actual problem is, so another router might solve exactly nothing.

How can the cause of the problem be determined?

Robert

Jolly Roger wrote:
> In article <UD_Gm.50992$PH1.8458@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
>>>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
>>>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
>>>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
>>> If the Airport Express is configured correctly, when you run Airport 
>>> Utility on your Mac, you will see the Airport Express in the list on the 
>>> left side of the window.
>> Well, I did have it listed there a few times before, but it's not there 
>> now. 
> 
> That indicates a problem to me. 

I agree.

>> I gave up trying to set it up again with my current configuration, 
>> because it's been revealed here that I should either change my settings 
>> somehow to avoid the conflict of having both the router and the Express 
>> sending out DHCP IP addresses, or get a more up-to-date router.
> 
> How do we know for sure you have such a conflict? Are you sure you have 
> configured your Airport Express to be a DHCP server??

Well, it think that's what David Empson and maybe Nospam (can't recall 
for sure) indicated.
> 
>> I don't know how to change the router settings to avoid the IP address 
>> conflict, so I decided to buy a new router to replace my old D-Link.
> 
> That's probably just as well. I've never considered D-Link's routers to 
> be among the better routers out there.
> 
>> Is there a good brand of router that's cheaper than the Apple Extremes?
> 
> Define "good" please.  : )
> 
> Seriously, none of them will come close to matching the plug-and-play 
> and ease of use of the Airport Extreme. You do get what you pay for. In 
> this case, you get additional headaches in the form of hard-to-use and 
> less secure configuration interfaces with the cheaper ones.

Too bad. That'll double my cost. I've already spent close to $200 on 
this wireless music piping system and it's useless now.

Robert

In article <6YqJm.51926$PH1.1772@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
> >> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
> >> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
> >> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
> > 
> > That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
> > done via software.
> 
> That's false.
> 
> The dictionary in my Imace defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".
> 
> Robert

I agree with those who say that you're a troll.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
>> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
>> fully understand the situation,
> 
> The problem is largely due to the fact that you have not clearly explained 
> the situation. 

Perhaps I didn't fully explain the situation initially due to my lack of 
  technical expertise, but the contributors here have had plenty of 
opportunities to find out subsequently what my situation is, because I 
write well and I've been eager to answer the questions posed so that I 
can solve this vexing problem.

We've now had about 120 messages in this thread, and even now you've 
written that you're not sure if my D-Link 604+ base station is Airtunes 
compatible and it's not known if my Airtunes port is blocked on the 
router, so if there's a lack of clarity, it's not all my fault.

And you may have noticed that – as usually and inevitably occurs because 
people can['t agree on anything – there's been much conflicting advice, 
which naturally complicates the situation and causes me to change my 
planned course of action frequently.

> To get airtunes to work, the computer, the router/base-station, and the 
> Airport Express must all be on the same network.  That means that the 
> router and the Airport Express must be connected to each other, either via 
> an ethernet cable or via WiFi.  And the router must be compatible with 
> airtunes.  Also, if there is any encryption required by the router (WEP or 
> WPA), the Airport Express must be configured with the right password.
> 
> I don't know whether the router is compatible with airtunes.  I don't know 
> whether you have airtunes' port blocked on the router.

How could I find out if I have Airtunes's port blocked by the router? Or 
is it beyond my ken to find out?

> I do know that your router is 802.11b, which is the slowest WiFi 
> connection, and may not be airtunes capable.
> 
> You would probably be best off (except financially, because "buying" 
> involves spending money) buying a new router/base station.  The two best 
> options are the Airport Extreme and another Airport Express.
> 
> The Extreme is more expensive than the Express, but the Express would 
> require you connect the Mac as well as the airtunes Express via wifi, 
> because it has only one ethernet port.  The Extreme would allow you to 
> connect either or both via ethernet or wifi (or mix one of each), but is 
> more expensive.

I'm considering buy a second Express, but I'm concerned, because you 
just wrote that my D-Link 604+ router, which is 802.11b, may not be 
Airtunes compatible, so you've implied that even with a second Express, 
I might still have problems.

Robert

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <6YqJm.51926$PH1.1772@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
>>>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
>>>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
>>>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
>>> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
>>> done via software.

>> That's false.
>>
>> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
>> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".
>>
>> Robert
> 
> I agree with those who say that you're a troll.

So you're coming up with your own definition of words?

How can you imply that the dictionary is wrong?

Let's be clear. To be clear, you have to use words that everyone 
understands. If you're going to come up with your own definitions of 
words, you're only going to confuse people.

And if you then also accuse people of being mischief-makers, if makes 
you look like a hypocrite. Using terms properly � as defined by 
dictionaries � is not making mischief.

I get the feeling that you have difficulty admitting that you're wrong, 
and perhaps that rankles you because you don't like being corrected by 
someone with less technical expertise than you have.

Goodness gracious, thicken your skin and be polite.

Robert

In article <4UsJm.51933$PH1.42709@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > In article <6YqJm.51926$PH1.1772@edtnps82>,
> >  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Michelle Steiner wrote:
> >>> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
> >>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
> >>>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
> >>>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
> >>>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
> >>> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
> >>> done via software.
> 
> >> That's false.
> >>
> >> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
> >> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".
> >>
> >> Robert
> > 
> > I agree with those who say that you're a troll.
> 
> So you're coming up with your own definition of words?
> 
> How can you imply that the dictionary is wrong?
> 
> Let's be clear. To be clear, you have to use words that everyone 
> understands. If you're going to come up with your own definitions of 
> words, you're only going to confuse people.
> 
> And if you then also accuse people of being mischief-makers, if makes 
> you look like a hypocrite. Using terms properly � as defined by 
> dictionaries � is not making mischief.
> 
> I get the feeling that you have difficulty admitting that you're wrong, 
> and perhaps that rankles you because you don't like being corrected by 
> someone with less technical expertise than you have.
> 
> Goodness gracious, thicken your skin and be polite.
> 
> Robert

Yep.  However harsh my initial assessment was about this guy, the shear 
number of posts about him trying to figure out this problem and 
stumbling at almost every turn has me wondering.  Can anyone be this 
clueless about computers and still be able to use them effectively?  I'm 
thinking specifically of the "12 o'clock flasher" syndrome.  Sound 
familiar?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LLTsSnGWMI

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically by ignored]

Michael Vilain wrote:
> In article <4UsJm.51933$PH1.42709@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>> In article <6YqJm.51926$PH1.1772@edtnps82>,
>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Michelle Steiner wrote:
>>>>> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961@edtnps83>,
>>>>>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express 
>>>>>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the 
>>>>>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I 
>>>>>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet.
>>>>> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
>>>>> done via software.
>>>> That's false.
>>>>
>>>> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
>>>> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".
>>>>
>>>> Robert
>>> I agree with those who say that you're a troll.
>> So you're coming up with your own definition of words?
>>
>> How can you imply that the dictionary is wrong?
>>
>> Let's be clear. To be clear, you have to use words that everyone 
>> understands. If you're going to come up with your own definitions of 
>> words, you're only going to confuse people.
>>
>> And if you then also accuse people of being mischief-makers, if makes 
>> you look like a hypocrite. Using terms properly � as defined by 
>> dictionaries � is not making mischief.
>>
>> I get the feeling that you have difficulty admitting that you're wrong, 
>> and perhaps that rankles you because you don't like being corrected by 
>> someone with less technical expertise than you have.
>>
>> Goodness gracious, thicken your skin and be polite.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> Yep.  However harsh my initial assessment was about this guy, the shear 
> number of posts about him trying to figure out this problem and 
> stumbling at almost every turn has me wondering.  Can anyone be this 
> clueless about computers and still be able to use them effectively?  I'm 
> thinking specifically of the "12 o'clock flasher" syndrome.  Sound 
> familiar?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LLTsSnGWMI


That video was one-sided, Michael ; there's an overabundance of stupid 
help desk tech support people, too.

I'm a lot more adept at computers than the average computer user. That 
video was about people who don't even know how to turn on a computer,

Most people I've recommended newsgroups to (to solve problems) don't 
even know what newsgroups are. And the average computer user has no idea 
of what 802.11_ signifies, what affect IPV6 might have, and how to 
change the basic settings of a router configuration page without the 
help of a tech supporter.

Your criticism is ironic, Michael. If (and Michelle) are so smart � as 
you both smugly still imply � why didn't either of you � or both of you 
� correctly figure out the problems and solutions? As I pointed out 
before (you still don't get it) neither of you warned me before I went 
out to buy my Express, cables and speakers, that my router might be a 
problem.

What I can't figure out is how people like you could be good at 
computers when you lack common sense. The issue is complicated, but you 
want me to rush to a store and buy a device when we didn't even know 
what the problem was. For an example of the complexity of the issue, 
somebody here just wrote that I can fix the problem by changing my 
settings, and that hardware has nothing to do with the problem � 
contradicting the advice of others such as David Empson, yet you had 
nothing to contribute to resolve that dichotomy.

How could you possibly be good at computers when you keep on jumping to 
conclusions � claiming that the issues are simple when they're complex? 
It's a paradox, because you can't be proficient at computers without 
delving and that means not making hasty assumptions and actions.

Different people have had different solutions to this problem. There's 
not one, easy answer. But you continue to be such dumbbells that you 
don't get this.

For example, some people have solved my problem by disabling IPV6 in 
their Network control panel. Neither you nor Michelle suggested that, 
yet you claim that my issue is simple. I don't think anyone in this 
thread even suggested that IPV6 might be the culprit. I had to find that 
out by searching on the Web It's mind-boggling that you keep on 
over-simplifying things.

It was only by persistent delving by me and the people trying to help me 
  that we figured out my problem and the best options.

And Michelle (who implied that I was purposely exaggerating my problem 
to anger people) has been shown to have given wrong advice. She claimed 
incorrectly that Airtunes might not work and that a second Express might 
still not work because of the blocking of the signal, but David 
explained how to avoid such a conflict. So how come neither she nor you 
figured that out, since you're both smart alecs and claim to be much 
smarter than me? You both accused me of being foolish and mischievous, 
but both of you have been made to look foolish in this thread. It's 
ironic and hypocritical.

I think you're not cut out to be a volunteer computer advisor because 
when the solutions are not quickly apparent, you lack patience and jump 
to conclusions and then insult the computer users seeking help. You keep 
on looking for a quick fix, even though that's reckless and stupid.

Robert

Michelle Steiner wrote:
> In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603@edtnps83>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
>> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at 
>> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't 
>> fully understand the situation,
> 
> The problem is largely due to the fact that you have not clearly explained 
> the situation.

If I didn't initially clearly explain the situation, then the onus is on 
you to  clearly ask the right questions, given your superior knowledge 
of computers.

Robert

In article <2cFJm.51981$PH1.43938@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

[deleted]
> I think you're not cut out to be a volunteer computer advisor because 
> when the solutions are not quickly apparent, you lack patience and jump 
> to conclusions and then insult the computer users seeking help. You keep 
> on looking for a quick fix, even though that's reckless and stupid.
> 
> Robert

I think that's mostly true, especially if for free.  IMO lengthy 
problems solving of detailed technical issues frequently aren't 
effectively diagnosed and solved unless there's intelligent data 
gathering at the problem site.  So far, you at least discovered what you 
don't know (level 1-uninformed).  That's better than before when you 
didn't know that you didn't know (level 0-totally clueless, there's also 
"-1"-don't care).  I knew next to nothing about WiFi and still don't 
know a lot.  I was able to read up and ask friends questions _before_ 
starting my Airtunes project.  When it didn't work, I used Apple's Help 
feature to find and unblock ports.  You, apparently, need more hand 
holding.  Ever think of hiring someone to help?  There's nothing wrong 
with stopping and asking for directions (although with GPS, men won't 
have to do that any more). 

Time will tell if you're for real or not.  Typical of a toll is to drop 
back on dictionary definitions when challenged as the goal is to stretch 
the interaction out as long as possible.  You seem to fit this profile 
more and more.  My hats off to David in NZ for sticking with this guy 
(even though I don't wear hats).

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically by ignored]

In article <m2sJm.51931$PH1.17389@edtnps82>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> > The Extreme is more expensive than the Express, but the Express would 
> > require you connect the Mac as well as the airtunes Express via wifi, 
> > because it has only one ethernet port.  The Extreme would allow you to 
> > connect either or both via ethernet or wifi (or mix one of each), but 
> > is more expensive.
> 
> I'm considering buy a second Express, but I'm concerned, because you 
> just wrote that my D-Link 604+ router, which is 802.11b, may not be 
> Airtunes compatible, so you've implied that even with a second Express, 
> I might still have problems.

If you buy a second Express, or if you buy an Extreme, it would be to 
replace the D-Link.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign

M-M wrote:

>> You can set up an AirPort wireless network in minutes, without special 
>> tools."

What about my settings in Internet Connect > 802.1x? Do I need to be 
concerned about the settings there?

Currently, the settings are:

Confiugration: Other
Network Port: Airport
User name:
Password:
Wireless Network:

Robert

Michael Vilain wrote:
> In article <2cFJm.51981$PH1.43938@edtnps82>,
>  Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:
> 
> [deleted]
>> I think you're not cut out to be a volunteer computer advisor because 
>> when the solutions are not quickly apparent, you lack patience and jump 
>> to conclusions and then insult the computer users seeking help. You keep 
>> on looking for a quick fix, even though that's reckless and stupid.
>>
>> Robert
> 
> I think that's mostly true, especially if for free.  

That opprobrium applies to you, too, buster.

> IMO lengthy 
> problems solving of detailed technical issues frequently aren't 
> effectively diagnosed and solved unless there's intelligent data 
> gathering at the problem site.  

That has been accomplished, albeit slowly, but that was because the 
problem is complex.

So far, you at least discovered what you
> don't know (level 1-uninformed).  That's better than before when you 
> didn't know that you didn't know (level 0-totally clueless, there's also 
> "-1"-don't care).  I knew next to nothing about WiFi and still don't 
> know a lot.  I was able to read up and ask friends questions _before_ 
> starting my Airtunes project.  

You are my computer friends. My nearby computer friends aren't 
Mac-knowledgeable enough to be tech support staff.

When it didn't work, I used Apple's Help
> feature to find and unblock ports.  

If I assumed that the problem of not being able to stream music 
wirelessly was caused by the ports being blocked, I'd be making one of 
the muttonheaded assumptions that I alluded to in the first paragraph. 
You apparently still don't get that point.

Zeroing in on port blocking would not likely have solved the problem, 
and I (and the other readers) would not have learned that:
1. D-Link 604+ modem-routers are out-of-date and need replacement
2. I could likely solve the problem by having two Airport Expresses 
along with my D-Link, or add one Airport Extreme to my existing Airport 
Express and D-Link router-modem
3. I need a new router-modem anyway to upgrade from WEP to WPA/WPA2 
security and
4. that I should upgrade to a G/B router-modem but that I don't need an 
"N" router-modem at this time.

You, apparently, need more hand
> holding.  Ever think of hiring someone to help?  There's nothing wrong 
> with stopping and asking for directions (although with GPS, men won't 
> have to do that any more). 

I can't afford to hire much help. And much of the paid help is 
ineffective. Last week, for example, I paid for an hour's worth of Epson 
tech support time on the phone, and in the end, the tech support man was 
unable to solve my problem regarding my Epson printer.

> Time will tell if you're for real or not.  

I repeat my first paragraph, because you still don't get it: "I think 
you're not cut out to be a volunteer computer advisor because
when the solutions are not quickly apparent, you lack patience and jump
to conclusions and then insult the computer users seeking help. You keep
 >> on looking for a quick fix, even though that's reckless and stupid.

Typical of a troll is to drop
> back on dictionary definitions when challenged as the goal is to stretch 
> the interaction out as long as possible.  You seem to fit this profile 
> more and more.  

No; the purpose of relying on dictionary definitions is to defend myself 
against unfair attack; I was accused unfairly of allegedly using the 
word "configuration" improperly.

Michele:
>> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration.  Configuration is 
>> > > done via software.

Robert:
>> That's false.
>> 
>> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement in 
>> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".

The official meaning of the word "configuration" can mean software or 
hardware, as my dictionary quote clearly indicates. You're missing my 
obvious, valid point. There's nothing wrong with quoting dictionaries to 
clear up misunderstandings. Quoting dictionaries resolves disagreements. 
NOT eferring to dictionaries when there's a disagreement about 
terminology is part of what leads to greater problems, because no 
complex issues can be reasonably debated without defining the terms of 
reference. This is just common sense.

> Typical of a troll is to..

Typical of a troll is to unreasonably find fault with someone like me � 
a person who's genuinely trying to solve a genuine problem, and to jump 
to the iirational assumption that the OP has nothing better to do than 
to spend much time making mischief. YOU (and Michelle) are therefore the 
ones who comes across as mischief-makers.

If you're not happy with your job, Michael, why don't you ask for a raise?

Robert

In article <XEv_m.57738$Db2.32248@edtnps83>,
 Robert Montgomery <info-block@northern-data-tech.net> wrote:

> >> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement 
> >> in which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected".
> 
> The official meaning of the word "configuration" can mean software or 
> hardware, as my dictionary quote clearly indicates.

Resorting to a general dictionary instead of using definitions for specific 
usage is not productive, and is indicative of a person who is either 
clueless or who is not really interested in solutions, but who is prone to 
argue for the sake of argument.

> YOU (and Michelle) are therefore the 
> ones who comes across as mischief-makers.

And that puts you in the category of someone who is not really interested 
in solutions, but who is prone to argue for the sake of argument.

-- 
Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign