f



MacWorld folds

<http://tidbits.com/article/15062>

Macworld Lays Off Staffers, Closes Print Edition
My Twitter feed just exploded with the news that numerous long-time
Macworld editors, including Dan Frakes, Roman Loyola, Philip Michaels,
Dan Miller, and Dan Moren have been laid off. (There is no truth the
rumor that Macworld parent IDG just had too many editors named �Dan� on
the books.) In addition, Jason Snell has quit; he was a senior vice
president and editorial director for IDG Consumer.

Specific details about what happened emerged quickly afterwards, with
Macworld Editor Dan Miller confirming that the print edition of
Macworld would be going away and the macworld.com Web site would
continue with a reduced staff. Exactly who that will include remains to
be seen, with Chris Breen being the only well-known Macworld
contributor to say that he wasn�t laid off. Dan Miller later said that
macworld.com would continue to hire freelancers.

The timing was particularly grating, since a number of the Macworld
staff had put in especially long hours the day before covering Apple�s
announcement of the iPhone 6, Apple Pay, and the Apple Watch. IDG
should be ashamed.
IDG has made no official statement, either about the layoffs or the
closing of the print edition of Macworld, and the company�s
business-as-usual home page still displays the wonderfully awkward
Twitter feed box showing tweets from the laid-off editors.

We at TidBITS are tremendously sorry to hear about the layoffs. These
people have been friends and colleagues for years, and although
occasional turnover in the industry is inevitable, mass layoffs like
this are deeply unsettling. Some of them have written for TidBITS and
worked on Take Control in the past, and all have been mentioned in our
pages. We hope to have the opportunity to work with them in the future.
Also troubling is the demise of the print edition of Macworld. Since
the launch of the Macintosh in 1984, Macworld has been a stalwart of
the Mac community, a role that has continued through the 1997 merger
with MacUser (see �MacUser and Macworld Merge,� 11 August 1997) and the
disappearance of MacWEEK (�MacWEEK to Roll into MacCentral,� 5 March
2001). The print magazine world is tough, but it�s still surprising
that Macworld would fold now, with Apple so dominant and Apple products
used by so many millions around the world.
0
Michelle
9/10/2014 1:01:01 AM
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In article <100920141340010051%michelle@michelle.org>,
 Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
> 
> Macworld Lays Off Staffers, Closes Print Edition
> My Twitter feed just exploded with the news that numerous long-time
> Macworld editors, including Dan Frakes, Roman Loyola, Philip Michaels,
> Dan Miller, and Dan Moren have been laid off.

I just checked, and have a year left on my current subscription. No 
telling what that may morph into, if anything. I've lost money of things 
like that in the past.

I can't imaging the iOS newsstand edition continuing in any kind of 
recognizable form. They've fired too many of their good contributors for 
that to happen.

I only visit Macworls.com if something interesting shows up in their RSS 
feed or email newsletter.

And one more thing, it was pretty shitty firing everyone just after they 
put in such a hard day's work at the 9/9 event.

-- 
chrispam1@me.com is a filtered spam magnet. Email replies may be lost.
You're better off replying to this newsgroup.
0
Chris
9/10/2014 9:57:47 PM
On 2014-09-10 20:40:01 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:

> The timing was particularly grating, since a number of the Macworld
> staff had put in especially long hours the day before covering Apple�s
> announcement of the iPhone 6, Apple Pay, and the Apple Watch. IDG
> should be ashamed.

I would assume they'd publish this work on their website.

> Since the launch of the Macintosh in 1984, Macworld has been a stalwart of
> the Mac community, a role that has continued through the 1997 merger
> with MacUser (see �MacUser and Macworld Merge,� 11 August 1997) and the
> disappearance of MacWEEK (�MacWEEK to Roll into MacCentral,� 5 March
> 2001). The print magazine world is tough, but it�s still surprising
> that Macworld would fold now, with Apple so dominant and Apple products
> used by so many millions around the world.

I was sad to see the printing of complete manuals accompany software 
purchase for the past 15 years or so.

And the evaporation of liner notes from CD's that I purchase on line.  
Who cares who played bass on the 3rd cut?

And ventriloquism has been in the doldrums for years... 

0
gtr
9/10/2014 11:04:58 PM
On 2014-09-10 23:04:58 +0000, gtr said:

> On 2014-09-10 20:40:01 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:
> 
>> The timing was particularly grating, since a number of the Macworld
>> staff had put in especially long hours the day before covering Apple�s
>> announcement of the iPhone 6, Apple Pay, and the Apple Watch. IDG
>> should be ashamed.
> 
> I would assume they'd publish this work on their website.

In fact they seem to have done that already.

0
gtr
9/10/2014 11:07:30 PM
On 2014.09.10, 16:40 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
>

One of those sad, but inevitable things.  When I got my first Mac I got 
a complimentary subscription for about 4 months (IIRC).  Then I renewed 
for a year.  But given how much info I could get on the web from various 
sites (incl. MacWorld) continuing a subscription for a magazine that I 
hardly leafed through to see the mags pile up didn't seem productive.


-- 
I was born a 1%er - I'm just more equal than the rest.


0
Alan
9/11/2014 1:01:01 AM
On Wed, 10 Sep 2014 14:57:47 -0700, Chris Schram <chrispam1@me.com>
wrote:

>In article <100920141340010051%michelle@michelle.org>,
> Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
>> 

  <<snipped>>
>
>And one more thing, it was pretty shitty firing everyone just after they 
>put in such a hard day's work at the 9/9 event.

 Maybe that was the last camel that broke the back of the straw? Some
Big Boss didn't like the coverage? 
 Or is that tin-foil-hat territory?
                                      J.
0
John
9/11/2014 1:03:04 AM
Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
[snip]

Gee, I always figured MacWorld would be the very last Mac magazine. Not
right in the middle of the end to monthly Mac print news.

-- 
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
0
jamiekg
9/11/2014 4:00:19 AM
Okay, so one time? In band camp? Chris Schram <chrispam1@me.com> was all, like: 
 --> 	 Wed, 10 Sep 2014 14:57:47 -0700 <chrispam1-36BD6C.14574710092014@nntp.aioe.org>
> And one more thing, it was pretty shitty firing everyone just after they 
> put in such a hard day's work at the 9/9 event.

I think this is the issue that has people pissed off. It is the issue
that pissed me off. I suspect it is the issue that pissed of Jason Snell
too.

-- 
A FIRE DRILL DOES NOT DEMAND A FIRE Bart chalkboard Ep. 4F16
0
Lewis
9/11/2014 5:52:53 AM
On 2014-09-10, gtr <xxx@yyy.zzz> wrote:
> On 2014-09-10 20:40:01 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:
>
>> The timing was particularly grating, since a number of the Macworld
>> staff had put in especially long hours the day before covering Apple¹s
>> announcement of the iPhone 6, Apple Pay, and the Apple Watch. IDG
>> should be ashamed.
>
> I would assume they'd publish this work on their website.
>
>> Since the launch of the Macintosh in 1984, Macworld has been a stalwart of
>> the Mac community, a role that has continued through the 1997 merger
>> with MacUser (see ³MacUser and Macworld Merge,² 11 August 1997) and the
>> disappearance of MacWEEK (³MacWEEK to Roll into MacCentral,² 5 March
>> 2001). The print magazine world is tough, but it¹s still surprising
>> that Macworld would fold now, with Apple so dominant and Apple products
>> used by so many millions around the world.
>
> I was sad to see the printing of complete manuals accompany software 
> purchase for the past 15 years or so.
>
> And the evaporation of liner notes from CD's that I purchase on line.  
> Who cares who played bass on the 4rd cut?

Me.

>
> And ventriloquism has been in the doldrums for years... 
>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-ZkJdQok2c

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL357BrwK7c


0
Huge
9/11/2014 9:00:06 AM
In article <9da8ec7a-202f-414d-b0b2-016c6110bcf5@googlegroups.com>, The
Translucent Amoebae <thetranslucentamoebae@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 10, 2014 1:40:01 PM UTC-7, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
> > 
> > Macworld Lays Off Staffers, Closes Print Edition
> > 
> > My Twitter feed just exploded with the news that numerous long-time
> > 
> > Macworld ...
> 
> If they go to Digital Tablet Editions; You may be able to get it, and many
> other current magazines for FREE through your Library and Zinio, I suspect
> that it is so cheap to distribute them this way, they are being paid for
> purely through the advertising ( ? ) 
> Ask your librarian about this service.
> P.S. ( you are ostensibly 'borrowing' them, ( forever ) ( ? ) )

Yep, the public libraries here in New Zealand started that free digital
magazine service a while back. I haven't looked into it, so I don't
know if they are fully up to date, or if there is some arrangement
where they are delayed (for example, issues only up to "last month",
but not "this month").
0
Your
9/12/2014 1:01:01 AM
Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> On 2014.09.10, 16:40 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
> >
> 
> One of those sad, but inevitable things.  When I got my first Mac I got
> a complimentary subscription for about 4 months (IIRC).  Then I renewed
> for a year.  But given how much info I could get on the web from various
> sites (incl. MacWorld) continuing a subscription for a magazine that I
> hardly leafed through to see the mags pile up didn't seem productive.

There was a time - back in the 90's - I was regularly buying at least a
few of MacAddict (now MacLife), MacFormat UK, MacWorld US, MacWorld
Australian (by far the best edition, IMO!), MacWorld UK... I'm
forgetting one, at least... hmmm...

Anyway, depending on what I saw from a quick flick through at the
newsstand, I'd end up with anywhere from two to four Mac mags per month
:-) Those were the days when they were the best source of Mac news and
reviews, before the WWW really matured. Earlier in my life as a kid I
remember first reading about the WWW and the Mosaic browser in MacWorld
US!
-- 
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
0
jamiekg
9/12/2014 2:09:00 AM
In article <1lrv5ph.lb9peg15m1gqoN%jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz>, Jamie
Kahn Genet <jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz> wrote:

> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> 
> > On 2014.09.10, 16:40 , Michelle Steiner wrote:
> > > <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
> > >
> > 
> > One of those sad, but inevitable things.  When I got my first Mac I got
> > a complimentary subscription for about 4 months (IIRC).  Then I renewed
> > for a year.  But given how much info I could get on the web from various
> > sites (incl. MacWorld) continuing a subscription for a magazine that I
> > hardly leafed through to see the mags pile up didn't seem productive.
> 
> There was a time - back in the 90's - I was regularly buying at least a
> few of MacAddict (now MacLife), MacFormat UK, MacWorld US, MacWorld
> Australian (by far the best edition, IMO!), MacWorld UK... I'm
> forgetting one, at least... hmmm...
> 
> Anyway, depending on what I saw from a quick flick through at the
> newsstand, I'd end up with anywhere from two to four Mac mags per month
> :-) Those were the days when they were the best source of Mac news and
> reviews, before the WWW really matured. Earlier in my life as a kid I
> remember first reading about the WWW and the Mosaic browser in MacWorld
> US!

I haven't seen anything in the regular MacWorld junk emails about this
yet.

Last time I looked, MacWorld suffers from far too many adverts, far too
boring look, far too boring content, and simply takes itself far too
seriously.

I only buy print magazines, mostly because I prefer them, but partly
because I don't have anything that can read the digital versions. I buy
the MacFormat magazine every month from the local stationery shop. It's
a much better magazine, although the writer of the "help section" can
be a hopeless idiot (largely due to being an ex-Windows writer).
Occasionally I'll buy other Mac magazines if there's something of
interest.

It's a bit annoying that most magazines no longer include a cover disk
/ disc. That used to be a great way for me to get some software. I
still use a copy of ColorIt (under Classic) from an old MacFormat cover
floppy disk as my main "paint" and "photoshop" application.  :-)

I've still got piles of MacFormat magazines sitting on the bookshelf,
almost every issue since the start, but some issues never turned up in
New Zealand, and almost every cover disk / disc in the drawers beside
my comuter desk. (I've still got a pile of Amiga Format magazines too,
but not the cover disks.)
0
Your
9/12/2014 2:28:14 AM
On Wednesday, September 10, 2014 1:40:01 PM UTC-7, Michelle Steiner wrote:
> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Macworld Lays Off Staffers, Closes Print Edition
>=20
> My Twitter feed just exploded with the news that numerous long-time
>=20
> Macworld ...

If they go to Digital Tablet Editions; You may be able to get it, and many =
other current magazines for FREE through your Library and Zinio, I suspect =
that it is so cheap to distribute them this way, they are being paid for pu=
rely through the advertising ( ? )=20
Ask your librarian about this service.
P.S. ( you are ostensibly 'borrowing' them, ( forever ) ( ? ) )
0
The
9/12/2014 6:24:17 PM


On 9/10/14 3:40 PM, in article 100920141340010051%michelle@michelle.org,
"Michelle Steiner" <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> <http://tidbits.com/article/15062>
> 
> Macworld Lays Off Staffers, Closes Print Edition
> My Twitter feed just exploded with the news that numerous long-time
> Macworld editors, including Dan Frakes, Roman Loyola, Philip Michaels,
> Dan Miller, and Dan Moren have been laid off. (There is no truth the
> rumor that Macworld parent IDG just had too many editors named �Dan� on
> the books.) In addition, Jason Snell has quit; he was a senior vice
> president and editorial director for IDG Consumer.
> 
> Specific details about what happened emerged quickly afterwards, with
> Macworld Editor Dan Miller confirming that the print edition of
> Macworld would be going away and the macworld.com Web site would
> continue with a reduced staff. Exactly who that will include remains to
> be seen, with Chris Breen being the only well-known Macworld
> contributor to say that he wasn�t laid off. Dan Miller later said that
> macworld.com would continue to hire freelancers.
> 
> The timing was particularly grating, since a number of the Macworld
> staff had put in especially long hours the day before covering Apple�s
> announcement of the iPhone 6, Apple Pay, and the Apple Watch. IDG
> should be ashamed.
> IDG has made no official statement, either about the layoffs or the
> closing of the print edition of Macworld, and the company�s
> business-as-usual home page still displays the wonderfully awkward
> Twitter feed box showing tweets from the laid-off editors.
> 
> We at TidBITS are tremendously sorry to hear about the layoffs. These
> people have been friends and colleagues for years, and although
> occasional turnover in the industry is inevitable, mass layoffs like
> this are deeply unsettling. Some of them have written for TidBITS and
> worked on Take Control in the past, and all have been mentioned in our
> pages. We hope to have the opportunity to work with them in the future.
> Also troubling is the demise of the print edition of Macworld. Since
> the launch of the Macintosh in 1984, Macworld has been a stalwart of
> the Mac community, a role that has continued through the 1997 merger
> with MacUser (see �MacUser and Macworld Merge,� 11 August 1997) and the
> disappearance of MacWEEK (�MacWEEK to Roll into MacCentral,� 5 March
> 2001). The print magazine world is tough, but it�s still surprising
> that Macworld would fold now, with Apple so dominant and Apple products
> used by so many millions around the world.

A real shame. It seems like I never really had to pay to subscribe to it
until a couple of years ago because of the fact that I got a free yearly
subscription because we were always buying a Mac computer in one form or
another yearly.

I did notice that in the past couple of years as well a thinning of each
issue published. Guess that was due to decrease in advertising. Another step
it seems in the eventual demise of printed materials in general, I guess.

0
George
9/13/2014 11:35:00 PM
On 2014-09-14, George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?

I'm not sure its entry as "World's ugliest car" ever went away.


-- 
Today is Boomtime, the 38th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3180
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere,
diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies”. Groucho Marx.
0
Huge
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <D03A3ED4.AF69D%ghost_topper@hotmail.com>, George Kerby
<ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
<snip>
> Another step it seems in the eventual demise of printed materials 
> in general, I guess.

To misquote Mark Twain ...

    "The reports of printed materials death have
     been greatly exaggerated."

:-)

The printed book and magazine isn't going to disappear any time soon,
although many indivudla publications may well either move to just
digital editions or stop production completely. 

Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.
0
Your
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <150920140921208249%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
<YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records. 

no they're not. 

a few indie bands do, but those don't sell in any appreciable numbers.
0
nospam
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <D03B1DD2.AF713%ghost_topper@hotmail.com>, George Kerby
<ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 9/13/14 8:01 PM, in article 140920141301357119%YourName@YourISP.com,
> "Your Name" <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> > In article <D03A3ED4.AF69D%ghost_topper@hotmail.com>, George Kerby
> > <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> 
> > <snip>
> >> Another step it seems in the eventual demise of printed materials
> >> in general, I guess.
> > 
> > To misquote Mark Twain ...
> > 
> >     "The reports of printed materials death have
> >      been greatly exaggerated."
> > 
> > :-)
> > 
> > The printed book and magazine isn't going to disappear any time soon,
> > although many indivudla publications may well either move to just
> > digital editions or stop production completely.
> > 
> > Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent
> > years.
> 
> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?

The current generation of lazy, talentless hacks in charge of things
are remaking / resurrecting pretty much everything, so I wouldn't be at
all surprised.
0
Your
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <c7lrarF236nU3@mid.individual.net>, Huge
<Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:
> On 2014-09-14, George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
> 
> I'm not sure its entry as "World's ugliest car" ever went away.

Nope. That award more recently went to the Nissan Leaf (and most other
electric cars).   ;-)
0
Your
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <su5heb-cee1.ln1@news.chingola.ch>, Paul Sture
<nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> On 2014-09-14, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> > 
> > Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.
> 
> I came across an old tape I had forgotten about the other day and it
> had the clunk of the playback head landing on the vinyl at the beginning.
> 
> It was a surprisingly nostalgic moment.

More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records. 

Just flicking through the dozen pages in the music section of the
September 2014 freebie magazine from the JB Hi-Fi chain here in New
Zealand (which sells electronics, DVDs, music and games), there are
adverts for new albums "available on CD and vinyl" from Kimbra and
Royal Blood, and a release of The Beatles albums, as individual or a
box set, of "remastered LPs cut from the original analogue tapes at
Abbey Road Studios, pressed on heavyweight 180g vinyl".

A couple of the local annual fundraiser second-hand book sales also
have old vinyl records, and the number of people you see trawling
through the piles has been slowly growing.
0
Your
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <150920140921208249%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
<YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> In article <su5heb-cee1.ln1@news.chingola.ch>, Paul Sture
> <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> > On 2014-09-14, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> > > 
> > > Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.
> > 
> > I came across an old tape I had forgotten about the other day and it
> > had the clunk of the playback head landing on the vinyl at the beginning.
> > 
> > It was a surprisingly nostalgic moment.
> 
> More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records. 
> 
> Just flicking through the dozen pages in the music section of the
> September 2014 freebie magazine from the JB Hi-Fi chain here in New
> Zealand (which sells electronics, DVDs, music and games), there are
> adverts for new albums "available on CD and vinyl" from Kimbra and
> Royal Blood, and a release of The Beatles albums, as individual or a
> box set, of "remastered LPs cut from the original analogue tapes at
> Abbey Road Studios, pressed on heavyweight 180g vinyl".
> 
> A couple of the local annual fundraiser second-hand book sales also
> have old vinyl records, and the number of people you see trawling
> through the piles has been slowly growing.

Oops! I nearly missed it. In that same JB Hi-Fi freebie magazine music
section there's also an article "A beginners guide to buying essential
vinyl", which lists albums from:
   - The Beatles
   - The Roling Stones
   - Burning Spear
   - The Clash
   - Split Enz
   - The The
   - Prince
   - Public Enemy
   - Beastie Boys
   - White Stripes
   - Amy Winehouse ("Stupid girl who was so full of promise".)
   - The Black Keys
0
Your
9/14/2014 1:01:01 AM


On 9/13/14 8:01 PM, in article 140920141301357119%YourName@YourISP.com,
"Your Name" <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> In article <D03A3ED4.AF69D%ghost_topper@hotmail.com>, George Kerby
> <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> 
> <snip>
>> Another step it seems in the eventual demise of printed materials
>> in general, I guess.
> 
> To misquote Mark Twain ...
> 
>     "The reports of printed materials death have
>      been greatly exaggerated."
> 
> :-)
> 
> The printed book and magazine isn't going to disappear any time soon,
> although many indivudla publications may well either move to just
> digital editions or stop production completely.
> 
> Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.

You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?

0
George
9/14/2014 3:26:26 PM
On 2014-09-14, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.

I came across an old tape I had forgotten about the other day and it
had the clunk of the playback head landing on the vinyl at the beginning.

It was a surprisingly nostalgic moment.

-- 
People who think they know everything really annoy those of us who know
we don't                                           -- Bjarne Stroustrup
0
Paul
9/14/2014 7:13:00 PM
On 2014-09-15, Davoud <star@sky.net> wrote:

> That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.

Except it isn't.

But not for the reasons people think;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war


-- 
Today is Pungenday, the 39th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3180
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere,
diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies”. Groucho Marx.
0
Huge
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
TaliesinSoft:
> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the 
> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant 
> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?)

Firstly, multiple (two to six or more, sometimes as many as 12) exhaust
manifolds have been around since the 1920's, perhaps before. They
provide a significant benefit by reducing back pressure at the valves,
clearing exhaust gases more efficiently. This is more especially
important with modern turbocharged and supercharged engines and for
high-performance engines with high compression ratios. My 2014 Subaru
Forester is an example. Just 2 litres, but with a turbocharger. This
little engine requires two exhaust manifolds and two exhaust pipes for
maximum power and efficiency.

> and four, instead of two, 
> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I 
> can tell don't really provide any benefit.

I suppose that depends on where you are. If you're in Canada they
prevent you from violating the law, which requires daytime running
lights or headlights on all cars at all times. These other two
"headlights" aren't headlights; they're running lights. The benefit is
to enable you to be seen by other cars, especially at dawn, at dusk,
and in gray weather. A gray car on a gray road in gray weather is
difficult to see if it has no lights on. So why not just use the
headlights? Because modern headlights are expensive to replace these
days--$300 each and way up from that. The DRLs are lower power and
longer lasting, especially if they are LEDs, yet they are more than
adequate for being seen. In newer cars the headlight switch goes into
an "Auto" position. During the day the DRLs are on. As it gets dark the
headlights switch on automatically and the DRLs go off.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <150920141141538970%star@sky.net>, Davoud <star@sky.net>
wrote:

> TaliesinSoft:
> > I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the 
> > latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant 
> > benefit over a single exhaust pipe?)
> 
> Firstly, multiple (two to six or more, sometimes as many as 12) exhaust
> manifolds have been around since the 1920's, perhaps before.

Although there started a significant habit here in the 70s of tarting
cars up by adding go-faster stripes, twin exhaust pipes to replace
singles, straps to supposedly fix the bonnet down so it wouldn't fly
open as you drove along, and artificial knock-off hub caps to go with
the artificial wire wheels.

> They
> provide a significant benefit by reducing back pressure at the valves,
> clearing exhaust gases more efficiently. This is more especially
> important with modern turbocharged and supercharged engines and for
> high-performance engines with high compression ratios. My 2014 Subaru
> Forester is an example. Just 2 litres, but with a turbocharger. This
> little engine requires two exhaust manifolds and two exhaust pipes for
> maximum power and efficiency.

Why do you need as much as two litres?

> > and four, instead of two, 
> > headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I 
> > can tell don't really provide any benefit.
> 
> I suppose that depends on where you are. If you're in Canada they
> prevent you from violating the law, which requires daytime running
> lights or headlights on all cars at all times. These other two
> "headlights" aren't headlights; they're running lights. The benefit is
> to enable you to be seen by other cars, especially at dawn, at dusk,
> and in gray weather. A gray car on a gray road in gray weather is
> difficult to see if it has no lights on. So why not just use the
> headlights? Because modern headlights are expensive to replace these
> days--$300 each and way up from that. The DRLs are lower power and
> longer lasting, especially if they are LEDs, yet they are more than
> adequate for being seen. In newer cars the headlight switch goes into
> an "Auto" position. During the day the DRLs are on. As it gets dark the
> headlights switch on automatically and the DRLs go off.

These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.

-- 
"... you must remember that if you're trying to propagate a creed of 
 poverty, gentleness and tolerance,  you need a very rich, powerful,
 authoritarian organisation to do it."             - Vice-Pope Eric
0
Tim
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <2014091422160678399-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> On 2014-09-15 02:38:13 +0000, Davoud <star@sky.net> said:
> > In article <lv5es7$mes$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
> > <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
> > Your Name:
> >>> Oops! I nearly missed it. In that same JB Hi-Fi freebie magazine music
> >>> section there's also an article "A beginners guide to buying essential
> >>> vinyl" ...
> > 
> > John McWilliams:
> >> Oh, yes, I did have a Roling Stones album or two in the Dark Ages of
> >> music playback.
> > 
> > Don't we all? I also have a working Edison cylinder phonograph from the
> > mid-1890's. As far as I'm concerned the technology did not improve
> > substantially until the Dolby-encoded tape came along, and digital was
> > the greatest improvement ever, though discs were more convenient than
> > cylinders. There will not be a substantial improvement in the future
> > due to limitations in human hearing. I don't miss the snaps, crackles,
> > and pops one bit, and I won't be trading my digital recordings for
> > vinyl. That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.
> 
> Interesting, I have two Cole Porter pianola rolls made by Porter. Load 
> them in the pianola and pedal away, and you have Cole Porter playing 
> for you as he did in the 1930's.
> Unfortunately I don't have that pianola.

Geez, you guys are on the cuting edge of tech. I'm still reading
caveman Ugh's cave painting of his song "Ug-ugh, Ugh Ugh" ... now that
true 'rock'.   ;-)
0
Your
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <2014091422121561483-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> On 2014-09-14 21:22:04 +0000, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> said:
> > In article <150920140921208249%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
> > <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> > 
> >> More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records.
> > 
> > no they're not.
> > 
> > a few indie bands do, but those don't sell in any appreciable numbers.
> 
> Check on the current Neil Young, Jack White direct to vinyl recordings 
> made on 1947 equipment, and the rush of many to White's Nashville 
> studio to use the same technique on their recordings. Interesting stuff.
>
> <http://consequenceofsound.net/2014/03/neil-young-confirms-new-album-was-recor
> ded-in-jack-whites-1947-voice-o-graph-booth/>
> 
> What 
> 
> was old is new again.

That's just brainless nospam showing he knows absolutely nothing, as
usual. Just ignore that idiot.
0
Your
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <lv7q7u$ius$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

> Digital recording and playback today is superior to analog, with the 
> possible exception of $100,000+ systems.

even those.
0
nospam
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <c7ni38Fg32nU3@mid.individual.net>, Huge
<Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:
> On 2014-09-15, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> > 
> > That's just brainless nospam showing he knows absolutely nothing, as
> > usual. Just ignore that idiot.
> 
> And we should pay any more attention to "Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>",
> why?

Mainly because I gave the actual facts (as always), not some made-up
crap from inside nospam's insane mind because it's not what he and his
two nerdy friends do.
0
Your
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
On 2014-09-15 02:38:13 +0000, Davoud <star@sky.net> said:

> In article <lv5es7$mes$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> Your Name:
>>> Oops! I nearly missed it. In that same JB Hi-Fi freebie magazine music
>>> section there's also an article "A beginners guide to buying essential
>>> vinyl" ...
> 
> John McWilliams:
>> Oh, yes, I did have a Roling Stones album or two in the Dark Ages of
>> music playback.
> 
> Don't we all? I also have a working Edison cylinder phonograph from the
> mid-1890's. As far as I'm concerned the technology did not improve
> substantially until the Dolby-encoded tape came along, and digital was
> the greatest improvement ever, though discs were more convenient than
> cylinders. There will not be a substantial improvement in the future
> due to limitations in human hearing. I don't miss the snaps, crackles,
> and pops one bit, and I won't be trading my digital recordings for
> vinyl. That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.

Interesting, I have two Cole Porter pianola rolls made by Porter. Load 
them in the pianola and pedal away, and you have Cole Porter playing 
for you as he did in the 1930's.
Unfortunately I don't have that pianola.
-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
On 2014-09-15 06:47:07 +0000, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> said:

> In article <c7n00eFcfslU1@mid.individual.net>, TaliesinSoft
> <taliesinsoft@me.com> wrote:
>> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
>>> 
>>> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
>> 
>> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the
>> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant
>> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two,
>> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I
>> can tell don't really provide any benefit.
> 
> Not really. In fact many cars only have a single exhaust pipe that
> splits at the back into four tailpipes simply for fashion effect. Some
> cars even have fake extra tailpipes that don't do anything at all.

My E350 with a V6 engine, has independent left & right exhaust systems 
which do not join. The tailpipes are not together, but on either side 
of the rear.

My good old 1969 Beetle with its flat-4 had a manifold on each cylinder 
bank leading into the muffler which was fitted across the back rather 
than inline. Then there were two exhaust pipe coming out of each side 
of the muffler.
<http://jk-uk-cdn.justkampers.com/media/parts-diagrams/334.jpg>

>> I did have an interesting awareness experience the other day when I
>> drove my syster's late model car. I found it difficult to see the
>> speedometer and other instruments as they were behind the steering
>> wheel and were constantly being blocked by my hands. This was in
>> comparison to my own caar which has the instruments placed on the
>> dashboard in a position where they are never blocked by my hands when
>> they are on the wheel. However I have yet to encounter a newer model
>> car that has the instruments positioned like that, instead doing as
>> does the great majority by placing them behind the steering wheel
>> where they are guaranteed to be made frequently hidden by one's hands.
> 
> Most cars have the speedometer, etc. behind the wheel. There are a few
> exceptions, mostly French cars that weirdly have the dials in the
> centre of the dashboard - between the driver and the passenger!  :-\
> (I have a vague recollection that the first of the resurrected Mini did
> that too.)
> 
> The angle and height of the steering wheel  and driver's seat can
> sometimes be altered, which may or may not help. The size of the
> steering wheel may also cause problems - many young hoons / boy-racers
> replace the standard steering wheel with a smaller version.
> 
> Some cars (usually expensive or those wacky French again) have a
> "heads-up" display where the speed, etc. is projected either either
> onto the windscreen or a small plastic screen that rises out of the top
> of the dashboard.


-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <2014091508254299740-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

> On 2014-09-15 06:47:07 +0000, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> said:
> 
> > In article <c7n00eFcfslU1@mid.individual.net>, TaliesinSoft
> > <taliesinsoft@me.com> wrote:
> >> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
> >>> 
> >>> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
> >> 
> >> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the
> >> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant
> >> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two,
> >> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I
> >> can tell don't really provide any benefit.
> > 
> > Not really. In fact many cars only have a single exhaust pipe that
> > splits at the back into four tailpipes simply for fashion effect. Some
> > cars even have fake extra tailpipes that don't do anything at all.
> 
> My E350 with a V6 engine, has independent left & right exhaust systems 
> which do not join. The tailpipes are not together, but on either side 
> of the rear.
> 
> My good old 1969 Beetle with its flat-4 had a manifold on each cylinder 
> bank leading into the muffler which was fitted across the back rather 
> than inline. Then there were two exhaust pipe coming out of each side 
> of the muffler.
> <http://jk-uk-cdn.justkampers.com/media/parts-diagrams/334.jpg>

On some cars more than one may be needed. Perhaps higher capacity
engines produce more exhaust.


As for the two sets of headlights, they're often called "running
lights" and are used to (supposedly) make your car more visible to
others without dazzling on-coming drivers. Of course, as more and more
cars have them, they'll simply become worthless as drivers tune them
out anyway.
0
Your
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
On 2014-09-15 02:08:14 +0000, TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft@me.com> said:

> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
> 
>> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
> 
> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the 
> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant 
> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two, 
> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I 
> can tell don't really provide any benefit. I did have an interesting 
> awareness experience the other day when I drove my syster's late model 
> car. I found it difficult to see the speedometer and other instruments 
> as they were behind the steering wheel and were constantly being 
> blocked by my hands. This was in comparison to my own caar which has 
> the instruments placed on the dashboard in a position where they are 
> never blocked by my hands when they are on the wheel. However I have 
> yet to encounter a newer model car that has the instruments positioned 
> like that, instead doing as does the great majority by placing them 
> behind the steering wheel where they are guaranteed to be made 
> frequently hidden by one's hands.

Yup! The speedo was in the middle of the dash in my 1969 VW Beetle. My 
hands obscured nothing. However, with my current E350, the instrument 
cluster is ahead of the steering wheel, and with my hands in an 
orthodox (9-3, or 10-2) steering position, I have no trouble seeing all 
of the dials & gauges.

-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 1:01:01 AM
On 9/14/14   PDT, 2:45 PM, Your Name wrote:
> In article <150920140921208249%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
> <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <su5heb-cee1.ln1@news.chingola.ch>, Paul Sture
>> <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
>>> On 2014-09-14, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Vinyl records have been making something of a comeback in recent years.
>>>
>>> I came across an old tape I had forgotten about the other day and it
>>> had the clunk of the playback head landing on the vinyl at the beginning.
>>>
>>> It was a surprisingly nostalgic moment.
>>
>> More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records.
>>
>> Just flicking through the dozen pages in the music section of the
>> September 2014 freebie magazine from the JB Hi-Fi chain here in New
>> Zealand (which sells electronics, DVDs, music and games), there are
>> adverts for new albums "available on CD and vinyl" from Kimbra and
>> Royal Blood, and a release of The Beatles albums, as individual or a
>> box set, of "remastered LPs cut from the original analogue tapes at
>> Abbey Road Studios, pressed on heavyweight 180g vinyl".
>>
>> A couple of the local annual fundraiser second-hand book sales also
>> have old vinyl records, and the number of people you see trawling
>> through the piles has been slowly growing.
>
> Oops! I nearly missed it. In that same JB Hi-Fi freebie magazine music
> section there's also an article "A beginners guide to buying essential
> vinyl", which lists albums from:
>     - The Beatles
>     - The Roling Stones
>     - Burning Spear
>     - The Clash
>     - Split Enz
>     - The The
>     - Prince
>     - Public Enemy
>     - Beastie Boys
>     - White Stripes
>     - Amy Winehouse ("Stupid girl who was so full of promise".)
>     - The Black Keys

Oh, yes, I did have a Roling Stones album or two in the Dark Ages of 
music playback.

0
John
9/15/2014 1:20:07 AM
On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:

> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?

I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the 
latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant 
benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two, 
headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I 
can tell don't really provide any benefit. I did have an interesting 
awareness experience the other day when I drove my syster's late model 
car. I found it difficult to see the speedometer and other instruments 
as they were behind the steering wheel and were constantly being 
blocked by my hands. This was in comparison to my own caar which has 
the instruments placed on the dashboard in a position where they are 
never blocked by my hands when they are on the wheel. However I have 
yet to encounter a newer model car that has the instruments positioned 
like that, instead doing as does the great majority by placing them 
behind the steering wheel where they are guaranteed to be made 
frequently hidden by one's hands.

-- 
James Leo Ryan - Austin, Texas

0
TaliesinSoft
9/15/2014 2:08:14 AM
In article <lv5es7$mes$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

Your Name:
> > Oops! I nearly missed it. In that same JB Hi-Fi freebie magazine music
> > section there's also an article "A beginners guide to buying essential
> > vinyl" ...

John McWilliams:
> Oh, yes, I did have a Roling Stones album or two in the Dark Ages of 
> music playback.

Don't we all? I also have a working Edison cylinder phonograph from the
mid-1890's. As far as I'm concerned the technology did not improve
substantially until the Dolby-encoded tape came along, and digital was
the greatest improvement ever, though discs were more convenient than
cylinders. There will not be a substantial improvement in the future
due to limitations in human hearing. I don't miss the snaps, crackles,
and pops one bit, and I won't be trading my digital recordings for
vinyl. That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/15/2014 2:38:13 AM
On 2014-09-14 21:22:04 +0000, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> said:

> In article <150920140921208249%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
> <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> 
>> More and more bands are releasing their music on vinyl records.
> 
> no they're not.
> 
> a few indie bands do, but those don't sell in any appreciable numbers.

Check on the current Neil Young, Jack White direct to vinyl recordings 
made on 1947 equipment, and the rush of many to White's Nashville 
studio to use the same technique on their recordings. Interesting stuff.
<http://consequenceofsound.net/2014/03/neil-young-confirms-new-album-was-recorded-in-jack-whites-1947-voice-o-graph-booth/>

What 

was old is new again.

-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 5:12:15 AM
In article <c7n00eFcfslU1@mid.individual.net>, TaliesinSoft
<taliesinsoft@me.com> wrote:
> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
> > 
> > You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
> 
> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the 
> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant 
> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two, 
> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I 
> can tell don't really provide any benefit. 

Not really. In fact many cars only have a single exhaust pipe that
splits at the back into four tailpipes simply for fashion effect. Some
cars even have fake extra tailpipes that don't do anything at all.



> I did have an interesting awareness experience the other day when I 
> drove my syster's late model car. I found it difficult to see the 
> speedometer and other instruments as they were behind the steering 
> wheel and were constantly being blocked by my hands. This was in 
> comparison to my own caar which has the instruments placed on the 
> dashboard in a position where they are never blocked by my hands when 
> they are on the wheel. However I have yet to encounter a newer model 
> car that has the instruments positioned like that, instead doing as 
> does the great majority by placing them behind the steering wheel
> where they are guaranteed to be made frequently hidden by one's hands.

Most cars have the speedometer, etc. behind the wheel. There are a few
exceptions, mostly French cars that weirdly have the dials in the
centre of the dashboard - between the driver and the passenger!  :-\
(I have a vague recollection that the first of the resurrected Mini did
that too.)

The angle and height of the steering wheel  and driver's seat can
sometimes be altered, which may or may not help. The size of the
steering wheel may also cause problems - many young hoons / boy-racers
replace the standard steering wheel with a smaller version.

Some cars (usually expensive or those wacky French again) have a
"heads-up" display where the speed, etc. is projected either either
onto the windscreen or a small plastic screen that rises out of the top
of the dashboard.
0
Your
9/15/2014 6:47:07 AM
On 2014-09-15, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> That's just brainless nospam showing he knows absolutely nothing, as
> usual. Just ignore that idiot.

And we should pay any more attention to "Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>",
why?


-- 
Today is Pungenday, the 39th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3180
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere,
diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies”. Groucho Marx.
0
Huge
9/15/2014 7:16:56 AM
On 2014-09-15, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> In article <c7ni38Fg32nU3@mid.individual.net>, Huge
><Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:
>> On 2014-09-15, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
>> > 
>> > That's just brainless nospam showing he knows absolutely nothing, as
>> > usual. Just ignore that idiot.
>> 
>> And we should pay any more attention to "Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>",
>> why?
>
> Mainly because I gave the actual facts (as always), not some made-up
> crap from inside nospam's insane mind because it's not what he and his
> two nerdy friends do.

*plonk*


-- 
Today is Pungenday, the 39th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3180
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere,
diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies”. Groucho Marx.
0
Huge
9/15/2014 7:42:50 AM
Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:

> On 2014-09-15, Davoud <star@sky.net> wrote:
> 
> > That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.
> 
> Except it isn't.
> 
> But not for the reasons people think;
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war

Sound check to the rescue. I find iVolume superior to iTunes' built in
sound check.
-- 
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
0
jamiekg
9/15/2014 12:51:31 PM
In article <c7ni38Fg32nU3@mid.individual.net>, Huge
<Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:

> On 2014-09-15, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
> 
> > That's just brainless nospam showing he knows absolutely nothing, as
> > usual. Just ignore that idiot.
> 
> And we should pay any more attention to "Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>",
> why?

In general, you shouldn't pay too much attention to either of them.
0
Michelle
9/15/2014 2:02:21 PM
Savageduck:
> Interesting, I have two Cole Porter pianola rolls made by Porter. Load 
> them in the pianola and pedal away, and you have Cole Porter playing 
> for you as he did in the 1930's.
> Unfortunately I don't have that pianola.

But you can get a pianola or other piano that will play those rolls.
You can also have Rachmaninoff, Jelly Roll Morton, Ravel, and authentic
performances from other greats in your living room. Or you can buy
digital recordings of those great pianists.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/15/2014 4:17:35 PM
Davoud:
> > Firstly, multiple (two to six or more, sometimes as many as 12) exhaust
> > manifolds have been around since the 1920's, perhaps before.

Tim Streater:
> Although there started a significant habit here in the 70s of tarting
> cars up by adding go-faster stripes, twin exhaust pipes to replace
> singles, straps to supposedly fix the bonnet down so it wouldn't fly
> open as you drove along, and artificial knock-off hub caps to go with
> the artificial wire wheels.

Dressing a car in phony accessories to make it look like what it isn't
is a different matter (but a successful sales ploy, Detroit has found).
On some cars such as my Subaru cited below, multiple exhausts have an
important function.
 
> > They
> > provide a significant benefit by reducing back pressure at the valves,
> > clearing exhaust gases more efficiently. This is more especially
> > important with modern turbocharged and supercharged engines and for
> > high-performance engines with high compression ratios. My 2014 Subaru
> > Forester is an example. Just 2 litres, but with a turbocharger. This
> > little engine requires two exhaust manifolds and two exhaust pipes for
> > maximum power and efficiency.

> Why do you need as much as two litres?

Because, unlike your average "SUV," where "off-road" means "mall
parking lot," the Subaru is a legitimate off-road vehicle, and it takes
power to climb and engine braking to descend. In more practical terms,
the larger engine makes highway driving much more pleasant in the
mountains of both the Eastern and Western U.S., as one doesn't have all
the buzz that is associated with over-worked 4-cylinder engines.

> > I suppose that depends on where you are. If you're in Canada they
> > prevent you from violating the law, which requires daytime running
> > lights or headlights on all cars at all times. These other two
> > "headlights" aren't headlights; they're running lights. The benefit is
> > to enable you to be seen by other cars, especially at dawn, at dusk,
> > and in gray weather. A gray car on a gray road in gray weather is
> > difficult to see if it has no lights on. So why not just use the
> > headlights? Because modern headlights are expensive to replace these
> > days--$300 each and way up from that. The DRLs are lower power and
> > longer lasting, especially if they are LEDs, yet they are more than
> > adequate for being seen. In newer cars the headlight switch goes into
> > an "Auto" position. During the day the DRLs are on. As it gets dark the
> > headlights switch on automatically and the DRLs go off.

> These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
> those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.

Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/15/2014 4:29:15 PM
In article <150920141229159529%star@sky.net>, Davoud <star@sky.net>
wrote:

> Tim Streater:

> > These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
> > those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.
> 
> Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
> safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
> tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.

Not here. These DRLs are strips of white LEDs. Each LED is quite bright.

-- 
"I love the way that Microsoft follows standards. 
 In much the same manner as fish follow migrating caribou."
                                               - Paul Tomblin, ASR
0
Tim
9/15/2014 4:46:49 PM
On 9/15/14   PDT, 9:46 AM, Tim Streater wrote:
> In article <150920141229159529%star@sky.net>, Davoud <star@sky.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Tim Streater:
>
>> > These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
>> > those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.
>>
>> Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
>> safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
>> tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.
>
> Not here. These DRLs are strips of white LEDs. Each LED is quite bright.

They shouldn't be on at night, though that doesn't mean the 
uninformed/careless/SOB's don't put them on then.

As to viewing of the speedometer, I've not had a problem at all, ever, 
in any car I've driven. My current cars are a Toyota Highlander and an 
MB 350E. The latter has a setting that'll put large numerals of the 
speed onto the display. (I don't use it, but it's nice to know it's there.)

As to tarting up cars, I believe it's been done since Henry Ford allowed 
non-black colors. Colours, too!

0
John
9/15/2014 10:40:07 PM
On 9/15/14   PDT, 12:11 AM, Huge wrote:
> On 2014-09-15, Davoud <star@sky.net> wrote:
>
>> That vinyl "sounds better" is pure myth.
>
> Except it isn't.
>
> But not for the reasons people think;
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war
>

Rubbish. Poorly engineered recordings (in this case, excessive 
compression) can be done in any medium.

Digital recording and playback today is superior to analog, with the 
possible exception of $100,000+ systems.

0
John
9/15/2014 10:46:20 PM
On 2014-09-15 06:47:07 +0000, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> said:

> In article <c7n00eFcfslU1@mid.individual.net>, TaliesinSoft
> <taliesinsoft@me.com> wrote:
>> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
>>> 
>>> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
>> 
>> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the
>> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant
>> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two,
>> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I
>> can tell don't really provide any benefit.
> 
> Not really. In fact many cars only have a single exhaust pipe that
> splits at the back into four tailpipes simply for fashion effect. Some
> cars even have fake extra tailpipes that don't do anything at all.
> 
> 
> 
>> I did have an interesting awareness experience the other day when I
>> drove my syster's late model car. I found it difficult to see the
>> speedometer and other instruments as they were behind the steering
>> wheel and were constantly being blocked by my hands. This was in
>> comparison to my own caar which has the instruments placed on the
>> dashboard in a position where they are never blocked by my hands when
>> they are on the wheel. However I have yet to encounter a newer model
>> car that has the instruments positioned like that, instead doing as
>> does the great majority by placing them behind the steering wheel
>> where they are guaranteed to be made frequently hidden by one's hands.
> 
> Most cars have the speedometer, etc. behind the wheel. There are a few
> exceptions, mostly French cars that weirdly have the dials in the
> centre of the dashboard - between the driver and the passenger!  :-\
> (I have a vague recollection that the first of the resurrected Mini did
> that too.)
> 
> The angle and height of the steering wheel  and driver's seat can
> sometimes be altered, which may or may not help. The size of the
> steering wheel may also cause problems - many young hoons / boy-racers
> replace the standard steering wheel with a smaller version.
> 
> Some cars (usually expensive or those wacky French again) have a
> "heads-up" display where the speed, etc. is projected either either
> onto the windscreen or a small plastic screen that rises out of the top
> of the dashboard.

The Germans seem to have got things reasonably right with the 
instrument pod in my car.
<https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/E350-instr.jpg>

-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 11:25:19 PM
On 2014-09-15 21:30:26 +0000, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> said:

> In article <2014091508254299740-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
> Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 2014-09-15 06:47:07 +0000, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> said:
>> 
>>> In article <c7n00eFcfslU1@mid.individual.net>, TaliesinSoft
>>> <taliesinsoft@me.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2014-09-14 15:26:26 +0000, George Kerby said:
>>>>> 
>>>>> You means there's hope for my '71 AMC Gremlin to make a 'comeback'?!?
>>>> 
>>>> I find it interesting how things becoome "a must" on automoviles, the
>>>> latest being dual exhaust pipes (do they really provide any significant
>>>> benefit over a single exhaust pipe?) and four, instead of two,
>>>> headlights, the latest thing being two llights further down which, as I
>>>> can tell don't really provide any benefit.
>>> 
>>> Not really. In fact many cars only have a single exhaust pipe that
>>> splits at the back into four tailpipes simply for fashion effect. Some
>>> cars even have fake extra tailpipes that don't do anything at all.
>> 
>> My E350 with a V6 engine, has independent left & right exhaust systems
>> which do not join. The tailpipes are not together, but on either side
>> of the rear.
>> 
>> My good old 1969 Beetle with its flat-4 had a manifold on each cylinder
>> bank leading into the muffler which was fitted across the back rather
>> than inline. Then there were two exhaust pipe coming out of each side
>> of the muffler.
>> <http://jk-uk-cdn.justkampers.com/media/parts-diagrams/334.jpg>
> 
> On some cars more than one may be needed. Perhaps higher capacity
> engines produce more exhaust.

As I said, my E350 has an exhaust system running down each side of the 
car, and it makes sense design-wise for them not to join into a single 
tailpipe.
<https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/E350-rear.jpg>

> As for the two sets of headlights, they're often called "running
> lights" and are used to (supposedly) make your car more visible to
> others without dazzling on-coming drivers. Of course, as more and more
> cars have them, they'll simply become worthless as drivers tune them
> out anyway.

Out here in California there are several designated highways with 
"daylight head lights on zones", one quite close to me. The LCD 
daylight running lights on my car meet the requirement and by leaving 
them on I save myself a fat fine on those highway sections, which 
coincidentally have a high CHP presence.

-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/15/2014 11:35:19 PM
In article <c7ro0hFk7jpU1@mid.individual.net>, Huge
<Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:
> On 2014-09-15, Davoud <star@sky.net> wrote:
> >
> > My 2014 Subaru Forester is an example. Just 2 litres, but with a 
> > turbocharger. This little engine requires two exhaust manifolds and 
> > two exhaust pipes for maximum power and efficiency.
> 
> Given that it's a flat four, how else could the exhaust manifolds be
> arranged, oh idiot?

It's the usual load of Davoud bollocks.  :-\

I've got a 2 litre, turbo-charged sportscar, and although it does have
two tailpipes (standard fitting in the factory, on the same side of the
car's rear), they both come out of the same muffler and the same
exhaust pipe system.
0
Your
9/16/2014 1:01:01 AM
In article <lv7ps9$gul$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 9/15/14   PDT, 9:46 AM, Tim Streater wrote:
> > In article <150920141229159529%star@sky.net>, <star@sky.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >>:
> >
> >> > These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
> >> > those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.
Davoud:
> >> Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
> >> safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
> >> tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.

Tim Streater:
> > Not here. These DRLs are strips of white LEDs. Each LED is quite bright.

John McWilliams:
> They shouldn't be on at night, though that doesn't mean the 
> uninformed/careless/SOB's don't put them on then.

Hmmm. My DRLs on my Toyota and my Avalon can't be on at night. In
"Auto" mode they switch off at a certain point and the headlights
switch on without driver intervention. If the lamp switch is used
manually after dark the choices are Off, Auto (which turns on the
headlights, not DRL) and Headlights. IOW, after dark Auto and
Headlights produce the same result.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/16/2014 4:07:54 AM
On 9/15/14   PDT, 9:07 PM, Davoud wrote:
> In article <lv7ps9$gul$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
> <jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> On 9/15/14   PDT, 9:46 AM, Tim Streater wrote:
>>> In article <150920141229159529%star@sky.net>, <star@sky.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> :
>>>
>>>>> These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
>>>>> those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.
> Davoud:
>>>> Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
>>>> safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
>>>> tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.
>
> Tim Streater:
>>> Not here. These DRLs are strips of white LEDs. Each LED is quite bright.
>
> John McWilliams:
>> They shouldn't be on at night, though that doesn't mean the
>> uninformed/careless/SOB's don't put them on then.
>
> Hmmm. My DRLs on my Toyota and my Avalon can't be on at night. In
> "Auto" mode they switch off at a certain point and the headlights
> switch on without driver intervention. If the lamp switch is used
> manually after dark the choices are Off, Auto (which turns on the
> headlights, not DRL) and Headlights. IOW, after dark Auto and
> Headlights produce the same result.
>
Would that that pertain to all vehicles, but it doesn't yet.
0
John
9/16/2014 4:27:59 AM
In article <lv7ps9$gul$1@dont-email.me>, John McWilliams
<jpmcw@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 9/15/14   PDT, 9:46 AM, Tim Streater wrote:
> > In article <150920141229159529%star@sky.net>, Davoud <star@sky.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Tim Streater:
> >
> >> > These lights, being bright point sources, are a serious irritation to
> >> > those of us with older eyes. And of course quite unnecessary.
> >>
> >> Point of view. My eyes are 70 years old. I find DRLs to be a great
> >> safety feature, and they are much less bright than HID, xenon,
> >> tungsten-halogen and other high-intensity headlights.
> >
> > Not here. These DRLs are strips of white LEDs. Each LED is quite bright.
> 
> They shouldn't be on at night, though that doesn't mean the 
> uninformed/careless/SOB's don't put them on then.

I'm not talking about at night. They're on during the *day* (DLR, hint,
hint) and they're far too bright.

-- 
Anyone who slaps a 'this page is best viewed with Browser X' label on
a Web page appears to be yearning for the bad old days, before the Web,
when you had very little chance of reading a document written on another
computer, another word processor, or another network. -- Tim Berners-Lee
0
Tim
9/16/2014 7:48:21 AM
Tim Streater wrote, concerning daytime running lights:
> I'm not talking about at night. They're on during the *day* (DLR, hint,
> hint) and they're far too bright.

You can't be wrong for yourself. Not everyone finds DRLs to be too
bright, and I believe that they reduce accidents by making visible cars
that might otherwise be difficult to see. As I said earlier, I'm
especially thinking of dark-colored cars on dark roads in inclement
weather.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/16/2014 1:48:22 PM
On 2014-09-16 13:48:22 +0000, Davoud <star@sky.net> said:

> Tim Streater wrote, concerning daytime running lights:
>> I'm not talking about at night. They're on during the *day* (DLR, hint,
>> hint) and they're far too bright.
> 
> You can't be wrong for yourself. Not everyone finds DRLs to be too
> bright, and I believe that they reduce accidents by making visible cars
> that might otherwise be difficult to see. As I said earlier, I'm
> especially thinking of dark-colored cars on dark roads in inclement
> weather.

Agreed, and in California we also have a "headlights on when windshield 
wipers are on law". The DMV is quite specific; "If weather conditions 
require you to use your windshield wipers, you must turn on your 
headlights."
<https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc24400.htm>

That pretty much takes care of the inclement weather issue.

There are also specific "Safety Corridors" in California, Nevada, & 
Arizona where there are mandatory headlights on sections (DRLs qualify) 
and where you will find signs such as this:
<https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_904.jpg>


-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

0
Savageduck
9/16/2014 5:33:32 PM
On 2014-09-15, Davoud <star@sky.net> wrote:

> My 2014 Subaru
> Forester is an example. Just 2 litres, but with a turbocharger. This
> little engine requires two exhaust manifolds and two exhaust pipes for
> maximum power and efficiency.

Given that it's a flat four, how else could the exhaust manifolds be
arranged, oh idiot?

-- 
Today is Prickle-Prickle, the 40th day of Bureaucracy in the YOLD 3180
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere,
diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies”. Groucho Marx.
0
Huge
9/16/2014 9:22:25 PM
In article <2014091610333253517-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> On 2014-09-16 13:48:22 +0000, Davoud <star@sky.net> said:
> >
> > Tim Streater wrote, concerning daytime running lights:
> >>
> >> I'm not talking about at night. They're on during the *day* (DLR, hint,
> >> hint) and they're far too bright.
> > 
> > You can't be wrong for yourself. Not everyone finds DRLs to be too
> > bright, and I believe that they reduce accidents by making visible cars
> > that might otherwise be difficult to see. As I said earlier, I'm
> > especially thinking of dark-colored cars on dark roads in inclement
> > weather.
> 
> Agreed, and in California we also have a "headlights on when windshield 
> wipers are on law". The DMV is quite specific; "If weather conditions 
> require you to use your windshield wipers, you must turn on your 
> headlights."
> <https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc24400.htm>
> 
> That pretty much takes care of the inclement weather issue.
> 
> There are also specific "Safety Corridors" in California, Nevada, & 
> Arizona where there are mandatory headlights on sections (DRLs qualify) 
> and where you will find signs such as this:
> <https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_904.jpg>

Driving lights are simply another of the nanny-state approach to road
safety for the terminally stupid and lazy, but which in reality is
pointless and achieves nothing of any real usefulness. 

Here in New Zealand motorbikes have for decades been legally required
to have their headlights on all the time they are being driven, day and
night, but it hasn't stopped there being numerous accidents* and
there's now a safety advertising campaign promoting people to "have a
second look for motobikes", so the headlights obviously aren't working
as expected - part of the reason being that people simply tune them out
after a while.


* It's impossible to know if it has actually decreased the number of
accidents that might have happened without it.
0
Your
9/16/2014 9:47:18 PM
Savageduck:
> Agreed, and in California we also have a "headlights on when windshield 
> wipers are on law"
> ...
> There are also specific "Safety Corridors" in California, Nevada, & 
> Arizona where there are mandatory headlights on sections (DRLs qualify)...

Ditto Maryland, where I live.

-- 
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm
0
Davoud
9/17/2014 1:09:39 AM
Website still has an ad for subscribing to print and iPad editions. Risk 
free!
-- 
Malcolm
0
MalcolmO
9/21/2014 4:09:44 AM
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