I posted earlier about Not bering able to quit Mail except by a forced 
quit. The problem seems to be associated with a loop that keeps the 
spinning spokes going while Mail is trying to log on.

I had though that the problem went away spontaneously. That is not the 
case. I still get spinning. at that time, the spokes are turning and 
Quit is grayed out. This time it happened on a different account from 
the previous counts. Sometimes running after a forced quit seems to have 
a valid Quit item in the menu, but it is not really functional.

Would it be best at this time to just reinstall Mail and transfer 
settings and data?

Bill

-- 
An old man would be better off never having been born.

In article <SalmonEgg-E0E9ED.22023622122009@news60.forteinc.com>,
 Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> I posted earlier about Not bering able to quit Mail except by a forced 
> quit. The problem seems to be associated with a loop that keeps the 
> spinning spokes going while Mail is trying to log on.
> 
> I had though that the problem went away spontaneously. That is not the 
> case. I still get spinning. at that time, the spokes are turning and 
> Quit is grayed out. This time it happened on a different account from 
> the previous counts. Sometimes running after a forced quit seems to have 
> a valid Quit item in the menu, but it is not really functional.
> 
> Would it be best at this time to just reinstall Mail and transfer 
> settings and data?

I tried Mail again. This time there were no spinning posts when I opened 
the application.

I then looked for new mail. The spinning of the last account that spun 
started spinning again. I clicked the Quit menu item. Mail ostensibly 
quit.

I then looked at the dock. The dock indicated that Mail was still 
running. Another click on th dock's Maiu icon got the menu bar to show 
up but no main window. Quit was grayed out.

AFAIK, the only way to shut down is a forced quit because Mail 
interrupts the shut down sequence.

How easy is it to delete Mail, reinstall it, and transfer suitable data?

Bill

-- 
An old man would be better off never having been born.

Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> writes:

> I then looked at the dock. The dock indicated that Mail was still 
> running. Another click on th dock's Maiu icon got the menu bar to show 
> up but no main window. Quit was grayed out.

It's doing something and don't wants to be interrupted as long as it's
not over with it.

> AFAIK, the only way to shut down is a forced quit because Mail 
> interrupts the shut down sequence.
>
> How easy is it to delete Mail, reinstall it, and transfer suitable
> data?

Why do you think reinstalling would change anything? The app itself is
never written to nor changed in any way. Reinstalling it would just
replace it bit by bit with an identical copy. Reinstalling misbehaving
apps makes almost never any difference in OS X.

First thing to do is open the Activity window (from the Windows menu in
Mail.app) and then look at what Mail is doing when it refuses to quit.
It probably is doing something that needs a while to finish and when
you're forcing it down over and over it never gets done with it. At
least this should give you some hint about what is going on.


        Jochem

-- 
 "A designer knows he has arrived at perfection not when there is no 
 longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away."
 - Antoine de Saint-Exupery 

Jochem Huhmann <joh@gmx.net> wrote:

> Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> writes:
> 
> > I then looked at the dock. The dock indicated that Mail was still 
> > running. Another click on th dock's Maiu icon got the menu bar to show
> > up but no main window. Quit was grayed out.
> 
> It's doing something and don't wants to be interrupted as long as it's
> not over with it.
> 
> > AFAIK, the only way to shut down is a forced quit because Mail 
> > interrupts the shut down sequence.
> >
> > How easy is it to delete Mail, reinstall it, and transfer suitable
> > data?
> 
> Why do you think reinstalling would change anything? The app itself is
> never written to nor changed in any way. Reinstalling it would just
> replace it bit by bit with an identical copy. Reinstalling misbehaving
> apps makes almost never any difference in OS X.
> 
> First thing to do is open the Activity window (from the Windows menu in
> Mail.app) and then look at what Mail is doing when it refuses to quit.
> It probably is doing something that needs a while to finish and when
> you're forcing it down over and over it never gets done with it. At
> least this should give you some hint about what is going on.

I'm wondering if it's trying to download a message that's got corrupted.
It used to be much more common a while ago, but still can happen. I've
occasionally had to deal with these for others.

It may help if you can login to Webmail and see if there's anything
showing there (if you have that option, such as with Googlemail).

-- 
Andy Hewitt
<http://web.me.com/andrewhewitt1/>

On Wed, 23 Dec 2009 01:20:46 -0500, Salmon Egg wrote
(in article <SalmonEgg-D18740.22204622122009@news60.forteinc.com>):

> In article <SalmonEgg-E0E9ED.22023622122009@news60.forteinc.com>,
>  Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> 
>> I posted earlier about Not bering able to quit Mail except by a forced 
>> quit. The problem seems to be associated with a loop that keeps the 
>> spinning spokes going while Mail is trying to log on.
>> 
>> I had though that the problem went away spontaneously. That is not the 
>> case. I still get spinning. at that time, the spokes are turning and 
>> Quit is grayed out. This time it happened on a different account from 
>> the previous counts. Sometimes running after a forced quit seems to have 
>> a valid Quit item in the menu, but it is not really functional.
>> 
>> Would it be best at this time to just reinstall Mail and transfer 
>> settings and data?
> 
> I tried Mail again. This time there were no spinning posts when I opened 
> the application.
> 
> I then looked for new mail. The spinning of the last account that spun 
> started spinning again. I clicked the Quit menu item. Mail ostensibly 
> quit.
> 
> I then looked at the dock. The dock indicated that Mail was still 
> running. Another click on th dock's Maiu icon got the menu bar to show 
> up but no main window. Quit was grayed out.
> 
> AFAIK, the only way to shut down is a forced quit because Mail 
> interrupts the shut down sequence.
> 
> How easy is it to delete Mail, reinstall it, and transfer suitable data?
> 
> Bill
> 
> 

Your Mail database is corrupt.

1 Log out or restart your Mac.

2 Launch Mail.

3 _Wait until the Spinning Pizza of Death goes away_. If the SPoD does not go 
away within a maximum of 15 minutes you have a major problem and will need to 
fix that before proceeding. Let it run, and contact us (or Apple, or someone) 
for further info. If you fail to wait until the SPoD goes away you can 
corrupt your mailboxes. This is what seems to have happened already. Doing a 
force quit will make it worse, so try to avoid doing that.

4 Assuming that the SPoD went away, select Activity from the Windows menu so 
that you can see what Mail is doing.

5 In the Mail sidebar, select 'Inbox'.

6 Select Rebuild from the Mailbox menu. You should see one item appear in the 
Activity window for each Inbox you have. DO NOT INTERRUPT THE REBUILDING 
PROCESS. The Activity window will show you what is going on as the system 
rebuilds your inboxes. This should remove any corruption in your inboxes. IF 
YOU INTERRUPT THE REBUILDING PROCESS YOU MAY MAKE THE CORRUPTION WORSE. If 
you make the corruption worse you may not be able to start up Mail again 
without deleting your inboxes. Depending on how many inboxes you have and how 
many items are in your inboxes in total, this may take several minutes.

7 Once the inboxes are rebuilt, if you have Mobile Me, go to the part of the 
Mail sidebar which lists your Mobile Me mailboxes and select _all_ of them.

8 Select Rebuild from the Mailbox menu. You should again see one item appear 
in the Activity window for each mailbox you have. DO NOT INTERRUPT THE 
REBUILDING PROCESS. If you interrupt the rebuilding process you may corrupt 
your Mobile Me mailboxes beyond repair and you would have to delete them.

-- 
email to oshea dot j dot j at gmail dot com.

In article <m2637ynp1t.fsf@revier.com>, Jochem Huhmann <joh@gmx.net> 
wrote:

> Why do you think reinstalling would change anything? The app itself is
> never written to nor changed in any way. Reinstalling it would just
> replace it bit by bit with an identical copy. Reinstalling misbehaving
> apps makes almost never any difference in OS X.
> 
> First thing to do is open the Activity window (from the Windows menu in
> Mail.app) and then look at what Mail is doing when it refuses to quit.
> It probably is doing something that needs a while to finish and when
> you're forcing it down over and over it never gets done with it. At
> least this should give you some hint about what is going on.

I certainly am going to try following up on these suggestions.

I tried Mail again this morning. Now, I am a bit more aware of what to 
look for. Upon first opening Mail, everything seemed to be working well. 
The account giving the problem does not get many messages. There were no 
number of messages indicated at the right of the mailbox name. I quit 
easily.

Starting Mail up again, the same thing happened. It was then that I 
clicked on the Get Mail icon when the trouble started up again, 
including the spinning spokes.

I am still thinking of reinstalling the system except that I Will use 
Leopard rather than Snow Leopard.

Bill

-- 
An old man would be better off never having been born.

In article <1jb64uf.1huiwrb1hroimvN%thewildrover@me.com>,
 thewildrover@me.com (Andy Hewitt) wrote:

> I'm wondering if it's trying to download a message that's got corrupted.
> It used to be much more common a while ago, but still can happen. I've
> occasionally had to deal with these for others.
> 
> It may help if you can login to Webmail and see if there's anything
> showing there (if you have that option, such as with Googlemail).

I think Mail is trying to log into the account. It seems to have no way 
of detecting a problem with the login so that the spokes keep spinning. 
This morning, there was no spoke spinning until I requested new mail by 
clicking on the Get Mail icon.

As far as I can tell, when I do observe a problem like the spinning 
spokes, there is no way to terminate that activity except for a forced 
quit. Starting Mail again, leads to the spinning spokes from the 
beginning. Somehow, maybe the morning boot, clears out whatever is the 
problem temporarily.

Bill

-- 
An old man would be better off never having been born.

Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> In article <m2637ynp1t.fsf@revier.com>, Jochem Huhmann <joh@gmx.net> 
> wrote:
> 
> > Why do you think reinstalling would change anything? The app itself is
> > never written to nor changed in any way. Reinstalling it would just
> > replace it bit by bit with an identical copy. Reinstalling misbehaving
> > apps makes almost never any difference in OS X.
> > 
> > First thing to do is open the Activity window (from the Windows menu in
> > Mail.app) and then look at what Mail is doing when it refuses to quit.
> > It probably is doing something that needs a while to finish and when
> > you're forcing it down over and over it never gets done with it. At
> > least this should give you some hint about what is going on.
> 
> I certainly am going to try following up on these suggestions.
> 
> I tried Mail again this morning. Now, I am a bit more aware of what to
> look for. Upon first opening Mail, everything seemed to be working well.
> The account giving the problem does not get many messages. There were no
> number of messages indicated at the right of the mailbox name. I quit
> easily.
> 
> Starting Mail up again, the same thing happened. It was then that I 
> clicked on the Get Mail icon when the trouble started up again, 
> including the spinning spokes.
> 
> I am still thinking of reinstalling the system except that I Will use
> Leopard rather than Snow Leopard.

I would look very carefully into making a retro step back with OS, it's
not entirely a straight forward job.

I think I'd be inclined to try and fix it first. Have you checked that
there are no server issues with your provider? These can mean that Mail
will take a while to time-out before it ignores the account.

It might also be worth trying a mailbox rebuild on the inboxes (how many
messages have you got in your Inboxes?), or running something like Onyx,
and clearing all the caches.

-- 
Andy Hewitt
<http://web.me.com/andrewhewitt1/>

Salmon Egg <SalmonEgg@sbcglobal.net> writes:

> As far as I can tell, when I do observe a problem like the spinning 
> spokes, there is no way to terminate that activity except for a forced 
> quit.

If you would have opened the activity window, you would have noticed a
red icon right of each action listed there which will stop this action.

> Starting Mail again, leads to the spinning spokes from the beginning.
> Somehow, maybe the morning boot, clears out whatever is the problem
> temporarily.

Try to move the file "Envelope Index" in Library/Mail elsewhere before
you start Mail. It can get corrupted and will just be rebuild if it is
not there.


        Jochem

-- 
 "A designer knows he has arrived at perfection not when there is no 
 longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away."
 - Antoine de Saint-Exupery