What is the word on openGL on Solaris 10 x86?  Is it there?  Hardware 
accelerated?

I know of MESA, but the fact that it is non-hardware accelerated makes 
it a non-option.

I would think that with Sun's new Opteron workstations, that there must 
be native x86 openGL support by now?

Thanks,

~S

On Thu, 6 Jan 2005, Shea Martin wrote:

> I would think that with Sun's new Opteron workstations, that there must
> be native x86 openGL support by now?

Not yet (AFAIK), but it is coming.  Dunno about any time scales though
(and if I did, I probably couldn't say!).

-- 
Rich Teer, SCNA, SCSA, author of "Solaris Systems Programming"

                                                    .  *   * . * .* .
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In article <Pine.SOL.4.58.0501061027110.8555@zaphod>,
Rich Teer  <rich.teer@rite-group.com> wrote:
>Not yet (AFAIK), but it is coming.  Dunno about any time scales though

Yes.
<URL:http://www.vnunet.com/news/1158746>
| Sun said that it is also committed to delivering nVidia technologies
| with future products, and the two companies are working together to
| tune and optimise the OpenGL implementation for Solaris on x86 and
| deliver an open, standards-based development environment.

Someone needs to update Sun's OpenGL page, however.
<URL:http://www.sun.com/software/graphics/opengl/faq.xml#q15>

>(and if I did, I probably couldn't say!).

Not sure where the vendor provided drivers go when used with Xorg's
server, but my guess is the nVidia ones will first appear in a
Software Express for Solaris release.
<URL:http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/solaris-express/>

John
groenveld@acm.org

Shea Martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|What is the word on openGL on Solaris 10 x86?  Is it there?  Hardware 
|accelerated?

No.

|I would think that with Sun's new Opteron workstations, that there must 
|be native x86 openGL support by now?

Not yet - nVidia is porting their OpenGL support for the Quadro cards in
the Opteron workstations, but it wasn't done in time for the initial
Solaris 10 release.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

groenvel@cse.psu.edu (John D Groenveld) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Someone needs to update Sun's OpenGL page, however.
|<URL:http://www.sun.com/software/graphics/opengl/faq.xml#q15>

I pinged the program manager handling our joint development with Nvidia
and the marketing person for the W1100z/W2100z workstations, and they
both promised to work on getting that updated.

|Not sure where the vendor provided drivers go when used with Xorg's
|server

They should go into /usr/X11/lib/modules/drivers with the ones we
provide.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

Alan Coopersmith wrote:
> groenvel@cse.psu.edu (John D Groenveld) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
> |Someone needs to update Sun's OpenGL page, however.
> |<URL:http://www.sun.com/software/graphics/opengl/faq.xml#q15>
> 
> I pinged the program manager handling our joint development with Nvidia
> and the marketing person for the W1100z/W2100z workstations, and they
> both promised to work on getting that updated.
> 
> |Not sure where the vendor provided drivers go when used with Xorg's
> |server
> 
> They should go into /usr/X11/lib/modules/drivers with the ones we
> provide.

Are the OpenGL drivers being developed for Xsun or Xorg?

Is sun moving over to Xorg and stopping development on Xsun?  I noticed 
a few people on this forum running Xorg instead of Xsun, but wasn't sure 
why they were doing so.

~S

Alan Coopersmith wrote:
> Shea Martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
> |What is the word on openGL on Solaris 10 x86?  Is it there?  Hardware 
> |accelerated?
> 
> No.
> 
> |I would think that with Sun's new Opteron workstations, that there must 
> |be native x86 openGL support by now?
> 
> Not yet - nVidia is porting their OpenGL support for the Quadro cards in
> the Opteron workstations, but it wasn't done in time for the initial
> Solaris 10 release.
> 
Two of the software packages we use shipped their last release with 
support for Solaris/SPARC (their original platform), IRIX, Linux x86, 
and windows.  But I was disappointed to see not solaris x86.  Now I know 
why.

Can we expect to see hardware accelerated OpenGL for anything other than 
quadro cards in the near future?

Management is trying to steer clear of Sun workstations due to price, 
and the fact they want users to have windows and unix access.  We are in 
a trial period right now of using Wintel and HummingBird's PC-X server, 
going into the SPARC boxes.  I tried to push for generic PC's (they are 
cheap as management wants) running solaris x86, and rdesktop to get into 
the windows world. But the workstations require openGL, this could be 
deal breaker.  I can hear the linux camp already... "lets just use linux 
instead of solaris".

Thanks for the info.

~S

In article <5dpDd.742987$%k.456530@pd7tw2no>,
shea martin  <smartin@arcis.com> wrote:
>Alan Coopersmith wrote:
>> They should go into /usr/X11/lib/modules/drivers with the ones we
>> provide.
>
>Are the OpenGL drivers being developed for Xsun or Xorg?

Looks like Xorg. /usr/X11 has not been part of the Xsun server.

>Is sun moving over to Xorg and stopping development on Xsun?  I noticed 
>a few people on this forum running Xorg instead of Xsun, but wasn't sure 
>why they were doing so.

The last Project Looking Glass JavaChat gives good hints.
<URL:http://java.sun.com/developer/community/chat/JavaLive/2004/jl1026.html>

John
groenveld@acm.org

shea martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Are the OpenGL drivers being developed for Xsun or Xorg?

Xorg.

|Is sun moving over to Xorg and stopping development on Xsun?  I noticed 
|a few people on this forum running Xorg instead of Xsun, but wasn't sure 
|why they were doing so.

Yes, we're moving towards Xorg as the Solaris X server.  Xsun
development is slowing down, but hasn't completely stopped yet.  Xorg is
the default X server for x86 in Solaris 10, but Xsun is still the
default on SPARC, since there are no SPARC drivers for Xsun on Solaris
yet.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

shea martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Can we expect to see hardware accelerated OpenGL for anything other than 
|quadro cards in the near future?

No plans have been announced yet for OpenGL support for anything else.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

shea martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes:

>Is sun moving over to Xorg and stopping development on Xsun?  I noticed 
>a few people on this forum running Xorg instead of Xsun, but wasn't sure 
>why they were doing so.


For Solaris 10/x86, Xorg is the default X server; so most people
running a recent Solaris 10 Express release on x86 hardware run Xorg
and not Xsun.

Casper
-- 
Expressed in this posting are my opinions.  They are in no way related
to opinions held by my employer, Sun Microsystems.
Statements on Sun products included here are not gospel and may
be fiction rather than truth.

In article <crli6c$1jmn$1@agate.berkeley.edu>,
	Alan Coopersmith <alanc@alum.calberkeley.org> writes:
> shea martin <smartin@arcis.com> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
>|Are the OpenGL drivers being developed for Xsun or Xorg?
> 
> Xorg.
> 
>|Is sun moving over to Xorg and stopping development on Xsun?  I noticed 
>|a few people on this forum running Xorg instead of Xsun, but wasn't sure 
>|why they were doing so.
> 
> Yes, we're moving towards Xorg as the Solaris X server.  Xsun
> development is slowing down, but hasn't completely stopped yet.  Xorg is
> the default X server for x86 in Solaris 10, but Xsun is still the
> default on SPARC, since there are no SPARC drivers for Xsun on Solaris
> yet.

Any caus for hope that an Adobe-free DPS extension might end up in Xorg
one day?  Or alternately, would licensing and technical considerations
perhaps allow proprietary DPS as a shared object extending Xorg?  It
isn't always true, but there are definitely times I can get better results
with DPS based viewers (the old pageview, dtimage, the freeware
psview/xpsview in DPS mode [it can also use gs, which can be handy for
comparing]) than with ghostscript based viewers.  And I'd hate to see
other client programs that use DPS left to choose between a stagnating
server (with relatively less device support over time) or being abandoned
or rewritten so that Xorg can be used.

-- 
mailto:rlhamil@smart.net  http://www.smart.net/~rlhamil

Lasik/PRK theme music:
    "In the Hall of the Mountain King", from "Peer Gynt"

Alan Coopersmith <alanc@alum.calberkeley.org> writes:

> Yes, we're moving towards Xorg as the Solaris X server.  Xsun
> development is slowing down, but hasn't completely stopped yet.
> Xorg is the default X server for x86 in Solaris 10, but Xsun is
> still the default on SPARC, since there are no SPARC drivers for
> Xsun on Solaris yet.

If/when the SPARC drivers are ported over to Xorg, do you know of any
plans to incoporate them into the open source distribution of Xorg?

-- 
David Magda <dmagda at ee.ryerson.ca>, http://www.magda.ca/
Because the innovator has for enemies all those who have done well under
the old conditions, and lukewarm defenders in those who may do well 
under the new. -- Niccolo Machiavelli, _The Prince_, Chapter VI

David Magda <dmagda+trace040726@ee.ryerson.ca> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|If/when the SPARC drivers are ported over to Xorg, do you know of any
|plans to incoporate them into the open source distribution of Xorg?

I don't know - that would be up to the SPARC graphics group inside Sun
responsible for those drivers, and I haven't talked to them about their
thinking on the matter.  I know at least some of the drivers for those
cards for Xsun are encumbered by the licenses with the OEMs who make the
cards for us, so I'd imagine at least some of them can't be released.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

Richard.L.Hamilton@mindwarp.smart.net (Richard L. Hamilton) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Any caus for hope that an Adobe-free DPS extension might end up in Xorg
|one day?

I don't know of any - there were some people working on DPS clones using
ghostscript for XFree86 a while ago, but I don't know if anyone still
is, and the ghostscript licensing issues make that problematic.  (Would
it be legal for Sun to distribute an Xorg with a GPL'ed ghostscript
engine for DPS and proprietary Nvidia drivers?  I don't know, but it 
sounds like something that would keep the lawyers up at night...)

|Or alternately, would licensing and technical considerations
|perhaps allow proprietary DPS as a shared object extending Xorg?  

I think the only thing blocking that is the time & resources it would
take to port technology, and how hard it is to justify that for software
Adobe EOL'ed years ago and very few clients still use.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

Alan Coopersmith wrote:
[snip] 
> |Or alternately, would licensing and technical considerations
> |perhaps allow proprietary DPS as a shared object extending Xorg?
> 
> I think the only thing blocking that is the time & resources it would
> take to port technology, and how hard it is to justify that for software
> Adobe EOL'ed years ago and very few clients still use.

Well, someone could come up with the argument of backwards-compatibility
(since other arguments like "it's a cool feature" or "maintaince" don't
count (seems several goodies in Solaris share the same fate, e.g. are
now sentenced to death (dtksh comes in mind again... ;-( ))) ...

----

Bye,
Roland

-- 
  __ .  . __
 (o.\ \/ /.o) roland.mainz@nrubsig.org
  \__\/\/__/  MPEG specialist, C&&JAVA&&Sun&&Unix programmer
  /O /==\ O\  TEL +49 641 7950090
 (;O/ \/ \O;)

Roland Mainz <roland.mainz@nrubsig.org> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|Alan Coopersmith wrote:
|[snip] 
|> |Or alternately, would licensing and technical considerations
|> |perhaps allow proprietary DPS as a shared object extending Xorg?
|> 
|> I think the only thing blocking that is the time & resources it would
|> take to port technology, and how hard it is to justify that for software
|> Adobe EOL'ed years ago and very few clients still use.
|
|Well, someone could come up with the argument of backwards-compatibility

The client side libdps is enough for that - applications using DPS have
always had to check for the extension in the server and do something
else if it's not there in order to support users displaying to other
boxes or replacing Xsun with XIG or XFree86 or another X server.

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

On Fri, 7 Jan 2005, Alan Coopersmith wrote:

> I don't know of any - there were some people working on DPS clones using
> ghostscript for XFree86 a while ago, but I don't know if anyone still
> is, and the ghostscript licensing issues make that problematic.  (Would
> it be legal for Sun to distribute an Xorg with a GPL'ed ghostscript
> engine for DPS and proprietary Nvidia drivers?  I don't know, but it
> sounds like something that would keep the lawyers up at night...)

True, but don't forget that there are TWO versions of Ghostscript: the
GPL one and the Aladdin (or whatever it is now) one.

-- 
Rich Teer, SCNA, SCSA, author of "Solaris Systems Programming"

                                                    .  *   * . * .* .
                                                     .   *   .   .*
President,                                          * .  . /\ ( .  . *
Rite Online Inc.                                     . .  / .\   . * .
                                                    .*.  / *  \  . .
                                                      . /*   o \     .
Voice: +1 (250) 979-1638                            *   '''||'''   .
URL: http://www.rite-online.net                     ******************

Alan Coopersmith <alanc@alum.calberkeley.org> writes in comp.unix.solaris:
|groenvel@cse.psu.edu (John D Groenveld) writes in comp.unix.solaris:
||Someone needs to update Sun's OpenGL page, however.
||<URL:http://www.sun.com/software/graphics/opengl/faq.xml#q15>
|
|I pinged the program manager handling our joint development with Nvidia
|and the marketing person for the W1100z/W2100z workstations, and they
|both promised to work on getting that updated.

Done!

-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Alan Coopersmith * alanc@alum.calberkeley.org * Alan.Coopersmith@Sun.COM
 http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~alanc/   *   http://blogs.sun.com/alanc/
  Working for, but definitely not speaking for, Sun Microsystems, Inc.

In article <cs6tln$17g2$1@agate.berkeley.edu>,
Alan Coopersmith  <alanc@alum.calberkeley.org> wrote:
>Done!

Thank you.
<URL:http://bugzilla.solaris-x86.org/show_bug.cgi?id=37>

I owe you a $BEVERAGE.

John
groenveld@acm.org